NYU ($$) vs Columbia ($$) Forum

DK21 · Post by **DK21** » Thu Apr 09, 2015 4:49 pm

Nebby wrote:Everyone goes for the free food. The actual question you should be asking is who has better food. This fart-huffing has gone on long enough.

Sorry, didn't realize it's rude to ask questions about law schools on a law school forum.

Nebby · Post by **Nebby** » Thu Apr 09, 2015 6:19 pm

DK21 wrote:
Nebby wrote:Everyone goes for the free food. The actual question you should be asking is who has better food. This fart-huffing has gone on long enough.
Sorry, didn't realize it's rude to ask questions about law schools on a law school forum.

It's not rude. You asked for actual student impressions, and I gave it to you. HTH

BiglawAssociate · Post by **BiglawAssociate** » Sat Apr 11, 2015 6:14 pm

Nebby wrote:ITT big lawyers (or more likely students) opine on PI hiring.

NYU and CLS will give you the same PI employment outcomes, because PI hiring is much more about demonstrated commitment, personality, and grades. To a much lesser extent does school matter (between these two, anyway. It is different if you're talking NYU v. Brooklyn Law).

My SO is a supervising attorney at a middle prestige non profit in NYC. The non profit hires half TTT grads (think CUNY) and half T-14 grads. Most of the attorneys, if not all, had to work for free before getting a full time offer. Non profits rarely hire people they don't already know from what I can tell (like people who volunteer for free for awhile). So mass mailing, etc. to PI jobs doesn't really work. The non profit regularly turns down Columbia/NYU grads who have no prior commitment to PI (and possibly no language skills).

This is why keeping your debt low is important for PI - because it's mainly about networking, commitment, and depending on which PI, language abilities (in NYC, Spanish/Chinese).

This is why I think paying like 200k for Columbia/NYU to do PI is fucking retarded.

DK21 · Post by **DK21** » Sat Apr 11, 2015 6:30 pm

Nebby wrote:
DK21 wrote:
Nebby wrote:Everyone goes for the free food. The actual question you should be asking is who has better food. This fart-huffing has gone on long enough.
Sorry, didn't realize it's rude to ask questions about law schools on a law school forum.
It's not rude. You asked for actual student impressions, and I gave it to you. HTH

I think referring to this thread as fart huffing suggests you disapprove of the questions being asked. But whatever thanks for your thoughts!

BiglawAssociate · Post by **BiglawAssociate** » Sat Apr 11, 2015 6:34 pm

LetsGoMets wrote:
BiglawAssociate wrote: As for PI, where did you get that info? I'm married to a supervising attorney of a middle-prestige non profit in NYC and they are by far more obsessed with your dedication to PI than your school name. They regularly turn down NYU/Columbia grads. At a lot of PI jobs you have to work for free after graduation to get a full time offer, and your school isn't really going to do that much for you.
Is there really such thing as a "middle-prestige non-profit"? I'm sure your spouse is highly accomplished, but it doesn't seem to me like PI gigs can really be ranked on a prestige basis. Sure you have your UNs and ACLUs (although they did just lay off 20% of their staff attorneys, which I guess is pretty prestigious), but what basis do you have for evaluating non-profits generally besides how much they show up in the media and high-profile cases? It doesn't take much to file an amicus in the Supreme Court.

Yes. The non profit is not ACLU/UN, but it's a prominent non profit that gets a decent amount of funding and takes on high profile cases. So I'd say factors include funding, high profile cases, and also PI attorneys in NYC know which non profits are better/worse, a lot of it based on how many legit legal cases the non profit takes. A lot of funding is based on the "number of cases" non profits have, so they have to spend a lot of time doing less client-service oriented shit (like doing intakes or doing non-legal bullshit); intakes also count in the numbers for funding purposes.

That said - it's going to be a lot harder for someone who can't speak Spanish/Chinese (especially Spanish) and English to get a non profit job in NYC PI orgs. You can still do policy type work for PI orgs that don't do a lot of client service work, but that's rare.

