Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

(Rankings, Profiles, Tuition, Student Life, . . . )

What should I do?

Columbia at sticker
7
5%
Northwestern freeride
141
91%
If no luck with Harvard - recycle
7
5%
 
Total votes: 155

User avatar
nimbus cloud

Silver
Posts: 536
Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2015 2:19 am

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby nimbus cloud » Wed Apr 12, 2017 10:04 pm

The older TLS crew should get a Pulitzer for public service or something. I am only half joking. Almost went to a TTT at sticker -- then discovered TLS, studied a little bit, retook the LSAT a couple of times and now going to a T10 for free. I am one of many. Find me a New York Times reporter who has made such a tangible difference.

User avatar
rpupkin

Platinum
Posts: 5658
Joined: Mon Dec 09, 2013 10:32 pm

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby rpupkin » Wed Apr 12, 2017 10:05 pm

tinyvessels wrote:I have zero interest in BL, so I may be missing something obvious...But why would Harvard Law guarantee a job in NYC, but not LA?

Greater supply of jobs in NYC. And "guarantee" is a little strong. More like "highly likely"--a very awkward person (or someone who actually managed to get a few rare LP grades) could strike out in NYC despite going to Harvard.

Npret

Silver
Posts: 1355
Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2017 11:42 am

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby Npret » Wed Apr 12, 2017 10:23 pm

I actually wonder how many full ride merit scholarships there are in the T14 (or T13 or T12 whatever.) I've never calculated it but there aren't many. Does anyone know? I think around 30 Dillard scholars is one figure that pops to mind.

Re supply of jobs: How many LA biglaw firms are there and what is the clas size?
Last edited by Npret on Thu Apr 13, 2017 5:54 am, edited 1 time in total.

T3TON

New
Posts: 66
Joined: Wed Mar 30, 2016 5:10 pm

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby T3TON » Thu Apr 13, 2017 4:11 am

I think some of the conclusions ITT have been hasty. Sure, Columbia at sticker is a terrible option for your goals. But if you think you have LSAT points left on the table then retake/reapply might not be a bad idea.

LA is a tough market to land. I cant verify the hiring partner's numbers but either way youll need a strong 1L performance at NU to be competitive. If you want to land at one of the top places (firms like MTO, lit boutiques like Hueston Hennigan) your grades would have to be stellar.

Retaking/reapplying could cost you your full ride. On the other hand it could land you Stanford or Berkeley at a discount. If youre truly LA-or-bust the difference in cost between a full ride and discounted tuition (70k-90k) isnt totally ridiculous. It all comes down to your own tolerance for debt and risk.

If you get in to Harvard off the waitlist and it comes through with big need aid that might be a great option.

Npret

Silver
Posts: 1355
Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2017 11:42 am

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby Npret » Thu Apr 13, 2017 5:58 am

T3TON wrote:I think some of the conclusions ITT have been hasty. Sure, Columbia at sticker is a terrible option for your goals. But if you think you have LSAT points left on the table then retake/reapply might not be a bad idea.

LA is a tough market to land. I cant verify the hiring partner's numbers but either way youll need a strong 1L performance at NU to be competitive. If you want to land at one of the top places (firms like MTO, lit boutiques like Hueston Hennigan) your grades would have to be stellar.

Retaking/reapplying could cost you your full ride. On the other hand it could land you Stanford or Berkeley at a discount. If youre truly LA-or-bust the difference in cost between a full ride and discounted tuition (70k-90k) isnt totally ridiculous. It all comes down to your own tolerance for debt and risk.

If you get in to Harvard off the waitlist and it comes through with big need aid that might be a great option.


I honestly believe he might just have to adjust his goals rather than going to a law school focused on working at one or two firms. Won't he need stellar grades from
anywhere to get those firms? How many biglaw SAs are there in the LA market?

User avatar
Dcc617

Gold
Posts: 2319
Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2014 3:01 pm

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby Dcc617 » Thu Apr 13, 2017 8:34 am

Your thread title should be 'NU freeride or retake.' You absolutely should not go to Columbia at sticker. Listen to all of the people who are actually lawyers or who have actually taken out debt for law school.

