Hey! URM questions...

(BLS, URM status, non-traditional, GLBT)
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vanwinkle
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Re: Hey! URM questions...

Postby vanwinkle » Tue Aug 03, 2010 7:18 pm

OP: You can get into YHS (Yale, Harvard, & Stanford). Graduating from any of these schools is a practical guarantee of employment and sufficient income to pay back any loans you might have to take. You should apply to them and consider taking loans to pay everything off.

If you want scholarships, apply to the rest of the Top 14. At least one, and probably several, will give you full-tuition scholarships. You'll still have to take loans to cover COL (cost of living) expenses, but you'll graduate with a lot less debt, and still have a nationally recognized degree.

You shouldn't go to schools like Emory or UGA because with your stats and background you can not only get into far better schools but get scholarships from them. Emory and UGA do not have the kind of national reach that schools like HYS and CCN do; if you go to any of those (and CCN will likely give you scholarships) you'll be able to look for work almost anywhere in the country, whereas with an Emory or UGA degree it'll be hard to find employers outside the southeast US unless you finish at the very top of your class (and even then it'll be difficult).

You might end up wanting to work somewhere else 3 years from now, so apply to the top schools and keep your options open. You can always apply to Emory and UGA also, and decide once you hear back, but you should get some amazing scholarship offers from top law schools, and admission to HYS, and those are things you should at least apply for so you know what you have as options.

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Na_Swatch
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Re: Hey! URM questions...

Postby Na_Swatch » Tue Aug 03, 2010 7:21 pm

What many of you are leaving out is the fact that HYS offer pretty good financial assistance..

Especially for somebody in the OP's situation [being a guardian for somebody else will definitely benefit], HYS should all offer substantial grant aid.. probably at least 1/2 or more of scholarships he could receive at other schools.

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ShuckingNotJiving
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Re: Hey! URM questions...

Postby ShuckingNotJiving » Tue Aug 03, 2010 7:34 pm

No, you did not, individually, cram it down his throat. But the posters who quoted what you said, did --and provided no other plausible answer to his question.

It isn't always necessarily wrong to harp on about HYS every time a URM with stellar numbers posts on this board, but it definitely can be. Especially if there are other issues at stake besides prestige. Which for many people, perhaps not the majority for people at this board, but certainly for the OP, there are. We aren't talking about "a lot of people" we're talking about one person. Who has a child for chrissakes.

So, yes, the OP needs to tell us where his priorities lie, so the situation can be assessed accordingly.

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20121109
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Re: Hey! URM questions...

Postby 20121109 » Tue Aug 03, 2010 8:18 pm

ShuckingNotJiving wrote:No, you did not, individually, cram it down his throat. But the posters who quoted what you said, did --and provided no other plausible answer to his question.

It isn't always necessarily wrong to harp on about HYS every time a URM with stellar numbers posts on this board, but it definitely can be. Especially if there are other issues at stake besides prestige. Which for many people, perhaps not the majority for people at this board, but certainly for the OP, there are. We aren't talking about "a lot of people" we're talking about one person. Who has a child for chrissakes.

So, yes, the OP needs to tell us where his priorities lie, so the situation can be assessed accordingly.


I sincerely think that everyone who has posted ITT has genuinely tried to help the OP. Though their methods of quoting my initial response may not have been optimal, it is a common TLS trait and they were only trying to convey just how great his chances are for the best schools.

We all recognize the exceptional circumstances of the OP. And there are certain posters, like Vanwinkle, who have given very comprehensive and helpful responses.

To be honest, I find the way you're responding to how others are responding to the OP more disconcerting than the actual individual responses. Its a lil weird, brah.

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mpasi
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Re: Hey! URM questions...

Postby mpasi » Tue Aug 03, 2010 8:27 pm

GAIAtheCHEERLEADER wrote:. Its a lil weird, brah.



I think he's just looking to start an argument. Quite a few people on this forum try to practice their "arguing skills" by making something out of nothing in any given thread. For my part, your post was far better than anything I could have posted, so I quoted you.

APimpNamedSlickback
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x

Postby APimpNamedSlickback » Tue Aug 03, 2010 8:42 pm

x
Last edited by APimpNamedSlickback on Thu Aug 05, 2010 2:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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ShuckingNotJiving
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Re: Hey! URM questions...

Postby ShuckingNotJiving » Tue Aug 03, 2010 9:58 pm

Nope, wasn't trying to start an argument. Disagreed with the way the question had been handled prior to posters such as vanwinkle shedding light on the subject in a way that was more comprehensive. Conflict doesn't automatically signify argument, and I would say that, now, we both understand what each other was attempting to say. This is a forum, posters respond to the opinions of others...much like how we all would correct someone who insists, for example, that the OP use LSP to gauge his options.

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ck3
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Re: Hey! URM questions...

Postby ck3 » Tue Aug 03, 2010 10:27 pm

GAIAtheCHEERLEADER wrote:
acrossthelake wrote:He can get full tuition at far better schools than the ones he listed.


Also this.

