Clerkship Placement Stats 2009 Forum

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[cornellbeez]

damn, Mich has got it going on.

Clerkship --> perfect opportunity to ride out the economy

Mich/UVA kick ass.

[cornellbeez]

Agreed. Duke has always seemed like a damn good school to me, just a damn good school in a damn bad location.

Michigan and Cornell both have worse locations than Duke.

...have you been to AA or Ithaca? Very pretty places. Not big cities, but there's plenty to do. A huge plus with them is that it is not rapingly hot in the spring/summer like it is in NC.

[zero1]

And without going into any stupid rivalry crap, anybody who wouldn't go to a school with the 20th best reputation (per USNWR survey) for next to nothing over a school with the 13th best rep. for $30k/yr is either irrational or pompous.

Duke is only 13th in reputation? That's surprising. I guess it's because the school rose to prominence just recently a la NYU law school.

You would think that a school which has never been ranked outside the top 10 since USNWR first started a rankings system would be higher in rep.

Huh? I was under the impression that Duke's been a prominent school for a long time. They fare better in the computed rankings because they are biased heavily towards private schools, especially small private schools.

Anyway, here's the most recent Academic Reputation rankings, in case you're interested:

1. Harvard
1. MIT
1. Stanford
4. Princeton
4. Yale
6. Berkeley
7. CIT
7. Chicago
9. Columbia
9. Cornell
9. Johns Hopkins
9. Penn
13. Duke
13. Michigan
15. Brown
15. Dartmouth
15. Northwestern
15. UVA
19. UCLA
20. Carnegie Mellon
20. UNC-Chapel Hill
20. Wisconsin
20. WUSTL
24. Georgetown
24. Georgia Tech
24. Rice
24. Illinois
24. Texas
24. Vanderbilt
30. Emory
30. Notre Dame
30. USC
30. U. Washington

Thanks for the list.

I thought Duke only became recognized as one of the most elite when Terry Sanford became president (1969/1970). Perhaps my NYU analogy was a bit hyperbolic. In any case, before him, Duke had a substantial budget deficit and a piss poor alumni giving rate. I believe he gained a lot of notoriety (infamy?) for his stance on legacy admissions and whatnot. Most of the schools that are ahead of Duke on this list were preeminent way before though.

[kurama20]

...have you been to AA or Ithaca? Very pretty places. Not big cities, but there's plenty to do. A huge plus with them is that it is not rapingly hot in the spring/summer like it is in NC.

A huge minus with them is that it is arctic tundra cold during the winter in Annn Arbor and Ithaca, wer'e talking an average high of 32 degress during the winter and lots of snow every year. Even during April and May you are talking about 40 degree weather. That's insane. North Carolina gets hot but it doesn't get super hot until the summer( it's in the 70s during most of the year, in the winter it drops far below that), during which time you should be doing internships somewhere other than Durham. Not to mention that NC is very pretty as well.

[cornellbeez]

...have you been to AA or Ithaca? Very pretty places. Not big cities, but there's plenty to do. A huge plus with them is that it is not rapingly hot in the spring/summer like it is in NC.

A huge minus with them is that it is arctic tundra cold during the winter in Annn Arbor and Ithaca, wer'e talking an average high of 32 degress during the winter and lots of snow every year. Even during April and May you are talking about 40 degree weather. That's insane. North Carolina gets hot but it doesn't get super hot until the summer( it's in the 70s during most of the year, in the winter it drops far below that), during which time you should be doing internships somewhere other than Durham. Not to mention that NC is very pretty as well.

Actually you're wrong...In May/April it is primarily 60 degree weather. Right now AA has 60-70 degree weather everyday. Ithaca has worse winters than AA, but the winters are over-exaggerated. Not to mention the humidity in the South is ridiculous and probably what makes it so unbearable in the spring/summer. It doesn't get that humid up north.

For northerners, it's primarily the humidity that they can't stand.

[dresden doll]

...have you been to AA or Ithaca? Very pretty places. Not big cities, but there's plenty to do. A huge plus with them is that it is not rapingly hot in the spring/summer like it is in NC.

A huge minus with them is that it is arctic tundra cold during the winter in Annn Arbor and Ithaca, wer'e talking an average high of 32 degress during the winter and lots of snow every year. Even during April and May you are talking about 40 degree weather. That's insane. North Carolina gets hot but it doesn't get super hot until the summer( it's in the 70s during most of the year, in the winter it drops far below that), during which time you should be doing internships somewhere other than Durham. Not to mention that NC is very pretty as well.

Actually you're wrong...In May/April it is primarily 60 degree weather. Right now AA has 60-70 degree weather everyday. Ithaca has worse winters than AA, but the winters are over-exaggerated. Not to mention the humidity in the South is ridiculous and probably what makes it so unbearable in the spring/summer. It doesn't get that humid up north.

