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Re: Fordham v NYU/Columbia

Posted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 5:47 pm
by cron1834
No, biglaw from median at Fordham is not very likely. 39% was their co'16 number, but it's a recent high-water mark. Usually they're in the low 30s. And of those 30-some %, you know some of those folks have credentials you don't - URM, IP, big-4 accounting background, family friend who's a partner somewhere, etc. If you're at or near median at Fordham, you should probably bet on not making enough money to service your 6 figures of debt very quickly.

With that said, I'm not advocating for sticker anywhere. Just being realistic about what happens at Fordham if you're not a top-third student.

Re: Fordham v NYU/Columbia

Posted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 6:35 pm
by ZVBXRPL
Suppose I get 15k/year at NYU. Is it worth it now? Is the general sentiment that once you get biglaw, it doesn't matter which school you went to, or does ranking still matter?

On the off chance i get into Columbia, Is it worth sticker?

Re: Fordham v NYU/Columbia

Posted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 6:42 pm
by cavalier1138
ZVBXRPL wrote:Suppose I get 15k/year at NYU. Is it worth it now? Is the general sentiment that once you get biglaw, it doesn't matter which school you went to, or does ranking still matter?

On the off chance i get into Columbia, Is it worth sticker?


I'd still say no, but I don't think that Fordham is worth it either. And yes, once you are in biglaw, your school name starts to matter less (it still matters for some things). But that's putting the cart before the horse. You need to get biglaw, and your school has a massive impact on your chances there.

And no, Columbia would not be worth sticker. NYU and Columbia have similar biglaw placement power. The differences in their numbers are largely due to NYU's PI placement. Striking out is quite rare at either school and usually requires an incredible commitment to doing poorly in class or being a singularly intolerable person.

Re: Fordham v NYU/Columbia

Posted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 11:44 pm
by Wild Card
cavalier1138 wrote:
ZVBXRPL wrote:Suppose I get 15k/year at NYU. Is it worth it now? Is the general sentiment that once you get biglaw, it doesn't matter which school you went to, or does ranking still matter?

On the off chance i get into Columbia, Is it worth sticker?


I'd still say no, but I don't think that Fordham is worth it either. And yes, once you are in biglaw, your school name starts to matter less (it still matters for some things). But that's putting the cart before the horse. You need to get biglaw, and your school has a massive impact on your chances there.

And no, Columbia would not be worth sticker. NYU and Columbia have similar biglaw placement power. The differences in their numbers are largely due to NYU's PI placement. Striking out is quite rare at either school and usually requires an incredible commitment to doing poorly in class or being a singularly intolerable person.


49.4 percent of CLS students are paying sticker. So about half of CLS students think that it's worth sticker.
56.6 percent of NYU students are paying sticker. So more than half of NYU students think that it's worth sticker.

Re: Fordham v NYU/Columbia

Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 12:03 am
by Lavitz
Wild Card wrote:49.4 percent of CLS students are paying sticker. So about half of CLS students think that it's worth sticker.
56.6 percent of NYU students are paying sticker. So more than half of NYU students think that it's worth sticker.

And 67 percent of New York Law School students are paying sticker. The fact that a lot of people do it doesn't make it a good idea.

And OP is fully debt-financing, has an extra 70K in debt, and no interest in going into PI and relying on NYU's LRAP.

Re: Fordham v NYU/Columbia

Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 5:12 am
by cavalier1138
Wild Card wrote:49.4 percent of CLS students are paying sticker. So about half of CLS students think that it's worth sticker.
56.6 percent of NYU students are paying sticker. So more than half of NYU students think that it's worth sticker.


I'm going to refrain from pointing out how many people voted for Trump, because it makes me mildly ill thinking about it. How many of the students paying sticker at these institutions are 100% debt-financing?

The main problem with the OP's situation is that he's backed himself into this mess. He had better options, and with a few extra points on the LSAT, he would have insanely good options. But because he's insisting on staying in NYC for school, now he's stuck with some pretty bad options: either get into an insane amount of debt or maintain a relatively high amount of debt that will likely be just as crippling if he doesn't place well in his class.

Re: Fordham v NYU/Columbia

Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 11:30 am
by proteinshake
Wild Card wrote:
cavalier1138 wrote:
ZVBXRPL wrote:Suppose I get 15k/year at NYU. Is it worth it now? Is the general sentiment that once you get biglaw, it doesn't matter which school you went to, or does ranking still matter?

On the off chance i get into Columbia, Is it worth sticker?


I'd still say no, but I don't think that Fordham is worth it either. And yes, once you are in biglaw, your school name starts to matter less (it still matters for some things). But that's putting the cart before the horse. You need to get biglaw, and your school has a massive impact on your chances there.

And no, Columbia would not be worth sticker. NYU and Columbia have similar biglaw placement power. The differences in their numbers are largely due to NYU's PI placement. Striking out is quite rare at either school and usually requires an incredible commitment to doing poorly in class or being a singularly intolerable person.


49.4 percent of CLS students are paying sticker. So about half of CLS students think that it's worth sticker.
56.6 percent of NYU students are paying sticker. So more than half of NYU students think that it's worth sticker.

I don't think it's a good idea to look at people who haven't started paying off their debt to see if NYU/CLS is worth sticker.

Re: Fordham v NYU/Columbia

Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 6:55 pm
by Wild Card
OP is getting only $45,000 total from Fordham.

So OP's options are 250,000 in debt from Fordham or 300,000 in debt from NYU.

Fordham students are not so dumb that OP can count on median. Only one-third of Fordham students land biglaw, whereas two-thirds of NYU students land biglaw, and presumably the other third willingly opts out.

Are you guys trying to destroy OP's life or what? How is he going to pay off 250,000 in debt if he doesn't land biglaw from Fordham?

Re: Fordham v NYU/Columbia

Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 7:11 pm
by cavalier1138
The OP has been edited, but I was under the impression that OP was offered $45k per year at Fordham with a total estimated COA of around $35k (on top of existing loans).

I still think it's a bad choice, but unless I completely misremember the facts, it's not ruinous.

Re: Fordham v NYU/Columbia

Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 7:31 pm
by Nebby
Yeah I was under the 45k/year impression too

Re: Fordham v NYU/Columbia

Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 7:39 pm
by Lavitz
Same. OP clearly stated it was 45K/year.

Re: Fordham v NYU/Columbia

Posted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 7:42 pm
by ZVBXRPL
Got It! Every1 is on the don't pay sticker train. Thanks all.