WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

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WashU or Pitt?

WashU
7
78%
Pitt
2
22%
 
Total votes: 9

smiles123
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby smiles123 » Wed Apr 08, 2015 5:08 pm

I think the question of which one is highly dependant on how much money Pitt offers and whether you feel the extra masters will be beneficial for your career.

Big Dog
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby Big Dog » Wed Apr 08, 2015 5:13 pm

I feel like that's not true. I've met deans of universities who have law degrees, financial consultants who have law degrees, and people in executive sales who have law degrees. Some of them have practiced law in the past, but some of them have never used their degree


And you find that plan valuable??????

btw: I've heard of real estate agents who have a law degree and run their own websites/blog (hi, Ken). :mrgreen:

francescalegge
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby francescalegge » Wed Apr 08, 2015 5:41 pm

zacharus85 wrote:
francescalegge wrote:I really don't understand why people on this forum seem so quick to judge and condemn. :/


First, what Rigo said: nobody hates/cares about you. Second, it's not about you, it's about the hapless hordes who follow you who look at your post and say 'BUT TEH JERBZ!' when people point out (legitimately) the limited usefulness of a JD.

You particular research/experience is all well and good, but there are some big caveats to that:

1. Executives and successful/established professionals tend to be older. Which means they came from an era when JD hiring and the economy were in very different places. Shit is tighter all around - just having a degree isn't going to cut it compared to having the right degree. A JD is very rarely the right degree for anything except practicing law.

2. Research/Experience involving executives and successful/established professionals tend to exclude the many, many people who did not become successful executives. So for every one person you talk to who made something interesting of themselves, there's one who's stuck in a crappy job they hate and two who didn't even get that opportunity.

3. You are arguing with people who are in law school, have graduated from it, are otherwise employed in the legal sector, or some combination therein. You ask questions, dislike the answers, and then state your opinion as if it is fact. That is annoying, and again because some of us want future posters to be well-informed, we post back.

4. Your anecdotal research may, *may* apply to you specifically, but we would've had no way of knowing that because we don't know the first thing about you. Like I said above, we go by the numbers here because that is the most reliable way to predict success. That's what you get on TLS. Do you read the newspaper and then complain because it doesn't talk about you specifically every morning?


Although you've given me possibly the most helpful insight into the question of whether or not I should pursue a law degree (which I am grateful for), when I started this thread I had one simple question:

WashU with 105,000K scholarship or Pitt with unnamed scholarship but let's assume it's full or almost full plus FLAS and international internship opportunities?

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BrazilBandit
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby BrazilBandit » Wed Apr 08, 2015 5:49 pm

francescalegge wrote:
zacharus85 wrote:
francescalegge wrote:I really don't understand why people on this forum seem so quick to judge and condemn. :/


First, what Rigo said: nobody hates/cares about you. Second, it's not about you, it's about the hapless hordes who follow you who look at your post and say 'BUT TEH JERBZ!' when people point out (legitimately) the limited usefulness of a JD.

You particular research/experience is all well and good, but there are some big caveats to that:

1. Executives and successful/established professionals tend to be older. Which means they came from an era when JD hiring and the economy were in very different places. Shit is tighter all around - just having a degree isn't going to cut it compared to having the right degree. A JD is very rarely the right degree for anything except practicing law.

2. Research/Experience involving executives and successful/established professionals tend to exclude the many, many people who did not become successful executives. So for every one person you talk to who made something interesting of themselves, there's one who's stuck in a crappy job they hate and two who didn't even get that opportunity.

3. You are arguing with people who are in law school, have graduated from it, are otherwise employed in the legal sector, or some combination therein. You ask questions, dislike the answers, and then state your opinion as if it is fact. That is annoying, and again because some of us want future posters to be well-informed, we post back.

4. Your anecdotal research may, *may* apply to you specifically, but we would've had no way of knowing that because we don't know the first thing about you. Like I said above, we go by the numbers here because that is the most reliable way to predict success. That's what you get on TLS. Do you read the newspaper and then complain because it doesn't talk about you specifically every morning?


Although you've given me possibly the most helpful insight into the question of whether or not I should pursue a law degree (which I am grateful for), when I started this thread I had one simple question:

WashU with 105,000K scholarship or Pitt with unnamed scholarship but let's assume it's full or almost full plus FLAS and international internship opportunities?


