AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

(BLS, URM status, non-traditional, GLBT)
misslaw1
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AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby misslaw1 » Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:54 pm

Long time lurker, first time poster. First, I want to thank everybody on these forums for providing such good information.

My situation is that I had about a year of Withdrawals in which after I got sick, I got diagnosed with diabetes. Since then, i have lost over 100 pounds and was able to get back into school. My overall GPA from previous university was a 1.5. My current GPA at my current school is a 4.0. LSDAS GPA has me at a 2.35 (factoring all withdrawals).

I have been practice testing the LSAT at 174-178. I am working on keeping my practice test score at or above 176. If I can manage an LSAT score of 176-178, what are my chances at HYSCCN? MVP? the rest of T14-T20? Scholarships?

Just so you know, I am an AA female.

Thank you so much for your responses, they are greatly appreciated.

Transferthrowaway
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Re: AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby Transferthrowaway » Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:58 pm

Even with AA URM and a 175+, because of your LSAC GPA you have no shot at HYSCCN. MVP is doable though.

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BruceWayne
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Re: AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby BruceWayne » Wed Oct 05, 2011 2:00 pm

Work whatever job you can find for 2 years, and then ED to Northwestern.

misslaw1
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Re: AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby misslaw1 » Wed Oct 05, 2011 3:26 pm

Thank you so much for your replies. What about my chances in a top 50?

I wouldn't consider working for two years and then going to law school an option for me. I definitely want to go to law school right after undergrad.

It seems that even with a high LSAT, I probably will end up going to Howard at best (w/ scholarship money)

Any other comments?

misslaw1
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Re: AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby misslaw1 » Wed Oct 05, 2011 3:43 pm

I don't know if it helps that I have two years worth of work experience while I didn't attend school (one year) and during school. Working in the womens health field. I want to be a public interest lawyer that specializes in human rights in general, but more specifically womens reproductive rights. I also have a spring internship under my belt working with Now NYC, a women's rights activist group.

I am working on an outline for my PS (I am applying for 2013). I have excellent writing skills so hopefully that will show. I am also studying hard to try and PT nothing below 177. I am planning on taking the June LSAT, and am shooting for a 180. I think it is possible for me seeing as though my diagnostic was 167 and I have improved my scores +10 points in two months of casual studying. I plan on starting to study hardcore starting November, using the Lsat Blog's 7 month study guide.

Any other input is greatly appreciated.
Last edited by misslaw1 on Wed Oct 05, 2011 3:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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redsoxfan2495
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Re: AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby redsoxfan2495 » Wed Oct 05, 2011 3:45 pm

I just typed entered your numbers into hourumd and came up with this:

http://www.hourumd.com/?lsat=177&gpa=2.35&money=no&urm=only&waitlist=no&range=yes

This could be a difficult cycle to predict...

Still, why do you say that Howard is the best you can hope for when someone here just told you that you have a shot at schools ranked 7-9?

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paratactical
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Re: AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby paratactical » Wed Oct 05, 2011 3:48 pm

Do you guys ever sit around the office and laugh at the fact that the NOW logo looks like an iron?

subtle
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Re: AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby subtle » Wed Oct 05, 2011 3:49 pm

misslaw1 wrote:Thank you so much for your replies. What about my chances in a top 50?

I wouldn't consider working for two years and then going to law school an option for me. I definitely want to go to law school right after undergrad.

It seems that even with a high LSAT, I probably will end up going to Howard at best (w/ scholarship money)

Any other comments?



Uhm, you´ll end up at somewhere with money better than Howard if you do more research.

Out of curiosity, why is working after undergrad not an option for you? It might help you distance yourself from the GPA.

Also, they´re going to tell you to come back with a real score because things can go wrong on test day.

Lastly, whatever you do, make sure you write a compelling addendum about your health and its effect on your GPA. It shouldn´t sound like "This is why it´s not my fault," but more like "This was the challenge I was presented with. This is how I handled it and as a result my GPA suffered, but now ____________. And I will be an asset to your school and the legal profession because of it."

Good luck.

misslaw1
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Re: AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby misslaw1 » Wed Oct 05, 2011 3:49 pm

@redsoxfan Thank you for that, but for some reason when I click that link it isn't showing me any numbers. And I said Howard because I am really trying to get a good amount in scholarship money, and Howard would be the only school I see giving me a good amount of scholarship, if not a full ride. I am very anti-debt.

