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Capitol_Idea
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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby Capitol_Idea » Wed Mar 25, 2015 8:51 pm

I go to GULC and begrudgingly like the school. But even I know it's damn well not #2. Except maybe like 'number 2' as in poop.

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idissent
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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby idissent » Wed Mar 25, 2015 8:52 pm


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Capitol_Idea
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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby Capitol_Idea » Wed Mar 25, 2015 9:05 pm

Brainiac: I'm sorry we were so rough on you before. It's just our way. Never leave us again?

Cradle our heads in your lap and whisper your sweet, condescending alternative law school rankings in our ear. Tell us GW is OK and that everything will be all right. Make us believe in love again.

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PeanutsNJam
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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby PeanutsNJam » Thu Mar 26, 2015 12:37 am

You're right OP, Yale and Stanford don't hone exceptional skills at all. Not nearly as well as Fordham, amirite.

Actually, wait, Yale does, but not Stanford. Here's the T11 of law schools for POTUS. I think this list blows OP's out of the water. I ranked them first by how many presidents, and second by how cool the presidents were. Not sure if withdraws should count since they didn't take their law degree with them to the White House...

1.) Columbia (Both Roosevelts, both withdrew, then awarded JD in 2008)
2.) Yale (Ford, Clinton)
3.) Harvard (Hayes, Obama)
4.) Cincinnati (Taft) - 4th place cause dude's the only POTUS who was also SCOTUS
5.) GULC (LBJ, withdrew)
6.) Duke (Nixon)
7.) UVA (Wilson, withdrew)
8.) Albany (McKinley)
9.) Northampton (Pierce, did not graduate)
10.) State and National (Arthur, did not graduate)
11.) Kansas (Truman, withdrew)

Seriously, Stanford is so TTT. No biglaw partners, no presidents... Sorry OP I don't see any GW in there.
Last edited by PeanutsNJam on Thu Mar 26, 2015 3:34 am, edited 4 times in total.

TheOnePercent
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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby TheOnePercent » Thu Mar 26, 2015 12:41 am

brianiac wrote:(magna cum laude)

Lulz

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Mack.Hambleton
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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby Mack.Hambleton » Thu Mar 26, 2015 1:17 am

Can braindeadiac get a BOW ban yet mods

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A. Nony Mouse
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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Thu Mar 26, 2015 2:40 am

FWIW, brianiac, the proximity study that you (? others?) referred to was conducted in part to address the glaring methodological problems with the Seto article.

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xael
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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby xael » Thu Mar 26, 2015 2:41 am

Mack.Hambleton wrote:Can braindeadiac get a BOW ban yet mods


only if he starts talking about gypsies

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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby dabigchina » Thu Mar 26, 2015 3:21 am

PeanutsNJam wrote:You're right OP, Yale and Stanford don't hone exceptional skills at all. Not nearly as well as Fordham, amirite.

Actually, wait, Yale does, but not Stanford. Here's the T11 of law schools for POTUS. I think this list blows OP's out of the water. I ranked them first by how many presidents, and second by how cool the presidents were. Not sure if withdraws should count since they didn't take their law degree with them to the White House...

1.) Harvard (Both Roosevelts, both withdrew, then awarded JD in 2008)
2.) Yale (Ford, Clinton)
3.) Columbia (Hayes, Obama)
4.) Cincinnati (Taft) - 4th place cause dude's the only POTUS who was also SCOTUS
5.) GULC (LBJ, withdrew)
6.) Duke (Nixon)
7.) UVA (Wilson, withdrew)
8.) Albany (McKinley)
9.) Northampton (Pierce, did not graduate)
10.) State and National (Arthur, did not graduate)
11.) Kansas (Truman, withdrew)

Seriously, Stanford is so TTT. No biglaw partners, no presidents... Sorry OP I don't see any GW in there.


obama went to HLS

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PeanutsNJam
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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby PeanutsNJam » Thu Mar 26, 2015 3:33 am

woops I got Harvard and Columbia presidents mixed up my bad. Will fix it.

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starry eyed
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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby starry eyed » Thu Mar 26, 2015 9:17 am

most billionaire alumni

checkmate -SMU

http://www.dallasnews.com/business/head ... -grads.ece

brianiac
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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby brianiac » Thu Mar 26, 2015 9:53 pm

A. Nony Mouse wrote:FWIW, brianiac, the proximity study that you (? others?) referred to was conducted in part to address the glaring methodological problems with the Seto article.

I don't like that study as much, it doesn't seem as accurate and the authors aren't as well credentialed as Seto (one is completely unknown, the other went to Chicago and did not get magna cum laude). Still, for the sake of addressing your point, I will combine the data from the two studies.

Adams Study:
1 Chicago
2 Harvard
3 Yale
4 Columbia
5 Northwestern
6 UVA
7 Penn
8 NYU
9 Stanford
10 Michigan
11 Duke
12 Cornell
13 GULC
14 GWU

Seto Study:
1 Harvard
2 Georgetown
3 NYU
4 Virginia
5 Columbia
6 George Washington
7 Michigan
8 Chicago
9 Texas
10 Northwestern
11 Pennsylvania
12 Boston University
13 Fordham
14 UC Berkeley

Now I will merge the T14s, to only include the schools that all authors involve agree truly belong.

