Current URM students taking Q's

(BLS, URM status, non-traditional, GLBT)
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D Brooks
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Re: Current AA URM student taking Q's

Postby D Brooks » Mon Jun 21, 2010 1:22 am

Kohinoor wrote:
D Brooks wrote:What's biglaw mecca for the UVa student body?

W&C? Sullivan & Cromwell?

biglaw mecca for everybody is W&C or one of the boutiques isn't it? Of course, a vanishingly small number actually get it.


Where can I find a list of starting salaries for boutiques and all firms, generally?

Is W&C really that selective? Mostly regulatory work and it has like 200 attorneys.

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Kohinoor
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Re: Current AA URM student taking Q's

Postby Kohinoor » Mon Jun 21, 2010 1:26 am

D Brooks wrote:
Kohinoor wrote:
D Brooks wrote:What's biglaw mecca for the UVa student body?

W&C? Sullivan & Cromwell?

biglaw mecca for everybody is W&C or one of the boutiques isn't it? Of course, a vanishingly small number actually get it.


Where can I find a list of starting salaries for boutiques and all firms, generally?

Is W&C really that selective? Mostly regulatory work and it has like 200 attorneys.

nalp? chambers guide? It is really that selective. Even in the boom years, we were talking a gpa requirement of 3.7

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jeremydc
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Re: Current AA URM student taking Q's

Postby jeremydc » Mon Jun 21, 2010 1:51 am

Did you feel out of place as a URM? Did you feel that it didn't matter, that everyone was equal when school began?

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Kohinoor
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Re: Current AA URM student taking Q's

Postby Kohinoor » Mon Jun 21, 2010 2:46 am

jeremydc wrote:Did you feel out of place as a URM? Did you feel that it didn't matter, that everyone was equal when school began?

I've always felt out of place. Others didn't.

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20121109
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Re: Current AA URM student taking Q's

Postby 20121109 » Mon Jun 21, 2010 2:48 am

Kohinoor wrote:
jeremydc wrote:Did you feel out of place as a URM? Did you feel that it didn't matter, that everyone was equal when school began?

I've always felt out of place. Others didn't.

The way you answer questions, K...its like this thread is parody of real "Taking Q's" threads and/or a time-waster for your own amusement <3

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jeremydc
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Re: Current AA URM student taking Q's

Postby jeremydc » Mon Jun 21, 2010 3:23 am

I'm sure a lot of people value Kermit's opinion.

Also would you happen to know any info on need based aid? My EFC will be a 0 and i know every school is different but I waned to know if you had any experience with need based aid.

creatinganalt
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Re: Current AA URM student taking Q's

Postby creatinganalt » Mon Jun 21, 2010 4:59 am

Kohinoor wrote:
D Brooks wrote:
Kohinoor wrote:
D Brooks wrote:What's biglaw mecca for the UVa student body?

W&C? Sullivan & Cromwell?

biglaw mecca for everybody is W&C or one of the boutiques isn't it? Of course, a vanishingly small number actually get it.


Where can I find a list of starting salaries for boutiques and all firms, generally?

Is W&C really that selective? Mostly regulatory work and it has like 200 attorneys.

nalp? chambers guide? It is really that selective. Even in the boom years, we were talking a gpa requirement of 3.7


For W&C. For a URM with no clerkship - what GPA? Can you get prestigious DC without a clerkship? Would you need a journal or would grades/prior experience be enough?

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hiromoto45
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Re: Current AA URM student taking Q's

Postby hiromoto45 » Mon Jun 21, 2010 11:54 am

Kohinoor wrote:
hubtubrub wrote:what are you doing this summer?

No idea. A few people are doing firm jobs, others are RAs, and others found gov jobs. There seem to be plenty of unpaid positions still available but far fewer paid positions. IP people seem to have an easier time of it.


What are you doing this summer?

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Kohinoor
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Re: Current AA URM student taking Q's

Postby Kohinoor » Mon Jun 21, 2010 12:14 pm

hiromoto45 wrote:
Kohinoor wrote:
hubtubrub wrote:what are you doing this summer?

No idea. A few people are doing firm jobs, others are RAs, and others found gov jobs. There seem to be plenty of unpaid positions still available but far fewer paid positions. IP people seem to have an easier time of it.


What are you doing this summer?

RAing. Not a bad gig. Charlottesville is quite nice during the summer. Even the law school is rather beautiful when not being used as an instrument of torture.

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Kohinoor
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Re: Current AA URM student taking Q's

Postby Kohinoor » Mon Jun 21, 2010 12:17 pm

jeremydc wrote:I'm sure a lot of people value Kermit's opinion.

Also would you happen to know any info on need based aid? My EFC will be a 0 and i know every school is different but I waned to know if you had any experience with need based aid.

