Wash U vs. Texas

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justicedoesnotexpire

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Wash U vs. Texas

Postby justicedoesnotexpire » Mon Feb 13, 2017 8:49 pm

I dont know if I'm asking this in the right place but I am really torn about this:
Wash U (150k total in scholarships) - vs. Texas (75k total scholarship)
I would barely have to take out a loan for tuition from Wash U, just for living expenses, whereas Texas I would graduate about 75k in debt from tuition and than add on living expenses whatever they turn out to be. I live in Dallas right now and am fond of Austin and Dallas and Texas in general so I am including that as a soft factor in my calculations. Despite that, is Texas worth 75 thousand more dollars than Wash U? I kinda wanna do biglaw or at least try it cause who doesnt want to make the big bucks.
P.S. I already negotiated the 75k from texas up from what was initially 63k using wash u's offer.

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UVA2B

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Re: Wash U vs. Texas

Postby UVA2B » Mon Feb 13, 2017 8:58 pm

Unless you're TX or bust, Washu and it's not particularly close. But if you are TX or bust, UT could be in play.

You need to solidify your goals regarding post-grad employment. I'd generally say Washu because it's a much better deal with comparable employment prospects, but it won't place in TX like UT will. So figure out how important TX is to you, and then you'll be able to make a better choice/get better advice.

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Re: Wash U vs. Texas

Postby KMart » Tue Feb 14, 2017 2:35 am

UVA2B wrote:Unless you're TX or bust, Washu and it's not particularly close. But if you are TX or bust, UT could be in play.

You need to solidify your goals regarding post-grad employment. I'd generally say Washu because it's a much better deal with comparable employment prospects, but it won't place in TX like UT will. So figure out how important TX is to you, and then you'll be able to make a better choice/get better advice.

this is 100% correct

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Re: Wash U vs. Texas

Postby AJordan » Tue Feb 14, 2017 3:02 am

Does WashU really have comparable employment numbers to UT? 0L but anecdotally there seems to be a lot more griping from WashU students about difficulty in getting jobs than UT students. UT's regional superiority doesn't more than compensate for WashU's lack of market?

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Re: Wash U vs. Texas

Postby favabeansoup » Tue Feb 14, 2017 1:49 pm

Totally going to go against other commenters. I'd say this is an easy case for going to UT.

UT at ~75k debt is a fantastic choice for someone looking to go into biglaw in Dallas/Houston, or to end in other various decent paying jobs.

Wash U does not have really "comparable" employment statistics compared to UT. Roughly 10% more kids get into biglaw /fed clerks from UT (more if you discount the large number of 2L UT transfers who routinely do poorly and dampen numbers). Wash U has good number ssure, but it's not into the 40%+ range of the UT/Vandy band of schools.

WashU for little to no money is also a good choice, but that would only be if you are comfortable with going to St Louis here, where OP has shown no particular interest in working.

Is there any data to show WashU beats out comparably ranked kids in other markets like D.C/LA/NY etc. I'd argue top third UT kids have a much better shot at those jobs than Wash U kids. (Not saying it's a fantastic shot, just better relatively).

That's besides the point though. If OP wants to work in TX (and he actually lives here right now so he has a pretty good idea) and he has a reasonable debt load, he can completely expect a good to decent outcome from UT.

Edit: missed part of OP where he wasn't including living expenses in debt load. From UT that could be significant for three years if all in loans. That makes me not quite as a strong Texas pick, but I still think it's the better option here if he really wants to work in Texas /biglaw in general.

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Re: Wash U vs. Texas

Postby acr » Tue Feb 14, 2017 2:00 pm

UVA2B wrote:Unless you're TX or bust, Washu and it's not particularly close. But if you are TX or bust, UT could be in play.

You need to solidify your goals regarding post-grad employment. I'd generally say Washu because it's a much better deal with comparable employment prospects, but it won't place in TX like UT will. So figure out how important TX is to you, and then you'll be able to make a better choice/get better advice.


I agree with this.

Anecdotally, as a WUSTL student, we seem to be doing pretty well in Texas. Many of my classmates are going to big/midsize firms in Houston and Dallas, and we have an off-campus interview program in Dallas that yields decent results. We also have a few Dallas/Houston firms come to our OCI, and I know for a fact that they hired multiple people from WUSTL this year.

WUSTL clearly won't place as well in Texas as UT. But with ties to Texas and decent grades, I think you have a solid chance at landing something in Texas from WUSTL.

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Re: Wash U vs. Texas

Postby BigZuck » Tue Feb 14, 2017 2:22 pm

acr wrote:
UVA2B wrote:Unless you're TX or bust, Washu and it's not particularly close. But if you are TX or bust, UT could be in play.

You need to solidify your goals regarding post-grad employment. I'd generally say Washu because it's a much better deal with comparable employment prospects, but it won't place in TX like UT will. So figure out how important TX is to you, and then you'll be able to make a better choice/get better advice.


I agree with this.

