UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

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Emory $$$ or UVA sticker?

UVA, $284k and all
10
40%
Emory, even at $114k
15
60%
 
Total votes: 25

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S.Picquery

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UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

Postby S.Picquery » Sun Apr 16, 2017 1:57 pm

Disclaimer: if I can live with family and the cost of Emory COA drops to 60k, I'll go there. But as it stands, without their help I have the following issue.


-The schools you are considering:
UVA
Emory

-The total Cost of Attendance (COA) of each
UVA: (sticker) $284,444 at repayment
Emory: (144k scholarship) $114,188 at repayment

-How you will be financing your COA: loans/LRAP (I'm P.I. Focused)

-Where you are from and where you want to work, and other places where you have significant ties (if any): I want to work in Atlanta. I have ties here and NYC.

-Your general career goals: I would to clerk and then do impact litigation at a public interest firm. (I'm extremely dedicated to PI and have a long work history here)

-Your LSAT/GPA numbers: 175/3.0

-How many times you have taken the LSAT: 2 but I don't think retaking will really help with my GPA.

Thoughts? Please??
Last edited by S.Picquery on Sun Apr 16, 2017 9:07 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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CR7

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Re: UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

Postby CR7 » Sun Apr 16, 2017 2:01 pm

Do you have any other t-13 offers with money?

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S.Picquery

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Re: UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

Postby S.Picquery » Sun Apr 16, 2017 2:02 pm

CR7 wrote:Do you have any other t-13 offers with money?

Just UMich and they gave me $15k which I don't think is enough to sway away from the southeast, and the placement power of UVA or Emory in Atlanta.

Everywhere else I was looking at sticker.

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Re: UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

Postby trebekismyhero » Sun Apr 16, 2017 2:07 pm

S.Picquery wrote:
CR7 wrote:Do you have any other t-13 offers with money?

Just UMich and they gave me $15k which I don't think is enough to sway away from the southeast, and the placement power of UVA or Emory in Atlanta.

Everywhere else I was looking at sticker.


$15k total or $15k per year? If $15k per year, I would do a little more investigating on chances of getting back to Southeast from Michigan.

If you want to clerk and do high level impact lit, go to UVA, that debt amount is scary though if anything ever happens to PLSF.

If you would be happy being a PD in the Atlanta metro area, go with Emory.

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S.Picquery

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Re: UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

Postby S.Picquery » Sun Apr 16, 2017 2:12 pm

trebekismyhero wrote:$15k total or $15k per year? If $15k per year, I would do a little more investigating on chances of getting back to Southeast from Michigan.

If you want to clerk and do high level impact lit, go to UVA, that debt amount is scary though if anything ever happens to PLSF.

If you would be happy being a PD in the Atlanta metro area, go with Emory.

Total. Per year would be a whole different ball game.

And yes I would be happy in ATL as a PD. Good thoughts, thank you.

grades??

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Re: UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

Postby grades?? » Sun Apr 16, 2017 2:18 pm

Something is either wrong with your app or you applied really late. I know people in your numbers getting much more money from Mich for example. There is something either bad in your app or you need to apply the first day of the fall when apps open

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Re: UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

Postby S.Picquery » Sun Apr 16, 2017 2:24 pm

grades?? wrote:Something is either wrong with your app or you applied really late. I know people in your numbers getting much more money from Mich for example. There is something either bad in your app or you need to apply the first day of the fall when apps open

That was helpful.

grades??

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Re: UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

Postby grades?? » Sun Apr 16, 2017 2:45 pm

S.Picquery wrote:
grades?? wrote:Something is either wrong with your app or you applied really late. I know people in your numbers getting much more money from Mich for example. There is something either bad in your app or you need to apply the first day of the fall when apps open

That was helpful.


Seriously. Your gpa isn't good but that LSAT should be getting more bites. I know people at Duke with those numbers who got more $ than Mich is currently offering you.

Did you apply late? IF not, then you need to go through your app really closely. If you did apply late, you should consider reapplying super early.

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Re: UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

Postby S.Picquery » Sun Apr 16, 2017 3:34 pm

grades?? wrote:
S.Picquery wrote:
grades?? wrote:Something is either wrong with your app or you applied really late. I know people in your numbers getting much more money from Mich for example. There is something either bad in your app or you need to apply the first day of the fall when apps open

That was helpful.