One simple question deserves one simple answer: Neither...

BigZuck
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby BigZuck » Wed Apr 08, 2015 5:50 pm

People are trying to help you get the exact job you want.

In that vein:
BigZuck wrote:I'm a little lost as to what a mediocre law degree would buy you in Europe. What exactly is the point of a JD for you career goals? The skills you learn? The stuff you learn? The prestige? Honestly, I read the thread and maybe I just missed it but what good is a random JD going to do for you?

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ILoveYou
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby ILoveYou » Wed Apr 08, 2015 5:55 pm

BrazilBandit wrote:One simple question deserves one simple answer: Neither...


+1

If you insist on choosing one of these bad options, then...the fully that you don't actually have yet at Pitt, I guess.

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bjsesq
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby bjsesq » Wed Apr 08, 2015 5:56 pm

I want to eat dogshit or catshit, so stop trying to tell me it's a bad idea to eat shit, you assholes.

francescalegge
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby francescalegge » Wed Apr 08, 2015 6:01 pm

bjsesq wrote:I want to eat dogshit or catshit, so stop trying to tell me it's a bad idea to eat shit, you assholes.


I dunno, I'm sort of with whoever says you shouldn't eat dog shit on this one. I'm pretty sure that can make you seriously ill.

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Capitol_Idea
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby Capitol_Idea » Wed Apr 08, 2015 6:02 pm

See, e.g.: the very first reply to you:

zombie mcavoy wrote:do not go to law school.

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Capitol_Idea
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby Capitol_Idea » Wed Apr 08, 2015 6:04 pm

bjsesq wrote:I want to eat dogshit or catshit, so stop trying to tell me it's a bad idea to eat shit, you assholes.


C'mon. There are some really exciting opportunities in Europe with catshit.

My browser history confirms this.
Last edited by Capitol_Idea on Wed Apr 08, 2015 6:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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bjsesq
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby bjsesq » Wed Apr 08, 2015 6:05 pm

francescalegge wrote:
bjsesq wrote:I want to eat dogshit or catshit, so stop trying to tell me it's a bad idea to eat shit, you assholes.


I dunno, I'm sort of with whoever says you shouldn't eat dog shit on this one. I'm pretty sure that can make you seriously ill.

That's not an answer. I'm guessing you mean eat cat shit. If not, please leave the thread because you aren't answering my question.

francescalegge
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby francescalegge » Wed Apr 08, 2015 6:12 pm

bjsesq wrote:
francescalegge wrote:
bjsesq wrote:I want to eat dogshit or catshit, so stop trying to tell me it's a bad idea to eat shit, you assholes.


I dunno, I'm sort of with whoever says you shouldn't eat dog shit on this one. I'm pretty sure that can make you seriously ill.

That's not an answer. I'm guessing you mean eat cat shit. If not, please leave the thread because you aren't answering my question.


Actually, I've noticed that a lot of people here ignore the question and throw in their own opinions to questions unasked so I feel like I'll be in good company if I stay :)

Although if you're serious about eating shit at all, I would advise you to consult a medical expert.

abl
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby abl » Wed Apr 08, 2015 6:14 pm

If you must go to law school, and those are your choices, go to Wash U. The value of an additional masters (from Pitt, no less) is negligible. It's certainly less than the difference between Wash U and Pitt for law school.

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bjsesq
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby bjsesq » Wed Apr 08, 2015 6:15 pm

francescalegge wrote:
bjsesq wrote:
francescalegge wrote:
bjsesq wrote:I want to eat dogshit or catshit, so stop trying to tell me it's a bad idea to eat shit, you assholes.


I dunno, I'm sort of with whoever says you shouldn't eat dog shit on this one. I'm pretty sure that can make you seriously ill.

That's not an answer. I'm guessing you mean eat cat shit. If not, please leave the thread because you aren't answering my question.


Actually, I've noticed that a lot of people here ignore the question and throw in their own opinions to questions unasked so I feel like I'll be in good company if I stay :)

Although if you're serious about eating shit at all, I would advise you to consult a medical expert.

You don't fucking say.

foreverlost
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby foreverlost » Wed Apr 08, 2015 6:19 pm

francescalegge wrote:
WashU with 105,000K scholarship or Pitt with unnamed scholarship but let's assume it's full or almost full plus FLAS and international internship opportunities?


