washu, tulane, emory

(Rankings, Profiles, Tuition, Student Life, . . . )

which school

WashU
4
33%
Tulane
5
42%
Emory
3
25%
 
Total votes: 12

johnwhoatics
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washu, tulane, emory

Postby johnwhoatics » Wed Apr 29, 2015 7:28 pm

Tulane vs. WashU vs. Emory

-Tulane: coa is about 70k(that's everything including living cost)
-WashU: coa is about 140k
-Emory: coa is about 155k

I have saved 236k from working and have a couple of apartments I am renting for about 2.5k per month total. This is how I am paying for school.

I am from New Orleans and would like to practice in New Orleans, Denver, New York or overseas (such as Brazil as I was born there.)

My goal is to solve interesting problems and make money doing so. I would prefer to stay away from personal injury and family law, but am pretty open minded about most things. IP, comparative and international law are currently my leanings though.

A big concern I have is that I love new Orleans and worry about leaving, but I really want to maximize my opportunities. I am very used to living in the south.


2.9 GPA/ 168 LSAT
-I took LSAT once four years ago and this past year.

Any advice or perspectives would be appreciated.

mu13ski
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Re: washu, tulane, emory

Postby mu13ski » Wed Apr 29, 2015 7:42 pm

Why do you want to go to law school? Besides to "solve interesting problems"

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OhBoyOhBortles
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Re: washu, tulane, emory

Postby OhBoyOhBortles » Wed Apr 29, 2015 7:45 pm

I have saved 236k from working and have a couple of apartments I am renting for about 2.5k per month total. This is how I am paying for school.


Wut. Don't go to law school.

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ILoveYou
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Re: washu, tulane, emory

Postby ILoveYou » Wed Apr 29, 2015 7:47 pm

OhBoyOhBortles wrote:
I have saved 236k from working and have a couple of apartments I am renting for about 2.5k per month total. This is how I am paying for school.


Wut. Don't go to law school.


Yeah, just keep doing what you're doing dude.

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OhBoyOhBortles
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Re: washu, tulane, emory

Postby OhBoyOhBortles » Wed Apr 29, 2015 7:49 pm

ILoveYou wrote:
OhBoyOhBortles wrote:
I have saved 236k from working and have a couple of apartments I am renting for about 2.5k per month total. This is how I am paying for school.


Wut. Don't go to law school.


Yeah, just keep doing what you're doing dude.


Consider teaching classes on how to do what you're doing. I'll sit front row.

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ILoveYou
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Re: washu, tulane, emory

Postby ILoveYou » Wed Apr 29, 2015 7:50 pm

OhBoyOhBortles wrote:
Consider teaching classes on how to do what you're doing. I'll sit front row.


Count me in, too. Screw law school.

03152016
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Re: washu, tulane, emory

Postby 03152016 » Wed Apr 29, 2015 7:53 pm

can you clarify your goals

you say you'd like to make money. that limits your career options. what would you consider an acceptable salary?

are you ip bar eligible?

and what do you mean by "comparative and international law"? idk what comparative law means in terms of practice, or if it even exists outside of an academic context. international law could mean anything – immigration, international transactions, prosecuting war criminals, etc. what, specifically, do you mean by this goal?

if you answer these questions with specificity, we'll be able to help you. but right now your stated goals are too vague for us to help you choose the right school

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Clyde Frog
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Re: washu, tulane, emory

Postby Clyde Frog » Wed Apr 29, 2015 7:57 pm

johnwhoatics wrote:Tulane vs. WashU vs. Emory

-Tulane: coa is about 70k(that's everything including living cost)
-WashU: coa is about 140k
-Emory: coa is about 155k

I have saved 236k from working and have a couple of apartments I am renting for about 2.5k per month total. This is how I am paying for school.

I am from New Orleans and would like to practice in New Orleans, Denver, New York or overseas (such as Brazil as I was born there.)

My goal is to solve interesting problems and make money doing so. I would prefer to stay away from personal injury and family law, but am pretty open minded about most things. IP, comparative and international law are currently my leanings though.

A big concern I have is that I love new Orleans and worry about leaving, but I really want to maximize my opportunities. I am very used to living in the south.


2.9 GPA/ 168 LSAT
-I took LSAT once four years ago and this past year.

Any advice or perspectives would be appreciated.



