1L Advice catered to URMs?

(BLS, URM status, non-traditional, GLBT)
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trialjunky
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1L Advice catered to URMs?

Postby trialjunky » Mon May 10, 2010 6:48 am

After reading this post, which I will follow like the holy grail I was wondering if this remained the same for URMs or should some of these situations should be handled differently. For the association portion, I think I'm going to look at the local ABWA & BLA?

http://www.lawschooldiscussion.org/prel ... msg5153383

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trialjunky
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Re: 1L Advice catered to URMs?

Postby trialjunky » Tue May 11, 2010 8:58 am

Fail...


Epic Fail

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La Grind Date
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Re: 1L Advice catered to URMs?

Postby La Grind Date » Tue May 11, 2010 9:55 am

I think it would make sense to hit up the black lawyer orgs--in addition to what the poster suggests.


I wonder what that poster would suggest for students who will be attending schools that are not in the city in which they would ideally like to practice (i'm going to school in STL, but would like to practice in the NYC, Philly, LA, or Chicago). any ideas?
Last edited by La Grind Date on Tue May 11, 2010 11:35 am, edited 2 times in total.

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SportsFanatic
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Re: 1L Advice catered to URMs?

Postby SportsFanatic » Tue May 11, 2010 10:08 am

great post thanks. tagged.

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3 Stripes
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Re: 1L Advice catered to URMs?

Postby 3 Stripes » Tue May 11, 2010 11:08 am

Thanks!

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trialjunky
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Re: 1L Advice catered to URMs?

Postby trialjunky » Tue May 11, 2010 11:37 am

La Grind Date wrote:I think it would make sense to hit up the black lawyer orgs--in addition to what the poster suggests.


I wonder what that poster would suggest for students who will be attending schools that are not in the city in which they would ideally like to practice (i'm going to school in STL, but would like to practice in the NYC, Philly, LA, or Chicago). any ideas?


That's a good question! How the hell do you network out of city? I dont know if it's possible.

legalized
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Re: 1L Advice catered to URMs?

Postby legalized » Thu May 13, 2010 3:23 pm

trialjunky wrote:
La Grind Date wrote:I think it would make sense to hit up the black lawyer orgs--in addition to what the poster suggests.


I wonder what that poster would suggest for students who will be attending schools that are not in the city in which they would ideally like to practice (i'm going to school in STL, but would like to practice in the NYC, Philly, LA, or Chicago). any ideas?


That's a good question! How the hell do you network out of city? I dont know if it's possible.


You don't for the most part. La Grind Date should have chosen a school located IN NYC if he wanted to practice in NYC (unless T-10 or so), in Pennsylvania if he wanted Philly, in California if he wanted LA, or near/in Illinois if he wanted Chicago.

He better start networking to get a job in the state he's in, or wherever most of the graduates of his school can be found.

legalized
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Re: 1L Advice catered to URMs?

Postby legalized » Thu May 13, 2010 3:41 pm

trialjunky wrote:After reading this post, which I will follow like the holy grail I was wondering if this remained the same for URMs or should some of these situations should be handled differently. For the association portion, I think I'm going to look at the local ABWA & BLA?

http://www.lawschooldiscussion.org/prel ... msg5153383


MAN that link confirmed that my thinking to solidify the whole approach to what happens after law school before I even get there is right on the money. I think a lot of law school students felt entitled to work and have no idea how to sell themselves or interview well, their sheer brilliance is suppose to do all the work for them, that or the name of their school.

I already picked up copies of the ABA journal and learned that bar dues and bar materials are cheaper as a student so it's best to get them then (and with your financial aid funds instead of out of pocket).

I could take those tips even to places I don't have existing contacts (like, say, out west) and do well though!

I think joining black lawyer associations falls under "joining local bar organizations of interest"...so yes that's a good idea, especially to find the minority movers and shakers since they are often called upon to help with minority recruitment.

I am definitely looking forward to putting all that advice to good use. People think I jump the gun with some of my statements on the board but if more people realized the time to plan out their law career strategy is before they end up at the wrong school instead of after, more people would have made a satisfying choice.