Anecdotally, as a WUSTL student, we seem to be doing pretty well in Texas. Many of my classmates are going to big/midsize firms in Houston and Dallas, and we have an off-campus interview program in Dallas that yields decent results. We also have a few Dallas/Houston firms come to our OCI, and I know for a fact that they hired multiple people from WUSTL this year.

WUSTL clearly won't place as well in Texas as UT. But with ties to Texas and decent grades, I think you have a solid chance at landing something in Texas from WUSTL.

I think this overstates the ease of getting TX big law from WUSTL, at least based on my super small sample size of anecdata from WUSTL kids I know who are practicing in Houston.

I think there is a sizeable gap between WUSTL and UT when it comes to employment and wouldn't say that employment prospects are all that comparable.

I wouldn't go to UT for the debt load the OP is looking at.

What are your numbers, OP? Also, "Lulz why not collect dem FAT STACKS of CASH $$$$$ HONEY??¿??" isn't really a good justification for going to law school IMO. I think you need a bit more career focus here before embarking on this path.

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Re: Wash U vs. Texas

Postby UVA2B » Tue Feb 14, 2017 2:35 pm

favabeansoup wrote:Totally going to go against other commenters. I'd say this is an easy case for going to UT.

UT at ~75k debt is a fantastic choice for someone looking to go into biglaw in Dallas/Houston, or to end in other various decent paying jobs.

Wash U does not have really "comparable" employment statistics compared to UT. Roughly 10% more kids get into biglaw /fed clerks from UT (more if you discount the large number of 2L UT transfers who routinely do poorly and dampen numbers). Wash U has good number ssure, but it's not into the 40%+ range of the UT/Vandy band of schools.

WashU for little to no money is also a good choice, but that would only be if you are comfortable with going to St Louis here, where OP has shown no particular interest in working.

Is there any data to show WashU beats out comparably ranked kids in other markets like D.C/LA/NY etc. I'd argue top third UT kids have a much better shot at those jobs than Wash U kids. (Not saying it's a fantastic shot, just better relatively).

That's besides the point though. If OP wants to work in TX (and he actually lives here right now so he has a pretty good idea) and he has a reasonable debt load, he can completely expect a good to decent outcome from UT.

Edit: missed part of OP where he wasn't including living expenses in debt load. From UT that could be significant for three years if all in loans. That makes me not quite as a strong Texas pick, but I still think it's the better option here if he really wants to work in Texas /biglaw in general.


Small note: it's 75k PLUS living expenses, making it more like $130k or so if debt financed. And OP mentioned being from Texas, not that they're exclusively targeting TX. Hence the importance of knowing how badly the OP wants TX vs. wanting biglaw generally.

Edit: missed your edit :P

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Re: Wash U vs. Texas

Postby UVA2B » Tue Feb 14, 2017 2:42 pm

BigZuck wrote:
acr wrote:
UVA2B wrote:Unless you're TX or bust, Washu and it's not particularly close. But if you are TX or bust, UT could be in play.

You need to solidify your goals regarding post-grad employment. I'd generally say Washu because it's a much better deal with comparable employment prospects, but it won't place in TX like UT will. So figure out how important TX is to you, and then you'll be able to make a better choice/get better advice.


I agree with this.

Anecdotally, as a WUSTL student, we seem to be doing pretty well in Texas. Many of my classmates are going to big/midsize firms in Houston and Dallas, and we have an off-campus interview program in Dallas that yields decent results. We also have a few Dallas/Houston firms come to our OCI, and I know for a fact that they hired multiple people from WUSTL this year.

WUSTL clearly won't place as well in Texas as UT. But with ties to Texas and decent grades, I think you have a solid chance at landing something in Texas from WUSTL.

I think this overstates the ease of getting TX big law from WUSTL, at least based on my super small sample size of anecdata from WUSTL kids I know who are practicing in Houston.

I think there is a sizeable gap between WUSTL and UT when it comes to employment and wouldn't say that employment prospects are all that comparable.

I wouldn't go to UT for the debt load the OP is looking at.

What are your numbers, OP? Also, "Lulz why not collect dem FAT STACKS of CASH $$$$$ HONEY??¿??" isn't really a good justification for going to law school IMO. I think you need a bit more career focus here before embarking on this path.


The employment prospects are probably because of UT having several big markets while WUSTL really doesn't. Not saying that's not significant to factor in, particularly since the OP has previous ties to TX, but in terms of placement power, they are peers.

Geographic goals here matter most: if TX, UT if you can stomach that debt. If other than TX, WUSTL to minimize debt.

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Re: Wash U vs. Texas

Postby BigZuck » Tue Feb 14, 2017 2:46 pm

UVA2B wrote:
BigZuck wrote:
acr wrote:
UVA2B wrote:Unless you're TX or bust, Washu and it's not particularly close. But if you are TX or bust, UT could be in play.

