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(Rankings, Profiles, Tuition, Student Life, . . . )

All things equal - Lowest ranked school you'd pay sticker?

I'd never pay sticker
19
23%
Yale
8
10%
Harvard / Stanford
27
32%
Columbia / Chicago
12
14%
NYU
3
4%
U Penn
2
2%
UVA / Berkeley / Michigan
4
5%
Duke, Northwestern, Cornell, Georgetown or lower
9
11%
 
Total votes: 84

canafsa

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Postby canafsa » Thu Jan 19, 2017 9:07 am

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Last edited by canafsa on Sun Feb 12, 2017 12:20 am, edited 2 times in total.

katthegreat11

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Re: Geographic variables notwithstanding, when does sticker price begin to make sense?

Postby katthegreat11 » Thu Jan 19, 2017 10:23 am

I too am curious about this, and am in a similar position both school options-wise and career-goals wise. I have gotten into NYU, Columbia, and Stanford, but I don't have the numbers to get substantial merit aid at the T6 (50% or more). I want to first do BigLaw, but I also want to be able to be selective about the BigLaw job I choose- aka access to the ones in more niche fields (anything not corporate) and more reasonable work/life balance than NY BigLaw. I then want to be able to move to unicorn government/PI jobs.

Basically, I want to have as much flexibility and as many opportunities as I can get, in terms of area of law, type of position, geographic location, etc. And I think out of the schools you listed, Stanford is the only one that guarantees that. Despite all this, I am still absolutely terrified at the thought of taking out so many loans, even for Stanford. So I'm curious what others think.

canafsa

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Re: Geographic variables notwithstanding, when does sticker price begin to make sense?

Postby canafsa » Thu Jan 19, 2017 3:15 pm

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Last edited by canafsa on Wed Feb 01, 2017 11:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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trebekismyhero

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Re: Geographic variables notwithstanding, when does sticker price begin to make sense?

Postby trebekismyhero » Thu Jan 19, 2017 3:30 pm

Depends on your goals. If you're going to get $$ from NYU and very little from Columbia, there is almost no situation where going to Columbia makes sense.

Stanford is more of a maybe. Especially if you want west coast and better clerkship opportunities and/or PI. Then it is just about comfort with debt level and your goals

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Johann

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Re: Geographic variables notwithstanding, when does sticker price begin to make sense?

Postby Johann » Thu Jan 19, 2017 3:58 pm

Depends on goals. If I was hellbent on academia or unicorn jobs, I'd take sticker at Stanford. If biglaw or a good paying job generically was the goal, I'd mini me debt.

canafsa

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Re: Geographic variables notwithstanding, when does sticker price begin to make sense?

Postby canafsa » Thu Jan 26, 2017 5:41 pm

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Last edited by canafsa on Sun Feb 12, 2017 12:20 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Tiago Splitter

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Re: Geographic variables notwithstanding, when does sticker price begin to make sense?

Postby Tiago Splitter » Fri Jan 27, 2017 3:20 am

canafsa wrote:
JohannDeMann wrote:Depends on goals. If I was hellbent on academia or unicorn jobs, I'd take sticker at Stanford. If biglaw or a good paying job generically was the goal, I'd mini me debt.


Part of my trouble is assessing how likely a unicorn job in, for example, Silicon Valley might be for going to Stanford as compared to NYU or whatever. I definitely value diverse exit options from BigLaw, but also definitely intend on practicing with a firm for at least a while.

If the plan is to start with a firm it generally makes sense to take the money within the T-14.

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Ferrisjso

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Re: Geographic variables notwithstanding, when does sticker price begin to make sense?

Postby Ferrisjso » Sat Jan 28, 2017 1:49 am

Yale, Harvard, Stanford,CUNY, NCC or University of District of Columbia.

runinthefront

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Re: Geographic variables notwithstanding, when does sticker price begin to make sense?

Postby runinthefront » Sat Jan 28, 2017 2:06 am

If my parents were millionaires, I'd probably pay sticker price at Columbia and up (i.e., screw retaking the LSAT). If I were debt financing the entire sticker price--which, for the record, would be very unlikely at HYS my parents having at least some money to help --I would not pay sticker anywhere. I don't think there's any circumstance where paying $300k for a Yale law degree makes more sense than going to Columbia at like $85k or Duke for free. I just don't see it.
Last edited by runinthefront on Fri Jan 26, 2018 11:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

TAD

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Re: Geographic variables notwithstanding, when does sticker price begin to make sense?

