UCI or Georgetown for CA Big Law

(Rankings, Profiles, Tuition, Student Life, . . . )

Which school is the best choice for CA Big Law?

Georgetown COA max $150,000
12
75%
UCI COA max $115,00
4
25%
 
Total votes: 16

gtowntexas

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UCI or Georgetown for CA Big Law

Postby gtowntexas » Fri May 04, 2018 12:44 pm

Hello,

I have these two choices for law school at the moment. I want to pursue Big Law in CA but I prefer having non-CA Big Law over CA non-big law. I am from CA, went to college in CA, and would like to come back after law school.

My two choices are Georgetown COA max at $150,000 and UCI COA max $115,000

Which school provides the best value and opportunity relative to its cost?

gtowntexas

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Re: UCI or Georgetown for CA Big Law

Postby gtowntexas » Fri May 04, 2018 1:21 pm

gtowntexas wrote:Hello,

I have these two choices for law school at the moment. I want to pursue Big Law in CA but I prefer having non-CA Big Law over CA non-big law. I am from CA, went to college in CA, and would like to come back after law school.

My two choices are Georgetown COA max at $150,000 and UCI COA max $115,000

Which school provides the best value and opportunity relative to its cost?

sparkytrainer

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Re: UCI or Georgetown for CA Big Law

Postby sparkytrainer » Fri May 04, 2018 1:56 pm

For biglaw generally, these are iffy choices. Georgetown obviously gives you a much better chance at biglaw generally, but that is rather expensive for Georgetown.

Irvine gives you a 30ish% chance at biglaw. https://www.lstreports.com/schools/irvine/jobs/

GT gives you a 45% chance at biglaw. https://www.lstreports.com/schools/gulc/jobs/

Given the prices, I would say neither. I would not pay 115k for a 30% chance at biglaw. I would also not pay 150k for GT for a 45% chance. Also, GT is not going to place you into California very well. It could, but you are competing against 13 better schools with better placement and UCLA/USC for CA placement.

If the goal is biglaw in CA, Irvine is defensible, but not at that price. I would recommend retaking, getting 5 more points right, then either considering Irvine for free with the thought that you have to be in the top 25% of your chance for a shot at biglaw, or for admissions to a t13 that give you a much better chance at biglaw.

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urmlaw17

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Re: UCI or Georgetown for CA Big Law

Postby urmlaw17 » Fri May 04, 2018 3:42 pm

sparkytrainer wrote:For biglaw generally, these are iffy choices. Georgetown obviously gives you a much better chance at biglaw generally, but that is rather expensive for Georgetown.

Irvine gives you a 30ish% chance at biglaw. https://www.lstreports.com/schools/irvine/jobs/

GT gives you a 45% chance at biglaw. https://www.lstreports.com/schools/gulc/jobs/

Given the prices, I would say neither. I would not pay 115k for a 30% chance at biglaw. I would also not pay 150k for GT for a 45% chance. Also, GT is not going to place you into California very well. It could, but you are competing against 13 better schools with better placement and UCLA/USC for CA placement.

If the goal is biglaw in CA, Irvine is defensible, but not at that price. I would recommend retaking, getting 5 more points right, then either considering Irvine for free with the thought that you have to be in the top 25% of your chance for a shot at biglaw, or for admissions to a t13 that give you a much better chance at biglaw.


Dear sparkytrainer,

Thank you for your advice. For UCI, I was already awarded their highest scholarship offer listed in Lawschoolnumbers. I already asked for reconsideration and was denied. I dont think an increase in LSAT will help me with scholarship numbers there since I already have a 169.

For Georgetown, at what cost do you see Georgetown being worth attending? If I can shave $5,000 off my living expenses every year, then I would graduate with around $130,000.If I am able to get a SA in 2L summer, I can put 15k-20k to my debt and graduate with around 100K. What do you think?

If I am interested in Fed Clerks as well, UCI goes up to 41% and Georgetown to 56%. Is it make it worth it to attend then?

sparkytrainer

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Re: UCI or Georgetown for CA Big Law

Postby sparkytrainer » Fri May 04, 2018 4:03 pm

urmlaw17 wrote:
sparkytrainer wrote:For biglaw generally, these are iffy choices. Georgetown obviously gives you a much better chance at biglaw generally, but that is rather expensive for Georgetown.

