Choosing a Law School in NYC?

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nmurphy8

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Choosing a Law School in NYC?

Postby nmurphy8 » Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:19 pm

I'm struggling with choosing a school and would appreciate some advice. I've been accepted to the following schools:
- Fordham - with a 25K a year scholarship, stay in "good standing" stipulation
- St.Johns - with a full tuition scholarship, stay in the top 80% stipulation
- Cardozo - with a 52K a year scholarship, no stipulation
- Brooklyn - with 38K a year scholarship, stay in top 80% stipulation
I know that Fordham is at a much higher standing than the other three and I love the school, but is it really worth the extra money to attend? If it comes down to St. Johns, Brooklyn, and Cardozo, I know that it would be much more convenient for me to go to either Brooklyn or Cardozo, but is St. Johns considered much better than those two?
I will be living at home no matter which school I choose. I don't know for sure what my career goals are, I think I would like to be in a law firm but not necessarily "Big Law" since I know that's hard to break into. I don't want to go into government or public interest. I'm possibly interested in intellectual property or real estate law but I don't want to limit my career options yet.
Please let me know what my best option is!
Last edited by nmurphy8 on Fri Feb 03, 2017 12:50 am, edited 3 times in total.

cavalier1138

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Re: Choosing a Law School in NYC?

Postby cavalier1138 » Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:23 pm

Well, it depends on your career goals. Except for St. John's. If your career goal is to be a lawyer of some kind, don't go to St. John's.

But except for that, what are your general career goals?

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UVA2B

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Re: Choosing a Law School in NYC?

Postby UVA2B » Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:26 pm

What are your career goals? Can you live at home with someone else covering cost of living at all of these, or would you have to move out and cover your own cost of living?

You need to include much more information to get good advice here. Start by going to the Choosing sub forum and calculate your cost of attendance at each of them. That, combined with your career goals, will better inform this decision.

nmurphy8

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Re: Choosing a Law School in NYC?

Postby nmurphy8 » Thu Feb 02, 2017 1:52 pm

cavalier1138 wrote:Well, it depends on your career goals. Except for St. John's. If your career goal is to be a lawyer of some kind, don't go to St. John's.

But except for that, what are your general career goals?


I edited my original post to include this, but I don't know for sure what my career goals are. I think I would like to be in a law firm but it does not necessarily have to be "Big Law" since I know that's difficult to get into. I'm possibly interested in intellectual property or real estate law but I don't want to limit my career options yet.

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Re: Choosing a Law School in NYC?

Postby Rigo » Thu Feb 02, 2017 3:08 pm

How much more for a full ride at Cardozo? Negotiate up to a full ride.
Then negotiate with Fordham using Cardozo.

You shouldn't go to St.John's or Brooklyn with scholarship stipulations.

What is the COA for Cardozo and Fordham currently?

You also need to really think about your goals and get a little more specific of what is an acceptable outcome and what isn't. All these schools will limit your employment options to varying degrees, so you unfortunately don't have the luxury that HYS students unsure of what they want to do have.

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Cogburn1984

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Re: Choosing a Law School in NYC?

Postby Cogburn1984 » Thu Feb 02, 2017 3:56 pm

cavalier1138 wrote:Well, it depends on your career goals. Except for St. John's. If your career goal is to be a lawyer of some kind, don't go to St. John's.

But except for that, what are your general career goals?


Can I ask why you feel so strongly about St. Johns? I'd agree it's not the best school to attend, and I hate the shenanigans they do with scholarship stipulations, but I'd say it's certainly a cut above places like Cooley or Touro which shouldn't be attended in any circumstance.

LST has them at 70 % legal employment for the C/O 2015. Not world beating, but it certainly could be worse. I'd argue that with modest goals and no ridiculous stipulations on scholarships St. Johns could be seen as a viable option. Am I wrong?

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Re: Choosing a Law School in NYC?

Postby Rigo » Thu Feb 02, 2017 4:01 pm

Yeah St. John's is a cut above Cooley and Touro, but that's not saying much at all.

judill

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Re: Choosing a Law School in NYC?

Postby judill » Thu Feb 02, 2017 4:11 pm

If you're looking for a fighting chance at BigLaw, Fordham is the way to go among these hands down.

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trmckenz

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Re: Choosing a Law School in NYC?

Postby trmckenz » Thu Feb 02, 2017 4:18 pm

I recommend going to to the school that you want to tell people you went to. It will come up a lot. Write your story the way you want to write it. You will be fine.

ventura234

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Re: Choosing a Law School in NYC?

Postby ventura234 » Thu Feb 02, 2017 4:22 pm

cavalier1138 wrote:Well, it depends on your career goals. Except for St. John's. If your career goal is to be a lawyer of some kind, don't go to St. John's.

But except for that, what are your general career goals?