I don't want to get into a match off here, but I want to point out that for people looking into relocating with SOs, Durham might work a lot better than AA or Ithaca. Durham is in a vibrant area with lots of technology/reserach industry. My SO could've relocated with me to Duke, but he found it impossible to follow me to either Cornell or Michigan.

[kurama20]

Actually you're wrong...In May/April it is primarily 60 degree weather. Right now AA has 60-70 degree weather everyday. Ithaca has worse winters than AA, but the winters are over-exaggerated. Not to mention the humidity in the South is ridiculous. It doesn't get that humid up north.

check out the weather section for both towns
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ithaca,_New_York

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ann_Arbor,_Michigan

The snow, snow storms, freezing winds and the below 30 degrees weather in the north are ridiculous. In response to the bolded that's the summer time.....you will not be in either town during the summer unless you messed up your grades or something. Also the fact that it is in the 60s during July in Ann Arbor/Ithaca is just an obvious sign of how cold the fall, winter, and spring will be. Outside of the summer time NC is not going to be rapingly hot.

[cornellbeez]

Actually you're wrong...In May/April it is primarily 60 degree weather. Right now AA has 60-70 degree weather everyday. Ithaca has worse winters than AA, but the winters are over-exaggerated. Not to mention the humidity in the South is ridiculous. It doesn't get that humid up north.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ithaca,_New_York

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ann_Arbor,_Michigan

The snow, snow storms, freezing winds and the below 30 degrees weather in the north are ridiculous. In response to the bolded that's the summer time.....you will not be in either town during the summer unless you messed up your grades or something. Also the fact that it is in the 60s during July in Ann Arbor is just an obvious sign of how cold the fall, winter, and spring will be. Outside of the summer time NC is not going to be rapingly hot.

Cold/snow >>>>>>>>>>>humidity. My s/o is from the South ...there's no way in hell I can live there after visiting. It is humid practically all the time there. But I'm a northerner, so whatever. I will say this much. East coast winters are like Midwest winters. Both coasts feel the same as the Midwest during the spring/summer. The South is like another region completely...super hot in the spring/summer and also kinda hot during the fall/winter.

[rayiner]

Snow is TTT.

I'll grant you that the south is pretty humid, and if that bothers you, you've got a problem. However, at least when you go inside you can get away from the humidity. Getting away from the cold, though, is harder. Even here in Atlanta I have to wear a sweater indoors in the winter, because my office, apartment, etc, can never stay warm enough.

Also, regarding cold/dark versus warm/sunny: people go on vacation to Cancun, not Ann Arbor. QED.

[cornellbeez]

You can also get away from the cold inside. Atlanta offices aren't build for cold weather because it is in the South. heating and A/C systems are built depending on the region. up north practically every building has heating. There's just no getting away from humidity, the air that you breathe is humid and you can feel it in your lungs. You can always bundle up in the cold.

[snotrocket]

A huge minus with them is that it is arctic tundra cold during the winter in Annn Arbor and Ithaca, wer'e talking an average high of 32 degress during the winter and lots of snow every year. Even during April and May you are talking about 40 degree weather. That's insane. North Carolina gets hot but it doesn't get super hot until the summer( it's in the 70s during most of the year, in the winter it drops far below that), during which time you should be doing internships somewhere other than Durham. Not to mention that NC is very pretty as well.

Stop pulling numbers out of your ass. It gets quite cold in Michigan, but it is not even remotely "arctic tundra cold." It never gets close to the epic, skin peeling -50F cold of places like Minnesota, and it's not even as severe as Chicago or Buffalo, which get far more wind and snow despite being at about the same latitude. The average high from April through October is around 60F, and the average highs in the thirties only hit for three months out of the year.

http://www.weatherbase.com/weather/weat ... =&units=us

[kurama20]

Snow is TTT.

I'll grant you that the south is pretty humid, and if that bothers you, you've got a problem. However, at least when you go inside you can get away from the humidity. Getting away from the cold, though, is harder. Even here in Atlanta I have to bundle up inside during the winter because my office/etc is never kept warm enough.

Seriously people do not realize...in the south you are going to get a cold during the winter and part of the fall (all the way down to the teens actually). However the cold doesn't last outside of a few months and it isn't arctic and filled with snowstorms and weather that can put you in the hospital. Even when it gets rapingly hot, it won't matter becasue you can just go inside and turn on the AC. Arctic cold like the kind in Ann Arbor and Ithaca doesn't work like that. You just simply cannot escape it. It also makes it incredibly difficult to drive and it makes flying dangerous. It is also mentally depressing when it's always grey outside and it's snowing and freezing in March. Humidity won't make you sick or force you in doors for months, or cause you to get stuck in 2 feet deep snow.