Irvine gives you a 30ish% chance at biglaw. https://www.lstreports.com/schools/irvine/jobs/

GT gives you a 45% chance at biglaw. https://www.lstreports.com/schools/gulc/jobs/

Given the prices, I would say neither. I would not pay 115k for a 30% chance at biglaw. I would also not pay 150k for GT for a 45% chance. Also, GT is not going to place you into California very well. It could, but you are competing against 13 better schools with better placement and UCLA/USC for CA placement.

If the goal is biglaw in CA, Irvine is defensible, but not at that price. I would recommend retaking, getting 5 more points right, then either considering Irvine for free with the thought that you have to be in the top 25% of your chance for a shot at biglaw, or for admissions to a t13 that give you a much better chance at biglaw.


Dear sparkytrainer,

Thank you for your advice. For UCI, I was already awarded their highest scholarship offer listed in Lawschoolnumbers. I already asked for reconsideration and was denied. I dont think an increase in LSAT will help me with scholarship numbers there since I already have a 169.

For Georgetown, at what cost do you see Georgetown being worth attending? If I can shave $5,000 off my living expenses every year, then I would graduate with around $130,000.If I am able to get a SA in 2L summer, I can put 15k-20k to my debt and graduate with around 100K. What do you think?

If I am interested in Fed Clerks as well, UCI goes up to 41% and Georgetown to 56%. Is it make it worth it to attend then?


Are you OP? Do you have two accounts? I mean UCI should be out for that cost. Just indefensible. Weren't they giving out full rides like candy?

Georgetown is defensible near free. Idk, maybe 50k max. Remember, 100k is 180-190k at repayment with interest. 150k repayment with interest is 250k. That is a huge number.

beinghuman

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Re: UCI or Georgetown for CA Big Law

Postby beinghuman » Fri May 04, 2018 4:21 pm

I agree with Sparkytrainer.
I will say though that large firm numbers for Georgetown for 2017 are around 54% now, so it's a 50/50 shot rather than 1 in 3 at Irvine.
However, that's still not great at that price.
At this point, you have no idea how well you will do in law school. So you should not count on a 2L SA out of Georgetown or UCI in making your decision. I would personally take GT over Irvine if you really want to go this fall but it might make your return to CA more difficult. Also, I have no ties to and no interest in living in CA so that makes my advice a little biased.
Was Cornell not an option? It's just one spot above GT and would give you much better chances at NY biglaw.



urmlaw17 wrote:
sparkytrainer wrote:For biglaw generally, these are iffy choices. Georgetown obviously gives you a much better chance at biglaw generally, but that is rather expensive for Georgetown.

Irvine gives you a 30ish% chance at biglaw. https://www.lstreports.com/schools/irvine/jobs/

GT gives you a 45% chance at biglaw. https://www.lstreports.com/schools/gulc/jobs/

Given the prices, I would say neither. I would not pay 115k for a 30% chance at biglaw. I would also not pay 150k for GT for a 45% chance. Also, GT is not going to place you into California very well. It could, but you are competing against 13 better schools with better placement and UCLA/USC for CA placement.

If the goal is biglaw in CA, Irvine is defensible, but not at that price. I would recommend retaking, getting 5 more points right, then either considering Irvine for free with the thought that you have to be in the top 25% of your chance for a shot at biglaw, or for admissions to a t13 that give you a much better chance at biglaw.


Dear sparkytrainer,

Thank you for your advice. For UCI, I was already awarded their highest scholarship offer listed in Lawschoolnumbers. I already asked for reconsideration and was denied. I dont think an increase in LSAT will help me with scholarship numbers there since I already have a 169.

For Georgetown, at what cost do you see Georgetown being worth attending? If I can shave $5,000 off my living expenses every year, then I would graduate with around $130,000.If I am able to get a SA in 2L summer, I can put 15k-20k to my debt and graduate with around 100K. What do you think?

