BU, VLS or Fordham

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meowmix551

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BU, VLS or Fordham

Postby meowmix551 » Tue Apr 11, 2017 12:07 pm

Hello all. Just looking for an honest assessment of what others think I should do. I appreciate in advance anyone’s feedback. I tried to follow the posting rules, but I realize it might look a bit clunky.

• Vanderbilt – 3 Year COA - $151,424.02 (my calculation) $169,100.02 (using ABA 509 values)
• Fordham – 3 Year COA - $151,362.11
• Boston University – 3 Year COA - $125,775.78

For financing, I would be using my personal savings and family funds.

For location, I live near and work in NYC. I want to work at a NYC law firm after graduation and in the long run. I also have significant ties to VT, but would not want to work or live there.

My general career goals are to work at a mid or large sized firm or perhaps in industry if private practice does not work out. Tax/ financial law is my interest with Health law a somewhat distant second.

165 LSAT/ 3.75 UGPA/ 2.5 years of paralegal work/ non-URM/ I have taken the LSAT once

Background (NOT necessary to read, but I thought pertinent) : The firm I work at now has stated they would welcome me back as an associate (starting pay around $90K), but I would prefer to explore other options at law school. My research (NALP, ABA and alumni discussions) shows that each school can place in NYC. The employment statistics also seem similar for all of the schools, I included below part of a list I made from the 2015 NALP summaries. Fordham seems like a logical choice for NYC, but the other schools are better rated. I am unsure why the ABA had such higher non-tuition expenses for VLS than I had. I am currently 25 years old and am not sure if it would be detrimental to not enlist in law school and instead take the LSAT again and apply next cycle. I would not consider myself a good test taker; my PR on the LSAT was 167 using a study book. Thanks again in advance!

• Vanderbilt – 36.76% of students employed by firm with more than 100 lawyers; weighted mean salary is $140,331.13
• Fordham – 31.95% " "; " " $150,881.84
• Boston University – 32.69% " "; " " $154,059.00

grades??

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Re: BU, VLS or Fordham

Postby grades?? » Tue Apr 11, 2017 12:11 pm

Classic retake situation. You have a fairly good GPA and a not great lsat in this context. Get 3 more points, and you are looking at paying almost nothing for these schools. Get 5-7 more points, you will have more scholarship to some t13 schools than you currently do.

Retake so you don't have to spend your life savings for a 30-40% chance at biglaw.

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Dr. Nefario

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Re: BU, VLS or Fordham

Postby Dr. Nefario » Tue Apr 11, 2017 12:11 pm

Waiting to retake and reapply at 25 is absolutely feasible. If that is an option, I would go with that. Your first LSAT is almost always your worst. The options you have are not bad (Vandy is probably currently your best if your goal is general biglaw), but I would sit out this year and retake and just keep working at your current firm.

meowmix551

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Re: BU, VLS or Fordham

Postby meowmix551 » Tue Apr 11, 2017 1:12 pm

Thank you to both of you for your answers. Do you think a retake would be viable for me? I was considering it, but as I said I do not test the best and my top score in practice was only 2 points higher than my actual score. Also, how would a retake impact my chances at the schools I applied to this cycle? I assume if I do better, it would increase my chances at schools I was rejected from, but what about schools that offered scholarships? Would it be approximately the same in the event that I do not get into better schools? Thanks again!

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Dr. Nefario

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Re: BU, VLS or Fordham

Postby Dr. Nefario » Tue Apr 11, 2017 1:19 pm

A retake should only help you. Even if you score worse, it won't hurt you, you should be in the same position. I would go through the study threads here and find useful aids that you didn't use to study the first time. Take either June (if possible) or September. Or, ideally, both! You get three takes and being an iffy test taker, more opportunities can only help.

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Re: BU, VLS or Fordham

Postby mrtux45 » Tue Apr 11, 2017 1:24 pm

meowmix551 wrote:Thank you to both of you for your answers. Do you think a retake would be viable for me? I was considering it, but as I said I do not test the best and my top score in practice was only 2 points higher than my actual score. Also, how would a retake impact my chances at the schools I applied to this cycle? I assume if I do better, it would increase my chances at schools I was rejected from, but what about schools that offered scholarships? Would it be approximately the same in the event that I do not get into better schools? Thanks again!