[rayiner]

You can also get away from the cold inside. Atlanta offices aren't build for cold weather because it is in the South. heating and A/C systems are built depending on the region. up north practically every building has heating.

Every building here in Atlanta has both heat and AC. It's a fairly new city, so all the buildings are pretty up-to-date. You still can't avoid the drafts, people opening doors, etc. The latter is pretty crucial --- I can't sit inside Starbucks' in the winter because people going in and out make them unbearably cold/drafty.

[snotrocket]

for people looking into relocating with SOs, Durham might work a lot better than AA or Ithaca. Durham is in a vibrant area with lots of technology/reserach industry. My SO could've relocated with me to Duke, but he found it impossible to follow me to either Cornell or Michigan.

AA and Ithaca are both small towns, with one giant employer each. This can be a serious issue if you're counting on having a working spouse while in school.

[soullesswonder]

Actually you're wrong...In May/April it is primarily 60 degree weather. Right now AA has 60-70 degree weather everyday. Ithaca has worse winters than AA, but the winters are over-exaggerated. Not to mention the humidity in the South is ridiculous. It doesn't get that humid up north.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ithaca,_New_York

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ann_Arbor,_Michigan

The snow, snow storms, freezing winds and the below 30 degrees weather in the north are ridiculous. In response to the bolded that's the summer time.....you will not be in either town during the summer unless you messed up your grades or something. Also the fact that it is in the 60s during July in Ann Arbor is just an obvious sign of how cold the fall, winter, and spring will be. Outside of the summer time NC is not going to be rapingly hot.

Cold/snow >>>>>>>>>>>humidity. My s/o is from the South ...there's no way in hell I can live there after visiting. It is humid practically all the time there. But I'm a northerner, so whatever. I will say this much. East coast winters are like Midwest winters. Both coasts feel the same as the Midwest during the spring/summer. The South is like another region completely...super hot in the spring/summer and also kinda hot during the fall/winter.

WTH? I grew up with snow days in the upper South. I've also seen December snow in South Carolina, and January snow in Birmingham, AL. I've been at soccer matches outside Nashville where the March sleet was blowing sideways. Summers are one thing, but winters are certainly nowhere close to "hot" unless you live in S. Florida.

[zero1]

You can also get away from the cold inside. Atlanta offices aren't build for cold weather because it is in the South. heating and A/C systems are built depending on the region. up north practically every building has heating.

Every building here in Atlanta has both heat and AC. It's a fairly new city, so all the buildings are pretty up-to-date. You still can't avoid the drafts, people opening doors, etc. The latter is pretty crucial --- I can't sit inside Starbucks' in the winter because people going in and out make them unbearably cold/drafty.

I hate this as well.

[cornellbeez]

Seriously people do not realize...in the south you are going to get a cold during the winter and part of the fall (all the way down to the teens actually). However the cold doesn't last outside of a few months and it isn't arctic and filled with snowstorms and weather that can put you in the hospital. Even when it gets rapingly hot, it won't matter becasue you can just go inside and turn on the AC. Arctic cold like the kind in Ann Arbor and Ithaca doesn't work like that. You just simply cannot escape it. It also makes it incredibly difficult to drive and it makes flying dangerous. It is also mentally depressing when it's always grey outside and it's snowing and freezing in March. Humidity won't make you sick or force you in doors for months, or cause you to get stuck in 2 feet deep snow.

It is not even remotely freezing in March... stop speaking bullshit please. Visit AA or Ithaca in the Spring and then comment.

Also more people die from heatstroke than "cold weather" every year in America. So yes, humidity/hot weather is more dangerous for people, especially the oldies.

btw, snotrocket is right, Michigan is not like Minnesota. And Chicago is colder than AA. Neither is "arctic" cold.

[kurama20]

Stop pulling numbers out of your ass. It gets quite cold in Michigan, but it is not even remotely "arctic tundra cold." It never gets close to the epic, skin peeling -50F cold of places like Minnesota, and it's not even as severe as Chicago or Buffalo, which get far more wind and snow despite being at about the same latitude. The average high from April through October is around 60F, and the average highs in the thirties only hit for three months out of the year.

Are you illiterate dumbass? Check out the temperature averages/ranges for Ann Arbor and Ithaca on the wiki links I posted. And why the hell would you be so stupid as to use temperature averages from the middle of the damn summer to prove your point? Of course it isn't as cold during the summer captain obvious. And obviously artic tundra cold was an exaggeration. You actuallly think saying that it doesn't reach -50 degrees in Michigan is helping prove that it doesn't get cold in Mich? Are you insane? 10 and 20 degrees is very very cold. Did you really just use "60 degree is the average high from April to Oct" to prove that it isn't extremely cold in Michigan? You are really only making it more obvious how cold it is in Ann Arbor.

It is not even remotely freezing in March... stop speaking bullshit please. Visit AA or Ithaca in the Spring and then comment

.