Most schools that say that they offer need based aid just mean that they will allow you to borrow how much ever in loans you need to attend the school. It doesn't necessarily mean that you'll see even a penny of grant/scholly money.

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Core
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Re: Current AA URM student taking Q's

Postby Core » Mon Jun 21, 2010 12:20 pm

jeremydc wrote:I'm sure a lot of people value Kermit's opinion.

Also would you happen to know any info on need based aid? My EFC will be a 0 and i know every school is different but I waned to know if you had any experience with need based aid.

I don't know how helpful you'll find this, but I received sizable need-based grants from Penn ($69k), Georgetown ($90k), UCLA ($48k), and a few other schools. I found that Chicago does not offer need-based aid (I'm not saying this just because I didn't receive any), and Cornell combines their need and merit-based offers.

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Kohinoor
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Re: Current AA URM student taking Q's

Postby Kohinoor » Mon Jun 21, 2010 12:22 pm

creatinganalt wrote:For W&C. For a URM with no clerkship - what GPA? Can you get prestigious DC without a clerkship? Would you need a journal or would grades/prior experience be enough?

I don't know anybody that has gotten W&C. Very small sample size. However, and this is pre-ITE and at a different but roughly equal T14, W&C would take people over a 4.0 but sometimes go for a ~3.5. Maybe the 3.5 dood was a URM? Of course, 3.5 is dancing around the top 10-15%.

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Kohinoor
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Re: Current AA URM student taking Q's

Postby Kohinoor » Sat Sep 11, 2010 1:16 pm

Guess I'm qualified to field OCI questions nao.

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Kohinoor
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Re: Current AA URM student taking Q's

Postby Kohinoor » Sat Sep 11, 2010 1:20 pm

Kohinoor wrote:
hiromoto45 wrote:
Kohinoor wrote:
hubtubrub wrote:what are you doing this summer?

No idea. A few people are doing firm jobs, others are RAs, and others found gov jobs. There seem to be plenty of unpaid positions still available but far fewer paid positions. IP people seem to have an easier time of it.


What are you doing this summer?

RAing. Not a bad gig. Charlottesville is quite nice during the summer. Even the law school is rather beautiful when not being used as an instrument of torture.

Coming out of OCI, RA work = writing lots of memos = being able to discuss substantive law at OCI. Whether discussing substantive law at OCI is a good thing remains an open question.

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DavidYurman85
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Re: Current URM students taking Q's

Postby DavidYurman85 » Sun Sep 12, 2010 5:03 pm

how was oci? does diversity seem to matter as much as people say? have you gotten offers yet? if not...good luck going forward!

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Kohinoor
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Re: Current URM students taking Q's

Postby Kohinoor » Sun Sep 12, 2010 7:53 pm

DavidYurman85 wrote:how was oci? does diversity seem to matter as much as people say? have you gotten offers yet? if not...good luck going forward!

OCI is tiring. That's what stands out most about it. Day after day of donning a suit and trudging to a room to try to convince people that you're better than 20 other similarly situated people. I didn't see diversity making many miracles happen but that might just be me (or, to put it better, diverse candidates with top credentials crush crush crush OCI but those without high grades still struggle. Thus, diversity does make a big difference but only to those who would have been fine anyway). I did notice an odd skew (with the preselect process) where I did worse at target firms and better at reach firms than expected. One clear and quantifiable advantage of being a diverse candidate is that diversity fairs end up giving you additional opportunities to sell yourself. If you have the money to do it and are open to any city, you could theoretically land a shitton of interviews by just hitting every single fair. Firms definitely do try to sell their diversity angle. ty for good luck wishes.

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Thirteen
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Re: Current URM students taking Q's

Postby Thirteen » Mon Sep 13, 2010 6:35 pm

Kohinoor wrote:
DavidYurman85 wrote:how was oci? does diversity seem to matter as much as people say? have you gotten offers yet? if not...good luck going forward!

OCI is tiring. That's what stands out most about it. Day after day of donning a suit and trudging to a room to try to convince people that you're better than 20 other similarly situated people. I didn't see diversity making many miracles happen but that might just be me (or, to put it better, diverse candidates with top credentials crush crush crush OCI but those without high grades still struggle. Thus, diversity does make a big difference but only to those who would have been fine anyway). I did notice an odd skew (with the preselect process) where I did worse at target firms and better at reach firms than expected. One clear and quantifiable advantage of being a diverse candidate is that diversity fairs end up giving you additional opportunities to sell yourself. If you have the money to do it and are open to any city, you could theoretically land a shitton of interviews by just hitting every single fair. Firms definitely do try to sell their diversity angle. ty for good luck wishes.


Thanks for answering questions, and good luck!

