Duke Vs. Cornell

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proteinshake
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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby proteinshake » Mon Jun 12, 2017 9:58 pm

chargers21 wrote:Any negotiation tips? I've sent quite a few negotiations to date, many successful, so I should be fine. Just not sure how to navigate with a deposit already down

I think the most important thing is to let them know you're serious about going to Cornell if they don't up your scholly.

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chargers21
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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby chargers21 » Thu Jun 15, 2017 8:19 pm

My parents want me to go to Duke, but didn't seem too hip on covering the difference in cost. Who woulda thought... Lol

Still waiting to see how negotiations work out, but I feel like Duke isn't going to play ball

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proteinshake
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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby proteinshake » Thu Jun 15, 2017 9:33 pm

so you're gonna head to Cornell if they don't? I'm happy for you and sad at the same time :( :lol:

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Slippin' Jimmy
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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby Slippin' Jimmy » Thu Jun 15, 2017 9:49 pm

chargers21 wrote:My parents want me to go to Duke, but didn't seem too hip on covering the difference in cost. Who woulda thought... Lol

Still waiting to see how negotiations work out, but I feel like Duke isn't going to play ball

Good luck man! Would you mind PMing stats? I'm targeting both Duke and Cornell next cycle, but have a strong preference for Duke because like you I hate the cold and want to stay in the South.

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chargers21
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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby chargers21 » Thu Jun 15, 2017 9:50 pm

proteinshake wrote:so you're gonna head to Cornell if they don't? I'm happy for you and sad at the same time :( :lol:

I'm happy and sad, too. Especially since I never got to go to the ASW at Cornell.

Part of what is selling me on Cornell is that I was looking at the employment for Duke grads in North Carolina, and those who stayed in the state didn't go to the best law firms very often. This makes me think that the big firms don't hire SAs and 1st years at those offices. So if Charlotte is out, it seems that Chicago opportunities are similar out of both (the Chicago schools were too expensive for me), and Atlanta is seemingly attainable at a similar rate out of both. So I think the location advantages I was looking for aren't as existent as I previously thought and hoped for. If anyone can provide better info on this side of things, I'd welcome it.

Since I'm on a pretty tight schedule to deposit, how much more is Duke worth everyone? I do like warm weather, and Duke is a $40 flight from family. Not sure of the value of those things

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proteinshake
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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby proteinshake » Thu Jun 15, 2017 10:11 pm

Where did you find the info about Duke and their NC grads? I'm curious

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proteinshake
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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby proteinshake » Thu Jun 15, 2017 10:20 pm

I would pay a decent amount more for Duke, but for personal reasons. I am also not very debt adverse.

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chargers21
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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby chargers21 » Thu Jun 15, 2017 10:22 pm

proteinshake wrote:I would pay a decent amount more for Duke, but for personal reasons. I am also not very debt adverse.

I'm massively debt averse. Like, paying cash for cars averse

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chargers21
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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby chargers21 » Thu Jun 15, 2017 10:23 pm

proteinshake wrote:Where did you find the info about Duke and their NC grads? I'm curious

Mostly just from the employment packets we got at ASW

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Yea All Right
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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby Yea All Right » Sat Jun 17, 2017 8:03 pm

I imagine that Charlotte's such a small legal market that if you for sure want to end up there, you can't count on getting market-paying biglaw. The firm I summered at is one of the firms that has a Charlotte office and pays NYC-market, and there were only 2 summers there (both from UNC, incidentally).

FWIW, I went to Cornell. Not advising one school over the other though. Just wanted to reiterate that getting biglaw in Charlotte doesn't seem easy, especially if there's so few market-paying biglaw firms in the city as you mentioned above.

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chargers21
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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby chargers21 » Sun Jun 18, 2017 10:48 pm

Thanks for the info yea all right

No help from Duke, but going to give it one last push. Also, does anyone know if a school will help out with the deposit if you had already deposited elsewhere? I don't really have much liquid cash

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UVA2B
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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby UVA2B » Sun Jun 18, 2017 11:00 pm

chargers21 wrote:Thanks for the info yea all right

No help from Duke, but going to give it one last push. Also, does anyone know if a school will help out with the deposit if you had already deposited elsewhere? I don't really have much liquid cash


Are you asking if a school will help out with their own seat deposit while you've deposited elsewhere? I sincerely doubt Cornell would pay their own deposit, but they might extend their deposit deadline if you ask nicely. Keep in mind that a seat deposit is just a down payment on tuition, so if you're seriously thinking you want to go to Cornell and want to keep your spot open, you should beg or borrow to get the liquidity to pay that deposit. It sucks that you have to eat the Duke deposit, but that's the nature of admissions in law schools.

