NYU ($$) vs. Harvard ($) Forum

[sfoglia]

I have a $75k scholarship from NYU. I love the school, and I couldn't have been happier when I was accepted. I also love the city and plan to work here after I graduate.

I was accepted to Harvard, but it looks like I'm unlikely to receive aid information in time and will receive approx. $15,000 in aid for my first year. I have until tomorrow midnight to decide. I was sure I would enroll at NYU until I attended Harvard ASW and found that I like the school enough to offset the fact that I don't love Boston.

I have never gotten into schools like this before, and I'm over the moon with gratitude. I'll be receiving an incredible education either way, I know.

Everyone in my life says I should attend Harvard, including lawyers, regardless of cost. Not a single person believes I should choose NYU.

Opinions?

[jbagelboy]

Congrats on your acceptances.

What kind of lawyer do you want to be? There are some areas where it makes effectively no difference between the two, and others where there's a notable difference. If you want to be a corporate attorney at a big fancy firm in New York, go to NYU and save yourself two years of debt repayment. If you want to work in a smaller market, in government, in academia, or maybe with a highly competitive public interest organization like the ACLU, go to Harvard and take advantage of the increased placement power. $75k is the *meh* point where there's no clear right answer since you'll have a lot of debt and a lot of good opportunities either way.

[Nebby]

Yup, what jbagelboy said. What type of law are you interested in? Are you right out of college or do you have work experience? Congratulations on your accomplishments thus far!

[michlaw]

Harvard. It doesn't matter that you don't like Boston because you won't be leaving Cambridge if you wish to excel. If the money difference means there is no clear answer then the answer is Harvard. Congrats on getting in at both great schools.

[sfoglia]

Thanks, guys!

At the risk of outing myself: I have five years work experience, and I'll be working in a niche market that will ultimately land me back in NYC. There is one professor at each school who works in the area in which I intend to practice.

I feel like $75k is indeed kind of a "meh" point. I do know that I will be able to work part time here in the city should I choose, but I'm not sure I'll have time for that or that it will be wise given how important grades are.

[spauldingno]

Personally, I'd go to Harvard and never think twice. If NYU offered closer to a full ride then I'd lean NYU. But for 75k, I'd personally get a top school under me

[jbagelboy]

Personally, I'd go to Harvard and never think twice. If NYU offered closer to a full ride then I'd lean NYU. But for 75k, I'd personally get a top school under me

They are both top schools. That's not the distinguishing factor. The issue is whether the added placement power in certain areas of law is cost-justified. Since OP wants to enter a niche field and will assume a heavy debt burden regardless, HLS could confer a meaningful advantage and is probably the right choice.

[Nebby]

Thanks, guys!

At the risk of outing myself: I have five years work experience, and I'll be working in a niche market that will ultimately land me back in NYC. There is one professor at each school who works in the area in which I intend to practice.

I feel like $75k is indeed kind of a "meh" point. I do know that I will be able to work part time here in the city should I choose, but I'm not sure I'll have time for that or that it will be wise given how important grades are.

What is the niche field? There are hundreds

[spauldingno]

Personally, I'd go to Harvard and never think twice. If NYU offered closer to a full ride then I'd lean NYU. But for 75k, I'd personally get a top school under me

They are both top schools. That's not the distinguishing factor. The issue is whether the added placement power in certain areas of law is cost-justified. Since OP wants to enter a niche field and will assume a heavy debt burden regardless, HLS could confer a meaningful advantage and is probably the right choice.

Tippy top of the top schools. I said I'd do it, you say it's worth it. We agree, isn't that wonderful?!

[Dishydiana]

I have a $75k scholarship from NYU. I love the school, and I couldn't have been happier when I was accepted. I also love the city and plan to work here after I graduate.

I was accepted to Harvard, but it looks like I'm unlikely to receive aid information in time. I have until tomorrow midnight to decide. I was sure I would enroll at NYU until I attended Harvard ASW and found that I like the school enough to offset the fact that I don't love Boston.

I have never gotten into schools like this before, and I'm over the moon with gratitude. I'll be receiving an incredible education either way, I know.