You need to solidify your goals regarding post-grad employment. I'd generally say Washu because it's a much better deal with comparable employment prospects, but it won't place in TX like UT will. So figure out how important TX is to you, and then you'll be able to make a better choice/get better advice.


I agree with this.

Anecdotally, as a WUSTL student, we seem to be doing pretty well in Texas. Many of my classmates are going to big/midsize firms in Houston and Dallas, and we have an off-campus interview program in Dallas that yields decent results. We also have a few Dallas/Houston firms come to our OCI, and I know for a fact that they hired multiple people from WUSTL this year.

WUSTL clearly won't place as well in Texas as UT. But with ties to Texas and decent grades, I think you have a solid chance at landing something in Texas from WUSTL.

I think this overstates the ease of getting TX big law from WUSTL, at least based on my super small sample size of anecdata from WUSTL kids I know who are practicing in Houston.

I think there is a sizeable gap between WUSTL and UT when it comes to employment and wouldn't say that employment prospects are all that comparable.

I wouldn't go to UT for the debt load the OP is looking at.

What are your numbers, OP? Also, "Lulz why not collect dem FAT STACKS of CASH $$$$$ HONEY??¿??" isn't really a good justification for going to law school IMO. I think you need a bit more career focus here before embarking on this path.


The employment prospects are probably because of UT having several big markets while WUSTL really doesn't. Not saying that's not significant to factor in, particularly since the OP has previous ties to TX, but in terms of placement power, they are peers.

Geographic goals here matter most: if TX, UT if you can stomach that debt. If other than TX, WUSTL to minimize debt.

I disagree. I think it is easier to get, say, NYC or LA big law from UT than it is from WUSTL. Not that it's easy or that UT is comparable to, say, Georgetown in that regard. But I think that WUSTL is in a tier below the UTs/Vandys/UCLAs of the world when it comes to legal employment.

We are now in an Internet fight

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Re: Wash U vs. Texas

Postby UVA2B » Tue Feb 14, 2017 2:55 pm

BigZuck wrote:
UVA2B wrote:
BigZuck wrote:
acr wrote:
UVA2B wrote:Unless you're TX or bust, Washu and it's not particularly close. But if you are TX or bust, UT could be in play.

You need to solidify your goals regarding post-grad employment. I'd generally say Washu because it's a much better deal with comparable employment prospects, but it won't place in TX like UT will. So figure out how important TX is to you, and then you'll be able to make a better choice/get better advice.


I agree with this.

Anecdotally, as a WUSTL student, we seem to be doing pretty well in Texas. Many of my classmates are going to big/midsize firms in Houston and Dallas, and we have an off-campus interview program in Dallas that yields decent results. We also have a few Dallas/Houston firms come to our OCI, and I know for a fact that they hired multiple people from WUSTL this year.

WUSTL clearly won't place as well in Texas as UT. But with ties to Texas and decent grades, I think you have a solid chance at landing something in Texas from WUSTL.

I think this overstates the ease of getting TX big law from WUSTL, at least based on my super small sample size of anecdata from WUSTL kids I know who are practicing in Houston.

I think there is a sizeable gap between WUSTL and UT when it comes to employment and wouldn't say that employment prospects are all that comparable.

I wouldn't go to UT for the debt load the OP is looking at.

What are your numbers, OP? Also, "Lulz why not collect dem FAT STACKS of CASH $$$$$ HONEY??¿??" isn't really a good justification for going to law school IMO. I think you need a bit more career focus here before embarking on this path.


The employment prospects are probably because of UT having several big markets while WUSTL really doesn't. Not saying that's not significant to factor in, particularly since the OP has previous ties to TX, but in terms of placement power, they are peers.

Geographic goals here matter most: if TX, UT if you can stomach that debt. If other than TX, WUSTL to minimize debt.

I disagree. I think it is easier to get, say, NYC or LA big law from UT than it is from WUSTL. Not that it's easy or that UT is comparable to, say, Georgetown in that regard. But I think that WUSTL is in a tier below the UTs/Vandys/UCLAs of the world when it comes to legal employment.

We are now in an Internet fight


It's about to get ugly.

I'm mainly resistant to making this distinction because it's impossible to quantify. Even though UT, et al outpace employment compared to WUSTL, those schools all have the distinction of feeding certain markets without peers (TX, LA, Southeast), whereas WUSTL has no sizable market they are immediately aligned with. Their best market is Chicago, where they're fighting with UChi/NU.

You could be right that there's a non-negligible difference in placement power, but there is no actual way to know that they're regarded at all differently in a vacuum.

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Re: Wash U vs. Texas

Postby BigZuck » Tue Feb 14, 2017 2:59 pm

Ultimately I don't think it really matters because WUSTL could very well be the best choice for the OP depending on cost/goals/other factors and I wouldn't really suggest someone go to UT unless they wanted to work in TX. It's not really worth derailing the thread IMO.

But I could quibble with it until we are both blue in the face. Hopefully we'll get that opportunity in another thread some day!



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