Duke ($$) vs UVA ($$)

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Alanar
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Duke ($$) vs UVA ($$)

Postby Alanar » Fri Apr 17, 2015 1:38 pm

Duke just matched UVA's award and I'm really stuck. Here are my impressions, I'd be really curious if others agree/disagree or have other thoughts. In terms of goals, I'm still figuring all of that out. I'm interested in private sector but want a place with a lot of options.

The schools basically identical on a lot of facets:
- beautiful, rural campuses
- supposedly incredible professors
- "collegial", friendly students
- great clerkship placement
- USNWR ranking
- students seem happy at both places (didn't always get this impression from other schools.. Like NYU)

And some differences…

Ranking trends: UVA stayed put at 8, allowing two other schools to tie it (which sort of means it fell in the rankings). Duke, as one of these schools, shot up 2 slots in the rankings… which is up (by another 2?) from where they were the year before that. Is this a trend that will continue?

Class size: Duke seems to be about 100+ kids smaller than UVA. Small class size is important to me, but this does mean that UVA will have a larger alumni network. Speaking of which…

Alumni network: I missed Duke's ASW but UVA's alumni seem pretty connected. I was impressed with the giving rate and also with the number of graduates in "senior" positions compared to other schools (presentation said they were second only to Harvard, which can obviously be manipulated to fit a narrative. It was still impressive though). As more of an up and coming school, I'm not sure that Duke has this (yet)

Placement/Employment: UVA favors DC whereas Duke favors NYC and then DC. Right now I'm interested in DC or possibly Texas or Cali. I know this might change. Overall, looks like UVA's employment percentage was better than Duke's

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OhBoyOhBortles
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Re: Duke ($$) vs UVA ($$)

Postby OhBoyOhBortles » Fri Apr 17, 2015 1:41 pm

-The schools you are considering
-The total Cost of Attendance (COA) of each. COA = cost of tuition + fees + books + cost of living (COL) + accumulated interest - scholarships. Here is a helpful calculator.
-How you will be financing your COA, i.e. loans, family, or savings
-Where you are from and where you want to work, and other places where you have significant ties (if any)
-Your general career goals
-Your LSAT/GPA numbers
-How many times you have taken the LSAT

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Serett
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Re: Duke ($$) vs UVA ($$)

Postby Serett » Fri Apr 17, 2015 2:40 pm

Alanar wrote:Duke just matched UVA's award and I'm really stuck. Here are my impressions, I'd be really curious if others agree/disagree or have other thoughts. In terms of goals, I'm still figuring all of that out. I'm interested in private sector but want a place with a lot of options.

The schools basically identical on a lot of facets:
- beautiful, rural campuses
- supposedly incredible professors
- "collegial", friendly students
- great clerkship placement
- USNWR ranking
- students seem happy at both places (didn't always get this impression from other schools.. Like NYU)

And some differences…

Ranking trends: UVA stayed put at 8, allowing two other schools to tie it (which sort of means it fell in the rankings). Duke, as one of these schools, shot up 2 slots in the rankings… which is up (by another 2?) from where they were the year before that. Is this a trend that will continue?

Class size: Duke seems to be about 100+ kids smaller than UVA. Small class size is important to me, but this does mean that UVA will have a larger alumni network. Speaking of which…

Alumni network: I missed Duke's ASW but UVA's alumni seem pretty connected. I was impressed with the giving rate and also with the number of graduates in "senior" positions compared to other schools (presentation said they were second only to Harvard, which can obviously be manipulated to fit a narrative. It was still impressive though). As more of an up and coming school, I'm not sure that Duke has this (yet)

Placement/Employment: UVA favors DC whereas Duke favors NYC and then DC. Right now I'm interested in DC or possibly Texas or Cali. I know this might change. Overall, looks like UVA's employment percentage was better than Duke's

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KMart
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Re: Duke ($$) vs UVA ($$)

Postby KMart » Fri Apr 17, 2015 3:04 pm

If you want to work in DC, go to UVA. As you stated, they are similar on many accounts except for where they place most of their students.

indo
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Re: Duke ($$) vs UVA ($$)

Postby indo » Fri Apr 17, 2015 3:17 pm

KMart wrote:If you want to work in DC, go to UVA. As you stated, they are similar on many accounts except for where they place most of their students.