Everyone in my life says I should attend Harvard, including lawyers, regardless of cost. Not a single person believes I should choose NYU.

Opinions?

I'm in exactly the same position, and I chose Harvard. For the next three years, I'm going to tell people I live in an exurb of NYC, a sleepy little college town, and leave it at that.

[sfoglia]

Thanks, guys!

At the risk of outing myself: I have five years work experience, and I'll be working in a niche market that will ultimately land me back in NYC. There is one professor at each school who works in the area in which I intend to practice.

I feel like $75k is indeed kind of a "meh" point. I do know that I will be able to work part time here in the city should I choose, but I'm not sure I'll have time for that or that it will be wise given how important grades are.

What is the niche field? There are hundreds

There is no advantage to one or the other, which is why this decision becomes so difficult; it is a purely personal one. It is better to be in NYC because that is the epicenter of the industry in which I'll work, but the Harvard brand is strong enough to offset my absence.

I already work in the industry in question in a non-legal capacity, so I am absolutely sure about this.

ETA: I attended every school I did (three total) because of scholarships and the fact that I wanted to save my parents as much money as possible. What I wanted was never a real consideration. So, this is an entirely new experience for me. And both schools are incredible.

Like choosing between a Ferrari and a Lamborghini, as a friend put it. (I don't know anything about cars, but this sounds about right.)

[sfoglia]

I'm in exactly the same position, and I chose Harvard. For the next three years, I'm going to tell people I live in an exurb of NYC, a sleepy little college town, and leave it at that.

Ha, I love your name.

Was cost a question for you? $75k may not be a lot of money in the scheme of things, but it does cover my tuition for an entire year.

[Nebby]

Thanks, guys!

At the risk of outing myself: I have five years work experience, and I'll be working in a niche market that will ultimately land me back in NYC. There is one professor at each school who works in the area in which I intend to practice.

I feel like $75k is indeed kind of a "meh" point. I do know that I will be able to work part time here in the city should I choose, but I'm not sure I'll have time for that or that it will be wise given how important grades are.

What is the niche field? There are hundreds

There is no advantage to one or the other, which is why this decision becomes so difficult; it is a purely personal one. It is better to be in NYC because that is the epicenter of the industry in which I'll work, but the Harvard brand is strong enough to offset my absence.

I already work in the industry in question in a non-legal capacity, so I am absolutely sure about this.

ETA: I attended every school I did (three total) because of scholarships and the fact that I wanted to save my parents as much money as possible. What I wanted was never a real consideration. So, this is an entirely new experience for me. And both schools are incredible.

Like choosing between a Ferrari and a Lamborghini, as a friend put it. (I don't know anything about cars, but this sounds about right.)

I'd take NYU then

[sfoglia]

There is no advantage to one or the other, which is why this decision becomes so difficult; it is a purely personal one. It is better to be in NYC because that is the epicenter of the industry in which I'll work, but the Harvard brand is strong enough to offset my absence.

I already work in the industry in question in a non-legal capacity, so I am absolutely sure about this.

ETA: I attended every school I did (three total) because of scholarships and the fact that I wanted to save my parents as much money as possible. What I wanted was never a real consideration. So, this is an entirely new experience for me. And both schools are incredible.

Like choosing between a Ferrari and a Lamborghini, as a friend put it. (I don't know anything about cars, but this sounds about right.)

I'd take NYU then

Yessssss, my one and only vote for NYU.

[gamerish]

There is no advantage to one or the other, which is why this decision becomes so difficult; it is a purely personal one. It is better to be in NYC because that is the epicenter of the industry in which I'll work, but the Harvard brand is strong enough to offset my absence.

I already work in the industry in question in a non-legal capacity, so I am absolutely sure about this.

ETA: I attended every school I did (three total) because of scholarships and the fact that I wanted to save my parents as much money as possible. What I wanted was never a real consideration. So, this is an entirely new experience for me. And both schools are incredible.

Like choosing between a Ferrari and a Lamborghini, as a friend put it. (I don't know anything about cars, but this sounds about right.)