Postby TAD » Sat Jan 28, 2017 2:14 am

Tiago Splitter wrote:
canafsa wrote:
JohannDeMann wrote:Depends on goals. If I was hellbent on academia or unicorn jobs, I'd take sticker at Stanford. If biglaw or a good paying job generically was the goal, I'd mini me debt.


Part of my trouble is assessing how likely a unicorn job in, for example, Silicon Valley might be for going to Stanford as compared to NYU or whatever. I definitely value diverse exit options from BigLaw, but also definitely intend on practicing with a firm for at least a while.

If the plan is to start with a firm it generally makes sense to take the money within the T-14.


Out of curiosity, why is this? Is this because the school name doesn't really matter after your first legal job? So even if you want to leave the firm life in the future, and plan on trying to lateral to other things later, you should still take the money?

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Re: Geographic variables notwithstanding, when does sticker price begin to make sense?

Postby cavalier1138 » Sat Jan 28, 2017 8:30 am

Ferrisjso wrote:Yale, Harvard, Stanford,CUNY, NCC or University of District of Columbia.


Quoting for posterity and for relevance to the OP.

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Re: Geographic variables notwithstanding, when does sticker price begin to make sense?

Postby Npret » Sat Jan 28, 2017 8:53 am

TAD wrote:
Tiago Splitter wrote:
canafsa wrote:
JohannDeMann wrote:Depends on goals. If I was hellbent on academia or unicorn jobs, I'd take sticker at Stanford. If biglaw or a good paying job generically was the goal, I'd mini me debt.


Part of my trouble is assessing how likely a unicorn job in, for example, Silicon Valley might be for going to Stanford as compared to NYU or whatever. I definitely value diverse exit options from BigLaw, but also definitely intend on practicing with a firm for at least a while.

If the plan is to start with a firm it generally makes sense to take the money within the T-14.


Out of curiosity, why is this? Is this because the school name doesn't really matter after your first legal job? So even if you want to leave the firm life in the future, and plan on trying to lateral to other things later, you should still take the money?

Because it's stupid to pay borrow hundreds of thousand dollars more than you have to in order to get a random NYC biglawjob. NYC biglaw is the easiest job to get from a top school.
Your work experience will matter most but it's not as if Duke isn't a highly respected school. Just because 0Ls and their families might think Harvard prestige is worth it, it really isn't for NYC biglaw jobs.
Don't know about SV but the COL is insane even compared to NYC. More debt will be an even bigger hindrance there.

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UVA2B

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Re: Geographic variables notwithstanding, when does sticker price begin to make sense?

Postby UVA2B » Sat Jan 28, 2017 9:37 am

Ferrisjso wrote:Yale, Harvard, Stanford,CUNY, NCC or University of District of Columbia.


Just wow. You need a disclaimer that follows you around this forum. Maybe something along the lines of:

*this advice should carry no weight. I approach life and law school like a drunk three year old playing with a kitchen knife*

canafsa

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Re: Geographic variables notwithstanding, when does sticker price begin to make sense?

Postby canafsa » Sat Jan 28, 2017 11:52 am

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Last edited by canafsa on Sun Feb 12, 2017 12:21 am, edited 1 time in total.

Npret

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Re: Geographic variables notwithstanding, when does sticker price begin to make sense?

Postby Npret » Sat Jan 28, 2017 11:56 am

canafsa wrote:Does school prestige carries any weight at all for exit options from Big Law or partnership prospects? I can't imagine it carries none...


Why do you assume this?

runinthefront

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Re: Geographic variables notwithstanding, when does sticker price begin to make sense?

Postby runinthefront » Sat Jan 28, 2017 11:57 am

canafsa wrote:Does school prestige carries any weight at all for exit options from Big Law or partnership prospects? I can't imagine it carries none...

The prestige doesn't add ~$300k worth of value for the median graduate (and you should assume you'd graduate at or around median).
Last edited by runinthefront on Fri Jan 26, 2018 11:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

whysooseriousbiglaw

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Re: Geographic variables notwithstanding, when does sticker price begin to make sense?