If I am interested in Fed Clerks as well, UCI goes up to 41% and Georgetown to 56%. Is it make it worth it to attend then?

biglawhopeful18

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Re: UCI or Georgetown for CA Big Law

Postby biglawhopeful18 » Fri May 04, 2018 9:05 pm

Current Georgetown student heading to CA biglaw. Idk where the above poster got the updated biglaw stats, but doesn’t surprise me at all. Vast majority of the people I know who wanted it got it. Myself, I landed multiple CA biglaw offers despite being below median. It’s been discussed a lot here in the past, but the number of highly qualified gov’t & PI types this school attracts truly skews the employment numbers. To what extent is hard to discern, but to claim that because we place x% in big firms means you have an x% shot at a big firm is untrue.

Full disclosure: I have a unique background which I’m sure helped me land offers. At the same time, I was literally amazed at how many weird, neurotic, socially awkward kids are at this school (and I’d assume most major law schools). No doubt this results in people with average or even exceptional grades underperform or even strike out at EIW. Being a normal person capable of holding a conversation probably gave me a competitive advantage in interviews.

This is not to be facetious; I say this to illustrate that you need to be honest with yourself. If you’re a K-JD awkward-type, you should err on the side of caution. If you have WE and are objectively normal, I would defend Georgetown at that price.

On top of EIW and mass mailing, Georgetown participates in OTIP (On Tour Interview Program) where we, along with other t14’s, can choose to participate in interview programs in non-NY or DC major markets. LA and SF are part of OTIP. This takes place before EIW and essentially gives you two bites at the apple.

CA markets are very different. Some are very insular. LA was smaller than I anticipated. CA overall is tough, not gonna lie, but you’ll have every opportunity to get it from here. Since you say non-CA biglaw is preferable to CA non-biglaw, I think Georgetown is a no-brainer between these two. Even if you “only” land NY biglaw, just transfer to that firm’s CA office after a couple years.

Lastly, DC is a way cooler place than Irvine to spend 3 years of your life. Not even close.

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urmlaw17

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Re: UCI or Georgetown for CA Big Law

Postby urmlaw17 » Sat May 05, 2018 12:48 am

biglawhopeful18 wrote:Current Georgetown student heading to CA biglaw. Idk where the above poster got the updated biglaw stats, but doesn’t surprise me at all. Vast majority of the people I know who wanted it got it. Myself, I landed multiple CA biglaw offers despite being below median. It’s been discussed a lot here in the past, but the number of highly qualified gov’t & PI types this school attracts truly skews the employment numbers. To what extent is hard to discern, but to claim that because we place x% in big firms means you have an x% shot at a big firm is untrue.

Full disclosure: I have a unique background which I’m sure helped me land offers. At the same time, I was literally amazed at how many weird, neurotic, socially awkward kids are at this school (and I’d assume most major law schools). No doubt this results in people with average or even exceptional grades underperform or even strike out at EIW. Being a normal person capable of holding a conversation probably gave me a competitive advantage in interviews.

This is not to be facetious; I say this to illustrate that you need to be honest with yourself. If you’re a K-JD awkward-type, you should err on the side of caution. If you have WE and are objectively normal, I would defend Georgetown at that price.

On top of EIW and mass mailing, Georgetown participates in OTIP (On Tour Interview Program) where we, along with other t14’s, can choose to participate in interview programs in non-NY or DC major markets. LA and SF are part of OTIP. This takes place before EIW and essentially gives you two bites at the apple.

CA markets are very different. Some are very insular. LA was smaller than I anticipated. CA overall is tough, not gonna lie, but you’ll have every opportunity to get it from here. Since you say non-CA biglaw is preferable to CA non-biglaw, I think Georgetown is a no-brainer between these two. Even if you “only” land NY biglaw, just transfer to that firm’s CA office after a couple years.

Lastly, DC is a way cooler place than Irvine to spend 3 years of your life. Not even close.


Thank you so much!!!! Is there any way I can contact you outside of TLS to chat? Im committed to attending Georgetown and would like to pick your brain. :)

Generic1L

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Re: UCI or Georgetown for CA Big Law

Postby Generic1L » Sat May 05, 2018 11:32 pm

sparkytrainer wrote:For biglaw generally, these are iffy choices. Georgetown obviously gives you a much better chance at biglaw generally, but that is rather expensive for Georgetown.