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chargers21
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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby chargers21 » Mon Jun 19, 2017 6:45 pm

Negotiation declined. Still 120k vs. 75k. If Atlanta is my new target (I have ties, but are there many jobs there?) what is the best option? Texas (no ties) and Chicago still ahead of NYC. Will the same grades (or class rank) at either ultimately give me the same non-NYC biglaw options? NYC top firms available with same grades from either? I'm just trying to see if the same options are there at median from both, as some people have been telling me Duke has the advantage in the south

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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby grades?? » Mon Jun 19, 2017 6:50 pm

chargers21 wrote:Negotiation declined. Still 120k vs. 75k. If Atlanta is my new target (I have ties, but are there many jobs there?) what is the best option? Texas (no ties) and Chicago still ahead of NYC. Will the same grades (or class rank) at either ultimately give me the same non-NYC biglaw options? NYC top firms available with same grades from either? I'm just trying to see if the same options are there at median from both, as some people have been telling me Duke has the advantage in the south


Duke surely has the advantage in the South. That goes without saying to be truthful.

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CR7
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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby CR7 » Mon Jun 19, 2017 8:09 pm

chargers21 wrote:Negotiation declined. Still 120k vs. 75k. If Atlanta is my new target (I have ties, but are there many jobs there?) what is the best option? Texas (no ties) and Chicago still ahead of NYC. Will the same grades (or class rank) at either ultimately give me the same non-NYC biglaw options? NYC top firms available with same grades from either? I'm just trying to see if the same options are there at median from both, as some people have been telling me Duke has the advantage in the south


Duke has a strong southern brand, but it's not like Cornell is unknown in Atlanta, it still has a strong national ivy reputation...getting a big law job in Atlanta will come down to several factors when you're considering non HYS schools...grades, ties, interviewing skills, and luck will all play a factor...if an ATL firm is looking at two candidates, one from Cornell and one from duke, they'll look at what sets them apart, mainly who performed better in their class (rank and gpa). I don't believe the duke name on its own will make or break a big law job in Atlanta over Cornell imo.

Both are great schools, good luck with the choice!

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runinthefront
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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby runinthefront » Mon Jun 19, 2017 8:15 pm

chargers21 wrote:Negotiation declined. Still 120k vs. 75k. If Atlanta is my new target (I have ties, but are there many jobs there?) what is the best option? Texas (no ties) and Chicago still ahead of NYC. Will the same grades (or class rank) at either ultimately give me the same non-NYC biglaw options? NYC top firms available with same grades from either? I'm just trying to see if the same options are there at median from both, as some people have been telling me Duke has the advantage in the south

Duke has more alumni in the South. Only you can decide whether that's worth the cost difference.

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Slippin' Jimmy
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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby Slippin' Jimmy » Mon Jun 19, 2017 11:33 pm

chargers21 wrote:Negotiation declined. Still 120k vs. 75k. If Atlanta is my new target (I have ties, but are there many jobs there?) what is the best option? Texas (no ties) and Chicago still ahead of NYC. Will the same grades (or class rank) at either ultimately give me the same non-NYC biglaw options? NYC top firms available with same grades from either? I'm just trying to see if the same options are there at median from both, as some people have been telling me Duke has the advantage in the south

This is such a difficult choice, but the difference in cost is very significant while the difference in job prospects are not. I'd have to say Cornell here.

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dm1683
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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby dm1683 » Tue Jun 20, 2017 5:26 pm

Slippin' Jimmy wrote:
chargers21 wrote:Negotiation declined. Still 120k vs. 75k. If Atlanta is my new target (I have ties, but are there many jobs there?) what is the best option? Texas (no ties) and Chicago still ahead of NYC. Will the same grades (or class rank) at either ultimately give me the same non-NYC biglaw options? NYC top firms available with same grades from either? I'm just trying to see if the same options are there at median from both, as some people have been telling me Duke has the advantage in the south

This is such a difficult choice, but the difference in cost is very significant while the difference in job prospects are not. I'd have to say Cornell here.