Also, I think you guys are underestimating the number of rich/trust fund kids in biglaw and PI. My SO and at least a few of my SO's coworkers didn't have any loans at all coming out of law school and in some cases, parents subsidize their living. So don't think that "everyone is in the same boat" as you if you take out massive loans for PI/biglaw (and if they can manage, you can) - because they're not.

Nebby · Post by **Nebby** » Sat Apr 11, 2015 6:50 pm

I'm riding that PSLF LRAP train to please-dont-taxbomb-me-bro station.

MCFC · Post by **MCFC** » Sat Apr 11, 2015 8:05 pm

DK21 wrote:
White Dwarf wrote:At the risk of sounding like a bro, can anyone compare the quality/accessibility of the gyms and athletic facilities at the two schools? I don't love the idea of running outdoors in NYC, especially during the cold season.
My tour guide at CLS said their gym sucks. Not sure about NYU.

If you're just not into running outdoors, that's great, people like different things, ignore the next bit. If it's something about NYC outdoor running in particular that bothers you though (safety or crowds or something), I wouldn't let it deter you.

jbagelboy · Post by **jbagelboy** » Sat Apr 11, 2015 9:52 pm

MCFC wrote:
DK21 wrote:
White Dwarf wrote:At the risk of sounding like a bro, can anyone compare the quality/accessibility of the gyms and athletic facilities at the two schools? I don't love the idea of running outdoors in NYC, especially during the cold season.
My tour guide at CLS said their gym sucks. Not sure about NYU.
If you're just not into running outdoors, that's great, people like different things, ignore the next bit. If it's something about NYC outdoor running in particular that bothers you though (safety or crowds or something), I wouldn't let it deter you.

it's admittedly tough to run outside from late november through march. I was definitely hitting the dodge treadmills during that time over outside. And yea, the bullshit sign up sheets piss me off. But there's an open indoor track anyway so it's a mild inconvenience at most.

bklynlady · Post by **bklynlady** » Sun Apr 12, 2015 1:37 am

Final conclusion: does it pay to try to negotiate with CLS using approx. 9K more from NYU + Harvard admission or not? My NYU deadline is in ten days. Is it too late to do this anyway at this point? If so, how to word it so I don't sound like a greedy you-know-what?

Mack.Hambleton · Post by **Mack.Hambleton** » Sun Apr 12, 2015 3:35 am

bklynlady wrote:Final conclusion: does it pay to try to negotiate with CLS using approx. 9K more from NYU + Harvard admission or not? My NYU deadline is in ten days. Is it too late to do this anyway at this point? If so, how to word it so I don't sound like a greedy you-know-what?

Greedy is charging sixty thousand dollars a year to go to school. Just call the fin aid office and tell them your deadline and see what they'll do

White Dwarf · Post by **White Dwarf** » Sun Apr 12, 2015 9:33 am

jbagelboy wrote:
MCFC wrote:
DK21 wrote:
White Dwarf wrote:At the risk of sounding like a bro, can anyone compare the quality/accessibility of the gyms and athletic facilities at the two schools? I don't love the idea of running outdoors in NYC, especially during the cold season.
My tour guide at CLS said their gym sucks. Not sure about NYU.
If you're just not into running outdoors, that's great, people like different things, ignore the next bit. If it's something about NYC outdoor running in particular that bothers you though (safety or crowds or something), I wouldn't let it deter you.
it's admittedly tough to run outside from late november through march. I was definitely hitting the dodge treadmills during that time over outside. And yea, the bullshit sign up sheets piss me off. But there's an open indoor track anyway so it's a mild inconvenience at most.

How is the free weight access/availability? Is it like my undergrad, where free weights are reserved for athletic teams 90% of the day? Or is it just a bunch of lousy machines?

I love running outdoors, I just wonder if NYC winters and summers will make that difficult 6 months out of the year.