The Darrow @ Michigan, AnnBryce @ NYU if OP is a first-generation grad student, and possibly a Hamilton @ Columbia.



I apologize for being a little off topic. What is the definition of a first generation grad student? Does it count just your parents only or does it include your siblings also? Neither of my parents graduated from high school but 2 of my older siblings have masters degrees and 1 has an MD. So would I qualify as first generation grad student.

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Knock
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Re: Hey! URM questions...

Postby Knock » Tue Aug 03, 2010 10:32 pm

ck3 wrote:
GAIAtheCHEERLEADER wrote:
acrossthelake wrote:He can get full tuition at far better schools than the ones he listed.


Also this.

The Darrow @ Michigan, AnnBryce @ NYU if OP is a first-generation grad student, and possibly a Hamilton @ Columbia.



I apologize for being a little off topic. What is the definition of a first generation grad student? Does it count just your parents only or does it include your siblings also? Neither of my parents graduated from high school but 2 of my older siblings have masters degrees and 1 has an MD. So would I qualify as first generation grad student.


"First-generation university students are those students whose parent(s) have not attained a college degree."

Source: http://www.counselingcenter.illinois.edu/?page_id=142

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ck3
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Re: Hey! URM questions...

Postby ck3 » Tue Aug 03, 2010 10:40 pm

As a parent, the well being of a child is always a lot to consider, however, depending upon the age of the child and other factors which we are not aware of, I would still have to lean toward moving for a better school. Also, even if you stay in state, your best job offers may end up being out of state if you are at the top of your class and then you would still have to move.

Again, as a parent, I think it is good to consider all factors but making a good living financially is a very important factor as a parent/guardian because it affects the types of opportunities you can provide for your dependent. Children are often disturbed when they have to change schools and no one can evaluate the effect that will have on your brother but you and he, however, children are resilient and their likes and dislikes have to be weighed against other concerns.

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Knock
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Re: Hey! URM questions...

Postby Knock » Tue Aug 03, 2010 10:41 pm

ck3 wrote:As a parent, the well being of a child is always a lot to consider, however, depending upon the age of the child and other factors which we are not aware of, I would still have to lean toward moving for a better school. Also, even if you stay in state, your best job offers may end up being out of state if you are at the top of your class and then you would still have to move.

Again, as a parent, I think it is good to consider all factors but making a good living financially is a very important factor as a parent/guardian because it affects the types of opportunities you can provide for your dependent. Children are often disturbed when they have to change schools and no one can evaluate the effect that will have on your brother but you and he, however, children are resilient and their likes and dislikes have to be weighed against other concerns.


This is a great response. I agree.

creatinganalt
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Re: Hey! URM questions...

Postby creatinganalt » Thu Aug 05, 2010 5:32 am

Not sure why this post brought out the trolls. The OP is likely to get a t6 if not t14 named full ride. Yale would probably throw 100k+ of need based his way. This is not a prestige v money debate - the OP can get both.

Btw - enjoy HYS means apply HYS on down.

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Rand M.
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Re: Hey! URM questions...

Postby Rand M. » Thu Aug 05, 2010 6:06 am

ShuckingNotJiving wrote:No, you did not, individually, cram it down his throat. But the posters who quoted what you said, did --and provided no other plausible answer to his question.

It isn't always necessarily wrong to harp on about HYS every time a URM with stellar numbers posts on this board, but it definitely can be. Especially if there are other issues at stake besides prestige. Which for many people, perhaps not the majority for people at this board, but certainly for the OP, there are. We aren't talking about "a lot of people" we're talking about one person. Who has a child for chrissakes.

So, yes, the OP needs to tell us where his priorities lie, so the situation can be assessed accordingly.


You are adding nothing. Even you say that the OP needs to provide more information, so given the information we have, its not all that crazy to make the recommendations we have. The OP really has the world at his feet and there is no sense in pretending that a ridiculous recommendation like UGA is worth taking seriously. People with children choose to attend prestigious schools all the time, so while the OP has other factors to consider, those factors should not necessarily keep them out of HYS, and until evidence to the contrary is offered, HYS is TCR. If any poster has a concrete reason they cannot attend the best school they can get into, then there is reason to advise accordingly, but until then, you are wrong and everyone else is right.

APimpNamedSlickback wrote:i concur with the idea that we all place excessive emphasis on hys. all law schools are basically the same, no? i say go to toledo or some shit op, its all about your personal circumstances!

also, fuck rand m. what an awful poster that guy is. and that other guy fucking "doritos," i mean wow he pretty much sucks at posting/life too.

that is all.


DIAF

creatinganalt
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Re: Hey! URM questions...

Postby creatinganalt » Thu Aug 05, 2010 7:25 am

Rand, please extend that DIAF (though I do think Slickback was joking) to all of the URMs on the thread who actually posted to try and lower the expectations of a fellow POC.

I mean, here you have someone with great academic potential being told total shit by their academic advisor. The typical bigotry of low expectations for POC. People with complicated family circumstances can and still do go to great schools. Stop telling people what they can and cannot do.