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2011Cycle
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Re: Current URM students taking Q's

Postby 2011Cycle » Mon Sep 13, 2010 6:40 pm

Kohinoor wrote:
DavidYurman85 wrote:how was oci? does diversity seem to matter as much as people say? have you gotten offers yet? if not...good luck going forward!

OCI is tiring. That's what stands out most about it. Day after day of donning a suit and trudging to a room to try to convince people that you're better than 20 other similarly situated people. I didn't see diversity making many miracles happen but that might just be me (or, to put it better, diverse candidates with top credentials crush crush crush OCI but those without high grades still struggle. Thus, diversity does make a big difference but only to those who would have been fine anyway). I did notice an odd skew (with the preselect process) where I did worse at target firms and better at reach firms than expected. One clear and quantifiable advantage of being a diverse candidate is that diversity fairs end up giving you additional opportunities to sell yourself. If you have the money to do it and are open to any city, you could theoretically land a shitton of interviews by just hitting every single fair. Firms definitely do try to sell their diversity angle. ty for good luck wishes.


1. Am I correct in stating you attend UVA? If not, please share the school in a PM.
2. Have you taken any of the clinical courses?

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Kohinoor
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Re: Current URM students taking Q's

Postby Kohinoor » Mon Sep 13, 2010 7:03 pm

2011Cycle wrote:
Kohinoor wrote:
DavidYurman85 wrote:how was oci? does diversity seem to matter as much as people say? have you gotten offers yet? if not...good luck going forward!

OCI is tiring. That's what stands out most about it. Day after day of donning a suit and trudging to a room to try to convince people that you're better than 20 other similarly situated people. I didn't see diversity making many miracles happen but that might just be me (or, to put it better, diverse candidates with top credentials crush crush crush OCI but those without high grades still struggle. Thus, diversity does make a big difference but only to those who would have been fine anyway). I did notice an odd skew (with the preselect process) where I did worse at target firms and better at reach firms than expected. One clear and quantifiable advantage of being a diverse candidate is that diversity fairs end up giving you additional opportunities to sell yourself. If you have the money to do it and are open to any city, you could theoretically land a shitton of interviews by just hitting every single fair. Firms definitely do try to sell their diversity angle. ty for good luck wishes.


1. Am I correct in stating you attend UVA? If not, please share the school in a PM.
2. Have you taken any of the clinical courses?

I'm at UVA and not on a clinic. I know several people who have done clinics and speak of them very highly. A friend in the employment law clinic had her own clients that she would travel to tribunals (and court I believe) to represent. Real people. Real issues. Real responsibility.

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2011Cycle
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Re: Current URM students taking Q's

Postby 2011Cycle » Mon Sep 13, 2010 7:07 pm

Kohinoor wrote:
2011Cycle wrote:
Kohinoor wrote:
DavidYurman85 wrote:how was oci? does diversity seem to matter as much as people say? have you gotten offers yet? if not...good luck going forward!

OCI is tiring. That's what stands out most about it. Day after day of donning a suit and trudging to a room to try to convince people that you're better than 20 other similarly situated people. I didn't see diversity making many miracles happen but that might just be me (or, to put it better, diverse candidates with top credentials crush crush crush OCI but those without high grades still struggle. Thus, diversity does make a big difference but only to those who would have been fine anyway). I did notice an odd skew (with the preselect process) where I did worse at target firms and better at reach firms than expected. One clear and quantifiable advantage of being a diverse candidate is that diversity fairs end up giving you additional opportunities to sell yourself. If you have the money to do it and are open to any city, you could theoretically land a shitton of interviews by just hitting every single fair. Firms definitely do try to sell their diversity angle. ty for good luck wishes.


1. Am I correct in stating you attend UVA? If not, please share the school in a PM.
2. Have you taken any of the clinical courses?

I'm at UVA and not on a clinic. I know several people who have done clinics and speak of them very highly. A friend in the employment law clinic had her own clients that she would travel to tribunals (and court I believe) to represent. Real people. Real issues. Real responsibility.


Thank you

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ChiButterfly
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Re: Current URM students taking Q's

Postby ChiButterfly » Tue Sep 14, 2010 1:49 pm

I have a few questions for those URMs currently in law school:

1. Is the Socratic Method really as intimidating as many make it out to be?
2. Is there a majorly competitive atmosphere in the schools?
3. How welcoming is the atmosphere for those who have work experience (I will have 4 years upon fall entrance)?
4. Do you feel that you have enough time for your final exams? (I heard it's only about 2 hours)
5. How popular is it for students to work during the semesters?

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Kohinoor
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Re: Current URM students taking Q's

Postby Kohinoor » Tue Sep 14, 2010 1:57 pm

ChiButterfly wrote:I have a few questions for those URMs currently in law school:

1. Is the Socratic Method really as intimidating as many make it out to be?
2. Is there a majorly competitive atmosphere in the schools?
3. How welcoming is the atmosphere for those who have work experience (I will have 4 years upon fall entrance)?
4. Do you feel that you have enough time for your final exams? (I heard it's only about 2 hours)
5. How popular is it for students to work during the semesters?