+1 agree

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Mack.Hambleton
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Re: Duke ($$) vs UVA ($$)

Postby Mack.Hambleton » Fri Apr 17, 2015 3:40 pm

Ranking trends? Seriously?

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Br3v
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Re: Duke ($$) vs UVA ($$)

Postby Br3v » Fri Apr 17, 2015 3:42 pm

You will probably forget about "ranking trends" when you start law school.

Schools are basically peers but from what I remember UVA has slightly better job placement no? If you aren't in love with one or the other and the COA is the same, follow the jobs. Either school would be a good choice though.

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KMart
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Re: Duke ($$) vs UVA ($$)

Postby KMart » Fri Apr 17, 2015 3:44 pm

Br3v wrote:Either school would be a good choice though.

+1 - you really can't go wrong and COA is the same. That's why I think it should be based on where you want to work.

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jbagelboy
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Re: Duke ($$) vs UVA ($$)

Postby jbagelboy » Fri Apr 17, 2015 6:50 pm

Alanar wrote:Ranking trends: UVA stayed put at 8, allowing two other schools to tie it (which sort of means it fell in the rankings). Duke, as one of these schools, shot up 2 slots in the rankings… which is up (by another 2?) from where they were the year before that. Is this a trend that will continue?


I died a little inside when I read this

Nomo
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Re: Duke ($$) vs UVA ($$)

Postby Nomo » Fri Apr 17, 2015 7:13 pm

OhBoyOhBortles wrote:-The schools you are considering
-The total Cost of Attendance (COA) of each. COA = cost of tuition + fees + books + cost of living (COL) + accumulated interest - scholarships. Here is a helpful calculator.
-How you will be financing your COA, i.e. loans, family, or savings
-Where you are from and where you want to work, and other places where you have significant ties (if any)
-Your general career goals
-Your LSAT/GPA numbers
-How many times you have taken the LSAT


Please answer these questions. We can't give good advice without knowing this stuff.

PS: If you attend law school next year then you're about 14 months from having to make a decision on where you want to be. This is a decision you have to make by the time you put in your OCI bids. There is no second shot. The best thing you can do is decide early in your 1L year so that you can get a 1L summer job in the market you plan to target at OCI.

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UVAIce
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Re: Duke ($$) vs UVA ($$)

Postby UVAIce » Fri Apr 17, 2015 7:22 pm

Not a single popped collar joke; I'm disappointed.

In all honesty, neither of these are "bad" choices. I would pick the one you are naturally more drawn to or the place you would rather spend three years of your life at. Have you actually visited Duke? I know you missed the ASW, but have you been to the school? Otherwise, I would take the good you know over the good you believe might be there.

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Rigo
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Re: Duke ($$) vs UVA ($$)

Postby Rigo » Fri Apr 17, 2015 9:06 pm

Go back to UVA and ask for more money and/or for Duke to sweeten the deal even more. Then go wherever is cheaper if you're not naturally drawn to one over the other.

CanadianWolf
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Re: Duke ($$) vs UVA ($$)

Postby CanadianWolf » Sat Apr 18, 2015 10:16 am

Virginia is better for DC placement.

(Do you consider the research triangle area (Raleigh, Durham & Chapel Hill) of North Carolina to be rural ?)

kcdc1
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Re: Duke ($$) vs UVA ($$)

Postby kcdc1 » Sat Apr 18, 2015 10:22 am

You'll most likely get your desired employment outcome from either school. If COA is equal, I'd make the decision on QOL during school. IMO, Charlottesville is nicer than Durham. UVA law has a reputation for being the young, party school of the T14 (could be good or bad depending on your perspective). Duke basketball is fun.