I'd take NYU then

Yessssss, my one and only vote for NYU.

If you're actively looking for someone to tell you to go to NYU, just go to NYU. If your ties to the industry are already strong enough and the distinction between the two schools actually is, like you said, "purely personal," go to the one you like the most (which seems to be NYU and the $75k certainly doesn't hurt).

[bczako]

Honestly, based on your posts I think you should just go to NYU. It's less about the scholarship (which isn't incredibly significant in the grand scheme of things) but more about how you would really much rather stay in New York. You said you don't love Boston, you definitely want to work in New York, and there's something to be said about living in the city you love/want to work in while in law school. It doesn't sound like Harvard would substantially improve your career prospects for what you want to do, so just go to NYU.

[Dishydiana]

Ha, I love your name.

Was cost a question for you? $75k may not be a lot of money in the scheme of things, but it does cover my tuition for an entire year.

Thanks I like it too

Cost was a big concern for me, and the offer from NYU was a bit higher ($120,000). Given my interests (PI/Gov/Fancy Clerking/Academics), my mechanism of loan repayment will be LIPP/LRAP regardless of whether I take out a debt of $120,000 or twice that much. The advantage of NYU, then, would be a smaller debt to claw my way out of should I end up hating (or crapping out with) PI/Gov/Fancy Clerking/Academics. I don't believe, though, that the debt at NYU would be small enough to offer me a quick and easy passage of escape from a career in the Law.

The choice, then, is Harvard or No Law School at All. And, for the time being, I've chosen Harvard. (I have all summer to second-guess and doubt my decision

It was tough to cross out NYC, though. I love that place so, so much. One day, I'll move back...

If you're going into a field where your expected salary would be above the cap of Harvard's LIPP, it may make sense to go to NYU, given your preferences. You also might want to think about how your salary will grow in the ten years beyond law school, as well as the salary of a spouse (should marrying a yuppie or baron be ur thing). Taking that $75,000 scholly would cut a few hundred off the top of your monthly repayment.

And if any TLS interlopers have a different take on my situation, please chime in! I'm interested in a career in environmental regulation and policy. My NYU scholarship expires tonight.

[sfoglia]

Ha, I love your name.

Was cost a question for you? $75k may not be a lot of money in the scheme of things, but it does cover my tuition for an entire year.

Thanks I like it too

Cost was a big concern for me, and the offer from NYU was a bit higher ($120,000). Given my interests (PI/Gov/Fancy Clerking/Academics), my mechanism of loan repayment will be LIPP/LRAP regardless of whether I take out a debt of $120,000 or twice that much. The advantage of NYU, then, would be a smaller debt to claw my way out of should I end up hating (or crapping out with) PI/Gov/Fancy Clerking/Academics. I don't believe, though, that the debt at NYU would be small enough to offer me a quick and easy passage of escape from a career in the Law.

The choice, then, is Harvard or No Law School at All. And, for the time being, I've chosen Harvard. (I have all summer to second-guess and doubt my decision

It was tough to cross out NYC, though. I love that place so, so much. One day, I'll move back...

If you're going into a field where your expected salary would be above the cap of Harvard's LIPP, it may make sense to go to NYU, given your preferences. You also might want to think about how your salary will grow in the ten years beyond law school, as well as the salary of a spouse (should marrying a yuppie or baron be ur thing). Taking that $75,000 scholly would cut a few hundred off the top of your monthly repayment.

And if any TLS interlopers have a different take on my situation, please chime in! I'm interested in a career in environmental regulation and policy. My NYU scholarship expires tonight.

That makes sense. I don't think I'll be eligible for LIPP.

Ahhh, NYU, why don't you love me more! I would run with $120. Even $100 would be enough to make NYU my 100% choice.

Harvard has gotten back to me with $14k for the first year. Which makes NYU's scholarship no longer much of a consideration.

I think I'm going to take Harvard. Leaving the city is going to break my damn heart.

[Dishydiana]

That makes sense. I don't think I'll be eligible for LIPP.