Yeah cause 20-30 degrees in March is obviously not cold at all. Visit Atlanta and stop spitting bullshit out of your ass.

[rayiner]

Seriously people do not realize...in the south you are going to get a cold during the winter and part of the fall (all the way down to the teens actually). However the cold doesn't last outside of a few months and it isn't arctic and filled with snowstorms and weather that can put you in the hospital. Even when it gets rapingly hot, it won't matter becasue you can just go inside and turn on the AC. Arctic cold like the kind in Ann Arbor and Ithaca doesn't work like that. You just simply cannot escape it. It also makes it incredibly difficult to drive and it makes flying dangerous. It is also mentally depressing when it's always grey outside and it's snowing and freezing in March. Humidity won't make you sick or force you in doors for months, or cause you to get stuck in 2 feet deep snow.

It is not even remotely freezing in March... stop speaking bullshit please. Visit AA or Ithaca in the Spring and then comment.

Also more people die from heatstroke than "cold weather" every year in America. So yes, humidity/hot weather is more dangerous for people, especially the oldies.

btw, snotrocket is right, Michigan is not like Minnesota. And Chicago is colder than AA. Neither is "arctic" cold.

Ann Arbor: http://www.weather.com/outlook/travel/v ... undeclared

Durham: http://www.weather.com/outlook/travel/v ... undeclared

27/45 lo/hi in March is pretty fricking shitty.

Also, who cares about old people?

[jschuyler]

Stop pulling numbers out of your ass. It gets quite cold in Michigan, but it is not even remotely "arctic tundra cold." It never gets close to the epic, skin peeling -50F cold of places like Minnesota, and it's not even as severe as Chicago or Buffalo, which get far more wind and snow despite being at about the same latitude. The average high from April through October is around 60F, and the average highs in the thirties only hit for three months out of the year.

Are you illiterate dumbass? Check out the temperature averages/ranges for Ann Arbor and Ithaca on the wiki links I posted. And why the hell would you be so stupid as to use temperature averages from the middle of the damn summer to prove your point? Of course it isn't as cold during the summer captain obvious. And obviously artic tundra cold was an exaggeration. You actuallly think saying that it doesn't reach -50 degrees in Michigan is helping prove that it doesn't get cold in Mich? Are you insane? 10 and 20 degrees is very very cold. Did you really just use "60 degree is the average high from April to Oct" to prove that it isn't extremely cold in Michigan? You are really only making it more obvious how cold it is in Ann Arbor.

What will happen to TLS when people run out of stupid shit to argue about? I bet it will resemble this Mr. Show sketch:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UfUv5t71_Xo

[cornellbeez]

[
Yeah cause 20-30 degrees in March is obviously not cold at all. Visit Atlanta and stop spitting bullshit out of your ass.

Average is 45 in march...which to be honest, really isn't that cold. Then again, I'm a northerner.

I think most non-southerners would agree with me that the South's humidity/weather sucks.

The takeaway of all this? More cross admits choose Michigan over Duke..argument over.

[rayiner]

[
Yeah cause 20-30 degrees in March is obviously not cold at all. Visit Atlanta and stop spitting bullshit out of your ass.

Average is 45 in march...which to be honest, really isn't that cold. Then again, I'm covered with a thick layer of insulating blubber.

[dresden doll]

for people looking into relocating with SOs, Durham might work a lot better than AA or Ithaca. Durham is in a vibrant area with lots of technology/reserach industry. My SO could've relocated with me to Duke, but he found it impossible to follow me to either Cornell or Michigan.

AA and Ithaca are both small towns, with one giant employer each. This can be a serious issue if you're counting on having a working spouse while in school.

Yeah, it pretty much killed my otherwise serious intent to attend Michigan. I am counting on having a working partner and SO has his own career to chase after. He cannot exactly sit on his butt/work at a nearby restaurant for three years while I finish school.

[kurama20]

WTH? I grew up with snow days in the upper South. I've also seen December snow in South Carolina, and January snow in Birmingham, AL. I've been at soccer matches outside Nashville where the March sleet was blowing sideways. Summers are one thing, but winters are certainly nowhere close to "hot" unless you live in S. Florida.

TITCR One thing I've noticed about TLS is that a lot of the people are from the north and have barely even visited the south. They start talking out of their ass about the weather and other things and it becomes quickly obvious that they have no idea what they are talking about. It defintiely gets cold in the south, just only in the fall/winter. For those of us who have spent time in both regions we know what we are talking about. People don't realize that the south gets cold, it just doesn't get to the mind blowing single digits like some places in the north get. Having been to both places and experiencing the level of cold that even Philly, Conneticut, and NYC offer, it is rather obvious to me how cold it gets in places like Mich and upstate NY. I even work with people from the area and they warn me how cold it gets. It can be insane.