Seriously. Your gpa isn't good but that LSAT should be getting more bites. I know people at Duke with those numbers who got more $ than Mich is currently offering you.

Did you apply late? IF not, then you need to go through your app really closely. If you did apply late, you should consider reapplying super early.


No, I seriously appreciate your input. I'll take it into account.

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Re: UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

Postby grades?? » Sun Apr 16, 2017 3:36 pm

S.Picquery wrote:
grades?? wrote:
S.Picquery wrote:
grades?? wrote:Something is either wrong with your app or you applied really late. I know people in your numbers getting much more money from Mich for example. There is something either bad in your app or you need to apply the first day of the fall when apps open

That was helpful.


Seriously. Your gpa isn't good but that LSAT should be getting more bites. I know people at Duke with those numbers who got more $ than Mich is currently offering you.

Did you apply late? IF not, then you need to go through your app really closely. If you did apply late, you should consider reapplying super early.


No, I seriously appreciate your input. I'll take it into account.


When did you apply? Twice you haven't answered. It is an important part of the calculus.

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Re: UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

Postby floatie » Sun Apr 16, 2017 3:54 pm

I would pick Emory. Sticker price at UVA, if you're PI-focused and are financing everything with loans, is financial suicide in your situation. If you've been following the news you know that things like PSLF are in contention right now, and you can't depend on that.

That being said, you should be netting more money with that 175, even with your GPA. Did you apply to other southern schools like Duke and Vandy? Have you tried to negotiate at all with UVA?

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Re: UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

Postby S.Picquery » Sun Apr 16, 2017 3:59 pm

floatie wrote:I would pick Emory. Sticker price at UVA, if you're PI-focused and are financing everything with loans, is financial suicide in your situation. If you've been following the news you know that things like PSLF are in contention right now, and you can't depend on that.

That being said, you should be netting more money with that 175, even with your GPA. Did you apply to other southern schools like Duke and Vandy? Have you tried to negotiate at all with UVA?


I have. Vandy gave me on par with Emory but I don't have the option of living with family (cutting the debt in half or less than half). Duke gave me similar money to Mich, but I HATED it. Every moment I spent there was miserable and I have students of mine at the UG and I just cannot imagine being content enough to do well there which is Very important.

I did try to negotiate. They said that head cobsider negotiating with me... after I deposited. Which is super weird.

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Postby gilmoregirlrevival » Sun Apr 16, 2017 5:26 pm

..
Last edited by gilmoregirlrevival on Sun Apr 16, 2017 8:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

Postby S.Picquery » Sun Apr 16, 2017 5:29 pm

gilmoregirlrevival wrote:Definitely worth it to deposit half on Tuesday and try to negotiate with UVA. Look at all the amounts they are giving out to low lsat, high gpa splitters. They need and want your 175. :) Good luck!


Thanks!

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Re: UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

Postby floatie » Sun Apr 16, 2017 6:40 pm

S.Picquery wrote:
floatie wrote:I would pick Emory. Sticker price at UVA, if you're PI-focused and are financing everything with loans, is financial suicide in your situation. If you've been following the news you know that things like PSLF are in contention right now, and you can't depend on that.

That being said, you should be netting more money with that 175, even with your GPA. Did you apply to other southern schools like Duke and Vandy? Have you tried to negotiate at all with UVA?


I have. Vandy gave me on par with Emory but I don't have the option of living with family (cutting the debt in half or less than half). Duke gave me similar money to Mich, but I HATED it. Every moment I spent there was miserable and I have students of mine at the UG and I just cannot imagine being content enough to do well there which is Very important.

I did try to negotiate. They said that head cobsider negotiating with me... after I deposited. Which is super weird.


OK, then I would deposit at UVA and Emory (FWIW, Emory will reimburse another school's deposit if you choose to go to Emory) and then negotiate like hell at UVA. Other posters are right - they're going to want your 175. I think UVA would be worth it if you can get your debt load down to no more than $150k. If not, then Emory.

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Re: UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

Postby S.Picquery » Sun Apr 16, 2017 7:01 pm

floatie wrote:
S.Picquery wrote:
floatie wrote:I would pick Emory. Sticker price at UVA, if you're PI-focused and are financing everything with loans, is financial suicide in your situation. If you've been following the news you know that things like PSLF are in contention right now, and you can't depend on that.