Ahhh, NYU, why don't you love me more! I would run with $120. Even $100 would be enough to make NYU my 100% choice.

Harvard has gotten back to me with $14k for the first year. Which makes NYU's scholarship no longer much of a consideration.

I think I'm going to take Harvard. Leaving the city is going to break my damn heart.

It's only a three-and-a-half hour bus ride!

ha ha?
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[jbagelboy]

Ha, I love your name.

Was cost a question for you? $75k may not be a lot of money in the scheme of things, but it does cover my tuition for an entire year.

Thanks I like it too

Cost was a big concern for me, and the offer from NYU was a bit higher ($120,000). Given my interests (PI/Gov/Fancy Clerking/Academics), my mechanism of loan repayment will be LIPP/LRAP regardless of whether I take out a debt of $120,000 or twice that much. The advantage of NYU, then, would be a smaller debt to claw my way out of should I end up hating (or crapping out with) PI/Gov/Fancy Clerking/Academics. I don't believe, though, that the debt at NYU would be small enough to offer me a quick and easy passage of escape from a career in the Law.

The choice, then, is Harvard or No Law School at All. And, for the time being, I've chosen Harvard. (I have all summer to second-guess and doubt my decision

It was tough to cross out NYC, though. I love that place so, so much. One day, I'll move back...

If you're going into a field where your expected salary would be above the cap of Harvard's LIPP, it may make sense to go to NYU, given your preferences. You also might want to think about how your salary will grow in the ten years beyond law school, as well as the salary of a spouse (should marrying a yuppie or baron be ur thing). Taking that $75,000 scholly would cut a few hundred off the top of your monthly repayment.

And if any TLS interlopers have a different take on my situation, please chime in! I'm interested in a career in environmental regulation and policy. My NYU scholarship expires tonight.

See, at $120k, I would say NYU since the debt will be pretty light and you could pay the bulk of it off in a pre-misery amount of time. So it's a better hedge than HLS LIPP since NYU's LRAP will function basically the same way. You either enter the PI field and NYU LRAP pays, or after your clerkship you decide to head to a big firm and pay off your debt easily, giving you maximum career flexibility.

At $75k, this is tougher.

I'm not saying you're making the wrong choice Dishydiana. I just don't think your logic really works insofar as HLS acts as a hedge and NYU doesn't act as a better one; also remember that LIPP will expire if you ever marry someone with a higher income than yourself (so there's a personal life consideration). What could make HLS compelling is if you have both a high tolerance for debt and a strong preference for those outcomes where HLS confers a specific benefit, which may be the case.

[sfoglia]

That makes sense. I don't think I'll be eligible for LIPP.

Ahhh, NYU, why don't you love me more! I would run with $120. Even $100 would be enough to make NYU my 100% choice.

Harvard has gotten back to me with $14k for the first year. Which makes NYU's scholarship no longer much of a consideration.

I think I'm going to take Harvard. Leaving the city is going to break my damn heart.

It's only a three-and-a-half hour bus ride!

ha ha?
.
.
.
.
.
...

.
..
.
.
..


.
..

4.5! My friend told me you can sometimes catch flights for as little as $70, though.

Ghghhhhh.

[sfoglia]

Ha, I love your name.

Was cost a question for you? $75k may not be a lot of money in the scheme of things, but it does cover my tuition for an entire year.

Thanks I like it too

Cost was a big concern for me, and the offer from NYU was a bit higher ($120,000). Given my interests (PI/Gov/Fancy Clerking/Academics), my mechanism of loan repayment will be LIPP/LRAP regardless of whether I take out a debt of $120,000 or twice that much. The advantage of NYU, then, would be a smaller debt to claw my way out of should I end up hating (or crapping out with) PI/Gov/Fancy Clerking/Academics. I don't believe, though, that the debt at NYU would be small enough to offer me a quick and easy passage of escape from a career in the Law.

The choice, then, is Harvard or No Law School at All. And, for the time being, I've chosen Harvard. (I have all summer to second-guess and doubt my decision

It was tough to cross out NYC, though. I love that place so, so much. One day, I'll move back...