Adams Study:
1 Chicago
2 Harvard
3 Yale
4 Columbia
5 Northwestern
6 Virginia
7 Pennsylvania
8 NYU
9 Stanford
10 Michigan
11 Duke
12 Cornell
13 Georgetown
14 George Washington

Seto Study:
1 Harvard
2 Georgetown
3 NYU
4 Virginia
5 Columbia
6 George Washington
7 Michigan
8 Chicago
9 Texas
10 Northwestern
11 Pennsylvania
12 Boston University
13 Fordham
14 UC Berkeley

As one can see, this leaves us with 10 schools. All the professors involved agree that these 10 schools, out of all the law schools in the country, are in the very top rankings for producing partners.

Harvard
Georgetown
NYU
Virginia
Columbia
George Washington
Michigan
Chicago
Northwestern
Pennsylvania

brianiac
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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby brianiac » Thu Mar 26, 2015 9:53 pm

Also to all of you trolling me STAY OUT. I don't want to hear it and it will not be tolerated. Any and all violations will be reported.

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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby brianiac » Thu Mar 26, 2015 9:58 pm

rpupkin wrote:This is excellent.

The linked law review article also ranks by city. Here are the numbers for Washington DC partners:

1.Georgetown 286
2 George Washington 215
3 Harvard 190
4 Virginia 176
5 American 93
6 Catholic 78
7 Yale 66
8 Chicago 63
9 Michigan 61
10 Columbia 58

We now have conclusive proof that, if you're interested in DC big law, GW > H

LOL@0Ls targeting DC who turn down GULC/GW ("G/G") and instead accept at HYS. Just LOL.

Well, HYS historically has a little bit of an edge over G/G, but I do agree they are all in the same ballpark when it comes to DC placement.

notgreat wrote:This list is useless, because it looks like it doesn't correct for class size. I mean the list looks like it is sorted more by class size than anything else. Additionally, like what, 2-5% of prospective law students at these schools will ever make partner at a large firm? So this is relevant to almost no one.

I already addressed the class size thing by including the new study. Also, the fact that few become partner proves my point that partners are those with exceptional qualities. It requires certain skills that certain schools hone. If it did not require certain skills, then why wouldn't everyone be partner worthy and become partner. If certain schools did not hone those skills, then why do certain schools come out on top in both the non-class size adjusted studies AND the class size adjusted studies. Your explanation defies logic.

BrazilBandit wrote:I also love how the intention of the post is to discredit the US NEWS rankings. It is already completely discredited on this website. The most prestigious schools and schools with better employment outcomes are only referred to as T14 for convenience. If a random school ranks 14th next year (Let's say UT-Austin, as happened before) it will not be incredibly better than Georgetown at 15.

Brianiac - GW is a solid school, if you attend at the right price and it matches your career goals. We have established that going to your regional school and establishing connections is a vastly superior strategy than attending GW at sticker and "networking your way to congress" in DC.

This thread isn't about me. And my intention is not to network my way to Congress in DC. However, I will say this. The TLS obsession with T14 is ridiculous and I think we need to look to other measurements for data beyond rankings, as I'm trying to do here. It's a tough pill for some of you to swallow, but I believe I will be proven right in time that these are phony measurements made by an irrelevant magazine.

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A. Nony Mouse
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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Thu Mar 26, 2015 10:00 pm

brianiac wrote:Also to all of you trolling me STAY OUT. I don't want to hear it and it will not be tolerated. Any and all violations will be reported.

That's not really how it works. And how can you convince anyone if you kick the people who disagree with you out of your thread?

brianiac
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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby brianiac » Thu Mar 26, 2015 10:02 pm

Dog wrote:Harvard and Georgetown are #1 and #2. Surely that has nothing to do with their 500+ class sizes.

But what about the class size adjusted studies.

BigZuck wrote:
Dog wrote:Harvard and Georgetown are #1 and #2. Surely that has nothing to do with their 500+ class sizes.

I think the top 9 or so with the exception of Chicago have pretty large classes?*

Impressive showing by Chicago. Must be dat skillz development.

*Of course I don't know how big the class sizes have been historically, maybe they are different now

Same objection as above.

PeanutsNJam wrote:You're right OP, Yale and Stanford don't hone exceptional skills at all. Not nearly as well as Fordham, amirite.

Actually, wait, Yale does, but not Stanford. Here's the T11 of law schools for POTUS. I think this list blows OP's out of the water. I ranked them first by how many presidents, and second by how cool the presidents were. Not sure if withdraws should count since they didn't take their law degree with them to the White House...