Dude, don't give your money to any of those law schools. Whatever you're doing to have over 250k in the bank keep doing it.

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Clemenceau
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Re: washu, tulane, emory

Postby Clemenceau » Wed Apr 29, 2015 8:07 pm

Seriously. Continuing to invest in real estate or maybe starting a small business is a better use of your money than burning at these law schools.

Having 6 figures in the bank + a steady stream of income from real estate is a formidable formula for success, but not cuz law school.

I would have a field day solving the "interesting problem" that you have here.

johnwhoatics
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Re: washu, tulane, emory

Postby johnwhoatics » Wed Apr 29, 2015 8:32 pm

I've been very blessed in terms of financial success and I've always had an interest in law. The real estate investments were a means to solidify a financial base where I can try to pursue any goals I decided on. I have two more properties that should be completed before August, so financially sound, but unfulfilled with what I do right now.

Interesting problems I refer to are things like:

-A friend of mine had a girlfriend whose family member was in the US illegally. He apparently married a US citizen and didn't know how to go about applying for things properly since the US had no record of him entering the country. She talked about how the attorney had to find a way to work out that problem which sounded really interesting.

-I had to argue with a patent examiner when they tried to state that "anything that cuts is a knife and all knives serve the same function so are not unique." That took up some time, but it was very fulfilling work.

Money solves a lot of problems, but it is not the only end worth working for. If I found opportunities to practice immigration law or do other forms of public interest that would be great. On the flip side trying to solve complex legal problems for companies would also be fun (for me). I want to be challenged and I want to be in more direct control over outcomes. What I currently do most of the time is facilitate transactions between two parties who either want to buy or sell something OR I try to invent a new way to make plastic bags work. The latter is much more fun, but very limited in scope.

I am very happy with my financial success, but I wanted to be lawyer before when I didn't have the financial security to do so. I'd like to follow that path now that I can.

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transferror
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Re: washu, tulane, emory

Postby transferror » Wed Apr 29, 2015 8:44 pm

You are a legit snowflake. Go to Tulane, stay in NO, keep investing so you never have to rely on your JD to support yourself, and do wtf you want with your degree.

johnwhoatics
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Re: washu, tulane, emory

Postby johnwhoatics » Wed Apr 29, 2015 8:51 pm

Are you saying I should go to Tulane because I have investments in New Orleans already? I can hire someone to manage the properties, I really am trying to broaden my opportunities to practice in the most rewarding/interesting fields/jobs possible.

03152016
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Re: washu, tulane, emory

Postby 03152016 » Wed Apr 29, 2015 8:56 pm

you mentioned a desire to work with companies
how important is that to you
is it important to keep that option on the table? or would you not mind if that option was not available at your school?

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ILoveYou
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Re: washu, tulane, emory

Postby ILoveYou » Wed Apr 29, 2015 9:01 pm

Wow, yeah, actual snowflake here. I say Tulane as well. The reason being, even given your financial success, neither of the other schools are worth that price. They won't give you better enough options to justify paying double what you would at Tulane. You aren't going to be tied to any shit legal job to pay for your JD either, you'll be able to do what you want more or less. And from what you've said, it sounds like you could find something interesting but relatively low paying and be fulfilled while financially relying on your properties and whatnot. Tulane seems like a sweet opportunity for you.

I still wanna take your class.

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swampman
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Re: washu, tulane, emory

Postby swampman » Wed Apr 29, 2015 9:01 pm

johnwhoatics wrote:Are you saying I should go to Tulane because I have investments in New Orleans already? I can hire someone to manage the properties, I really am trying to broaden my opportunities to practice in the most rewarding/interesting fields/jobs possible.

Because you love NOLA and your opportunities wouldn't be much better at the other schools. Emory and WUSTL would give you a small chance at a big firm job in NYC, but I think you would find the work is neither interesting nor fulfilling. A small firm where you see lots of different cases, and can do public interest stuff as well, would probably be much more fulfilling and you have the financial freedom to do that. The easiest place to do that would be where you already have ties, ie NOLA.

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transferror
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Re: washu, tulane, emory

Postby transferror » Wed Apr 29, 2015 9:02 pm

johnwhoatics wrote:Are you saying I should go to Tulane because I have investments in New Orleans already? I can hire someone to manage the properties, I really am trying to broaden my opportunities to practice in the most rewarding/interesting fields/jobs possible.