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Kabuo
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Re: AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby Kabuo » Wed Oct 05, 2011 3:50 pm

I don't know how the T14 will look at your GPA. But I can guarantee that you don't have to fall past WUSTL if you don't want to. They will probably throw a lot of money at you, actually.

misslaw1
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Re: AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby misslaw1 » Wed Oct 05, 2011 3:53 pm

@subtle Thank you so much for your input. I would really just rather not wait a couple of years to start law school honestly, I just wouldn't. How much can distancing myself from my GPA help, really? And thank you for that suggestion on how to write an addendum.

@Kabuo Thank you for your input, that gives me a lot of hope.


All I can continue to do is just study extra hard to try to make sure I test atleast in the mid 170's.

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nygrrrl
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Re: AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby nygrrrl » Wed Oct 05, 2011 3:56 pm

misslaw1 wrote:@subtle Thank you so much for your input. I would really just rather not wait a couple of years to start law school honestly, I just wouldn't. How much can distancing myself from my GPA help, really? And thank you for that suggestion on how to write an addendum.

@Kabuo Thank you for your input, that gives me a lot of hope.


All I can continue to do is just study extra hard to try to make sure I test atleast in the mid 170's.

Actually, distancing yourself from your GPA with solid WE can help a great deal. Right now what you really need to focus on is making sure you actually get that 176. GET the great LSAT score, your options are much better. Best of luck!

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redsoxfan2495
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Re: AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby redsoxfan2495 » Wed Oct 05, 2011 3:58 pm

misslaw1 wrote:@redsoxfan Thank you for that, but for some reason when I click that link it isn't showing me any numbers.
That's the point. That site gives you odds based on how others with your numbers have fared. So when I enter a non-URM 170 LSAT 3.8 GPA combo I get this:

--LinkRemoved--

There is not a single URM with your potential numbers who has ever entered their data. My point was that your cycle will be very difficult to predict.

Still, it sounds like you'll have an amazing LSAT score and if you can effectively explain the low GPA you may be able to get a good scholarship at a school ranked much higher than Howard.

subtle
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Re: AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby subtle » Wed Oct 05, 2011 4:00 pm

Distancing yourself from a low GPA gives yourself time so that you can easily make the claim that was then and this is now. You let the time and work experience since your graduation speak for itself and speak to your maturation and how, even were another illness to occur, something similar would be unlikely to happen again.

That said, it´s by no means necessary to distance yourself if you are sure you want to go after graduation. Some people say they don´t want to wait because they don´t know what to do. That´s usually a bad choice. But if you have reasons for wanting to go directly then, by all means, go.

Also, I´m fairly confident that if you score as high as you think you will, you will get scholarship money. There just aren´t that many African Americans with scores that high. I´d be willing to bet that more than a few schools would be willing to swallow your GPA in light of the score.

misslaw1
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Re: AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby misslaw1 » Wed Oct 05, 2011 5:43 pm

@nygrrl You are so right. Thanks for your input.

@subtle Thanks so much for your insight. Now I just have to study and get that score. I wonder if I'm waiting too long and should just take the Feb test instead of June?

@redsoxfan Oh, wow, I see. Thanks so much for that.

tronredo
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Re: AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby tronredo » Wed Oct 05, 2011 5:50 pm

misslaw1 wrote:@nygrrl You are so right. Thanks for your input.

@subtle Thanks so much for your insight. Now I just have to study and get that score. I wonder if I'm waiting too long and should just take the Feb test instead of June?

@redsoxfan Oh, wow, I see. Thanks so much for that.


Law school admissions is a "blotto game" with many fronts. If you get a 176 or higher on your LSAT, if you write a great personal statement highlighting your strengths and if you write an addendum tactfully explaining the low GPA and showing what you learnt from it, you would have dominated the majority of fronts in the admission process and there is a high chance that you would get admitted.

A 176 is in the 99th percentile and most schools value the LSAT more anyways.

So get on the LSAT, super-ace it, and i'm sure a lower T14 school would send you that "Congratulations, you've been .... letter"

misslaw1
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Re: AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby misslaw1 » Wed Oct 05, 2011 6:09 pm

@tranredo That is actually a good point. If I can translate my PT score to test day I just need to perfect every other aspect of my application that is in my control. I am going to start my PS now and continue to revise.

Thanks for the good information/advice everyone.

misslaw1
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Re: AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby misslaw1 » Wed Oct 05, 2011 7:34 pm

bumping for more thoughts.

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BlakcMajikc
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Re: AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby BlakcMajikc » Wed Oct 05, 2011 9:01 pm

misslaw1 wrote:bumping for more thoughts.


I would strongly consider moving your test day up to February.