1. It's as intimidating as you let it be. If you did the reading, you have nothing to be afraid of.
2. Depends from school to school.
3. It's fine. If you like to go out, nobody cares that you're 25 instead of 21. If you don't, then its a non-issue entirely.
4. It's closer to 3-4 in my experience, and it doesn't matter since exams are graded on the curve and everybody is subject to the same restrictions. So, you don't have enough time but neither does anybody else.
5. Do not do this during your first year.

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ArchRoark
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Re: Current URM students taking Q's

Postby ArchRoark » Wed Sep 15, 2010 11:01 am

Kohinoor wrote:I'm at UVA...


Do you mind sharing the stats that got you into UVA? Did you apply as a Virginia resident? What type of URM and about when did you send in apps? Did you receive any scholarship money?

Sorry for the barrage of questions. I am trying to decide if I should ED or just let my apps roll.

My stats: 2.76/177/Mexican-American

UVA is my top choice out of the the lower T-14. I have this unrealistic hope that I may get accepted into CC. That plus the idea of weighing scholarship offers is making me unsure if I should seal the deal and send in the ED contract.

Aqualibrium
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Re: Current URM students taking Q's

Postby Aqualibrium » Wed Sep 15, 2010 11:49 am

DavidYurman85 wrote:how was oci? does diversity seem to matter as much as people say? have you gotten offers yet? if not...good luck going forward!


OCI was good for me, but OCI really shouldn't be the only thing you bank on for a job. I had a successful OCI, but as URM you are given a huge leg up on your classmates through job fairs. I went to every job fair I could go to this summer and as a result ended up with multiple offers and callbacks before OCI even started. Job fairs also help you escape the regional reputation of your school, giving you access to employers from all over the country who don't normally recruit at your school or in your region at all.

In interviews in general, I don't think diversity alone really helps you much. You still have to interview well, and you still need grades that can indicate you have the ability to do the work.


1. Is the Socratic Method really as intimidating as many make it out to be?
2. Is there a majorly competitive atmosphere in the schools?
3. How welcoming is the atmosphere for those who have work experience (I will have 4 years upon fall entrance)?
4. Do you feel that you have enough time for your final exams? (I heard it's only about 2 hours)
5. How popular is it for students to work during the semesters?


1. No. I have a lot of experience speaking in public, so this wasnt an issue for me.
2. At my school, everyone realizes that we are essentially competing against one another for grades and jobs, but that doesn't affect the collegiality of the environment.
3. Can't really answer this question as constructed. Your teachers and fellow students aren't gonna give a damn about your work experience. Employers seem to care, but in the end, interviewing well matters more than work experience ever will.
4. Different professors allow more or less time for exams. Generally though, I never feel like I found everything.
5. 2L's and 3L's often work during the semester (I am). Fulltime 1L's should not, and legally cannot work during the semester .

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Aberzombie1892
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Re: Current URM students taking Q's

Postby Aberzombie1892 » Wed Sep 15, 2010 12:10 pm

Okay.

This post is about jobs fairs that I intended and looked at (I'm leaving two off, one to maintain secrecy and the other was a Louisiana Diversity Career fair). Specifically, I will talk about the Bay Area Diversity Career far, the Southeastern Minority Job Fair, and the Sunbelt Diversity Career Fair.

Sunbelt -
If you are a URM and want to practice in TX:
GO TO A SCHOOL IN ONE OF THE FOLLOWING STATES:
Louisiana,
Texas,
Oklahoma,
New Mexico, or
Arizona.

Why? Because only URMs that go to law school in those states can attend Sunbelt.

The Sunbelt job fair had about 45 employers this year (usually it has more), and URMs have no limits on bidding (and there is no interview limit that I was aware of). Employers there include V100/NLJ250s from all over the US, Federal government, prestigious mid/small law, corporations, etc. It is definitely worth attending. It took place on August 27th in Dallas this year.

Southeastern
This job fair has no limitations on where bidding students have to go to school that I am aware of. It had around 70 employers this year and there is a bidding limit of 20. The employers were national in scope with NLJ 250s, some Federal government, mid/small law, etc. It is a neat experience and is worth attending. It took place at the end of July in Atlanta this year.

Bay Area
This job fair has no limitations on where bidding students have to go to school that I am aware of. It had around 50 employers this year and there was a bidding limit of 25. The vast majority of employers were big name California employers.

The kicker is, the Southeastern Fair and the Bay Area Fair take place during the same weekend. So you must bid on both and pick the one that provides more interviews.




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