I'm saying all of these schools are regional and carry the same "prestige" - which is that they are respected in their local markets and their names don't carry much weight elsewhere. You like New Orleans, have roots in New Orleans, and New Orleans will offer just as many, if not more, public interest interest opportunities than Atlanta or St. Louis.

Your desired markets are Denver, NO, NYC, or over seas. All of these schools give you (basically) equally bad odds of ending up in NYC, Denver, or over seas, and Tulane gives you the best shot at networking in NO during school and thus the best odds at your desired job (whatever that may be) in New Orleans. Admittedly Emory and WUSTL place a non-negligible number of students in NYC, but I'm under the impression that it's primarily into biglaw firms, which I don't think you want. So there's no good reason to leave NO, and especially not to pay 70k+ extra while doing so.

Edit: mostly scooped

johnwhoatics
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Re: washu, tulane, emory

Postby johnwhoatics » Wed Apr 29, 2015 9:30 pm

Are WUSTL and Emory really just regional schools? When looking at their geographic placement, it seemed they were national in scope. Is this from people going to study there and returning home?

Sorry if I sound naive about these things, I was just under a different impression.

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ILoveYou
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Re: washu, tulane, emory

Postby ILoveYou » Wed Apr 29, 2015 9:39 pm

Most schools are mostly regional. You shouldn't count on any school outside the t14 being truly national, and even most of the t14 are pretty regional. Ties are a significant factor in a lot of markets.

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rpupkin
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Re: washu, tulane, emory

Postby rpupkin » Wed Apr 29, 2015 9:50 pm

johnwhoatics wrote:-I had to argue with a patent examiner when they tried to state that "anything that cuts is a knife and all knives serve the same function so are not unique." That took up some time, but it was very fulfilling work.

If you were actually fulfilled by arguments with a patent examiner, then perhaps law is for you.

I will offer further advice on the condition that you post pics of the novel knife that you invented.

03152016
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Re: washu, tulane, emory

Postby 03152016 » Wed Apr 29, 2015 9:50 pm

the goals are still completely unclear. we've failed to identify the basics in this thread

law schools have specific strengths and weaknesses, in terms of region, placement into certain types of jobs, externship and clinic opportunities, portability, etc
because op has not sufficiently clarified her goals, i believe it's close to impossible to make a recommendation in good faith

therefore, i recommend op sit out this cycle and work on clarifying her goals
if op is unwilling to do this, i recommend op attend the school that is least expensive when all costs are factored in

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transferror
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Re: washu, tulane, emory

Postby transferror » Wed Apr 29, 2015 9:52 pm

johnwhoatics wrote:Are WUSTL and Emory really just regional schools? When looking at their geographic placement, it seemed they were national in scope. Is this from people going to study there and returning home?

Sorry if I sound naive about these things, I was just under a different impression.


Yes, they are regional. Of course the tippy top students from WUSTL and Emory will have a chance at DC and the top 10-15% from each have a good chance at NYC, but most of the students headed to other markets are either returning home or have some kind of roots where they are headed. There are obviously exceptions, but the overwhelming majority of students are either staying local or going home. And like I said, I'd wager that a huge chunk of the students headed to NYC/DC/Cali are headed to biglaw firms, and I don't think that's what you want. You've had entrepreneurial success and currently have a lot of autonomy, so I don't imagine you being happy as a corporate drone doing doc review or diligence at a biglaw firm.

As for public interest - non-profits, small firms doing civil rights or immigration, etc. - that stuff is best acquired through demonstrated commitment and networking. The networking part is essential, and it's easiest to network in your school's market. Externships and internships during the academic year are far less competitive than summer jobs, so you could, for instance, go to Tulane and intern during your semesters with the ACLU or city law department in the immigration unit or whatever and it could lead to opportunities. It's far more likely you'll have greater access to and opportunity for a position there than you will applying cold to spots in NYC or whatever.

Tulane is the right choice by a mile. TLS often recommends students go to top schools or take a full ride at a strong regional with a clear path and plan of attack, but you are absolutely the exception. Go to Tulane and explore, network, and figure out what type of practice will give you satisfaction.

