Iowa vs Illinois

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sprinky07
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Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2012 6:05 am

Re: Iowa vs Illinois

Postby sprinky07 » Sun Mar 22, 2015 9:06 am

XxSpyKEx wrote:
The Dark Shepard wrote:I feel its more likely that someone is aiming for a PI job than a shitlaw firm. I wouldn't say its a "bad result" if they go in planning for this as their main goal.


I dunno that many people go into law school planning to get a job that pays $40k /year or less. Even in the PI crowd, I think it's pretty rare that someone is aiming for a job that pays that poorly. I think a lot of people who fall into those PI jobs are people who couldn't find anything better, and they typically leave within a couple years (because the salary is too low to reasonably live off). You pretty much need to have someone supporting you or to be independently wealthy for that to be a reasonable salary (unless you're living somewhere like Lincoln, Nebraska).

DaRascal wrote:Umm an admissions scandal means that the school cheated to get its ranking to begin with!
Illinois seems to have only been ranked higher than Iowa because it was gaming the system until it finally got caught.

We're deep into the 21st century and USNWR is much harder to dupe these days.

Iowa- #22 (Pushing for T20 status)
Illinois- #41 (Former T30 fading quickly)



The rankings are pretty worthless on a national basis (unless you're talking about t14s). UIowa is okay if you want to work in Iowa or middle of nowhere. UIllinois is okay if you want to work in Illinois. There's not many Iowa grads in Chicago, and it's pretty hard to find something decent in Chicago with nothing more than an Iowa degree. It's also really dumb to go into law school splitting hairs this badly (i.e. deciding whether to go to a law school that's ranked at 22 over a school that's ranked 41), because the ranking vary vastly year-to-year, based on whatever the hell US News decides are good factors to rank law school with. And whether a school is ranked 22 or 41 has little to do with how it places in a particular market (again, your odds of finding a legal job in Illinois is better coming out of UIUC than it is coming out of UIowa). Personally, I wouldn't go to either law school, but if you had a bad GPA (where there's no possibility of getting reasonable scholarships at t14s) and are getting a full-ride at Iowa or Illinois, and have significant ties to whatever market the law school you're looking to go to is in, then I can see why you would go attend that school.


Do you have any sources to back up your PI claim? Almost all of the PIs I know fought tooth and nail for their low paying, PI job. Some wanted it for loan forgiveness, others for the desire to "give back". One partner at the firm I currently work at is actually leaving his extremely cushy job in a couple of months for a PI opening that he competed with recent grads for.

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Rigo
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Re: Iowa vs Illinois

Postby Rigo » Sun Mar 22, 2015 1:58 pm

Illinois has twice the percentage of the graduating class in Biglaw as Iowa. If that's a goal for you and costs are equal or almost equal (and you don't have a desire to work in Iowa after graduating), then Illinois is likely the better choice.

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XxSpyKEx
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Re: Iowa vs Illinois

Postby XxSpyKEx » Sun Mar 22, 2015 2:56 pm

sprinky07 wrote:
XxSpyKEx wrote:
The Dark Shepard wrote:I feel its more likely that someone is aiming for a PI job than a shitlaw firm. I wouldn't say its a "bad result" if they go in planning for this as their main goal.


I dunno that many people go into law school planning to get a job that pays $40k /year or less. Even in the PI crowd, I think it's pretty rare that someone is aiming for a job that pays that poorly. I think a lot of people who fall into those PI jobs are people who couldn't find anything better, and they typically leave within a couple years (because the salary is too low to reasonably live off). You pretty much need to have someone supporting you or to be independently wealthy for that to be a reasonable salary (unless you're living somewhere like Lincoln, Nebraska).

DaRascal wrote:Umm an admissions scandal means that the school cheated to get its ranking to begin with!
Illinois seems to have only been ranked higher than Iowa because it was gaming the system until it finally got caught.

We're deep into the 21st century and USNWR is much harder to dupe these days.

Iowa- #22 (Pushing for T20 status)
Illinois- #41 (Former T30 fading quickly)



The rankings are pretty worthless on a national basis (unless you're talking about t14s). UIowa is okay if you want to work in Iowa or middle of nowhere. UIllinois is okay if you want to work in Illinois. There's not many Iowa grads in Chicago, and it's pretty hard to find something decent in Chicago with nothing more than an Iowa degree. It's also really dumb to go into law school splitting hairs this badly (i.e. deciding whether to go to a law school that's ranked at 22 over a school that's ranked 41), because the ranking vary vastly year-to-year, based on whatever the hell US News decides are good factors to rank law school with. And whether a school is ranked 22 or 41 has little to do with how it places in a particular market (again, your odds of finding a legal job in Illinois is better coming out of UIUC than it is coming out of UIowa). Personally, I wouldn't go to either law school, but if you had a bad GPA (where there's no possibility of getting reasonable scholarships at t14s) and are getting a full-ride at Iowa or Illinois, and have significant ties to whatever market the law school you're looking to go to is in, then I can see why you would go attend that school.


Do you have any sources to back up your PI claim? Almost all of the PIs I know fought tooth and nail for their low paying, PI job. Some wanted it for loan forgiveness, others for the desire to "give back". One partner at the firm I currently work at is actually leaving his extremely cushy job in a couple of months for a PI opening that he competed with recent grads for.


Just people who I know that are in PI now and common sense. I mean "low paying" is different than $40k /year or less. There's a lot more people willing to accept closer to $50-60k /year starting with quick increases thereafter (which seems to be how most PI jobs are). By quick increases, I don't mean biglaw increases, but more like making $70k /year+ within 5 years (so, a pretty livable salary in most of the country). $40k /year or less is really low, even in the PI realm. Most paralegals, legal secretaries, and court reporters make at least that much, if not more. And it's not atypical for people who have already made a lot of money to want to switch tracks and go into PI (like the partner at your firm). They fall into the independently wealthy category, where the salary doesn't matter very much.




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