If you're going into a field where your expected salary would be above the cap of Harvard's LIPP, it may make sense to go to NYU, given your preferences. You also might want to think about how your salary will grow in the ten years beyond law school, as well as the salary of a spouse (should marrying a yuppie or baron be ur thing). Taking that $75,000 scholly would cut a few hundred off the top of your monthly repayment.

And if any TLS interlopers have a different take on my situation, please chime in! I'm interested in a career in environmental regulation and policy. My NYU scholarship expires tonight.

See, at $120k, I would say NYU since the debt will be pretty light and you could pay the bulk of it off in a pre-misery amount of time. So it's a better hedge than HLS LIPP since NYU's LRAP will function basically the same way. You either enter the PI field and NYU LRAP pays, or after your clerkship you decide to head to a big firm and pay off your debt easily, giving you maximum career flexibility.

At $75k, this is tougher.

I'm not saying you're making the wrong choice Dishydiana. I just don't think your logic really works insofar as HLS acts as a hedge and NYU doesn't act as a better one; also remember that LIPP will expire if you ever marry someone with a higher income than yourself (so there's a personal life consideration). What could make HLS compelling is if you have both a high tolerance for debt and a strong preference for those outcomes where HLS confers a specific benefit, which may be the case.

Well now, with my grant, it should come to be a $40k difference for all three years, should I accept NYU's offer. Soo, errrr.

[kumquat3]

Ha, I love your name.

Was cost a question for you? $75k may not be a lot of money in the scheme of things, but it does cover my tuition for an entire year.

Thanks I like it too

Cost was a big concern for me, and the offer from NYU was a bit higher ($120,000). Given my interests (PI/Gov/Fancy Clerking/Academics), my mechanism of loan repayment will be LIPP/LRAP regardless of whether I take out a debt of $120,000 or twice that much. The advantage of NYU, then, would be a smaller debt to claw my way out of should I end up hating (or crapping out with) PI/Gov/Fancy Clerking/Academics. I don't believe, though, that the debt at NYU would be small enough to offer me a quick and easy passage of escape from a career in the Law.

The choice, then, is Harvard or No Law School at All. And, for the time being, I've chosen Harvard. (I have all summer to second-guess and doubt my decision

It was tough to cross out NYC, though. I love that place so, so much. One day, I'll move back...

If you're going into a field where your expected salary would be above the cap of Harvard's LIPP, it may make sense to go to NYU, given your preferences. You also might want to think about how your salary will grow in the ten years beyond law school, as well as the salary of a spouse (should marrying a yuppie or baron be ur thing). Taking that $75,000 scholly would cut a few hundred off the top of your monthly repayment.

And if any TLS interlopers have a different take on my situation, please chime in! I'm interested in a career in environmental regulation and policy. My NYU scholarship expires tonight.

For any other lurkers like me reading this thread, I'll just chime in to say that I have similar career goals and given a slighter lower but comparable NYU scholarship, I will be enrolling at NYU over Harvard. I think my environmental interests (with a particular interest in city-level planning, so NYU obviously has great strength here) will be well-served, that there's no edge that meaningful edge that Harvard would provide in terms of my preferred career interests (non-academic, non-federal, non-impact lit), and that personally I will be happier studying at NYU and living in the city.

Also, for the little it's worth and at risk of diverting the conversation, I would like to chime in to note the frequency with which I have already heard (as a 0L) stories of spousal assets rendering students/alums ineligible for LIPP/LRAP, and how this came as a very unwelcome surprise. Even if you're dead poor, if you marry someone living in a high COL area, it doesn't take a yuppie or baron (haha, to quote the previous poster ) to have purchased a home and have 200K in combined equity (edit: though mortgage liability is also usually included as debt), savings, investments, and retirement by the time they reach their early thirties. It takes a relatively lucrative but not insane salary, or an unexpected death of a grandparent leading to a partial house downpayment, etcetc, and smart financial planning. So say you're a KJD who gets married at 30 to such an individual, you would say have a minimum of 5 years of LIPP/LRAP left, and potentially be on the hook for 150K of still outstanding student loan debt. Obviously, if you're an older student, it becomes more and more likely that you could find a partner with LIPP-complicating assets before you finish the program. Now, you don't have to get married, but I don't like the way that the program can heavily disincentivize that life choice, and I think very few admits understand how possible this complication can be.