I'd argue that your goals don't justify Harvard sticker. I also don't think Harvard sticker is a good idea. The reality of the debt is starting to hit a lot of my classmates, and it hurts.

I'd feel super bad for you if you fuck your life by taking out 300K+ in debt. That's a house. That's retirement. That's a fundamentally different life.

User avatar
quiver

Silver
Posts: 977
Joined: Fri Feb 11, 2011 6:46 pm

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby quiver » Thu Apr 13, 2017 9:07 am

I'm really looking forward to next year's thread when OP is deciding between half CLS and HLS at sticker (but just can't let go of that HLS prestige). I'm sure this will be just as fun the second time.

User avatar
poptart123

Silver
Posts: 1153
Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2015 5:31 pm

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby poptart123 » Thu Apr 13, 2017 9:09 am

nu

Npret

Silver
Posts: 1355
Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2017 11:42 am

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby Npret » Thu Apr 13, 2017 9:16 am

quiver wrote:I'm really looking forward to next year's thread when OP is deciding between half CLS and HLS at sticker (but just can't let go of that HLS prestige). I'm sure this will be just as fun the second time.


If he gets into Harvard he's going whatever it costs. I'm still betting there is a solid shot he goes to Columbia this year.

User avatar
UVA2B

Gold
Posts: 3421
Joined: Sun May 22, 2016 10:48 pm

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby UVA2B » Thu Apr 13, 2017 9:17 am

I think this might be the most lopsided vote I've seen to date. Kudos, random voters, you're emphasizing how illogical this decision will be when OP ends up at Columbia at sticker or HLS next cycle at sticker.

User avatar
UVA2B

Gold
Posts: 3421
Joined: Sun May 22, 2016 10:48 pm

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby UVA2B » Thu Apr 13, 2017 9:18 am

Dcc617 wrote:Your thread title should be 'NU freeride or retake.' You absolutely should not go to Columbia at sticker. Listen to all of the people who are actually lawyers or who have actually taken out debt for law school.

I'd argue that your goals don't justify Harvard sticker. I also don't think Harvard sticker is a good idea. The reality of the debt is starting to hit a lot of my classmates, and it hurts.

I'd feel super bad for you if you fuck your life by taking out 300K+ in debt. That's a house. That's retirement. That's a fundamentally different life.


Doing the lord's work right here. If OP can't listen to current HLS students recommending avoiding debt for Columbia and HLS, then they seriously aren't listening to anyone.

Npret

Silver
Posts: 1355
Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2017 11:42 am

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby Npret » Thu Apr 13, 2017 9:35 am

UVA2B wrote:
Dcc617 wrote:Your thread title should be 'NU freeride or retake.' You absolutely should not go to Columbia at sticker. Listen to all of the people who are actually lawyers or who have actually taken out debt for law school.

I'd argue that your goals don't justify Harvard sticker. I also don't think Harvard sticker is a good idea. The reality of the debt is starting to hit a lot of my classmates, and it hurts.

I'd feel super bad for you if you fuck your life by taking out 300K+ in debt. That's a house. That's retirement. That's a fundamentally different life.


Doing the lord's work right here. If OP can't listen to current HLS students recommending avoiding debt for Columbia and HLS, then they seriously aren't listening to anyone.

He's not listening to anyone except a random emailer about NU job placement. I admit I'm enjoying this more than I should. Few posters are so unable to eventually see through their own BS.

User avatar
quiver

Silver
Posts: 977
Joined: Fri Feb 11, 2011 6:46 pm

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby quiver » Thu Apr 13, 2017 9:40 am

UVA2B wrote:
Dcc617 wrote:Your thread title should be 'NU freeride or retake.' You absolutely should not go to Columbia at sticker. Listen to all of the people who are actually lawyers or who have actually taken out debt for law school.

I'd argue that your goals don't justify Harvard sticker. I also don't think Harvard sticker is a good idea. The reality of the debt is starting to hit a lot of my classmates, and it hurts.