Hi! I was actually trying to get more info on Pitt's dual degree and saw this. But did you get your admission packet yet? Cause my scholarship came with the acceptance letter (not to say they don't send it out separately too). And also, you might want to keep in mind that you get charged for tuition for the grad program separately and I got that scholarship info completely independent of any of the law school stuff. Hope that helps :)

francescalegge
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby francescalegge » Wed Apr 08, 2015 6:33 pm

I dunno, I'm sort of with whoever says you shouldn't eat dog shit on this one. I'm pretty sure that can make you seriously ill.[/quote]
That's not an answer. I'm guessing you mean eat cat shit. If not, please leave the thread because you aren't answering my question.[/quote]

Actually, I've noticed that a lot of people here ignore the question and throw in their own opinions to questions unasked so I feel like I'll be in good company if I stay :)

Although if you're serious about eating shit at all, I would advise you to consult a medical expert.[/quote]
You don't fucking say.[/quote]

At least that's what I gather.

As a side note - when I say medical professional, I mean an actual medical professional rather than WebMD or some health forum. You'll probably end up sicker than you were before, and you might have a troll problem to boot :D

francescalegge
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby francescalegge » Wed Apr 08, 2015 6:37 pm

foreverlost wrote:
francescalegge wrote:
WashU with 105,000K scholarship or Pitt with unnamed scholarship but let's assume it's full or almost full plus FLAS and international internship opportunities?


Hi! I was actually trying to get more info on Pitt's dual degree and saw this. But did you get your admission packet yet? Cause my scholarship came with the acceptance letter (not to say they don't send it out separately too). And also, you might want to keep in mind that you get charged for tuition for the grad program separately and I got that scholarship info completely independent of any of the law school stuff. Hope that helps :)


That does help!! I don't know about the scholarship - I got my WashU scholarship over a week after the original acceptance and I was just admitted at Pitt a couple days ago so I've been waiting to see. But your message tells me I should call them and ask directly - and negotiate if I don't have one :)

I am aware that the tuition is separate for both :(

Have you only applied to the grad program so far? Also, which joint degree are you looking at?

francescalegge
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby francescalegge » Wed Apr 08, 2015 6:39 pm

abl wrote:If you must go to law school, and those are your choices, go to Wash U. The value of an additional masters (from Pitt, no less) is negligible. It's certainly less than the difference between Wash U and Pitt for law school.


Thanks! :) Yeah, I've been wondering if the additional Master's would be helpful... I've heard a few times that it's probably not worth it, which is a shame because it looks like an interesting program.

francescalegge
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby francescalegge » Wed Apr 08, 2015 6:41 pm

zacharus85 wrote:See, e.g.: the very first reply to you:

zombie mcavoy wrote:do not go to law school.


I see that :)
Unfortunately that didn't help me answer my original question at all! :? (I don't actually know what that smiley means, but I'm going for the equivalent of :/)

francescalegge
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby francescalegge » Wed Apr 08, 2015 6:51 pm

BigZuck wrote:People are trying to help you get the exact job you want.

In that vein:
BigZuck wrote:I'm a little lost as to what a mediocre law degree would buy you in Europe. What exactly is the point of a JD for you career goals? The skills you learn? The stuff you learn? The prestige? Honestly, I read the thread and maybe I just missed it but what good is a random JD going to do for you?


And those people I very much appreciate. But I've noticed that some people here prefer to use insults and to demean others. So I apologize if I'm sometimes snappy but I've never had much patience for unwarranted vitriol - and I'm a strong believer that you should always be able to pick up the same shit that you sling.

To answer your question, this would be an example of a job: http://www.opensocietyfoundations.org/a ... am-officer

This is not my region of interest, nor is this an organization that I have a particularly strong desire to join (although I wouldn't mind, certainly) but I think it represents the type of work and the environment that I am aiming for.