1.) Columbia (Both Roosevelts, both withdrew, then awarded JD in 2008)
2.) Yale (Ford, Clinton)
3.) Harvard (Hayes, Obama)
4.) Cincinnati (Taft) - 4th place cause dude's the only POTUS who was also SCOTUS
5.) GULC (LBJ, withdrew)
6.) Duke (Nixon)
7.) UVA (Wilson, withdrew)
8.) Albany (McKinley)
9.) Northampton (Pierce, did not graduate)
10.) State and National (Arthur, did not graduate)
11.) Kansas (Truman, withdrew)

Seriously, Stanford is so TTT. No biglaw partners, no presidents... Sorry OP I don't see any GW in there.

There is some truth to the fact that the prestige of schools that haves presidential alumnus gives a powerful prestige punch. That's why Harvard and Yale are tops, just in terms of lay prestige. But not everyone wants to be President. Partner is a much more common goal. However I do appreciate this list, I hope you don't mind me using this for my own... purposes :wink:

starry eyed wrote:most billionaire alumni

checkmate -SMU

http://www.dallasnews.com/business/head ... -grads.ece

I'm not familiar with that school but I'll check out the article when I have a chance.

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KMart
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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby KMart » Thu Mar 26, 2015 10:04 pm

Started getting nervous Brainiac wasn't posting and this thread was going to lose steam. Keep on keepin' on, Mr. Congressman!

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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby brianiac » Thu Mar 26, 2015 10:06 pm

I don't deserve the hate in this thread. All I'm trying to do is introduce the board to different ways of looking at this problem. It is easy and thoughtless for you people to point to some arbitrary magazine's T14 ranking and say, look here, this is the best school. It is something entirely different to carefully investigate different varied studies that speak to individual goals future law students may have. You can shout Retake and T14 or Bust all you want, but it doesn't do anything than perpetuate an echo chamber of ignorance. I am aware there is a penalty for going against the grain, and I guess that's my cross to bear.

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KMart
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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby KMart » Thu Mar 26, 2015 10:10 pm

brianiac wrote:I don't deserve the hate in this thread. All I'm trying to do is introduce the board to different ways of looking at this problem. It is easy and thoughtless for you people to point to some arbitrary magazine's T14 ranking and say, look here, this is the best school. It is something entirely different to carefully investigate different varied studies that speak to individual goals future law students may have. You can shout Retake and T14 or Bust all you want, but it doesn't do anything than perpetuate an echo chamber of ignorance. I am aware there is a penalty for going against the grain, and I guess that's my cross to bear.

Our leader is motivating the Revolution!

milkisforbabies
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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby milkisforbabies » Thu Mar 26, 2015 10:11 pm

brianiac wrote:
A. Nony Mouse wrote:FWIW, brianiac, the proximity study that you (? others?) referred to was conducted in part to address the glaring methodological problems with the Seto article.

I don't like that study as much, it doesn't seem as accurate and the authors aren't as well credentialed as Seto (one is completely unknown, the other went to Chicago and did not get magna cum laude). Still, for the sake of addressing your point, I will combine the data from the two studies.


This can't be serious.

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rpupkin
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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby rpupkin » Thu Mar 26, 2015 10:11 pm

brianiac wrote:I am aware there is a penalty for going against the grain, and I guess that's my cross to bear.

Please tread lightly. Any and all references to martydom will be reported.

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A. Nony Mouse
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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Thu Mar 26, 2015 10:12 pm

brianiac wrote:I don't deserve the hate in this thread. All I'm trying to do is introduce the board to different ways of looking at this problem. It is easy and thoughtless for you people to point to some arbitrary magazine's T14 ranking and say, look here, this is the best school. It is something entirely different to carefully investigate different varied studies that speak to individual goals future law students may have. You can shout Retake and T14 or Bust all you want, but it doesn't do anything than perpetuate an echo chamber of ignorance. I am aware there is a penalty for going against the grain, and I guess that's my cross to bear.

Except none of that is true.

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hairbear7
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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby hairbear7 » Thu Mar 26, 2015 10:12 pm

brianiac wrote: It is easy and thoughtless for you people to point to some arbitrary magazine's T14 ranking and say, look here, this is the best school.


I don't know any reputable person on this forum that does that.

brianiac
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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby brianiac » Thu Mar 26, 2015 10:14 pm

rpupkin wrote:
brianiac wrote:I am aware there is a penalty for going against the grain, and I guess that's my cross to bear.

Please tread lightly. Any and all references to martydom will be reported.

First of all I find that offensive. Second, stop trying to screw up people's threads. I've noticed that's something you do a lot on this forum and it will not be tolerated here.

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middlebear
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Re: What schools are best for biglaw? A methodical approach

Postby middlebear » Thu Mar 26, 2015 10:16 pm

brianiac wrote:
rpupkin wrote:
brianiac wrote:I am aware there is a penalty for going against the grain, and I guess that's my cross to bear.

Please tread lightly. Any and all references to martydom will be reported.

First of all I find that offensive. Second, stop trying to screw up people's threads. I've noticed that's something you do a lot on this forum and it will not be tolerated here.


See, this is the part where an average citizen steps in and reminds you that you're not a mod, and, despite all the power inherent in pushing a post button to create this thread, are not actually in charge of its participants.




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