Tiago Splitter · Post by **Tiago Splitter** » Sun Apr 12, 2015 10:41 am

White Dwarf wrote: How is the free weight access/availability? Is it like my undergrad, where free weights are reserved for athletic teams 90% of the day? Or is it just a bunch of lousy machines?

It's even worse because the weights are reserved for PE classes. It's not like our sacrifice is producing some great athletic program lol. Ultimately you can get to everything you need in the gym you just lose some hours during the day Mon-Thu and have to deal with general gym overcrowding most other times.

jbagelboy · Post by **jbagelboy** » Sun Apr 12, 2015 11:44 am

Tiago Splitter wrote:
White Dwarf wrote: How is the free weight access/availability? Is it like my undergrad, where free weights are reserved for athletic teams 90% of the day? Or is it just a bunch of lousy machines?
It's even worse because the weights are reserved for PE classes. It's not like our sacrifice is producing some great athletic program lol. Ultimately you can get to everything you need in the gym you just lose some hours during the day Mon-Thu and have to deal with general gym overcrowding most other times.

If you go before 10am you're usually okay on weights

Bench bars can be scarce and treadmills are always a pain

Overall I think dodge is bad but manageable and people complain too much. I went to a small LAC and we had a small, shit gym too

bklynlady · Post by **bklynlady** » Sun Apr 12, 2015 11:59 am

jbagelboy wrote:
Tiago Splitter wrote:
White Dwarf wrote: How is the free weight access/availability? Is it like my undergrad, where free weights are reserved for athletic teams 90% of the day? Or is it just a bunch of lousy machines?
It's even worse because the weights are reserved for PE classes. It's not like our sacrifice is producing some great athletic program lol. Ultimately you can get to everything you need in the gym you just lose some hours during the day Mon-Thu and have to deal with general gym overcrowding most other times.
If you go before 10am you're usually okay on weights

Bench bars can be scarce and treadmills are always a pain

Overall I think dodge is bad but manageable and people complain too much. I went to a small LAC and we had a small, shit gym too

JB - whats your take on this? Final conclusion: does it pay to try to negotiate with CLS using approx. 9K more from NYU + Harvard admission or not? My NYU deadline is in ten days. Is it too late to do this anyway at this point? If so, how to word it so I don't sound like a greedy you-know-what? BTW, are there no 50 buck/month gyms in the neighborhood to supplement Dodge? With the COA numbers, this seems like a drop in the bucket and certainly a worthwhile expense...

banjo · Post by **banjo** » Sun Apr 12, 2015 12:32 pm

There are several affordable gyms around 125th street and 8th Avenue. There's a Blink, a Planet Fitness, a NY Sports Club, and possibly others. I think both Blink and PF are $10-20/mo.

I don't see the harm in negotiating. Just call them tomorrow and see what they can do.

bklynlady · Post by **bklynlady** » Sun Apr 12, 2015 12:48 pm

banjo wrote:There are several affordable gyms around 125th street and 8th Avenue. There's a Blink, a Planet Fitness, a NY Sports Club, and possibly others. I think both Blink and PF are $10-20/mo.

I don't see the harm in negotiating. Just call them tomorrow and see what they can do.

Call or e-mail? I was just composing an e-mail...

banjo · Post by **banjo** » Sun Apr 12, 2015 12:52 pm

bklynlady wrote:
banjo wrote:There are several affordable gyms around 125th street and 8th Avenue. There's a Blink, a Planet Fitness, a NY Sports Club, and possibly others. I think both Blink and PF are $10-20/mo.

I don't see the harm in negotiating. Just call them tomorrow and see what they can do.
Call or e-mail? I was just composing an e-mail...

An email is fine, but I would follow up with a call to alert them to your NYU deadline.

bklynlady · Post by **bklynlady** » Sun Apr 12, 2015 12:55 pm

banjo wrote:
bklynlady wrote:
banjo wrote:There are several affordable gyms around 125th street and 8th Avenue. There's a Blink, a Planet Fitness, a NY Sports Club, and possibly others. I think both Blink and PF are $10-20/mo.

