PNW vs. NY School Choice

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EdSheeranKnockoff

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PNW vs. NY School Choice

Postby EdSheeranKnockoff » Wed Jan 17, 2018 11:59 am

First time poster, let me know if I screw up any general posting policies.

UGPA: 3.73
LSAT: 159

Job experience is varied, including several internships in the petroleum industry. Took a year between Undergraduate and Law School to work as a substitute school teacher as well as a bartender.

Undergraduate experience was huge resume builder, with accolades that recognize me as "Greek Man of the Year" twice over. These have been a huge help to emphasize on my application.

Trying to decide between: Lewis and Clark, University of Washington, Brooklyn Law School, University of Wisconsin Madison, University of Oregon, and University of Colorado.

Interested in pursuing business/corporate law.

I would love your opinions on what schools to focus on, and what financial aid might look like to make it viable. Interviewed with L&C the other day, went very well. Admitted to several other schools already (Duquesne Tuition Free) so I know my application is completely hopeless.

Thanks in advance for any input.

cavalier1138

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Re: PNW vs. NY School Choice

Postby cavalier1138 » Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:02 pm

If you mean "business/corporate law" in a large firm, then retake the LSAT and reapply. None of these schools will do that for you.

Otherwise, these schools should only be attended with a full scholarship. What's your total COA at each school? What kind of practice are you envisioning? And where do you want to practice?

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EdSheeranKnockoff

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Re: PNW vs. NY School Choice

Postby EdSheeranKnockoff » Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:08 pm

Got it, I will keep that in mind.

COA has yet to be determined in terms of scholarship. Have not yet been admitted and have no received scholarship information.

Tuition
L&C: 48988
Brooklyn: 43500
UofO: 40394
UofC: 38623
UofW: 44112

I would like to either practice in New York, or somewhere in the PNW. Seattle, Portland, potentially Alaska. In terms of the kind of law, I'm still figuring that out. I was hoping to sit down with a counselor and lean heavy on orientation experiences. Still lining up talks with current lawyers regarding their fields.

Optimally, I would love the experience of clerking. It sounds interesting and seems like a great insight into the legal world.

cavalier1138

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Re: PNW vs. NY School Choice

Postby cavalier1138 » Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:11 pm

Come back when you have actual decisions to make. You need to get admitted and get scholarship offers before anyone can give concrete advice.

But in terms of region, these schools will lock you down to their respective regions. And to phrase the practice question a different way: what do you envision your salary being after graduation?

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EdSheeranKnockoff

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Re: PNW vs. NY School Choice

Postby EdSheeranKnockoff » Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:18 pm

You're right, the pre-posting was a little pre-mature. I just have extra time right now and am trying to plan ahead, I'll repost this after I've gotten the info.

After graduation, I'd like to see something 80,000 or above. More realistically, I would probably take something that was 65,000 if necessary. I know this won't come from the public sector, so I'm curious what law I should pursue to make that happen in the private sector?

sparkytrainer

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Re: PNW vs. NY School Choice

Postby sparkytrainer » Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:20 pm

EdSheeranKnockoff wrote:You're right, the pre-posting was a little pre-mature. I just have extra time right now and am trying to plan ahead, I'll repost this after I've gotten the info.

After graduation, I'd like to see something 80,000 or above. More realistically, I would probably take something that was 65,000 if necessary. I know this won't come from the public sector, so I'm curious what law I should pursue to make that happen in the private sector?


Chances are if you even get a legal job from any of these schools (if you get in), you won't sniff 80k or above. Most of these schools only have 50% of the class even get to be lawyers at ALL, let alone make 80k plus.

The most likely option if you are a lucky one to get a legal job from one of these schools is either in local government paying pennies, or with a small firm at the 40-50 range at best.

Just fyi.

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EdSheeranKnockoff

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Re: PNW vs. NY School Choice

Postby EdSheeranKnockoff » Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:26 pm

Chances are if you even get a legal job from any of these schools (if you get in), you won't sniff 80k or above. Most of these schools only have 50% of the class even get to be lawyers at ALL, let alone make 80k plus


With where I'm currently at, what would be your recommendation right now? Applying to a different school?

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pancakes3

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Re: PNW vs. NY School Choice

Postby pancakes3 » Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:36 pm

retake the LSAT, dummy.

sparkytrainer

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Re: PNW vs. NY School Choice

Postby sparkytrainer » Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:38 pm

pancakes3 wrote:retake the LSAT, dummy.


This is the only right answer

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A. Nony Mouse

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Re: PNW vs. NY School Choice

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:52 pm

sparkytrainer wrote:
EdSheeranKnockoff wrote:You're right, the pre-posting was a little pre-mature. I just have extra time right now and am trying to plan ahead, I'll repost this after I've gotten the info.

After graduation, I'd like to see something 80,000 or above. More realistically, I would probably take something that was 65,000 if necessary. I know this won't come from the public sector, so I'm curious what law I should pursue to make that happen in the private sector?


Chances are if you even get a legal job from any of these schools (if you get in), you won't sniff 80k or above. Most of these schools only have 50% of the class even get to be lawyers at ALL, let alone make 80k plus.