I think a retake could definitely pay off, like the others said, 3 points would be huge for scholly $. But you have to decide for yourself whether you're willing to postpone for another year and risk not doing better. It was only your first take so who knows, improvement is possible, especially if you weren't studying optimally.

But if you're truly done with this process, aren't confident in a 3 point improvement on your next take, I think your options are reasonable provided you're prepared to handle the debt if you miss big law. From the debt numbers you're posting, it looks like you'd be in the position where the debt would suck, but not be crushing to the extent of impacting you beyond the repayment period. This is really a your call situation IMO

Be honest with yourself though. Be logical and avoid rationalizing because you're too lazy to retake.

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Re: BU, VLS or Fordham

Postby Rigo » Tue Apr 11, 2017 2:44 pm

Just want to update your stats using this year's new data just released.
Vandy is 56.6% biglaw+fed clerkship
Fordham 41.9%
BU is 36.2%

I'd retake, but if I were to go I'd pick Vanderbilt.
Last edited by Rigo on Tue Apr 11, 2017 2:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Thomas Hagan, ESQ.

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Re: BU, VLS or Fordham

Postby Thomas Hagan, ESQ. » Tue Apr 11, 2017 2:47 pm

Rigo wrote:Just want to update your stats using this year's new data just released.
Vandy is 56.6% biglaw+fed clerkship
Fordham 41.9%
BU is 36.2%

I'd pick Vanderbilt.


I agree, but I think OP just listed BL numbers and excluded fedclerk.

EDIT: How much did Biglaw numbers increase?
Last edited by Thomas Hagan, ESQ. on Tue Apr 11, 2017 2:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Rigo

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Re: BU, VLS or Fordham

Postby Rigo » Tue Apr 11, 2017 2:48 pm

Thomas Hagan, ESQ. wrote:
Rigo wrote:Just want to update your stats using this year's new data just released.
Vandy is 56.6% biglaw+fed clerkship
Fordham 41.9%
BU is 36.2%

I'd pick Vanderbilt.


I agree, but I think OP just listed BL numbers and excluded fedclerk.

Which isn't the standard, so I included them for OP.

grades??

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Re: BU, VLS or Fordham

Postby grades?? » Tue Apr 11, 2017 2:50 pm

meowmix551 wrote:Thank you to both of you for your answers. Do you think a retake would be viable for me? I was considering it, but as I said I do not test the best and my top score in practice was only 2 points higher than my actual score. Also, how would a retake impact my chances at the schools I applied to this cycle? I assume if I do better, it would increase my chances at schools I was rejected from, but what about schools that offered scholarships? Would it be approximately the same in the event that I do not get into better schools? Thanks again!


You have a 3.75. Get a 170, and you are in the mix for getting money at lower t13s (probably more money than you have right now). Also, you will be able to get these schools up to free or close to free. It is in your financial interest to retake here. Literally 4-5 more questions right and then you can decide between Cornell with money or a full at Vandy.

meowmix551

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Re: BU, VLS or Fordham

Postby meowmix551 » Tue Apr 11, 2017 4:53 pm

Thanks all, I really appreciate everyone's responses! Special thanks to Rigo, I can't believe I missed the new employment numbers coming out :oops:; good call. It sounds like the advice is unanimous to preferably retake, but go to VLS if not. I will think about it, as I had previously thought I was too old (25) to delay another year. I am open to retaking, I just need to really soul search and see if I think there is a good chance of my score going up.

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floatie

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Re: BU, VLS or Fordham

Postby floatie » Tue Apr 11, 2017 4:58 pm

You still have a chance to retake in June to negotiate for better scholarships this cycle.

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Thomas Hagan, ESQ.

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Re: BU, VLS or Fordham

Postby Thomas Hagan, ESQ. » Tue Apr 11, 2017 4:59 pm

meowmix551 wrote:Thanks all, I really appreciate everyone's responses! Special thanks to Rigo, I can't believe I missed the new employment numbers coming out :oops:; good call. It sounds like the advice is unanimous to preferably retake, but go to VLS if not. I will think about it, as I had previously thought I was too old (25) to delay another year. I am open to retaking, I just need to really soul search and see if I think there is a good chance of my score going up.


25 is too old to be a date for high school prom but certainly far from being too old to go to law school lols



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