Irvine gives you a 30ish% chance at biglaw. https://www.lstreports.com/schools/irvine/jobs/

GT gives you a 45% chance at biglaw. https://www.lstreports.com/schools/gulc/jobs/

Given the prices, I would say neither. I would not pay 115k for a 30% chance at biglaw. I would also not pay 150k for GT for a 45% chance. Also, GT is not going to place you into California very well. It could, but you are competing against 13 better schools with better placement and UCLA/USC for CA placement.

If the goal is biglaw in CA, Irvine is defensible, but not at that price. I would recommend retaking, getting 5 more points right, then either considering Irvine for free with the thought that you have to be in the top 25% of your chance for a shot at biglaw, or for admissions to a t13 that give you a much better chance at biglaw.


Georgetown student here. I would err against looking at cold statistics, as a lot of people opt for different programs. I received a CA Biglaw offer at EIW, and I would say that most people that reach for Biglaw attain it. That being said I will be clerking after I graduate and will most likely apply for DOJ Honors after, so my stats will not add to the statistics that the above poster is referencing. The evidence is anecdotal, but it's representative of a good portion of Georgetown students who strive for clerkships, federal honors programs, and public interest.

Either way, I'm not here to argue that you will definitely get a biglaw job; just that you should not rely on statistics. Your grades, interviewing style, and connections/ties are probably more determinative factors. I think either school will help you attain your goal, so make sure to base your decision on more than numbers. Hope that helps!

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urmlaw17

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Re: UCI or Georgetown for CA Big Law

Postby urmlaw17 » Mon May 07, 2018 3:37 pm

Generic1L wrote:
sparkytrainer wrote:For biglaw generally, these are iffy choices. Georgetown obviously gives you a much better chance at biglaw generally, but that is rather expensive for Georgetown.

Irvine gives you a 30ish% chance at biglaw. https://www.lstreports.com/schools/irvine/jobs/

GT gives you a 45% chance at biglaw. https://www.lstreports.com/schools/gulc/jobs/

Given the prices, I would say neither. I would not pay 115k for a 30% chance at biglaw. I would also not pay 150k for GT for a 45% chance. Also, GT is not going to place you into California very well. It could, but you are competing against 13 better schools with better placement and UCLA/USC for CA placement.

If the goal is biglaw in CA, Irvine is defensible, but not at that price. I would recommend retaking, getting 5 more points right, then either considering Irvine for free with the thought that you have to be in the top 25% of your chance for a shot at biglaw, or for admissions to a t13 that give you a much better chance at biglaw.


Georgetown student here. I would err against looking at cold statistics, as a lot of people opt for different programs. I received a CA Biglaw offer at EIW, and I would say that most people that reach for Biglaw attain it. That being said I will be clerking after I graduate and will most likely apply for DOJ Honors after, so my stats will not add to the statistics that the above poster is referencing. The evidence is anecdotal, but it's representative of a good portion of Georgetown students who strive for clerkships, federal honors programs, and public interest.

Either way, I'm not here to argue that you will definitely get a biglaw job; just that you should not rely on statistics. Your grades, interviewing style, and connections/ties are probably more determinative factors. I think either school will help you attain your goal, so make sure to base your decision on more than numbers. Hope that helps!


Thank you!

I feel so must more confident to attend Georgetown in the fall.

biglawhopeful18

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Re: UCI or Georgetown for CA Big Law

Postby biglawhopeful18 » Tue May 08, 2018 12:47 pm

urmlaw17 wrote:
biglawhopeful18 wrote:Current Georgetown student heading to CA biglaw. Idk where the above poster got the updated biglaw stats, but doesn’t surprise me at all. Vast majority of the people I know who wanted it got it. Myself, I landed multiple CA biglaw offers despite being below median. It’s been discussed a lot here in the past, but the number of highly qualified gov’t & PI types this school attracts truly skews the employment numbers. To what extent is hard to discern, but to claim that because we place x% in big firms means you have an x% shot at a big firm is untrue.

Full disclosure: I have a unique background which I’m sure helped me land offers. At the same time, I was literally amazed at how many weird, neurotic, socially awkward kids are at this school (and I’d assume most major law schools). No doubt this results in people with average or even exceptional grades underperform or even strike out at EIW. Being a normal person capable of holding a conversation probably gave me a competitive advantage in interviews.