I agree with the above posters talking about using work experience to distance yourself from your GPA. The GULC dean of admissions actually talked about that as a factor during my group interview... Especially if you have some impact during your time off, at the job or with PI/commserv work, you can certainly get that distance that you will need. I think you'll get into the T14, I think its just a matter of how far up the T14 ladder and the dollars.

rgndvo
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Re: AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby rgndvo » Wed Oct 05, 2011 11:51 pm

According to the most recent study done by LSAC, there are under 30 AA's who score above a 170 on the LSAT a year. That study was commissioned by LSAC several years ago, but if LSN is any indication, there hasn't been too huge of a change in AA test scores (perhaps a small gain, but not a colossal one).

Given the paucity of AA's scoring so high, and the extremely small proportion of 175+ test-takers with GPA's like OP, the likelihood that this is a flame is exceedingly high. That is just a statistical fact, not an accusation (OP seems nice so we should give her the benefit of the proverbial -- and in this case, considerable -- doubt).

But because of the rarity of her situation, it is difficult to give OP good advice on it. There are virtually zero applicants who are all of the things that she is (176/2.35/AA). No basis for comparison=a bunch of people rambling off of pure intuition, although she can safely assume that she will be rejected from all those schools from which AA's with similar LSAT's but higher GPA's were rejected from. I remain agnostic about your chances, OP, but you should apply to any schools you want (with the exceptions of those from which AA students of similar LSATs but higher GPAs are routinely rejected), given the fact that it's a naked guess as to how you'll be treated.

For what it's worth, OP: If your situation is truly as they describe, my intuition (which proves absolutely nothing) tells me that they might evaluate your GPA holistically. Really, anything below 3.4 is assured to be below the 25th percentiles at T-14's, so you wouldn't likely affect a school's standing in rankings any more than would an applicant with a 3.3; your story indicates that your previous GPA was due to extenuating factors beyond your control, and you've become an exceptional student. So my gut instinct (which again, means very little) tells me might be willing to turn a blind eye to it.
Last edited by rgndvo on Thu Oct 06, 2011 12:06 am, edited 1 time in total.

misslaw1
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Re: AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby misslaw1 » Thu Oct 06, 2011 12:02 am

@rgndvo Thanks a lot for your insight. From what I have understood from reading the boards, a 'flame' is someone who starts a post for the purpose of starting trouble (??). Either way, I understand why you would think that. However, I have yet to test, those are my PT scores and I am just looking for advice. And would you happen to be able to give me a rough list as to some schools that other AA's are routinely rejected from w/ similar LSAT's but higher GPA?

@Blackmajic OK, I see the point that everyone is making with taking two years off to distance myself from my GPA. But it's honestly not that important for me to get into a T14 for me to waste two years of my life doing something that I don't want to do. I sincerely appreciate your input though.

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Grizz
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Re: AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby Grizz » Thu Oct 06, 2011 12:05 am

edit: whoops, wrong forum
Last edited by Grizz on Thu Oct 06, 2011 12:10 am, edited 1 time in total.

rgndvo
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Re: AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby rgndvo » Thu Oct 06, 2011 12:09 am

misslaw1 wrote:@rgndvo Thanks a lot for your insight. From what I have understood from reading the boards, a 'flame' is someone who starts a post for the purpose of starting trouble (??). Either way, I understand why you would think that. However, I have yet to test, those are my PT scores and I am just looking for advice. And would you happen to be able to give me a rough list as to some schools that other AA's are routinely rejected from w/ similar LSAT's but higher GPA?

@Blackmajic OK, I see the point that everyone is making with taking two years off to distance myself from my GPA. But it's honestly not that important for me to get into a T14 for me to waste two years of my life doing something that I don't want to do. I sincerely appreciate your input though.


I'm not calling you a flame; I was just trying to illustrate the rarity of your situation, which was relevant to my latter point. I am actually an AA URM with a low GPA and an expected high LSAT (167 in June but have been PT-ing in the mid-high 170's and I just know I killed Oct), but I don't know much about how URM cycles work. Check Law School Numbers.com (a site with tons of data on the application success of all sorts of applicants) and ask around here.

misslaw1
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Re: AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby misslaw1 » Thu Oct 06, 2011 12:14 am

@rgndvo Oh, OK, I understand. Thanks for all the information. We sound like we are in somewhat the same boat, however I'm sure your GPA is better than mines, lol. Good luck on your LSATS and everything. We need to really raise the number of AA scoring 170+.

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Glock
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Re: AA Female/2.35 GPA/176 LSAT

Postby Glock » Thu Oct 06, 2011 12:39 am

Rare situation. Most people are rambling out of their ass. Blanket T20 and ask for waivers. Somebody will want to raise their LSAT median and boost their URM enrollment.




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