Regent vs. U. of Baltimore Forum

[waldorf]

The estimated COA at Regent is $53,000 ($35,500 tuition + $17,500 room and board, books, other expenses, etc.) BUT with renewable scholarship of $20,000/year, would bring total cost down to about $33,000/year.

The estimated COA at Baltimore is $50,000 (30,000 in-state tuition + $20,000 room and board, books, other expenses, etc.).

I have a 3.8GPA and have always been top of class in high school and college, but I did average on LSAT (149). Never have been a great standardized test-taker and am not considering holding off any time before going into Law School to take LSAT again.

I am begging you. Please do not take out loans for either of these schools. Please.

[rellek]

I really do appreciate your all's opinion! After studying a TON for the LSAT I took in February, I was taking practice tests and only scoring between 150-155. It's frustrating. Coming into college, I scored a 1770 on the SAT. I just don't know what I did wrong for the LSAT.

Parents, both of whom are lawyers, are dead-set against me taking a year off. They absolutely won't let me do it. I brought up that very idea when I first got my LSAT scores back, and it was an immediate "no." They believe if I went that route, I would essentially put-off law school and never go. I have no clue where they got that idea from.

My mom went to University of Baltimore and is working alongside my father at their own law office. My sister went to Oklahoma City University and is working in Federal Government doing well. I do get that it will be an uphill battle for a job no matter where I go with how competitive the market is, but I don't think it's impossible.

[HamlinMcgill]

Are you still in college? Re-taking does not mean wasting a year of your life — especially if you get a job. You can get work experience (helpful for law school admissions, getting a job after law school, just general life skills) and save up some money. I also think it's important to take the long-view here. The law school you go to will determine the trajectory of your entire career for the next 40 or so years. Taking 1 extra year to make sure you're giving yourself the best shot possible to achieve your career goals is basically nothing in the scheme of things.

[Future Ex-Engineer]

Coming into college, I scored a 1770 on the SAT. I just don't know what I did wrong for the LSAT.

Like most people, you probably didn't study well, even if you studied a ton. Read some guides here on TLS and see if it looks anything like what your prep was.

FWIW, a 1770 SAT isn't amazing, but it's certainly not bad. I know the two tests aren't directly correlated, but if you can make a 1770 on the SAT, you aren't 'really bad at standardized tests' like you claimed earlier. Please don't let your parents pressure into making the same mistake they did.

[Ronan]

Coming into college, I scored a 1770 on the SAT. I just don't know what I did wrong for the LSAT.

Like most people, you probably didn't study well, even if you studied a ton. Read some guides here on TLS and see if it looks anything like what your prep was.

FWIW, a 1770 SAT isn't amazing, but it's certainly not bad. I know the two tests aren't directly correlated, but if you can make a 1770 on the SAT, you aren't 'really bad at standardized tests' like you claimed earlier. Please don't let your parents pressure into making the same mistake they did.

I'm sure at the time OP's parents attended law school, going to UB wasn't a mistake. But times have changed OP, and your parents are being extremely reckless in their ignorance to your situation. You going to UB or Regent with a 3.8 and having to pay for it IS A MISTAKE.

[rellek]

One more question: I haven't heard back from University of Maryland yet. IF I were to get into there, would you advise to go there, or to still re-take the LSAT?

[zot1]

I really do appreciate your all's opinion! After studying a TON for the LSAT I took in February, I was taking practice tests and only scoring between 150-155. It's frustrating. Coming into college, I scored a 1770 on the SAT. I just don't know what I did wrong for the LSAT.

Parents, both of whom are lawyers, are dead-set against me taking a year off. They absolutely won't let me do it. I brought up that very idea when I first got my LSAT scores back, and it was an immediate "no." They believe if I went that route, I would essentially put-off law school and never go. I have no clue where they got that idea from.

My mom went to University of Baltimore and is working alongside my father at their own law office. My sister went to Oklahoma City University and is working in Federal Government doing well. I do get that it will be an uphill battle for a job no matter where I go with how competitive the market is, but I don't think it's impossible.

When your parents and sister went to school and graduated, the market was a whole different story. To begin with, your parents likely didn't take the same amount of debt you're about to get into. Now, if they can get you a job, that's a whole 'nother story.

As to your sister, the fed gov hiring market changes every year for the worst. This year, my agency hired only law clerks because the pool was so damn talented. Imagine that, most top school graduates never even stood a chance.

My FIL who is a lawyer graduated when people literally walked into 100k/yr jobs. That's not the market anymore. But if your parents are well off and might be able to help you, that's something else.

[Future Ex-Engineer]

I really do appreciate your all's opinion! After studying a TON for the LSAT I took in February, I was taking practice tests and only scoring between 150-155. It's frustrating. Coming into college, I scored a 1770 on the SAT. I just don't know what I did wrong for the LSAT.

Parents, both of whom are lawyers, are dead-set against me taking a year off. They absolutely won't let me do it. I brought up that very idea when I first got my LSAT scores back, and it was an immediate "no." They believe if I went that route, I would essentially put-off law school and never go. I have no clue where they got that idea from.

