Texas w/ higher COA vs Minn.

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BigTenBadger

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Texas w/ higher COA vs Minn.

Postby BigTenBadger » Fri Apr 14, 2017 12:06 am

Right now I am stuck deciding between Minnesota and Texas. My total debt at repayment for Minnesota would be ~30k as compared to ~100k at UT. I have about 30k in undergrad debt. I'll be financing my COA with loans primarily. My SO will be joining me during my 2l regardless of where I go. If she does that would drop the COA to 5 vs 70 respectively.

I'm from Wisconsin, but definitely do not want to work here. The Twin Cities hold appeal, but so does Austin. My goal is to get a solid MBA within the next 8 years. My worry is that if I go to Texas and learn I dislike the idea of big law, I'll be left in a scenario where I'll have to pursue big law regardless in order to pay off my debt. If I go to Minnesota and I realize I would like the big law experience, I'm worried I'll be SOL.

I have a 3.45 undergrad with a 169 and a 173.

acr

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Re: Texas w/ higher COA vs Minn.

Postby acr » Fri Apr 14, 2017 12:23 am

BigTenBadger wrote:Right now I am stuck deciding between Minnesota and Texas. My total debt at repayment for Minnesota would be ~30k as compared to ~100k at UT. I have about 30k in undergrad debt. I'll be financing my COA with loans primarily. My SO will be joining me during my 2l regardless of where I go. If she does that would drop the COA to 5 vs 70 respectively.

I'm from Wisconsin, but definitely do not want to work here. The Twin Cities hold appeal, but so does Austin. My goal is to get a solid MBA within the next 8 years. My worry is that if I go to Texas and learn I dislike the idea of big law, I'll be left in a scenario where I'll have to pursue big law regardless in order to pay off my debt. If I go to Minnesota and I realize I would like the big law experience, I'm worried I'll be SOL.

I have a 3.45 undergrad with a 169 and a 173.


Err...what? Referring to the bolded.

If your ultimate career goal is to "get a solid MBA," then why are you going to law school?

Having said that, I hate both of your options.

Minnesota is a good school, but a regional school. Meaning that you will likely be confined to the Twin Cities for the foreseeable future after graduation, unless you kill it grade-wise. Are you comfortable with laying down roots in the Twin Cities and accepting the possibility of $45K-$60K "small law"? If so, then Minnesota is a good option at $5K debt.

Texas is also a really good school, but is also regional. Meaning that you will likely be working in Dallas or Houston long-term after graduation. I don't think that $70K is a totally unreasonable amount of debt to pay off, assuming that you land Dallas/Houston big law. Texas COL is low, and the firms pay market compensation, so it's not unthinkable that you could be out of 70K debt in two years.

But I hate your options because I think you should have better ones. With a 3.45 and 173 I would think that some T-14's (other than UT) would have accepted you. Especially with the 173. That makes me think that something went wrong in your cycle. Did you apply super late? Did you write a weird personal statement or something? I don't know all the details, but I don't think sitting out and reapplying early next cycle isn't out of the question.

At the end of the day, a 3.45/173 who wants an MBA down the line, with no compelling reason to be in the TCs or Texas, should not be deciding between Minnesota and Texas.

Here's a suggestion: since you want the MBA, apply early decision to NU at the beginning of next cycle. With your 173 and some work experience, I would think you would be competitive. Then add the MBA once you're accepted. A Kellogg MBA is nothing to scoff at, and you would limit debt with the $150,000 ED scholarship. And you would have national portability.

-BigTenHawkeye

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Re: Texas w/ higher COA vs Minn.

Postby BigZuck » Fri Apr 14, 2017 2:03 am

Don't go to law school. Just get a solid job and then a solid MBA down the line if you still want one.

cavalier1138

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Re: Texas w/ higher COA vs Minn.

Postby cavalier1138 » Fri Apr 14, 2017 5:47 am

Don't go to law school if you don't want to be a lawyer.

If you insist on going to law school, reapply early next cycle and/or fix your app. As mentioned, a 173 should have given you much better options.

BigTenBadger

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Re: Texas w/ higher COA vs Minn.

Postby BigTenBadger » Fri Apr 14, 2017 12:25 pm

Okay so I posted this before going through other posts on here about MBAs, and realizing that they are not totally necessary... So ignoring that... I don't hate the idea of living in either the Twin Cities or Texas. Twin Cities is a great place for young people, just as Austin is. The Twin Cities being closer to home makes it a tad more appealing than living in Austin. Are my job prospects at a place like Minn that bad? I'm relatively new to these forums, and I notice there's a general pessimism, which I believe can be warranted, but which I also don't see many other places. Therefore, if I were forced to choose between these two as it stands, would it not make sense to go try to make the best of Minn since it has a lower COA, and therefore a much lower amount of debt upon repayment?

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PeanutsNJam

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Re: Texas w/ higher COA vs Minn.

Postby PeanutsNJam » Fri Apr 14, 2017 12:29 pm

You should have much better results with a 3.45/173

acr

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Re: Texas w/ higher COA vs Minn.