That being said, you should be netting more money with that 175, even with your GPA. Did you apply to other southern schools like Duke and Vandy? Have you tried to negotiate at all with UVA?


I have. Vandy gave me on par with Emory but I don't have the option of living with family (cutting the debt in half or less than half). Duke gave me similar money to Mich, but I HATED it. Every moment I spent there was miserable and I have students of mine at the UG and I just cannot imagine being content enough to do well there which is Very important.

I did try to negotiate. They said that head cobsider negotiating with me... after I deposited. Which is super weird.


OK, then I would deposit at UVA and Emory (FWIW, Emory will reimburse another school's deposit if you choose to go to Emory) and then negotiate like hell at UVA. Other posters are right - they're going to want your 175. I think UVA would be worth it if you can get your debt load down to no more than $150k. If not, then Emory.



Awesome. That's pretty close to where I was thinking but I was around 180k. Thank you for your input. Y'all are great :)

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Re: UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

Postby S.Picquery » Mon Apr 17, 2017 9:19 am

Bumping to see if there's any more input before the deadline.

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Re: UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

Postby albanach » Mon Apr 17, 2017 12:28 pm

floatie wrote:Other posters are right - they're going to want your 175.


Why is this? Since it's percentiles and medians that are reported, an applicant one point above the 75th percentile is worth the same as one five points above it. Not to say that a 175 is in any way a bad thing, I just don't see it being treated that differently.

I agree with others that the whole application might need looked at to see if it can be made more attractive to schools next cycle.

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Re: UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

Postby lilitiger99 » Mon Apr 17, 2017 12:43 pm

I might be in the minority for this, but UVA/Michigan/t13 schools sometimes have more generous LRAP I've heard? For PI that is something to consider. And if you're not one hundred percent set on PI, I would choose UVA. You will have much better outward employment rates - BL/FC rates are double I think.

sticker is a huge commitment obviously, but it's a trade off, I think. I was also considering Emory with a scholarship, but their employment stats scared me a little bit.

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Re: UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

Postby cheaptilts » Mon Apr 17, 2017 12:47 pm

lilitiger99 wrote:I might be in the minority for this, but UVA/Michigan/t13 schools sometimes have more generous LRAP I've heard? For PI that is something to consider. And if you're not one hundred percent set on PI, I would choose UVA. You will have much better outward employment rates - BL/FC rates are double I think.

sticker is a huge commitment obviously, but it's a trade off, I think. I was also considering Emory with a scholarship, but their employment stats scared me a little bit.

If OP is not 100% all-in on PI, then attending UVA at sticker is a much, much worse decision than attending Emory.

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Re: UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

Postby albanach » Mon Apr 17, 2017 12:51 pm

lilitiger99 wrote:I might be in the minority for this, but UVA/Michigan/t13 schools sometimes have more generous LRAP I've heard? For PI that is something to consider. And if you're not one hundred percent set on PI, I would choose UVA. You will have much better outward employment rates - BL/FC rates are double I think.

sticker is a huge commitment obviously, but it's a trade off, I think. I was also considering Emory with a scholarship, but their employment stats scared me a little bit.


UVA is also likely to come with access to a Kennedy Fellowship which gives OP significant post-graduation options.

However, I think the school's LRAP program is predicated on PSLF existing. Mind you, if PSLF were to disappear there would almost certainly have to be an adjustment in PD and prosecutor salaries just to maintain enough lawyers in the field to keep the system functional.

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Re: UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

Postby lilitiger99 » Mon Apr 17, 2017 1:42 pm

cheaptilts wrote:
lilitiger99 wrote:I might be in the minority for this, but UVA/Michigan/t13 schools sometimes have more generous LRAP I've heard? For PI that is something to consider. And if you're not one hundred percent set on PI, I would choose UVA. You will have much better outward employment rates - BL/FC rates are double I think.

sticker is a huge commitment obviously, but it's a trade off, I think. I was also considering Emory with a scholarship, but their employment stats scared me a little bit.

If OP is not 100% all-in on PI, then attending UVA at sticker is a much, much worse decision than attending Emory.


How so? I know the consensus is usually nothing is worth sticker - and I'm turning down a t6 for a lower t13 on scholly - but if OP changes his or her mind and wants big law or clerking? Wouldn't emory effectively make that very difficult?