Agreed. Cornell is an NYC biglaw factory but it still has national placement. I know a guy who graduated my ug, went to Cornell and snagged a job at Foley Milwaukee with little trouble. Now he works for the feds.

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rpupkin
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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby rpupkin » Tue Jun 20, 2017 5:31 pm

Slippin' Jimmy wrote:
chargers21 wrote:Negotiation declined. Still 120k vs. 75k. If Atlanta is my new target (I have ties, but are there many jobs there?) what is the best option? Texas (no ties) and Chicago still ahead of NYC. Will the same grades (or class rank) at either ultimately give me the same non-NYC biglaw options? NYC top firms available with same grades from either? I'm just trying to see if the same options are there at median from both, as some people have been telling me Duke has the advantage in the south

This is such a difficult choice, but the difference in cost is very significant while the difference in job prospects are not. I'd have to say Cornell here.

On what do you base the bolded? Are you familiar with hiring patterns and preferences in the Atlanta market?

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rpupkin
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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby rpupkin » Tue Jun 20, 2017 5:34 pm

dm1683 wrote:
Slippin' Jimmy wrote:
chargers21 wrote:Negotiation declined. Still 120k vs. 75k. If Atlanta is my new target (I have ties, but are there many jobs there?) what is the best option? Texas (no ties) and Chicago still ahead of NYC. Will the same grades (or class rank) at either ultimately give me the same non-NYC biglaw options? NYC top firms available with same grades from either? I'm just trying to see if the same options are there at median from both, as some people have been telling me Duke has the advantage in the south

This is such a difficult choice, but the difference in cost is very significant while the difference in job prospects are not. I'd have to say Cornell here.

Agreed. Cornell is an NYC biglaw factory but it still has national placement. I know a guy who graduated my ug, went to Cornell and snagged a job at Foley Milwaukee with little trouble. Now he works for the feds.

That's terrific. I know a guy who went to a TTTT in California and who now works at DOJ. We all know people. But the point is that OP has a specific goal (a job at a law firm in Atlanta) and has a choice between schools where one school has a better alumni network, and a better reputation for placing lawyers, in the South. I'm not saying Duke is significantly better than Cornell for Atlanta (I honestly don't know), but I think many of you are being a little too caviler with advice that affects someone's future.

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chargers21
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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby chargers21 » Tue Jun 20, 2017 5:55 pm

rpupkin wrote:
dm1683 wrote:
Slippin' Jimmy wrote:
chargers21 wrote:Negotiation declined. Still 120k vs. 75k. If Atlanta is my new target (I have ties, but are there many jobs there?) what is the best option? Texas (no ties) and Chicago still ahead of NYC. Will the same grades (or class rank) at either ultimately give me the same non-NYC biglaw options? NYC top firms available with same grades from either? I'm just trying to see if the same options are there at median from both, as some people have been telling me Duke has the advantage in the south

This is such a difficult choice, but the difference in cost is very significant while the difference in job prospects are not. I'd have to say Cornell here.

Agreed. Cornell is an NYC biglaw factory but it still has national placement. I know a guy who graduated my ug, went to Cornell and snagged a job at Foley Milwaukee with little trouble. Now he works for the feds.

That's terrific. I know a guy who went to a TTTT in California and who now works at DOJ. We all know people. But the point is that OP has a specific goal (a job at a law firm in Atlanta) and has a choice between schools where one school has a better alumni network, and a better reputation for placing lawyers, in the South. I'm not saying Duke is significantly better than Cornell for Atlanta (I honestly don't know), but I think many of you are being a little too caviler with advice that affects someone's future.