I'd feel super bad for you if you fuck your life by taking out 300K+ in debt. That's a house. That's retirement. That's a fundamentally different life.


Doing the lord's work right here. If OP can't listen to current HLS students recommending avoiding debt for Columbia and HLS, then they seriously aren't listening to anyone.
And actual practicing lawyers who are currently dealing with the debt.

With respect to OP's legacy point, that seems pretty silly and shortsighted. Legacy of what? Your kids won't care where their dad went to law school, you'll just be their dad. And none of your kids' friends will care either. The "legacy" that will matter is providing your kids with the same or better opportunities than you had, and that's something an extra 300k+ will do. When your kids can go to HLS without taking on debt because you went to NU on full scholarship, what will that do for your legacy?

To the extent you mean "legacy" in the sense of what your peers think, you're just talking about prestige, which is what this thread has been railing against from the beginning. CLS and HLS will provide a slight benefit for LA biglaw, but not one worth 300k+.

This seems to be falling on deaf ears, though.

Enjoy your "legacy", OP.

User avatar
Future Ex-Engineer

Silver
Posts: 1429
Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2016 3:20 pm

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby Future Ex-Engineer » Thu Apr 13, 2017 9:44 am

Why is this even a question?

Obviously NU freeride. Recycling would probably get you more acceptances (since you did apply late), but I don't think a retake is going to do you a whole lot of good. You've already got median or higher for every school out there.

User avatar
Future Ex-Engineer

Silver
Posts: 1429
Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2016 3:20 pm

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby Future Ex-Engineer » Thu Apr 13, 2017 9:53 am

FLSFHYS wrote:
jbagelboy wrote:I don't see how the HLS waitlist makes much difference here unless you would anticipate receiving substantial need-based aid. The value proposition between Northwestern for free and CLS at sticker or HLS at sticker doesn't change much. True, HLS is stronger than both CLS and Northwestern in placing into SoCal, but only by degrees. You're still faced with a very similar decision where the best choice is to go to Northwestern or negotiate a larger aid package from another school.

Significant need-based is a real possibility (I'm broke), and HLS seems to be quite a bit stronger for SoCal than Columbia or NU. If it is indeed top 30% of Columbia grads that have solid chances at top firms, it definitely improves up to the median with HLS, which is more or less a guarantee of a job. All things considered, the opportunities, the alumni network, and the legacy value of HLS make it well worth it in my eyes, even at sticker.


I think this is the most hilarious part of the whole deal here - OP is broke and is still turning his nose up at a free degree from a literal top/elite school. In a few years, look back and this and remember that it is entirely your own fault that you are poor/broke.

Also, why the hell is Berkeley not on this list of options if you want Cali BigLaw so bad? Surely with your stats you could at least get some money from BoalTTT

Npret

Silver
Posts: 1355
Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2017 11:42 am

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby Npret » Thu Apr 13, 2017 10:00 am

mrgstephe wrote:
FLSFHYS wrote:
jbagelboy wrote:I don't see how the HLS waitlist makes much difference here unless you would anticipate receiving substantial need-based aid. The value proposition between Northwestern for free and CLS at sticker or HLS at sticker doesn't change much. True, HLS is stronger than both CLS and Northwestern in placing into SoCal, but only by degrees. You're still faced with a very similar decision where the best choice is to go to Northwestern or negotiate a larger aid package from another school.

Significant need-based is a real possibility (I'm broke), and HLS seems to be quite a bit stronger for SoCal than Columbia or NU. If it is indeed top 30% of Columbia grads that have solid chances at top firms, it definitely improves up to the median with HLS, which is more or less a guarantee of a job. All things considered, the opportunities, the alumni network, and the legacy value of HLS make it well worth it in my eyes, even at sticker.


I think this is the most hilarious part of the whole deal here - OP is broke and is still turning his nose up at a free degree from a literal top/elite school. In a few years, look back and this and remember that it is entirely your own fault that you are poor/broke.

