Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

(BLS, URM status, non-traditional, GLBT)
rundoxierun
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Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby rundoxierun » Wed Jul 28, 2010 9:46 am

Ok so Im getting to work on the statement portion of my application but I have a problem.. I want to write a PS that highlights what background I come from(educationally/socioeconomically disadvantaged) because I really think it will strengthen my application but writing about that stuff will make any DS I could write completely redundant. Any ideas?? Im sure this is a pretty common problem.

creatinganalt
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Re: Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby creatinganalt » Wed Jul 28, 2010 10:30 am

can't you write a DS about being a URM?

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merichard87
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Re: Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby merichard87 » Wed Jul 28, 2010 10:34 am

You don't have anything else that unique about you other than your race and economic level?

rundoxierun
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Re: Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby rundoxierun » Wed Jul 28, 2010 11:25 am

merichard87 wrote:You don't have anything else that unique about you other than your race and economic level?


Well there are unique things but mentioning them seems to be just hitting on the same thing that my PS is going for. For instance, you could talk about growing up with one of your parents serving a life sentence in prison but how does that really show you are adding some kind of useful perspective to the school?? And how does that go show a different angle than the whole overcoming being from a educationally and socially disadvantaged background??

rundoxierun
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Re: Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby rundoxierun » Wed Jul 28, 2010 11:30 am

Would it be better to just in my PS work on talking about my educational background (first gen college grad, had teenage mother who dropped out and later had to pursue educ, etc.) and use the DS to focus more on my socioecon background?

creatinganalt
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Re: Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby creatinganalt » Wed Jul 28, 2010 11:34 am

I think there is a questionnaire you can fill in in Anna Levy's book or somewhere. You can use it to explore various themes for your PS/DS. Have you read the stickies? I think that thinking of your PS or DS as bad news/sob stories is pretty narrow.

It can be on anything that demonstrates that you, the applicant, are desirable to a law school. Not about cataloguing all of the ways in which you are disadvantaged.

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20121109
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Re: Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby 20121109 » Wed Jul 28, 2010 11:40 am

Granted my cycle was a bit of an anomaly, but I did not write a DS. My PS was full of DS material (whatever that is, lol). Didn't want to repeat the few interesting things about me.

CanadianWolf
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Re: Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby CanadianWolf » Wed Jul 28, 2010 11:41 am

Quality, not quantity.

rundoxierun
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Re: Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby rundoxierun » Wed Jul 28, 2010 11:41 am

creatinganalt wrote:I think there is a questionnaire you can fill in in Anna Levy's book or somewhere. You can use it to explore various themes for your PS/DS. Have you read the stickies? I think that thinking of your PS or DS as bad news/sob stories is pretty narrow.

It can be on anything that demonstrates that you, the applicant, are desirable to a law school. Not about cataloguing all of the ways in which you are disadvantaged.


Well I thought the point was to say things that demonstrate your character but cant be seen in a resume. I dont really know what I could say to show Im desirable to a school beyond reiterating my resume. It seems like writing about my experience as a finance intern will just put me in the masses. Writing about seeing how my mother getting a simple vocational degree in nursing, how happy it made her, the effect it had on us as a family, and how that compelled me to go further in my education seems like something that would seperate me. I apologize if I was unclear, Im not just going for the sob story.

rundoxierun
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Re: Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby rundoxierun » Wed Jul 28, 2010 11:44 am

GAIAtheCHEERLEADER wrote:Granted my cycle was a bit of an anomaly, but I did not write a DS. My PS was full of DS material (whatever that is, lol). Didn't want to repeat the few interesting things about me.


Thanks, thats reassuring.. Im really just thinking about taking this route as well.

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Fresh
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Re: Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby Fresh » Wed Jul 28, 2010 11:44 am

creatinganalt wrote:I think there is a questionnaire you can fill in in Anna Levy's book or somewhere. You can use it to explore various themes for your PS/DS. Have you read the stickies? I think that thinking of your PS or DS as bad news/sob stories is pretty narrow.

It can be on anything that demonstrates that you, the applicant, are desirable to a law school. Not about cataloguing all of the ways in which you are disadvantaged.


I'm an URM and I would consider myself disadvantaged as well, and I agree with this post. It'd be smart to make sure you're not just talking about how unfortunate your circumstances are, but that you talk about how you're circumstances have molded you into an individual that would be desirable for law school. With a little creativity it won't be hard to do.

Also, I think that your DS should be the one that talks about how your URM status (whether it is race or socioeconomics or both) makes you a DIFFERENT person for "X" Law School, while your PS makes you a STRONG candidate for law school (not necessarily just because your different).

I hope you end up posting your statements on here eventually, because I'm in a similar boat and I would like to see where you go with it.

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vanwinkle
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Re: Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby vanwinkle » Wed Jul 28, 2010 11:47 am

The whole point of a DS is to mention diversity issues that aren't highlighted in your PS or the rest of your app. If you cover that stuff in your PS the DS is no longer necessary.

I integrated all my diversity stuff into my PS, and did not do a separate DS. That worked twice for me: Once getting into a T14 and the second time transferring to HLS.

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hiromoto45
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Re: Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby hiromoto45 » Wed Jul 28, 2010 11:57 am

Fresh wrote:
Also, I think that your DS should be the one that talks about how your URM status (whether it is race or socioeconomics or both) makes you a DIFFERENT person for "X" Law School, while your PS makes you a STRONG candidate for law school (not necessarily just because your different).