I don't see the harm in negotiating. Just call them tomorrow and see what they can do.
Call or e-mail? I was just composing an e-mail...
An email is fine, but I would follow up with a call to alert them to your NYU deadline.

I'm thinking of trying to get NYU to extend the deadline; do you know if they have they ever done that?

Nebby · Post by **Nebby** » Sun Apr 12, 2015 12:55 pm

The gym at CLS is not that bad once you figure out the busy time. M-F your best bet is either from 6am-8am or 4pm-6pm or 9pm-close. 8am-4pm there are PE classes interspersed throughout the day that close the weight room. On weekends, 6am-3pm is the best window. There are anomalies, but as long as you're not a social goob and understand gym ediqete then you'll be fine.

Also, running outside is best since you're close to Central park or Riverside, which are choice running venues. The heat nor cold is not that bad, but your dedication to running may be challenged as it appears you grew up in California where the weather never changes.

jbagelboy · Post by **jbagelboy** » Sun Apr 12, 2015 1:49 pm

bklynlady wrote:
jbagelboy wrote:
Tiago Splitter wrote:
White Dwarf wrote: How is the free weight access/availability? Is it like my undergrad, where free weights are reserved for athletic teams 90% of the day? Or is it just a bunch of lousy machines?
It's even worse because the weights are reserved for PE classes. It's not like our sacrifice is producing some great athletic program lol. Ultimately you can get to everything you need in the gym you just lose some hours during the day Mon-Thu and have to deal with general gym overcrowding most other times.
If you go before 10am you're usually okay on weights

Bench bars can be scarce and treadmills are always a pain

Overall I think dodge is bad but manageable and people complain too much. I went to a small LAC and we had a small, shit gym too
JB - whats your take on this? Final conclusion: does it pay to try to negotiate with CLS using approx. 9K more from NYU + Harvard admission or not? My NYU deadline is in ten days. Is it too late to do this anyway at this point? If so, how to word it so I don't sound like a greedy you-know-what? BTW, are there no 50 buck/month gyms in the neighborhood to supplement Dodge? With the COA numbers, this seems like a drop in the bucket and certainly a worthwhile expense...

Lol there are $25/month gyms if you want, but unless lifting is central to your life, the columbia gym is fine and its silly to consider

There's never any harm to negotiation. Write to Charles on monday and see what he can do. With a $9k delta its unlikely they will budge (and I wouldn't play up a mere acceptance at another school without aid too much), but you can point out the higher tuition and see what they say. There's no risk: worst that happens is they just say nah.

bklynlady · Post by **bklynlady** » Sun Apr 12, 2015 2:15 pm

Thanks JB! I just composed an e-mail. As you said, I really have nothing to lose and the clock is ticking. I don't believe they will penalize me for negotiating - isn't that what lawyers are supposed to do?! p.s. if its not worth $25/month for a secondary gym, than dodge can't be that bad! Thanks again!

bklynlady · Post by **bklynlady** » Sun Apr 12, 2015 2:32 pm

My NYU scholarship letter is a password-encrypted PDF file; don't think CLS will be able to open it. Anyone know any way around this or should I just fax it to them?

k5220 · Post by **k5220** » Tue Apr 14, 2015 7:36 pm

bklynlady wrote:
banjo wrote:
bklynlady wrote:
banjo wrote:There are several affordable gyms around 125th street and 8th Avenue. There's a Blink, a Planet Fitness, a NY Sports Club, and possibly others. I think both Blink and PF are $10-20/mo.

I don't see the harm in negotiating. Just call them tomorrow and see what they can do.
Call or e-mail? I was just composing an e-mail...
An email is fine, but I would follow up with a call to alert them to your NYU deadline.
I'm thinking of trying to get NYU to extend the deadline; do you know if they have they ever done that?

NYU extended the deadline a little for me. I asked for 2 weeks and they gave me 1.

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