As a prospective student making a similar decision to OP, I am curious as to why would you draw this distinction? The employee data on LST seems to be pretty comparable. St. John's has a slightly higher legal employment rating and lower underemployment %. That being said, Brooklyn and Cardozo seem to send a slightly higher % of their classes to big law.

cavalier1138

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Re: Choosing a Law School in NYC?

Postby cavalier1138 » Thu Feb 02, 2017 4:55 pm

ventura234 wrote:As a prospective student making a similar decision to OP, I am curious as to why would you draw this distinction? The employee data on LST seems to be pretty comparable. St. John's has a slightly higher legal employment rating and lower underemployment %. That being said, Brooklyn and Cardozo seem to send a slightly higher % of their classes to big law.


Cogburn1984 wrote:Can I ask why you feel so strongly about St. Johns? I'd agree it's not the best school to attend, and I hate the shenanigans they do with scholarship stipulations, but I'd say it's certainly a cut above places like Cooley or Touro which shouldn't be attended in any circumstance.

LST has them at 70 % legal employment for the C/O 2015. Not world beating, but it certainly could be worse. I'd argue that with modest goals and no ridiculous stipulations on scholarships St. Johns could be seen as a viable option. Am I wrong?


Because NYC is such a great market that the school would have to literally be run out of someone's apartment for you to not have some kind of shot at employment. And NYC also has a wide selection of law schools, so if you're set on staying in the city, you can literally go anywhere else and get a better degree. Sure, it's better than Cooley, but that's not a good metric to use when you're in a city like New York.

ventura234

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Re: Choosing a Law School in NYC?

Postby ventura234 » Thu Feb 02, 2017 5:26 pm

Because NYC is such a great market that the school would have to literally be run out of someone's apartment for you to not have some kind of shot at employment. And NYC also has a wide selection of law schools, so if you're set on staying in the city, you can literally go anywhere else and get a better degree. Sure, it's better than Cooley, but that's not a good metric to use when you're in a city like New York.[/quote]


Thanks, I think that's pretty fair. I was just curious as to the distinction between SJ and Brooklyn/Dozo, as it does not seem to be supported by objective jobs data.

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Ferrisjso

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Re: Choosing a Law School in NYC?

Postby Ferrisjso » Wed Feb 08, 2017 11:17 pm

It could be worth the extra money. Two schools you should be deciding on here are Fordham(third best school in NYC) or Cardozo(fourth best school in NYC,yet cheapest non stip school on your list). 25k is a good scholly from Fordham. I guess it all depends on how debt adverse you are but those should be your top 2 choices. Don't go to SJU with the stips, they are notorious for taking away many people's scholly's and while those stips aren't horrible why take that chance when you got good money at better schools?

mariano283

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Re: Choosing a Law School in NYC?

Postby mariano283 » Wed Feb 08, 2017 11:51 pm

Ferrisjso wrote:It could be worth the extra money. Two schools you should be deciding on here are Fordham(third best school in NYC) or Cardozo(fourth best school in NYC,yet cheapest non stip school on your list). 25k is a good scholly from Fordham. I guess it all depends on how debt adverse you are but those should be your top 2 choices. Don't go to SJU with the stips, they are notorious for taking away many people's scholly's and while those stips aren't horrible why take that chance when you got good money at better schools?


FWIW, Dozo, St. John's and Brooklyn are really on par with each other in the NYC market. As pointed out above, they are ranked about the same and consistently have largely identical employment stats.

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Ferrisjso

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Re: Choosing a Law School in NYC?

Postby Ferrisjso » Thu Feb 09, 2017 12:58 am

mariano283 wrote:
Ferrisjso wrote:It could be worth the extra money. Two schools you should be deciding on here are Fordham(third best school in NYC) or Cardozo(fourth best school in NYC,yet cheapest non stip school on your list). 25k is a good scholly from Fordham. I guess it all depends on how debt adverse you are but those should be your top 2 choices. Don't go to SJU with the stips, they are notorious for taking away many people's scholly's and while those stips aren't horrible why take that chance when you got good money at better schools?


FWIW, Dozo, St. John's and Brooklyn are really on par with each other in the NYC market. As pointed out above, they are ranked about the same and consistently have largely identical employment stats.


I agree somewhat, Cardozo, Brooklyn and SJU are pretty similar in oppurtunities but i do think SJU's position is the least secure of three(in terms of reputation, I've been reading up on the NYC market and apparently there was a time Hofstra was on this level to and now it's not so a school's reputation can genuinely change) and that Brooklyn is slightly better and likewise Cardozo is slightly better than Brooklyn. I think SJU, all financial considerations aside, is still slightly worse but their behavior towards scholly's make's Cardozo and Brooklyn a better choice in almost all cases even if I grant you that all three schools are basically the same(which they are to some extent).



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