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sophia.olive
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Re: Hey! URM questions...

Postby sophia.olive » Thu Aug 05, 2010 7:27 am

creatinganalt wrote:Rand, please extend that DIAF (though I do think Slickback was joking) to all of the URMs on the thread who actually posted to try and lower the expectations of a fellow POC.

I mean, here you have someone with great academic potential being told total shit by their academic advisor. The typical bigotry of low expectations for POC. People with complicated family circumstances can and still do go to great schools. Stop telling people what they can and cannot do.


I vote Yale

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ShuckingNotJiving
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Re: Hey! URM questions...

Postby ShuckingNotJiving » Thu Aug 05, 2010 10:14 am

I really hate carrying this out on the thread, lest the OP be scared away -- but, it's funny how if one doesn't listen, they don't realize when the person they're trying to argue with is saying the same thing.

There is an important line in your retort that sums up my sentiments exactly:

You are adding nothing. Even you say that the OP needs to provide more information, so given the information we have, its not all that crazy to make the recommendations we have. The OP really has the world at his feet and there is no sense in pretending that a ridiculous recommendation like UGA is worth taking seriously. People with children choose to attend prestigious schools all the time, so while the OP has other factors to consider, those factors should not necessarily keep them out of HYS, and until evidence to the contrary is offered, HYS is TCR. If any poster has a concrete reason they cannot attend the best school they can get into, then there is reason to advise accordingly, but until then, you are wrong and everyone else is right.


Which is what I was stated -- rather clearly, when I said: "The OP needs to tell us where his priorities lie." That could be the evidence to the contrary that would make HYS not feasible or appealing. Yes, people with children attend law prestigious law schools all the time --and the OP is not deciding between HYS and Cooley, he deciding between more prestigious schools, for less prestigious schools. Let's not forget were talking about a person, with a child, who we can assume is financially struggling. This isn't a typical nuclear family, this is a single person taking care of his brother while still a young man. Getting tuition paid is one thing, but there are other costs that he would incur that he wouldn't if he stayed near by. Let's also not forget that wealth isn't just about money, but also networks (which he would be losing) and comfort (losing that too, possibly). These possible losses are also magnified by the fact that he has a child. Have you considered the possibility that while the OP is working now, the child is able to be watched by family members that he won't have around if he moved to a different state? Or the possibility that the child who has already experienced trauma as he is not being raised by his biological parents might be extra-sensitive to a cross-country move (in the case of Y and S)?

So, there is, to be sure, other evidence to the contrary that could complicate his decision. This is what I was contending --and it wasn't a matter of being "right" or "wrong" it was a matter of helping the OP by giving him as comprehensive of an answer as possible. I was offering another opinion from my experience, as someone who isn't as bent on rankings, and someone who has spent a lot of time working with children. That's what I think will truly help the OP, getting different perspectives, not hearing the same thing over and over again.

APimpNamedSlickback wrote:i concur with the idea that we all place excessive emphasis on hys. all law schools are basically the same, no? i say go to toledo or some shit op, its all about your personal circumstances!

also, fuck rand m. what an awful poster that guy is. and that other guy fucking "doritos," i mean wow he pretty much sucks at posting/life too.

that is all.

DIAF



Lastly, even I saw that "APimP" was being ironic. I don't know what DIAF means, but hopefully now you've sensed the irony too.

Ben Reilly
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Re: Hey! URM questions...

Postby Ben Reilly » Mon Aug 09, 2010 1:12 am

MikeNorec wrote:PLSAT Scores: 170,176,171
LSAT Score: 173
URM: Hispanic ( Peurto Rican )

Can anyone give me an idea of what my chances might look like? I went to community college first (3.84GPA), graduating GSU in fall 10' with honors (3.92 GPA). I have had a full-time job since age 14, (yeah that is illegal) - but will community college hurt my law school chances? Thanks. My hopes are to apply somewhere in the T14, however my counselor is suggesting GSU Law, UGA, or Emory - because it is close to home and I am my younger brothers guardian.

*Edit, to those who PM'D me questioning the PLSAT scores -- I was just trying to show the consistency of my results... Also, I intern for a Yale graduate, who was my tutor and time keeper :D. I also received a PM questioning why I posted my stats? Well, when you look at your ''predictors'' - plenty of people troll your statistical information (Esp. URM numbers).


If I receive full rides instate, should I consider staying home?? My brother would have to move wherever I go..


I go to GSU as well, and although I realize that the school and its law school are fine for some, I personally really don't like the school. I'll spare you my life story, though.

As it is, you're going to have to make a personal choice about relocating based upon your unique situation. If you do decide to stay in GA, I can almost guarantee that you'll be getting a full scholarship to Emory. I know a white lawyer whose numbers weren't near yours, but still got a full-ride there. If you do decide to relocate, have fun at the top 3.

MikeNorec
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Re: Hey! URM questions...

Postby MikeNorec » Tue Dec 14, 2010 10:53 am

Harvard = )




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