Postby acr » Fri Apr 14, 2017 12:41 pm

BigTenBadger wrote:Okay so I posted this before going through other posts on here about MBAs, and realizing that they are not totally necessary... So ignoring that... I don't hate the idea of living in either the Twin Cities or Texas. Twin Cities is a great place for young people, just as Austin is. The Twin Cities being closer to home makes it a tad more appealing than living in Austin. Are my job prospects at a place like Minn that bad? I'm relatively new to these forums, and I notice there's a general pessimism, which I believe can be warranted, but which I also don't see many other places. Therefore, if I were forced to choose between these two as it stands, would it not make sense to go try to make the best of Minn since it has a lower COA, and therefore a much lower amount of debt upon repayment?


It's not that job prospects from Minnesota are bad, it's that you should have better options. Minnesota is a fine school in the right circumstances, but it's a strong regional school. You can simply serve yourself much better by sitting out and expanding your options. You worked hard for your 173, don't waste it on a lollipop when you could have a chocolate cake.

But if you were forced to choose, which you're not, then it's not clear that Minn is the best option simply because it's lower COA and lower debt upon repayment. UT is still a T14 and gives you a better shot of big law, and $70K really isn't that terrible of an amount of debt.
Last edited by acr on Fri Apr 14, 2017 12:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

cavalier1138

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Re: Texas w/ higher COA vs Minn.

Postby cavalier1138 » Fri Apr 14, 2017 12:42 pm

BigTenBadger wrote:Twin Cities is a great place for young people, just as Austin is.


Not that either city is a bad place to live, but how much longer do you think you'll be able to consider yourself a young person?

You're picking a place to start building a career/life. Don't make decisions based on whether it's the hip place to be at the moment. If you want flexibility, reapply next cycle, because your numbers should have given you better options.

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trebekismyhero

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Re: Texas w/ higher COA vs Minn.

Postby trebekismyhero » Fri Apr 14, 2017 12:49 pm

BigTenBadger wrote:Okay so I posted this before going through other posts on here about MBAs, and realizing that they are not totally necessary... So ignoring that... I don't hate the idea of living in either the Twin Cities or Texas. Twin Cities is a great place for young people, just as Austin is. The Twin Cities being closer to home makes it a tad more appealing than living in Austin. Are my job prospects at a place like Minn that bad? I'm relatively new to these forums, and I notice there's a general pessimism, which I believe can be warranted, but which I also don't see many other places. Therefore, if I were forced to choose between these two as it stands, would it not make sense to go try to make the best of Minn since it has a lower COA, and therefore a much lower amount of debt upon repayment?


Minnesota is fine for the twin cities and you'll be able to get a job. But the Twin Cities legal market is pretty small especially when it comes to big law so to get a job with the Faegres/Dorseys of Minneapolis you need to be in the top 15%. Otherwise, likely looking at a job making $45-60.

As others said, you really should reapply. With your numbers you should have good scholarship offers at t13 schools

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SmokeytheBear

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Re: Texas w/ higher COA vs Minn.

Postby SmokeytheBear » Fri Apr 14, 2017 1:21 pm

trebekismyhero wrote:
BigTenBadger wrote:Okay so I posted this before going through other posts on here about MBAs, and realizing that they are not totally necessary... So ignoring that... I don't hate the idea of living in either the Twin Cities or Texas. Twin Cities is a great place for young people, just as Austin is. The Twin Cities being closer to home makes it a tad more appealing than living in Austin. Are my job prospects at a place like Minn that bad? I'm relatively new to these forums, and I notice there's a general pessimism, which I believe can be warranted, but which I also don't see many other places. Therefore, if I were forced to choose between these two as it stands, would it not make sense to go try to make the best of Minn since it has a lower COA, and therefore a much lower amount of debt upon repayment?


Minnesota is fine for the twin cities and you'll be able to get a job. But the Twin Cities legal market is pretty small especially when it comes to big law so to get a job with the Faegres/Dorseys of Minneapolis you need to be in the top 15%. Otherwise, likely looking at a job making $45-60.

As others said, you really should reapply. With your numbers you should have good scholarship offers at t13 schools


If you search around the threads, you'll see similar comments to this about the Mpls legal market. The general theme is insular and on a payscale that doesn't seem justified given the same NYC hours and increasing cost of living in Mpls.

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Greenteachurro

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Re: Texas w/ higher COA vs Minn.

Postby Greenteachurro » Fri Apr 14, 2017 1:31 pm

trebekismyhero wrote:
BigTenBadger wrote:Okay so I posted this before going through other posts on here about MBAs, and realizing that they are not totally necessary... So ignoring that... I don't hate the idea of living in either the Twin Cities or Texas. Twin Cities is a great place for young people, just as Austin is. The Twin Cities being closer to home makes it a tad more appealing than living in Austin. Are my job prospects at a place like Minn that bad? I'm relatively new to these forums, and I notice there's a general pessimism, which I believe can be warranted, but which I also don't see many other places. Therefore, if I were forced to choose between these two as it stands, would it not make sense to go try to make the best of Minn since it has a lower COA, and therefore a much lower amount of debt upon repayment?


Minnesota is fine for the twin cities and you'll be able to get a job. But the Twin Cities legal market is pretty small especially when it comes to big law so to get a job with the Faegres/Dorseys of Minneapolis you need to be in the top 15%. Otherwise, likely looking at a job making $45-60.

As others said, you really should reapply. With your numbers you should have good scholarship offers at t13 schools


I agree you should probably reapply with numbers that good. But you don't need to be in the to 15% to get a job from Dorsey or Faegre from UMN. Closer to top 40%, which I guess is still not a great chance for MN BL.



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