This is an example of a job where a JD is not required, but helpful. As you can see, they accept "Advanced degree in human rights, law, or related field"

So I understand that I wouldn't need a JD for this position, but I can absolutely see the benefit of having one while doing this type of work. The point of a JD would be a combination of knowledge and skill, as well as the ability to practice if I have to. Also, if this is the job I want, it would absolutely be to my benefit to have a JD, since I already have an advanced degree in human rights. It will make me more competitive if I am applying against others with similar backgrounds and only one degree.

foreverlost
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby foreverlost » Wed Apr 08, 2015 6:53 pm

francescalegge wrote:
That does help!! I don't know about the scholarship - I got my WashU scholarship over a week after the original acceptance and I was just admitted at Pitt a couple days ago so I've been waiting to see. But your message tells me I should call them and ask directly - and negotiate if I don't have one :)

I am aware that the tuition is separate for both :(

Have you only applied to the grad program so far? Also, which joint degree are you looking at?


I've been accepted for both programs, the JD/MPIA for Human Security and want to do international human rights stuff too. I went to Pitt undergrad and loved it, but I think I will probably end up choosing a better law school over a dual degree program. I might wait to see if the law admissions packet they mail you has financial aid info first, and then call them. Feel free to PM me for more info?

timbs4339
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby timbs4339 » Wed Apr 08, 2015 6:57 pm

francescalegge wrote:To answer your question, this would be an example of a job: http://www.opensocietyfoundations.org/a ... am-officer

This is not my region of interest, nor is this an organization that I have a particularly strong desire to join (although I wouldn't mind, certainly) but I think it represents the type of work and the environment that I am aiming for.

This is an example of a job where a JD is not required, but helpful. As you can see, they accept "Advanced degree in human rights, law, or related field"



An international HRL organization wrote:Minimum of five years of relevant experience in the Arab region;
Knowledge of and experience in the Arab region’s human rights and governance fields;


Now replace "Arab" with wherever you want to work, and you're going to get the same result. Unless I have missed something in this thread, you do not have five years in international policy work experience in the field generally, never mind actually in the region.

I would read this thread: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=149331 to get a better sense of the kind of background you need to get one of these jobs. They do not just go to people with collections of degrees.

francescalegge
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby francescalegge » Wed Apr 08, 2015 7:01 pm

timbs4339 wrote:
francescalegge wrote:To answer your question, this would be an example of a job: http://www.opensocietyfoundations.org/a ... am-officer

This is not my region of interest, nor is this an organization that I have a particularly strong desire to join (although I wouldn't mind, certainly) but I think it represents the type of work and the environment that I am aiming for.

This is an example of a job where a JD is not required, but helpful. As you can see, they accept "Advanced degree in human rights, law, or related field"



An international HRL organization wrote:Minimum of five years of relevant experience in the Arab region;
Knowledge of and experience in the Arab region’s human rights and governance fields;


Now replace "Arab" with wherever you want to work, and you're going to get the same result. Unless I have missed something in this thread, you do not have five years in international policy work experience in the field generally, never mind actually in the region.

I would read Worldtraveler's international human rights law thread to get a better sense of the kind of background you need to get one of these jobs. They do not just go to people with collections of degrees.


Yes, of course! That is my career end goal, not my direct out of school goal. That is what I would spend the first ten years working towards :)

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zombie mcavoy
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby zombie mcavoy » Wed Apr 08, 2015 7:02 pm

troll

timbs4339
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Re: WashU vs Joint Degree at UPitt

Postby timbs4339 » Wed Apr 08, 2015 7:07 pm

francescalegge wrote:
timbs4339 wrote:
francescalegge wrote:To answer your question, this would be an example of a job: http://www.opensocietyfoundations.org/a ... am-officer

This is not my region of interest, nor is this an organization that I have a particularly strong desire to join (although I wouldn't mind, certainly) but I think it represents the type of work and the environment that I am aiming for.

This is an example of a job where a JD is not required, but helpful. As you can see, they accept "Advanced degree in human rights, law, or related field"



An international HRL organization wrote:Minimum of five years of relevant experience in the Arab region;
Knowledge of and experience in the Arab region’s human rights and governance fields;


Now replace "Arab" with wherever you want to work, and you're going to get the same result. Unless I have missed something in this thread, you do not have five years in international policy work experience in the field generally, never mind actually in the region.

I would read Worldtraveler's international human rights law thread to get a better sense of the kind of background you need to get one of these jobs. They do not just go to people with collections of degrees.


Yes, of course! That is my career end goal, not my direct out of school goal. That is what I would spend the first ten years working towards :)


What is the first job that you will get that will begin to provide you with the five years experience part of that job description and why can't you start now instead of waiting three years to get a JD?




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