Also, why the hell is Berkeley not on this list of options if you want Cali BigLaw so bad? Surely with your stats you could at least get some money from BoalTTT

Berkeley waitlisted him despite his excellent "why Berkeley?" essay. It's in an earlier post in the thread.
Stanford straight out denied OP.

philepistemer

Bronze
Posts: 102
Joined: Thu Jan 03, 2013 5:43 am

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby philepistemer » Thu Apr 13, 2017 10:32 am

OP, I went to Columbia, paid sticker, got a job at a v5, and if I could go back and choose some other T14 at even an 80k discount I would. How successful you are in law depends a lot more on what you can produce than on where you got your degree. Yes, Columbia will make it a little easier to get a job at a top firm, but 250k lower net worth will make it much more difficult to exercise all the random options life will generate for you once you graduate. You will be stuck in biglaw and may have to forego opportunities that could make you a lot more successful than a partner at a top firm.

Dont. Fucking. Go. To. Columbia.

User avatar
MediocreAtBest

Silver
Posts: 632
Joined: Thu Feb 16, 2017 2:51 pm

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby MediocreAtBest » Thu Apr 13, 2017 10:37 am

What happens when you go $300k in debt and don't get into LA biglaw? Not like top 1/3 at CLS is easy. :shock:

Pure Applesauce

Bronze
Posts: 210
Joined: Fri Feb 19, 2016 5:30 pm

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby Pure Applesauce » Thu Apr 13, 2017 11:48 am

Dcc617 wrote:I'd argue that your goals don't justify Harvard sticker. I also don't think Harvard sticker is a good idea.


But the legacy benefits! Doors will be flying off their hinges!

OP follow your dreams !

User avatar
btruj777

Bronze
Posts: 332
Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2016 9:31 am

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby btruj777 » Thu Apr 13, 2017 11:50 am

philepistemer wrote:OP, I went to Columbia, paid sticker, got a job at a v5, and if I could go back and choose some other T14 at even an 80k discount I would. How successful you are in law depends a lot more on what you can produce than on where you got your degree. Yes, Columbia will make it a little easier to get a job at a top firm, but 250k lower net worth will make it much more difficult to exercise all the random options life will generate for you once you graduate. You will be stuck in biglaw and may have to forego opportunities that could make you a lot more successful than a partner at a top firm.

Dont. Fucking. Go. To. Columbia.


I am not the OP, but as someone doing research, I appreciate your honesty! Thanks for the insight!

Justtrying2help

Bronze
Posts: 116
Joined: Wed Jun 29, 2016 3:57 pm

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby Justtrying2help » Thu Apr 13, 2017 4:23 pm

So what are you going to OP? We are dying to know.

Scurvy Cur

New
Posts: 59
Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2017 8:02 pm

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby Scurvy Cur » Thu Apr 13, 2017 4:52 pm

I'm actually fairly sure the correct course of action is to write a heartfelt letter to NU's admissions office requesting that they turn that full ride scholarship over to a deserving soul who would be genuinely thrilled at the opportunity, since the OP is hellbent on turning his nose up at it.

User avatar
Pomeranian

Bronze
Posts: 263
Joined: Thu May 05, 2016 10:23 pm

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby Pomeranian » Thu Apr 13, 2017 5:12 pm

Also, Columbia has a very competitive, cold and cutthroat vibe. Whereas Northwestern is "Midwestern nice" and has a very professional vibe due to the work experience factor in admissions.
Last edited by Pomeranian on Thu Apr 13, 2017 5:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
poptart123

Silver
Posts: 1153
Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2015 5:31 pm

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby poptart123 » Thu Apr 13, 2017 5:14 pm

Also NU was in Making a Murder sooooo

User avatar
Po$eidon

Bronze
Posts: 271
Joined: Tue Dec 15, 2015 2:03 pm

Re: Columbia sticker vs NU freeride vs Retake and Recycle

Postby Po$eidon » Thu Apr 13, 2017 5:33 pm

Pomeranian wrote:Also, Columbia has a very competitive, cold and cutthroat vibe. Whereas Northwestern is "Midwestern nice" and has a very professional vibe due to the work experience factor in admissions.


I've heard stories from Columbia that were :shock:



Return to “Choosing a Law School�

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google Adsense [Bot] and 13 guests