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BasilHallward
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Re: Duke ($$) vs UVA ($$)

Postby BasilHallward » Sat Apr 18, 2015 10:22 am

jbagelboy wrote:
Alanar wrote:Ranking trends: UVA stayed put at 8, allowing two other schools to tie it (which sort of means it fell in the rankings). Duke, as one of these schools, shot up 2 slots in the rankings… which is up (by another 2?) from where they were the year before that. Is this a trend that will continue?


I died a little inside when I read this


+1

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SquedTheScholar
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Re: Duke ($$) vs UVA ($$)

Postby SquedTheScholar » Sat Apr 18, 2015 3:53 pm

Doesn't UVA hire a bunch of its own students?

The Dark Shepard
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Re: Duke ($$) vs UVA ($$)

Postby The Dark Shepard » Sat Apr 18, 2015 5:21 pm

SquedTheScholar wrote:Doesn't UVA hire a bunch of its own students?


If two schools have a similar FTLTBR job rating after taking away school-funded jobs, does it really matter how many school-funded jobs had to be taken away?

whatamidoing
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Re: Duke ($$) vs UVA ($$)

Postby whatamidoing » Sat Apr 18, 2015 7:53 pm

SquedTheScholar wrote:Doesn't UVA hire a bunch of its own students?


I think lots of schools are doing this lately.

BigZuck
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Re: Duke ($$) vs UVA ($$)

Postby BigZuck » Sat Apr 18, 2015 8:39 pm

I'm missing the part where the OP says how much each costs. I just don't see it. Can anyone fill me in?

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Pragmatic Gun
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Re: Duke ($$) vs UVA ($$)

Postby Pragmatic Gun » Sat Apr 18, 2015 10:26 pm

BigZuck wrote:I'm missing the part where the OP says how much each costs. I just don't see it. Can anyone fill me in?



Lol

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BiglawAssociate
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Re: Duke ($$) vs UVA ($$)

Postby BiglawAssociate » Tue Apr 21, 2015 1:48 am

Alanar wrote:- "collegial", friendly students


More like fratty, douchey, really Southern kids...or is that just the undergrads?

Just fyi - both schools are very fratty bro schools and Southern.

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Serett
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Re: Duke ($$) vs UVA ($$)

Postby Serett » Tue Apr 21, 2015 1:08 pm

BiglawAssociate wrote:
Alanar wrote:- "collegial", friendly students


More like fratty, douchey, really Southern kids...or is that just the undergrads?

Just fyi - both schools are very fratty bro schools and Southern.


No idea about UVA, but this is absolutely baseless concerning Duke. I don't know whether you're talking about the law school class:

Geographic Distribution

Northeast: 25%
Mid-Atlantic: 18%
West: 26%
South: 12%
Midwest:12%
Foreign: 6%


Or the undergrads, but you're working outside the bounds of your knowledge either way.

Not that the TC is listing determinative factors between the two anyway, but let's at least try not to post random nonsense in return.

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BiglawAssociate
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Re: Duke ($$) vs UVA ($$)

Postby BiglawAssociate » Tue Apr 21, 2015 10:57 pm

Serett wrote:
BiglawAssociate wrote:
Alanar wrote:- "collegial", friendly students


More like fratty, douchey, really Southern kids...or is that just the undergrads?

Just fyi - both schools are very fratty bro schools and Southern.


No idea about UVA, but this is absolutely baseless concerning Duke. I don't know whether you're talking about the law school class:

Geographic Distribution

Northeast: 25%
Mid-Atlantic: 18%
West: 26%
South: 12%
Midwest:12%
Foreign: 6%


Or the undergrads, but you're working outside the bounds of your knowledge either way.

Not that the TC is listing determinative factors between the two anyway, but let's at least try not to post random nonsense in return.



Thanks for confirming that Duke has a ton of Southern undergrads

That's just the stereotype of both schools - although Duke also has the preppy, spoiled Northeastern kids. Both are fratty and I would assume UVA is more Southern (at least on the undergrad front).




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