This is not to be facetious; I say this to illustrate that you need to be honest with yourself. If you’re a K-JD awkward-type, you should err on the side of caution. If you have WE and are objectively normal, I would defend Georgetown at that price.

On top of EIW and mass mailing, Georgetown participates in OTIP (On Tour Interview Program) where we, along with other t14’s, can choose to participate in interview programs in non-NY or DC major markets. LA and SF are part of OTIP. This takes place before EIW and essentially gives you two bites at the apple.

CA markets are very different. Some are very insular. LA was smaller than I anticipated. CA overall is tough, not gonna lie, but you’ll have every opportunity to get it from here. Since you say non-CA biglaw is preferable to CA non-biglaw, I think Georgetown is a no-brainer between these two. Even if you “only” land NY biglaw, just transfer to that firm’s CA office after a couple years.

Lastly, DC is a way cooler place than Irvine to spend 3 years of your life. Not even close.


Thank you so much!!!! Is there any way I can contact you outside of TLS to chat? Im committed to attending Georgetown and would like to pick your brain. :)


Sure, PM me

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urmlaw17

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Re: UCI or Georgetown for CA Big Law

Postby urmlaw17 » Wed May 09, 2018 12:32 am

biglawhopeful18 wrote:
urmlaw17 wrote:
biglawhopeful18 wrote:Current Georgetown student heading to CA biglaw. Idk where the above poster got the updated biglaw stats, but doesn’t surprise me at all. Vast majority of the people I know who wanted it got it. Myself, I landed multiple CA biglaw offers despite being below median. It’s been discussed a lot here in the past, but the number of highly qualified gov’t & PI types this school attracts truly skews the employment numbers. To what extent is hard to discern, but to claim that because we place x% in big firms means you have an x% shot at a big firm is untrue.

Full disclosure: I have a unique background which I’m sure helped me land offers. At the same time, I was literally amazed at how many weird, neurotic, socially awkward kids are at this school (and I’d assume most major law schools). No doubt this results in people with average or even exceptional grades underperform or even strike out at EIW. Being a normal person capable of holding a conversation probably gave me a competitive advantage in interviews.

This is not to be facetious; I say this to illustrate that you need to be honest with yourself. If you’re a K-JD awkward-type, you should err on the side of caution. If you have WE and are objectively normal, I would defend Georgetown at that price.


Pm option is not available in TLS anymore.

On top of EIW and mass mailing, Georgetown participates in OTIP (On Tour Interview Program) where we, along with other t14’s, can choose to participate in interview programs in non-NY or DC major markets. LA and SF are part of OTIP. This takes place before EIW and essentially gives you two bites at the apple.

CA markets are very different. Some are very insular. LA was smaller than I anticipated. CA overall is tough, not gonna lie, but you’ll have every opportunity to get it from here. Since you say non-CA biglaw is preferable to CA non-biglaw, I think Georgetown is a no-brainer between these two. Even if you “only” land NY biglaw, just transfer to that firm’s CA office after a couple years.

Lastly, DC is a way cooler place than Irvine to spend 3 years of your life. Not even close.


Thank you so much!!!! Is there any way I can contact you outside of TLS to chat? Im committed to attending Georgetown and would like to pick your brain. :)


Sure, PM me

Questions123

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Re: UCI or Georgetown for CA Big Law

Postby Questions123 » Fri Jun 15, 2018 7:03 pm

so I was deciding between UCI and a few places last year, my dad is a lawyer at a big law firm in Nor Cal and so I spoke to him and a handful of other lawyers from various law schools who work at his firm

basically, I came to the conclusion that UCI may still be a bit of a risk. I know they are killing it rn (21!!! wow!) but a lot of older lawyers didn't even seem to realize it existed... which makes sense because its so new.

my dad and his law friends seemed to think that reputation is huge in big law so if you come in saying Georgetown all these old dudes who are deciding whether you're gonna make partner or not will hear that and go wow.
if you say UCI the old guys are gonna be like ??? unless they stay up to date on US News which... sounds like most of them don't care to do or have time for.

I don't know how helpful or realistic that is haha but all of them told me probably not to do UCI. they are crushing it rn though so idk



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