My mom went to University of Baltimore and is working alongside my father at their own law office. My sister went to Oklahoma City University and is working in Federal Government doing well. I do get that it will be an uphill battle for a job no matter where I go with how competitive the market is, but I don't think it's impossible.

When your parents and sister went to school and graduated, the market was a whole different story. To begin with, your parents likely didn't take the same amount of debt you're about to get into. Now, if they can get you a job, that's a whole 'nother story.

Yes, but he said his parents work at their own firm. I'm imagining its a 2-5 lawyer shop. That doesn't line up AT ALL with OP's stated goals.

[Ronan]

One more question: I haven't heard back from University of Maryland yet. IF I were to get into there, would you advise to go there, or to still re-take the LSAT?

We'd advise you to retake because you will have to take out a ton of debt to attend there.

Seriously, with a 3.8 you could get a free rides from some of the best schools in MD/DC/VA area with just an okay score.

[zot1]

I really do appreciate your all's opinion! After studying a TON for the LSAT I took in February, I was taking practice tests and only scoring between 150-155. It's frustrating. Coming into college, I scored a 1770 on the SAT. I just don't know what I did wrong for the LSAT.

Parents, both of whom are lawyers, are dead-set against me taking a year off. They absolutely won't let me do it. I brought up that very idea when I first got my LSAT scores back, and it was an immediate "no." They believe if I went that route, I would essentially put-off law school and never go. I have no clue where they got that idea from.

My mom went to University of Baltimore and is working alongside my father at their own law office. My sister went to Oklahoma City University and is working in Federal Government doing well. I do get that it will be an uphill battle for a job no matter where I go with how competitive the market is, but I don't think it's impossible.

When your parents and sister went to school and graduated, the market was a whole different story. To begin with, your parents likely didn't take the same amount of debt you're about to get into. Now, if they can get you a job, that's a whole 'nother story.

Yes, but he said his parents work at their own firm. I'm imagining its a 2-5 lawyer shop. That doesn't line up AT ALL with OP's stated goals.

No, but it would lower the risk of investment by: (1) providing him some form of employment opportunity, and (2) providing him a financial safety net if his parents are willing to help him out with his debt and/or unemployment phase if any.

[nyu2019maybeplease]

If you want even like a 1% chance of ever achieving your stated career goals, then I really encourage you to retake (even though it sucks). That awesome GPA should open many doors that are unavailable to most people here on TLS, but you're literally shutting that door on you.

Otherwise, FedGov/entlaw jobs will be almost certainly out of reach with these schools.

This is literally the same as someone choosing to walk out with the $100 after the first question on Who Wants to Be A Millionaire.

It is not "literally the same." Literally does not mean figuratively, no matter how fun it is to use it that way.

Anyhow, I hate saying retake, but yipes. Please please please please think about this. If you're not good at tests, go to a school where class rank matters less. With that GPA, you can.

[Ferrisjso]

One more question: I haven't heard back from University of Maryland yet. IF I were to get into there, would you advise to go there, or to still re-take the LSAT?

Depends on how much it would cost. Even if the situation was good though(and I don't think it would be), the main issue here is it looks like you took the LSAT one time and received a 149. Second time takers usually score better just by merit of knowing what to expect, nm better studying, and you have a good deal of room for improvement with a 149 so it's probably more likely that you will improve than it is on average(and the averge student marginally improves). With such a great GPA even getting my LSAT score a 156 could get you into T1's with half rides. I don't agree with retake advocates alot and I usually side with the people who don't want to take a year off, but here the retakers really are just right. It would be a tragedy to go to Baltimore or Regent with a 3.8 GPA, especially when you don't have a full ride and you've only taken the LSAT once. Don't think the debt is at a life crippling level and again for most schools(not Regent though) , 33 to 50 is a really good deal but I think you have almost no chance of success from those schools given your stated goals.

[rellek]

I really do appreciate everyone's opinions and I apologize if I came off as unappreciative at first. You all have really given me something to think about these upcoming weeks (esp. next week since I'll be off for Spring Break).

The truth is I don't know exactly what I would want to do in terms of a legal career yet. I do know that the study of law does come naturally to me though.I have always had a knack for business as well, and was even considering getting an MBA over a JD but thought I could do everything with a JD that I could do with a MBA, but not vice-versa, if that makes sense.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I had heard that of recent years (as in past couple of years post-recession), the number of J.D. applicants was actually on the decline?

[bmathers]

I respect the opinions of you telling me to retake and wait another year to go into law school, but at this point in my life, I'd rather knock schooling out, rather than essentially waste a year with no guarantee of actually being able to improve on the test. Retaking the test is simply not an alternative for me.

I'm 29 and decided to sit a year out and retake last year after getting a 153 on the Feb 2016 administration. My (somewhat) viable options were Akron for an unconditional ship that would make tuition $10k/yr, or Syracuse, where I was offered nearly a full ship so tuition would be $3k/yr, but with a 2.8 (?) stipulation for renewel.