I have a partner who will likely render me LIPP/LRAP-ineligible if we get married, so obviously the scholarship (a 60-70K gap over a projection of Harvard's grant aid) became much more important when I realize that these and other loan repayment options could be problematic for my particular situation.

[Dr. Nefario]

It's only a three-and-a-half hour bus ride!
ha ha?

4.5! My friend told me you can sometimes catch flights for as little as $70, though.
Ghghhhhh.

I dream of finding these flights and/or having my SO find the time off for the trip.

[Nebby]

Ha, I love your name.

Was cost a question for you? $75k may not be a lot of money in the scheme of things, but it does cover my tuition for an entire year.

Thanks I like it too

Cost was a big concern for me, and the offer from NYU was a bit higher ($120,000). Given my interests (PI/Gov/Fancy Clerking/Academics), my mechanism of loan repayment will be LIPP/LRAP regardless of whether I take out a debt of $120,000 or twice that much. The advantage of NYU, then, would be a smaller debt to claw my way out of should I end up hating (or crapping out with) PI/Gov/Fancy Clerking/Academics. I don't believe, though, that the debt at NYU would be small enough to offer me a quick and easy passage of escape from a career in the Law.

The choice, then, is Harvard or No Law School at All. And, for the time being, I've chosen Harvard. (I have all summer to second-guess and doubt my decision

It was tough to cross out NYC, though. I love that place so, so much. One day, I'll move back...

If you're going into a field where your expected salary would be above the cap of Harvard's LIPP, it may make sense to go to NYU, given your preferences. You also might want to think about how your salary will grow in the ten years beyond law school, as well as the salary of a spouse (should marrying a yuppie or baron be ur thing). Taking that $75,000 scholly would cut a few hundred off the top of your monthly repayment.

And if any TLS interlopers have a different take on my situation, please chime in! I'm interested in a career in environmental regulation and policy. My NYU scholarship expires tonight.

For any other lurkers like me reading this thread, I'll just chime in to say that I have similar career goals and given a slighter lower but comparable NYU scholarship, I will be enrolling at NYU over Harvard. I think my environmental interests (with a particular interest in city-level planning, so NYU obviously has great strength here) will be well-served, that there's no edge that meaningful edge that Harvard would provide in terms of my preferred career interests (non-academic, non-federal, non-impact lit), and that personally I will be happier studying at NYU and living in the city.

Also, for the little it's worth and at risk of diverting the conversation, I would like to chime in to note the frequency with which I have already heard (as a 0L) stories of spousal assets rendering students/alums ineligible for LIPP/LRAP, and how this came as a very unwelcome surprise. Even if you're dead poor, if you marry someone living in a high COL area, it doesn't take a yuppie or baron (haha, to quote the previous poster ) to have purchased a home and have 200K in combined equity (edit: though mortgage liability is also usually included as debt), savings, investments, and retirement by the time they reach their early thirties. It takes a relatively lucrative but not insane salary, or an unexpected death of a grandparent leading to a partial house downpayment, etcetc, and smart financial planning. So say you're a KJD who gets married at 30 to such an individual, you would say have a minimum of 5 years of LIPP/LRAP left, and potentially be on the hook for 150K of still outstanding student loan debt. Obviously, if you're an older student, it becomes more and more likely that you could find a partner with LIPP-complicating assets before you finish the program. Now, you don't have to get married, but I don't like the way that the program can heavily disincentivize that life choice, and I think very few admits understand how possible this complication can be.

I have a partner who will likely render me LIPP/LRAP-ineligible if we get married, so obviously the scholarship (a 60-70K gap over a projection of Harvard's grant aid) became much more important when I realize that these and other loan repayment options could be problematic for my particular situation.

Don't get married