ND (Full) vs. Vandy (Half)

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UOI4430
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ND (Full) vs. Vandy (Half)

Postby UOI4430 » Thu Apr 23, 2015 3:38 pm

Hey TLS,

So I am down to my final two schools and I need to make a decision. I have placed a deposit at Notre Dame, but need to decide if I will chose Vanderbilt instead by tomorrow.

Cost of Attendance:
Notre Dame -- 50-60K
Vanderbilt -- 135K

I will be debt financing everything. I am from WA which is the only place where I have significant ties, but I have absolutely zero geographic preference. I am truly willing to work wherever the opportunity is greatest. It seems like Notre Dame feeds its top students into Chicago which would be just fine for me. My career goals are not too specific. I am hoping to find what I want practice while I am in law school. A federal clerkship would be my first choice. I think that I could stomach big law for a few years if I had to but not much longer than that.

3.78, 168 (1 time)

I think that Notre Dame is the obvious choice given the cost. However, I don't want to lock myself out of certain firms, clerkships, etc. having gone to a lower ranked school. Vanderbilt has a much better fed. clerkship and big law rate. My real question is, is Vanderbilt worth more than twice what I will spend to go to Notre Dame?

Thanks.

Traynor Brah
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Re: ND (Full) vs. Vandy (Half)

Postby Traynor Brah » Thu Apr 23, 2015 3:42 pm

Obviously Notre Dame is better but for someone in your situation a retake might be advisable. I think saying geography is irrelevant to you is pretty much like saying loans are irrelevant to you. I would try to go to school where I had ties or to a school that provided more geographic flexibility. Law school isn't really a good time to try out a new region for fun.

But to answer the specific question: no, Vandy is not worth that much money, generally, and it is definitely not worth that much more than Notre Dame, especially when geography is not being considered.

liberalartslawyer
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Re: ND (Full) vs. Vandy (Half)

Postby liberalartslawyer » Thu Apr 23, 2015 3:53 pm

Vanderbilt does in fact have better Big Law + Clerkship, but I wouldn't say dramatically so:

Vandy Big Law:29.9%
ND Big Law: 29.61%

Vandy Clerk:11.34%
ND Clerk: 7.82%

Vandy Total:41.24
ND Total: 37.43%

If you feel that 3.81% is a meaningful difference, then side with Vanderbilt. I imagine the weather is better too.

Also, I don't know if you visited South Bend, but it is kind of a pit. It was worse than I was expecting anyway (did my undergrad in a shitty Northeastern small town - thought they would be similar).

Personally though, I would choose ND. (Full disclosure: I have also deposited at ND.)

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ILoveYou
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Re: ND (Full) vs. Vandy (Half)

Postby ILoveYou » Thu Apr 23, 2015 3:55 pm

I think a retake/reapply would be TCR for you, although my stats weren't a whole lot different and I chose not to retake, so I definitely understand that sometimes it just isn't the right move--only you can decide that for your situation.

That said, that is way too much money to pay for Vandy, and ND at that cost is far from ideal, especially without geographic ties.

BigZuck
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Re: ND (Full) vs. Vandy (Half)

Postby BigZuck » Thu Apr 23, 2015 3:58 pm

Classic "Neither. Retake." scenario.

These schools just don't align with your goals. Luckily you have a good GPA and you're scoring in a range where every point matters and you're really close to some much better options.

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Rigo
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Re: ND (Full) vs. Vandy (Half)

Postby Rigo » Thu Apr 23, 2015 6:22 pm

How do you not have decent T14 offers?

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Mack.Hambleton
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Re: ND (Full) vs. Vandy (Half)

Postby Mack.Hambleton » Thu Apr 23, 2015 10:09 pm

Rigo wrote:How do you not have decent T14 offers?


yeah you should have some $ at michigan, cornell etc with those numbers

CanadianWolf
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Re: ND (Full) vs. Vandy (Half)

Postby CanadianWolf » Fri Apr 24, 2015 12:29 am

Were you accepted to & offered a scholarship to the Univ. of Washington law school ?