03152016
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Re: washu, tulane, emory

Postby 03152016 » Wed Apr 29, 2015 10:03 pm

i agree that op should go to tulane, based on cost

however, as it stands, i disagree that we have enough information for tulane to be the right decision based on goals
op's goals are not clear. depending on what op meant, tulane could be a fine choice, or it could cut off opportunities op wants to keep on the table
it is not unusual for prospective law students to lack a clear vision of what area they'd like to practice in. however, here, the goals are too diverse and too vague to offer meaningful guidance, imo

i also think your assessment of wustl's chances at the ny market are a touch pessimistic, but that's another can of worms

03152016
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Re: washu, tulane, emory

Postby 03152016 » Wed Apr 29, 2015 10:09 pm

op just asked me to clarify what information i think should be provided

here are some questions i asked earlier that i think are important:

1) op mentioned a desire to make money. what would op consider an acceptable salary?

2) is op patent bar eligible? if you're not sure what that means, what was your undergrad major?

3) op mentioned comparative law. that sounds like academia. is op considering academia?

4) op mentioned business. is working with companies an important goal that op would like to keep on the table? (and, adding onto my earlier question, what sort of companies? stuff like helping local businesses set up shop? or are you thinking more on the scale of large companies in a firm environment?)

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transferror
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Re: washu, tulane, emory

Postby transferror » Wed Apr 29, 2015 10:15 pm

I mean, I'm not sure OP needs clear goals. I know the TLS mantra is often only go to a strong regional with a full ride, attainable goals and a clear plan of attack to achieve them, but I think OP is the exception if ever there was an exception.

I just don't think the risk matters enough to sit out a cycle. If OP suddenly realizes that he or she wants to be a prosecutor during 3L, then OP can afford to spend a year or two volunteering. I think the primary risk of attending Tulane is closing the door on biglaw, and as I stated earlier, I can't imagine such an entrepreneurial, autonomous person being happy or fulfilled as a biglaw drone. OP doesn't need financial stability from the JD; just fulfillment. Let'em go figure it out.

**And I concede that my wording should have been more like 10-15% of WUSTL's class will end up in NYC with the top 1/3 being competitive for those jobs.

edit: I'm anxious to hear OP's answers to Brut's questions, though

johnwhoatics
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Re: washu, tulane, emory

Postby johnwhoatics » Wed Apr 29, 2015 10:36 pm

Brut wrote:op just asked me to clarify what information i think should be provided

here are some questions i asked earlier that i think are important:

1) op mentioned a desire to make money. what would op consider an acceptable salary?

2) is op patent bar eligible? if you're not sure what that means, what was your undergrad major?

3) op mentioned comparative law. that sounds like academia. is op considering academia?

4) op mentioned business. is working with companies an important goal that op would like to keep on the table? (and, adding onto my earlier question, what sort of companies? stuff like helping local businesses set up shop? or are you thinking more on the scale of large companies in a firm environment?)


1) Depending on area really. Below for scale:
New Orleans: >40k
Denver: >45k
NYC: >75k

I want to be able to survive on a comfortable level with my income from law if possible and use my investments to build capital and wealth. This way I am not constrained by money in my legal work.

2) I am not patent bar eligible, but I have considered taking Category B qualifying classes to fulfill requirements if that seemed the best opportunity for me to pursue. I know that patent prosecution is the only part where that is necessary, but it might still be a fulfilling line of work when working with inventors.

3) I am willing to work in academia, but it is not of primary interest at the moment. I was under the impression that when legal matters cross state and/or national borders that it would fall under this or international law. I am beginning to think I was mistaken perhaps?

4) Speaking to attorneys who currently work in various fields, I have been told on many occasions that working with companies or big firms offers some of the most varied scope of work that I would have to deal with. This doesn't mean I necessarily am going after big law or corporate work, but rather that I am most interested in feeling fulfilled by the work I do. I like to learn new things and solve problems that require more than just a cursory glance.

I would love to help local business set up shop or assist in other start ups. It would also be interesting to help combat patent trolls or other forms of litigation. I am VERY open to various paths I just really do not want to be shaking down insurance companies or dealing with angry couples who are seeking emotional release through nasty divorces.

I want to either make a positive impact in the world around me (in various manners) or I want to solve interesting/challenging problems that are mentally rewarding.

Let me know if there is more I can answer.




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