And please note that this can be done before even starting law school. Makes it seem like even LESS of a suck up move!
I love the main point: get known by and talking to LAWYERS and judges in all settings where you come to know each other as a person and not as a name and 1L grade...don't spend law school lol-ing and commiserating with your future competition, cause they can't help you get employed!

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La Grind Date
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Re: 1L Advice catered to URMs?

Postby La Grind Date » Fri May 14, 2010 10:14 am

legalized wrote:
trialjunky wrote:
La Grind Date wrote:I think it would make sense to hit up the black lawyer orgs--in addition to what the poster suggests.


I wonder what that poster would suggest for students who will be attending schools that are not in the city in which they would ideally like to practice (i'm going to school in STL, but would like to practice in the NYC, Philly, LA, or Chicago). any ideas?


That's a good question! How the hell do you network out of city? I dont know if it's possible.


You don't for the most part. La Grind Date should have chosen a school located IN NYC if he wanted to practice in NYC (unless T-10 or so), in Pennsylvania if he wanted Philly, in California if he wanted LA, or near/in Illinois if he wanted Chicago.

He better start networking to get a job in the state he's in, or wherever most of the graduates of his school can be found.


Legalized, I appreciate the reply.

You seem to show a bit of a defeatist attitude. Sure, networking for NYC would not be easy if I go to school in STL; however, I think we are a creative bunch that can find ways to ease that difficulty. Here is one way: I can become a visiting student at a NYC law school! (Also, don't you think judges on the Fed Court of Appeals level have lots of connections that extend outside of their region? Would you guess that STL BigLaw/mid law partners also have connections that extend outside of their region, to NYC?)


I have not read the Guerrilla Job book, yet. I hope that it will have more ointment formulas! Can you guys add any?

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MC Southstar
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Re: 1L Advice catered to URMs?

Postby MC Southstar » Fri May 14, 2010 10:15 am

Do the Sammy Sosa.

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PoorOrpheus
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Re: 1L Advice catered to URMs?

Postby PoorOrpheus » Fri May 14, 2010 10:50 am

Thanks for the link, trialjunky! The poster mentioned a few orgs I hadn't heard of.

legalized
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Re: 1L Advice catered to URMs?

Postby legalized » Fri May 14, 2010 2:14 pm

La Grind Date wrote:
legalized wrote:
trialjunky wrote:
La Grind Date wrote:I think it would make sense to hit up the black lawyer orgs--in addition to what the poster suggests.


I wonder what that poster would suggest for students who will be attending schools that are not in the city in which they would ideally like to practice (i'm going to school in STL, but would like to practice in the NYC, Philly, LA, or Chicago). any ideas?


That's a good question! How the hell do you network out of city? I dont know if it's possible.


You don't for the most part. La Grind Date should have chosen a school located IN NYC if he wanted to practice in NYC (unless T-10 or so), in Pennsylvania if he wanted Philly, in California if he wanted LA, or near/in Illinois if he wanted Chicago.

He better start networking to get a job in the state he's in, or wherever most of the graduates of his school can be found.


Legalized, I appreciate the reply.

You seem to show a bit of a defeatist attitude. Sure, networking for NYC would not be easy if I go to school in STL; however, I think we are a creative bunch that can find ways to ease that difficulty. Here is one way: I can become a visiting student at a NYC law school! (Also, don't you think judges on the Fed Court of Appeals level have lots of connections that extend outside of their region? Would you guess that STL BigLaw/mid law partners also have connections that extend outside of their region, to NYC?)


I have not read the Guerrilla Job book, yet. I hope that it will have more ointment formulas! Can you guys add any?


1. I said for the most part you don't. For the most part being key. If you feel you fall in the special minority outside of the "most" part, fine, I don't know you so I can't argue that.

2. I am being real, that is how harsh I am on myself when I plan out this law school thing. I have to walk in with eyes open and I want you and anyone looking for a future successful career like myself to have the MOST opportunity to realize that goal, and my opinion, based on research outside of this site, is also confirmed by many with more legal education and actual experience than I do right here on this site. Maybe I should have let them say it and it would sound less negative. But a lot of them are way meaner than me, trust. lol

3. Visiting student or no, how long of your 3 years of law school do you plan to be visiting? You need plenty of time to network, and aside from that, visiting student or no, the university granting you your JD doesn't change because you visited x school. A Tulane student visiting Columbia is still graduating from Tulane and therefore will have Tulane's reach to work with. None of this applies if you have a relative waiting to hire you or some other such inside track that existed as an 0L.