Thank you for your input Rpupkin. Anecdotal evidence is generally bad for LS stuff. I ultimately decided the seemingly small advantage of Duke over Cornell for Atlanta specific jobs wasn't worth the financial difference, and I am heading to Cornell. I feel like saving some money will allow me to relax a little, since money tends to stress me out. That might help my grades. Also, I'm an avid outdoorsman, and Durham's weather would have been very distracting for me. 2L and 3L me might be pissed about the weather, but I think it will end up helping 1L me out. From what I've heard, grades will likely be more of a deciding factor in whether I can get in at some firms than school, so I'm going all in on that. Before picking Cornell, I also sold myself on the idea that I can live in NYC, and that for the career that I have decided to pursue, it might be the best thing for me early on in my career. I am correct in thinking that if I put in a good 3 years at a reputable NYC firm, I might have the option to lateral or transfer into a secondary market, rightt? I'm not giving up on my initial goal, but I'm just trying to plan for the event that it doesn't happen

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rpupkin
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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby rpupkin » Tue Jun 20, 2017 6:04 pm

chargers21 wrote:Thank you for your input Rpupkin. Anecdotal evidence is generally bad for LS stuff. I ultimately decided the seemingly small advantage of Duke over Cornell for Atlanta specific jobs wasn't worth the financial difference, and I am heading to Cornell. I feel like saving some money will allow me to relax a little, since money tends to stress me out. That might help my grades. Also, I'm an avid outdoorsman, and Durham's weather would have been very distracting for me. 2L and 3L me might be pissed about the weather, but I think it will end up helping 1L me out. From what I've heard, grades will likely be more of a deciding factor in whether I can get in at some firms than school, so I'm going all in on that. Before picking Cornell, I also sold myself on the idea that I can live in NYC, and that for the career that I have decided to pursue, it might be the best thing for me early on in my career. I am correct in thinking that if I put in a good 3 years at a reputable NYC firm, I might have the option to lateral or transfer into a secondary market, rightt? I'm not giving up on my initial goal, but I'm just trying to plan for the event that it doesn't happen

Sounds like a sensible plan. Enjoy Cornell and good luck!

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chargers21
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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby chargers21 » Tue Jun 20, 2017 6:06 pm

rpupkin wrote:
chargers21 wrote:Thank you for your input Rpupkin. Anecdotal evidence is generally bad for LS stuff. I ultimately decided the seemingly small advantage of Duke over Cornell for Atlanta specific jobs wasn't worth the financial difference, and I am heading to Cornell. I feel like saving some money will allow me to relax a little, since money tends to stress me out. That might help my grades. Also, I'm an avid outdoorsman, and Durham's weather would have been very distracting for me. 2L and 3L me might be pissed about the weather, but I think it will end up helping 1L me out. From what I've heard, grades will likely be more of a deciding factor in whether I can get in at some firms than school, so I'm going all in on that. Before picking Cornell, I also sold myself on the idea that I can live in NYC, and that for the career that I have decided to pursue, it might be the best thing for me early on in my career. I am correct in thinking that if I put in a good 3 years at a reputable NYC firm, I might have the option to lateral or transfer into a secondary market, rightt? I'm not giving up on my initial goal, but I'm just trying to plan for the event that it doesn't happen

Sounds like a sensible plan. Enjoy Cornell and good luck!

Thanks!

pizzagoblin
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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby pizzagoblin » Wed Jun 21, 2017 11:24 am

chargers21 wrote:Thank you for your input Rpupkin. Anecdotal evidence is generally bad for LS stuff. I ultimately decided the seemingly small advantage of Duke over Cornell for Atlanta specific jobs wasn't worth the financial difference, and I am heading to Cornell. I feel like saving some money will allow me to relax a little, since money tends to stress me out. That might help my grades. Also, I'm an avid outdoorsman, and Durham's weather would have been very distracting for me. 2L and 3L me might be pissed about the weather, but I think it will end up helping 1L me out. From what I've heard, grades will likely be more of a deciding factor in whether I can get in at some firms than school, so I'm going all in on that. Before picking Cornell, I also sold myself on the idea that I can live in NYC, and that for the career that I have decided to pursue, it might be the best thing for me early on in my career. I am correct in thinking that if I put in a good 3 years at a reputable NYC firm, I might have the option to lateral or transfer into a secondary market, rightt? I'm not giving up on my initial goal, but I'm just trying to plan for the event that it doesn't happen


Congrats, numbers twin! This really came out of left field, but I think you made a wise decision. Enjoy Cornell!

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chargers21
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Re: Duke Vs. Cornell

Postby chargers21 » Wed Jun 21, 2017 11:52 am

pizzagoblin wrote:
Congrats, numbers twin! This really came out of left field, but I think you made a wise decision. Enjoy Cornell!

Thanks! It definitely caught me off guard! You never hear about people getting this much off the waitlists but it's nice because now I have some room to financially relax a little




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