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cron1834
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Re: ND (Full) vs. Vandy (Half)

Postby cron1834 » Fri Apr 24, 2015 2:01 am

If you don't know what you want to do, and don't know where you want to do it, I would not suggest going to a regional school where you have no connection to the region. With that said, if you must go ND is clearly the better choice here bc debt.

hearsay77
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Re: ND (Full) vs. Vandy (Half)

Postby hearsay77 » Fri Apr 24, 2015 2:46 am

Mack.Hambleton wrote:
Rigo wrote:How do you not have decent T14 offers?


yeah you should have some $ at michigan, cornell etc with those numbers


+1 I have similar stats, do you not have any T14 options?

gj49
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Re: ND (Full) vs. Vandy (Half)

Postby gj49 » Wed Jul 01, 2015 4:18 pm

Going to hijack this post since I'm considering the same two schools. Looking for advice. MAIN DIFFERENCE NO DEBT


I have scholarships to both schools (smaller than many of you would consider worthwhile I'm sure, but they are similar in amount to OP) and my family will be covering the entire COA with no loans and without any burden. Vanderbilt will be $53,000 ( not $75,000 like OP) more expensive over the 3 years


-Where you are from and where you want to work, and other places where you have significant ties (if any)

ties to philly, DC and NYC. willing to work in any major city NYC>Chicago>LA>DC>Philly>Boston

-Your general career goals

corporate biglaw but would probably be content with corporate midlaw or possibly JD advantaged jobs in finance related to law (such as restructuring)


I don't intend to retake, already took twice, and I'm not going into any debt which seems to be most peoples' concern with options like mine. Plus my family is financing the schooling and they don't want me to take a gap year.


my question is whether Vanderbilt is worth 53,000 extra with my corporate goals and not considering debt

Thanks for any perspective on this

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KMart
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Re: ND (Full) vs. Vandy (Half)

Postby KMart » Wed Jul 01, 2015 4:21 pm

Notre Dame is likely the correct choice given your facts (to the person above) ^^.

arklaw13
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Re: ND (Full) vs. Vandy (Half)

Postby arklaw13 » Wed Jul 01, 2015 5:10 pm

Dunno what the best call is for the above poster, but I'm a Vandy 3L happy to answer any specific questions you have about the school. Here or PM is fine.

CanadianWolf
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Re: ND (Full) vs. Vandy (Half)

Postby CanadianWolf » Wed Jul 01, 2015 6:09 pm

OP: Vanderbilt places better than Notre Dame into biglaw which is your target career goal. Otherwise, personal preference.

gj49
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Re: ND (Full) vs. Vandy (Half)

Postby gj49 » Wed Jul 01, 2015 7:58 pm

CanadianWolf wrote:OP: Vanderbilt places better than Notre Dame into biglaw which is your target career goal. Otherwise, personal preference.


Thanks to all of you for the responses. CanadianWolf or arklaw13, I was wondering if your experiences could help to explain the biglaw statistics considering that LST says their biglaw numbers are almost identical. Do you think Vanderbilt students self-select out of biglaw more than ND students?

Also, do you think that the law&business certificates at Vanderbilt or Notre Dame are attractive to employers or is it pretty much just class rank/law review that matters?

Is common TLS belief that Nashville is nicer than Notre Dame to live in? I've never visited Nashville

arklaw13
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Re: ND (Full) vs. Vandy (Half)

Postby arklaw13 » Thu Jul 02, 2015 9:19 am

gj49 wrote:
CanadianWolf wrote:OP: Vanderbilt places better than Notre Dame into biglaw which is your target career goal. Otherwise, personal preference.


Thanks to all of you for the responses. CanadianWolf or arklaw13, I was wondering if your experiences could help to explain the biglaw statistics considering that LST says their biglaw numbers are almost identical. Do you think Vanderbilt students self-select out of biglaw more than ND students?

Also, do you think that the law&business certificates at Vanderbilt or Notre Dame are attractive to employers or is it pretty much just class rank/law review that matters?

Is common TLS belief that Nashville is nicer than Notre Dame to live in? I've never visited Nashville


I'll PM you

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ndirish2010
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Re: ND (Full) vs. Vandy (Half)

Postby ndirish2010 » Fri Jul 03, 2015 3:25 am

There are too many things to respond to in this thread, but if anyone has any specific questions about ND, feel free to ask. As for the OP, neither of these schools really makes sense for you, but if you must go, ND at that price isn't terrible. I would not pay 135k for Vandy.

Also, 3.7/168 getting a full ride at ND is just amazing to me. Those were exactly my stats and I definitely did not get a full ride. Everyone who applied back in 2010 just wishes they waited it out.

BigZuck
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Re: ND (Full) vs. Vandy (Half)

Postby BigZuck » Fri Jul 03, 2015 8:06 am

ndirish2010 wrote:There are too many things to respond to in this thread, but if anyone has any specific questions about ND, feel free to ask. As for the OP, neither of these schools really makes sense for you, but if you must go, ND at that price isn't terrible. I would not pay 135k for Vandy.

Also, 3.7/168 getting a full ride at ND is just amazing to me. Those were exactly my stats and I definitely did not get a full ride. Everyone who applied back in 2010 just wishes they waited it out.

Yeah I think if I had waited just one more year I would have got close to or a full ride at Cornell instead of a half ride. It's crazy out there right now.




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