I didn't want to sit out, I felt that I was to the age that I should just go forward and not look back. I took the advice, sat the cycle out, and retook. I now have multiple viable full-tuition scholarship offers that can likely place me in the Philadelphia legal market (my likely goal). None of these offers are conditional on any certain GPA or class ranking. One of these offers includes a living stipend... all because I sat out a year, studied, and retook. These schools all fall in the Tier 2, strong regional law schools distinction on this forum. However, I also received lesser scholarship offers from Tier 1 schools -- including UMD.

I do not have nearly your 3.8 GPA, that GPA is a big deal (but, in the eyes of admissions, not nearly as important as the LSAT). Please retake.

[bmathers]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I had heard that of recent years (as in past couple of years post-recession), the number of J.D. applicants was actually on the decline?

Yes, until this last year I believe it actually went up a very, very small percentage. Admissions are way down compared to a decade ago, though.

[Hennessy]

Baltimore is a bad school for anyone without strong ties to the city. Even then, most people come out with state govt. jobs - I mean like a huge percentage of the class is working at tiny firms or doing corporate real estate zoning for the city. Fine for them, bad for you.

retake
retake

source: am from Baltimore

[Rigo]

This is all pretty life ruining, OP. Retake or don't go.
You'd be in a better position working at Starbucks for 3 years.

[rellek]

.

[Ronan]

Nope, it doesn't. And you should delete that post so you don't run the risk of being outed to any adcomms that might frequent here.

[ponderingmeerkat]

This is all pretty life ruining, OP. Retake or don't go.
You'd be in a better position working at Starbucks for 3 years.

[Thomas Hagan, ESQ.]

If you want even like a 1% chance of ever achieving your stated career goals, then I really encourage you to retake (even though it sucks). That awesome GPA should open many doors that are unavailable to most people here on TLS, but you're literally shutting that door on you.

Otherwise, FedGov/entlaw jobs will be almost certainly out of reach with these schools.

This is literally the same as someone choosing to walk out with the $100 after the first question on Who Wants to Be A Millionaire.

It is not "literally the same." Literally does not mean figuratively, no matter how fun it is to use it that way.

Anyhow, I hate saying retake, but yipes. Please please please please think about this. If you're not good at tests, go to a school where class rank matters less. With that GPA, you can.

It's for emphasis. Perhaps you literally need to calm down lol

[Future Ex-Engineer]

If you want even like a 1% chance of ever achieving your stated career goals, then I really encourage you to retake (even though it sucks). That awesome GPA should open many doors that are unavailable to most people here on TLS, but you're literally shutting that door on you.

Otherwise, FedGov/entlaw jobs will be almost certainly out of reach with these schools.

This is literally the same as someone choosing to walk out with the $100 after the first question on Who Wants to Be A Millionaire.

It is not "literally the same." Literally does not mean figuratively, no matter how fun it is to use it that way.

Anyhow, I hate saying retake, but yipes. Please please please please think about this. If you're not good at tests, go to a school where class rank matters less. With that GPA, you can.

It's for emphasis. Perhaps you literally need to calm down lol

But you weren't wrong. Websters literally lists a definition of 'literally' as 'figuratively'

https://www.merriam-webster.com/words-a ... -literally

[Thomas Hagan, ESQ.]

If you want even like a 1% chance of ever achieving your stated career goals, then I really encourage you to retake (even though it sucks). That awesome GPA should open many doors that are unavailable to most people here on TLS, but you're literally shutting that door on you.

Otherwise, FedGov/entlaw jobs will be almost certainly out of reach with these schools.

This is literally the same as someone choosing to walk out with the $100 after the first question on Who Wants to Be A Millionaire.

It is not "literally the same." Literally does not mean figuratively, no matter how fun it is to use it that way.

Anyhow, I hate saying retake, but yipes. Please please please please think about this. If you're not good at tests, go to a school where class rank matters less. With that GPA, you can.

It's for emphasis. Perhaps you literally need to calm down lol

But you weren't wrong. Websters literally lists a definition of 'literally' as 'figuratively'

https://www.merriam-webster.com/words-a ... -literally

Wow, didn't even know that!

[Future Ex-Engineer]

If you want even like a 1% chance of ever achieving your stated career goals, then I really encourage you to retake (even though it sucks). That awesome GPA should open many doors that are unavailable to most people here on TLS, but you're literally shutting that door on you.

Otherwise, FedGov/entlaw jobs will be almost certainly out of reach with these schools.

This is literally the same as someone choosing to walk out with the $100 after the first question on Who Wants to Be A Millionaire.

It is not "literally the same." Literally does not mean figuratively, no matter how fun it is to use it that way.

Anyhow, I hate saying retake, but yipes. Please please please please think about this. If you're not good at tests, go to a school where class rank matters less. With that GPA, you can.

It's for emphasis. Perhaps you literally need to calm down lol

But you weren't wrong. Websters literally lists a definition of 'literally' as 'figuratively'

https://www.merriam-webster.com/words-a ... -literally

Wow, didn't even know that!

Yep, they made the change a couple of years ago. White girls everywhere were rejoicing

[jjcorvino]

I am glad to see that you are coming around a bit, but I just want to reiterate that to attend law school at this point would be the worst decision of your life. It will put you in crippling debt, with no job that could possibly pay it down. Your parents are completely wrong. Do not do it.