Postby whysooseriousbiglaw » Sat Jan 28, 2017 12:00 pm

It never does, but it's not completely stupid if your parents have over 20 million and this is like joke money to them.

runinthefront

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Re: Geographic variables notwithstanding, when does sticker price begin to make sense?

Postby runinthefront » Sat Jan 28, 2017 12:16 pm

whysooseriousbiglaw wrote:It never does, but it's not completely stupid if your parents have over 20 million and this is like joke money to them.


I 10000% agree, which is why

runinthefront wrote:If my parents were millionaires, I'd probably pay sticker price at Columbia and up (i.e., screw retaking the LSAT).
Last edited by runinthefront on Fri Jan 26, 2018 11:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Johann

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Re: Geographic variables notwithstanding, when does sticker price begin to make sense?

Postby Johann » Sat Jan 28, 2017 1:04 pm

canafsa wrote:Does school prestige carries any weight at all for exit options from Big Law or partnership prospects? I can't imagine it carries none...

Carries none for partnership

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Johann

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Re: Geographic variables notwithstanding, when does sticker price begin to make sense?

Postby Johann » Sat Jan 28, 2017 1:06 pm

runinthefront wrote:
canafsa wrote:Does school prestige carries any weight at all for exit options from Big Law or partnership prospects? I can't imagine it carries none...

The prestige doesn't add ~$300k worth of value for the median graduate (and you should assume you'd graduate at or around median).

People can value things differently. If someone is hell bent academia, the price is worth it. 1-2 million might be worth it over a 30-40 year career

Npret

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Re: Geographic variables notwithstanding, when does sticker price begin to make sense?

Postby Npret » Sat Jan 28, 2017 1:14 pm

JohannDeMann wrote:
runinthefront wrote:
canafsa wrote:Does school prestige carries any weight at all for exit options from Big Law or partnership prospects? I can't imagine it carries none...

The prestige doesn't add ~$300k worth of value for the median graduate (and you should assume you'd graduate at or around median).

People can value things differently. If someone is hell bent academia, the price is worth it. 1-2 million might be worth it over a 30-40 year career

But how many people are going to get legal academia and stay 30 years? Tenure jobs are few and far between. I don't kno where to find data other than the Faculty Lounge and I've seen only a handful of tenure positions over the past few years.

There may be at most a handful of gifted people who know they truly have what it takes for academics before they start law school.

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Re: Geographic variables notwithstanding, when does sticker price begin to make sense?

Postby HYPSM » Sat Jan 28, 2017 1:26 pm

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Last edited by HYPSM on Wed Mar 08, 2017 11:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Ferrisjso

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Re: Geographic variables notwithstanding, when does sticker price begin to make sense?

Postby Ferrisjso » Sat Jan 28, 2017 1:33 pm

UVA2B wrote:
Ferrisjso wrote:Yale, Harvard, Stanford,CUNY, NCC or University of District of Columbia.


Just wow. You need a disclaimer that follows you around this forum. Maybe something along the lines of:

*this advice should carry no weight. I approach life and law school like a drunk three year old playing with a kitchen knife*


The point I was trying to make is the best 3 schools are worth paying sticker for because they have such great opportunities/debt repayment options and the other ones are super affordable. I fail to see how this generates controversy at all.

cavalier1138

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Re: Geographic variables notwithstanding, when does sticker price begin to make sense?

Postby cavalier1138 » Sat Jan 28, 2017 1:34 pm

Ferrisjso wrote:The point I was trying to make is the best 3 schools are worth paying sticker for because they have such great opportunities/debt repayment options and the other ones are super affordable. I fail to see how this generates controversy at all.


Of course you do.

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A. Nony Mouse

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Re: Geographic variables notwithstanding, when does sticker price begin to make sense?

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Sat Jan 28, 2017 1:35 pm

Ferrisjso wrote:
UVA2B wrote:
Ferrisjso wrote:Yale, Harvard, Stanford,CUNY, NCC or University of District of Columbia.


Just wow. You need a disclaimer that follows you around this forum. Maybe something along the lines of:

*this advice should carry no weight. I approach life and law school like a drunk three year old playing with a kitchen knife*


The point I was trying to make is the best 3 schools are worth paying sticker for because they have such great opportunities/debt repayment options and the other ones are super affordable. I fail to see how this generates controversy at all.

Super affordable (for law school) doesn't mean something is a good financial investment.



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