Why exactly did you go to school in st. louis if you had no intention of practicing anywhere near the state it serves? I don't understand that. Did you not look up how law school placement typically works before starting?

Why is it such a priority to work in THOSE markets? Even if you did no research and just find yourself stuck in this position the school you chose to attend puts you in, why not take lemons and make lemonade by working with the hand you've been dealt? What's wrong with practicing in your local area?

I don't like swimming upstream when I don't have to cause too much else is upstream in my life already. So if the visiting student thing works out for you, congrats but know that for 90% of non-T-14 grads, they better expect to practice in the state or the few-hundred-mile-radius (if the school is near another state's border) in which their school is located, and plan their adherence to Matthies' advice on that note.

The only thing I understand about federal portability is that immigration law is federal and can be practiced for any client while based in any state. But lawyers seem to be deadset on recruiting from their alma mater and the other local law schools, and that sort of archaic approach to bringing new talent on board might not be NICE but it's the way it IS and I deal with what it is not what it could be when it comes to how best to get a job with someone else.

SBimmer
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Re: 1L Advice catered to URMs?

Postby SBimmer » Fri May 14, 2010 3:17 pm

trialjunky wrote:After reading this post, which I will follow like the holy grail I was wondering if this remained the same for URMs or should some of these situations should be handled differently. For the association portion, I think I'm going to look at the local ABWA & BLA?

http://www.lawschooldiscussion.org/prel ... msg5153383


+1

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La Grind Date
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Re: 1L Advice catered to URMs?

Postby La Grind Date » Fri May 14, 2010 4:37 pm

Legalized,

i was suggesting that STL-based fed court of appeals judges would put me in touch with people who would get me firm jobs in NYC. But that's neither here nor there.

i think you are right: i glossed over your "for the most part" stipulation. But i was not looking for general advice: i was looking for advice that would help me buck the trend.

i don't think the institution from which one graduates matters nearly as much as you do. i draw my opinion from lawyers and other non-TLS sources. I started to read the GUERRILLA BOOK today, and its author would agree.


To answer some of your questions:

i am going to school in STL because i really like Wash U. also, they were generous enough to give me a great scholarship.

I want NYC because it's the art/cultural capital of the US. I LOVE the fashion & arts--and artsy women make me a happy man!


so who has some ideas to help me--a future Wash U grad--market myself for a NYC firm job?
Last edited by La Grind Date on Fri May 14, 2010 4:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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La Grind Date
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Re: 1L Advice catered to URMs?

Postby La Grind Date » Fri May 14, 2010 4:46 pm

urm sisters and brothers,

with you, i would much rather be cooperative than competitive!

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Rand M.
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Re: 1L Advice catered to URMs?

Postby Rand M. » Fri May 14, 2010 5:09 pm

La Grind Date wrote:so who has some ideas to help me--a future Wash U grad--market myself for a NYC firm job?


I gotta kinda agree with legalized on this one. I think there are certainly avenues out of the market that your school is in, but I think most of those are very much centered on grade measured performance. I know you are basing your opinions on lawyers, etc., but I really think placement stats don't lie. I think that nearly all of those that are able to leave the base market are people with biglaw grades, whatever that means for your respective school. You certainly have a chance at NYC, but besides getting the absolute best grades you can, I'm not sure what else you can do. Personally, that's why I chose to bite the bullet and go to the school I knew would allow me to practice where I wanted (even if it will cost significantly more).

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Mattalones
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Re: 1L Advice catered to URMs?

Postby Mattalones » Fri May 14, 2010 6:11 pm

I think the thread you link to is great! It made me think that I may have underestimated the value in attending law schools with programs catered to URMs (these are out there at good schools, but aren't really advertised). So, I am trying to compile a list of them here:

-----> viewtopic.php?f=14&t=117662 <-----

If you know of any, help me our by posting it in that thread. Thanks. :)

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hiromoto45
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Re: 1L Advice catered to URMs?

Postby hiromoto45 » Thu Jul 08, 2010 9:14 pm

.




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