The most likely option if you are a lucky one to get a legal job from one of these schools is either in local government paying pennies, or with a small firm at the 40-50 range at best.

Just fyi.

Will you actually look at employment numbers, please? I get your overall point but you keep saying the bolded about schools where that’s just not true. I agree that the OP’s goals don’t really match those schools but that’s not the same as saying that people at those schools have a coin flip’s chance of being a lawyer at all.

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deadpanic

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Re: PNW vs. NY School Choice

Postby deadpanic » Wed Jan 17, 2018 6:49 pm

As a fellow Greek and practicing attorney, being "Greek Man of the Year" is going to hold basically zero weight in admittance to law school. It is about GPA and LSAT. It may prove somewhat (although very little) valuable down the road for hiring at a smaller firm or a bigger firm where you basically have the right grades and the hiring partner was a Greek in your fraternity at your school, but those odds are very slim.

What state did you do undergrad in? You should probably go to that law school, assuming you want to practice in that state. Your ties are going to be important, especially if you wish to lean on your undergrad Greek ties. Some of the state schools and their respective cities with mid-size firms needing business may give the nod to you over others for connections (although you will still need the grades first).

I don't think most of the state schools you listed have to be for free, but obviously the lower the cost the better. But you do need to lower your expectations. As others have said, it is more likely you will be making 40-50k out of law school and not doing corporate law.

Wisconsin is obviously not in the PNW or NYC, so that is kind of an outlier that I would be cautious of. It sounds like you are from (and went to undergrad) in the PNW. To maximize your chances at employment, I would stick there. Brooklyn is the only NY school I see and I don't see how that would possibly be worth it. NY probably doesn't care as much about ties, but it would be super expensive for a similar outcome at a state school in the PNW. So you would have the same (or about the same) salary coming out of Brooklyn with much more debt. No one in NY is going to care about "Greek Man of the Year" either. Not trying to give you a hard time, just practically speaking.

You should retake the LSAT for your goals or re-adjust your goals, though.

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pancakes3

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Re: PNW vs. NY School Choice

Postby pancakes3 » Wed Jan 17, 2018 7:01 pm

don't advertise that you're greek in your resume or application. i don't have my fraternity on my resume. it came up once at an interview bc the interviewer went to my UG and we both laughed about how we'd never disclose that we were greek to colleagues in normal circumstances.

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whodareswins

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Re: PNW vs. NY School Choice

Postby whodareswins » Thu Jan 18, 2018 1:11 am

UW definitely produces some decent outcomes, but you'll likely have to retake the lsat to get admitted there. Your gpa is solid so retaking is the credited response here.

Good luck!

dabigchina

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Re: PNW vs. NY School Choice

Postby dabigchina » Thu Jan 18, 2018 1:16 am

I wouldn't say putting your fraternity on your resume (assuming some kind of leadership position) is the kiss of death or anything like that. I do agree nobody cares about OP being greek man of the year.

That being said, I didn't interview in NYC so YMMV over there.

mcmand

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Re: PNW vs. NY School Choice

Postby mcmand » Thu Jan 18, 2018 1:27 am

EdSheeranKnockoff wrote:Trying to decide between: Lewis and Clark, University of Washington, Brooklyn Law School, University of Wisconsin Madison, University of Oregon, and University of Colorado.


UW alum here, PM if you have questions about UW or Seattle market generally. Sparkytrainer doesn't know enough about UW or PNW to be opining on either and I want you to get informed advice.

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EdSheeranKnockoff

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Re: PNW vs. NY School Choice

Postby EdSheeranKnockoff » Thu Jan 18, 2018 2:42 pm

Thank you all.

I do lean kinda greek heavy on my Resume only because it was a significant amount of my work effort during Undergrad (Executive Board Etc.) However, I know where you guys are coming from in regards to leaving it off your record.

mcmand, thank you for the offer. Once I've got a solid look in terms of acceptance/aid, I probably will.

Thank you all for the input, it's given me quite a bit to think on. I may be posting again once I'm at the next stage here.

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abujabal

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Re: PNW vs. NY School Choice

Postby abujabal » Fri Jan 19, 2018 5:52 pm

sparkytrainer wrote:Chances are if you even get a legal job from any of these schools (if you get in), you won't sniff 80k or above. Most of these schools only have 50% of the class even get to be lawyers at ALL, let alone make 80k plus.

The most likely option if you are a lucky one to get a legal job from one of these schools is either in local government paying pennies, or with a small firm at the 40-50 range at best.

Just fyi.


OP, don't listen to this entirely. UW has solid employment outcomes in the PNW, and given the insularity of the Seattle area, it's sometimes a better option than "higher-ranked" schools, depending on your desired outcome.

mcmand is your guy - he'll know much more

CanadianWolf

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Re: PNW vs. NY School Choice

Postby CanadianWolf » Sat Jan 20, 2018 8:52 pm

Did you take a prep course for the LSAT ? If not, do so & retake the LSAT.

Raising your score from a 159 to 164, for example, should dramatically enhance your chances of receiving scholarship money.



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