I hope you end up posting your statements on here eventually, because I'm in a similar boat and I would like to see where you go with it.


I have a completely different view than most in this thread. The DS does not have to be centered on your URM status. I think focusing on URM status puts on at a disadvantage, for exactly what the poster said above. If the vast majority of URMs go in this direction, it's just an evaluation of whom is more disadvantaged than the next. This may not necessarily be the case for adcoms deciding admissions, but if you don't want to get lost in the "masses" think of writing something that hasn't been done and tried already.

PPl think they need to lay their lives out there for adcoms to take notice. When you really just have to be strategic.

Tkgrrett: with your numbers you just have to write an adequate and error-free PS and or DS(if you want). It really is an exercise in futility for you.

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20121109
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Re: Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby 20121109 » Wed Jul 28, 2010 11:59 am

hiromoto45 wrote:Tkgrrett: with your numbers you just have to write an adequate and error-free PS and or DS(if you want). It really is an exercise in futility for you.


TITCR.

Seriously, tk.

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vanwinkle
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Re: Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby vanwinkle » Wed Jul 28, 2010 12:08 pm

GAIAtheCHEERLEADER wrote:
hiromoto45 wrote:Tkgrrett: with your numbers you just have to write an adequate and error-free PS and or DS(if you want). It really is an exercise in futility for you.

TITCR.

Seriously, tk.

Holy cow, I just looked at tk's profile. No kidding. Make sure your application is written in English and you run spell-check on it; that's about the only advice you need.

rundoxierun
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Re: Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby rundoxierun » Wed Jul 28, 2010 12:08 pm

GAIAtheCHEERLEADER wrote:
hiromoto45 wrote:Tkgrrett: with your numbers you just have to write an adequate and error-free PS and or DS(if you want). It really is an exercise in futility for you.


TITCR.

Seriously, tk.


Ehh, Im a hyper-rational constant risk manager. I approach my cycle as if I was a completely vanilla person. Any boost is only "in addition" so you should still get as close to the optimal approach as possible.

Plus, a recent convo with the gf has put Yale back in play so I have the insanity of that process to look forward to.

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20121109
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Re: Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby 20121109 » Wed Jul 28, 2010 12:10 pm

Fuck Yale. Embrace Crimson.

r6_philly
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Re: Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby r6_philly » Wed Jul 28, 2010 2:21 pm

GAIAtheCHEERLEADER wrote:Fuck Yale. Embrace Crimson.


Haha your loyalties grow stronger by the day!

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vanwinkle
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Re: Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby vanwinkle » Wed Jul 28, 2010 2:34 pm

tkgrrett wrote:Ehh, Im a hyper-rational constant risk manager. I approach my cycle as if I was a completely vanilla person. Any boost is only "in addition" so you should still get as close to the optimal approach as possible.

With that attitude and a strong work ethic, this is you 20 years from now:

--ImageRemoved--

rundoxierun
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Re: Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby rundoxierun » Wed Jul 28, 2010 3:07 pm

vanwinkle wrote:
tkgrrett wrote:Ehh, Im a hyper-rational constant risk manager. I approach my cycle as if I was a completely vanilla person. Any boost is only "in addition" so you should still get as close to the optimal approach as possible.

With that attitude and a strong work ethic, this is you 20 years from now:

--ImageRemoved--


Haha if you actually knew me you would laugh at that statement. Way too cynical to be that guy. Lets just say that my campaign platform would be divisive.

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bk1
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Re: Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby bk1 » Wed Jul 28, 2010 3:22 pm

This is unrelated to the OP's situation, but shouldn't it be noted that certain schools do not differentiate between different Hispanics and thus PR/MX cannot expect a normal URM boost unless they talk about it in their DS?

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vanwinkle
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Re: Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby vanwinkle » Wed Jul 28, 2010 3:27 pm

bk1 wrote:This is unrelated to the OP's situation, but shouldn't it be noted that certain schools do not differentiate between different Hispanics and thus PR/MX cannot expect a normal URM boost unless they talk about it in their DS?

I've wondered about this. Do those schools not give a URM boost to any Hispanics, or do they give one to all of them? I have yet to figure out a clear answer to that question.

miamiman
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Re: Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby miamiman » Wed Jul 28, 2010 3:33 pm

vanwinkle wrote:
bk1 wrote:This is unrelated to the OP's situation, but shouldn't it be noted that certain schools do not differentiate between different Hispanics and thus PR/MX cannot expect a normal URM boost unless they talk about it in their DS?

I've wondered about this. Do those schools not give a URM boost to any Hispanics, or do they give one to all of them? I have yet to figure out a clear answer to that question.

It varies, school-by-school, case-by-case.

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vanwinkle
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Re: Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby vanwinkle » Wed Jul 28, 2010 3:55 pm

miamiman wrote:It varies, school-by-school, case-by-case.

This is what I've been assuming, but I've not gotten anywhere more specific than that (like trying to figure out which schools do what).

miamiman
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Re: Not writing DS= Death sentence for URM?

Postby miamiman » Wed Jul 28, 2010 3:57 pm

vanwinkle wrote:
miamiman wrote:It varies, school-by-school, case-by-case.

This is what I've been assuming, but I've not gotten anywhere more specific than that (like trying to figure out which schools do what).

There don't seem to be hard-and-fast rules. I do think, however, if you're hispanic and particularly the type of hispanic not generally shown love in the admissions process, it behooves you to write a diversity statement. You still may not get any boost but at least you've put your best foot forward.




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