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Re: UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

Postby cheaptilts » Mon Apr 17, 2017 1:59 pm

lilitiger99 wrote:
cheaptilts wrote:
lilitiger99 wrote:I might be in the minority for this, but UVA/Michigan/t13 schools sometimes have more generous LRAP I've heard? For PI that is something to consider. And if you're not one hundred percent set on PI, I would choose UVA. You will have much better outward employment rates - BL/FC rates are double I think.

sticker is a huge commitment obviously, but it's a trade off, I think. I was also considering Emory with a scholarship, but their employment stats scared me a little bit.

If OP is not 100% all-in on PI, then attending UVA at sticker is a much, much worse decision than attending Emory.


How so? I know the consensus is usually nothing is worth sticker - and I'm turning down a t6 for a lower t13 on scholly - but if OP changes his or her mind and wants big law or clerking? Wouldn't emory effectively make that very difficult?

Emory at $114,000 would give OP an okay-at-best chance at biglaw, but OP would still be able to find work at a small or mid-sized firm, and OP would eventually be able to pay back that $114,000.

That outcome is much better than the scenario in which OP pays ~$300,000 just for a chance to work biglaw.

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Re: UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

Postby guynourmin » Mon Apr 17, 2017 2:04 pm

cheaptilts wrote:
lilitiger99 wrote:
cheaptilts wrote:
lilitiger99 wrote:I might be in the minority for this, but UVA/Michigan/t13 schools sometimes have more generous LRAP I've heard? For PI that is something to consider. And if you're not one hundred percent set on PI, I would choose UVA. You will have much better outward employment rates - BL/FC rates are double I think.

sticker is a huge commitment obviously, but it's a trade off, I think. I was also considering Emory with a scholarship, but their employment stats scared me a little bit.

If OP is not 100% all-in on PI, then attending UVA at sticker is a much, much worse decision than attending Emory.


How so? I know the consensus is usually nothing is worth sticker - and I'm turning down a t6 for a lower t13 on scholly - but if OP changes his or her mind and wants big law or clerking? Wouldn't emory effectively make that very difficult?

Emory at $114,000 would give OP an okay-at-best chance at biglaw, but OP would still be able to find work at a small or mid-sized firm, and OP would eventually be able to pay back that $114,000.

That outcome is much better than the scenario in which OP pays ~$300,000 just for a chance to work biglaw.


I don't have a dog in this fight, but I would think sticker would be easier to pay off at a biglaw salary than 114k would be on typical smalllaw salary.

Disingenuous to say UVA is "just a chance" for biglaw: you can get biglaw from UVA.

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Re: UVA (sticker) vs Emory $$$ for Atlanta PI

Postby lilitiger99 » Mon Apr 17, 2017 2:28 pm

guybourdin wrote:
cheaptilts wrote:
lilitiger99 wrote:
cheaptilts wrote:
lilitiger99 wrote:I might be in the minority for this, but UVA/Michigan/t13 schools sometimes have more generous LRAP I've heard? For PI that is something to consider. And if you're not one hundred percent set on PI, I would choose UVA. You will have much better outward employment rates - BL/FC rates are double I think.

sticker is a huge commitment obviously, but it's a trade off, I think. I was also considering Emory with a scholarship, but their employment stats scared me a little bit.

If OP is not 100% all-in on PI, then attending UVA at sticker is a much, much worse decision than attending Emory.


How so? I know the consensus is usually nothing is worth sticker - and I'm turning down a t6 for a lower t13 on scholly - but if OP changes his or her mind and wants big law or clerking? Wouldn't emory effectively make that very difficult?

Emory at $114,000 would give OP an okay-at-best chance at biglaw, but OP would still be able to find work at a small or mid-sized firm, and OP would eventually be able to pay back that $114,000.

That outcome is much better than the scenario in which OP pays ~$300,000 just for a chance to work biglaw.


I don't have a dog in this fight, but I would think sticker would be easier to pay off at a biglaw salary than 114k would be on typical smalllaw salary.

Disingenuous to say UVA is "just a chance" for biglaw: you can get biglaw from UVA.


I guess for the OP the question then is - is sticker worth potentially being able to work in other markets besides Atlanta + potential for big law if PI doesn't pan out.

In that case, why not Vanderbilt? they have better employment stats than emory, and if your debt is around 100k that is still manageable.



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