Word of Warning

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itascot1992
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Word of Warning

Postby itascot1992 » Wed Mar 11, 2015 10:07 am

I have basically received all my offers back from schools by now bc i applied early in the cycle. One thing to note that I found is crazy (and most TLSers will not be surprised), is scholarships with high stipulations. While maintaining a 3.0 or top 50% in your class doesn't seem hard, one school specifically mentioned in the scholarship letter that OVER 50% of the incoming class received a scholarship requiring top half grades. In other words, there will be people there losing their scholarships for sure... TRAP... AVOID

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zombie mcavoy
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Re: Word of Warning

Postby zombie mcavoy » Wed Mar 11, 2015 10:16 am

Yep. This is one the many reasons we told you to retake the lsat: TTT schools do stuff like this.

What's really going to blow your mind, though: many to most of these schools are going to put everyone who got a scholarship into the same section, so, on the forced curve, half of them are required to be below median and lose their scholarship. Google "site:top-law-schools.com "section stacking"" for more information.

itascot1992
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Re: Word of Warning

Postby itascot1992 » Wed Mar 11, 2015 10:17 am

zombie mcavoy wrote:Yep. This is one the many reasons we told you to retake the lsat: TTT schools do stuff like this.

What's really going to blow your mind, though: many to most of these schools are going to put everyone who got a scholarship into the same section, so, on the forced curve, half of them are required to be below median and lose their scholarship. Google "site:top-law-schools.com "section stacking"" for more information.


1.) This wasn't a TTT
2.) That is a scheme

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zombie mcavoy
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Re: Word of Warning

Postby zombie mcavoy » Wed Mar 11, 2015 10:19 am

If they have a any stip beyond good academic standing and force a portion of their incoming students to lose their scholarships, the school is per se TTT. Good schools don't do this kind of stuff.

itascot1992
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Re: Word of Warning

Postby itascot1992 » Wed Mar 11, 2015 10:20 am

zombie mcavoy wrote:If they have a any stip beyond good academic standing and force a portion of their incoming students to lose their scholarships, the school is per se TTT. Good schools don't do this kind of stuff.


Valid point, funny how some TTT do the Stips while others don't. some of my offers were only good academic standing (and they were some of the best offers too)

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zombie mcavoy
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Re: Word of Warning

Postby zombie mcavoy » Wed Mar 11, 2015 10:22 am

Some TTTs stealthily do this, too. They put the stips at 2.0 (generally the "good academic standing" threshold) and then set the curve to 2.0.

itascot1992
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Re: Word of Warning

Postby itascot1992 » Wed Mar 11, 2015 10:24 am

zombie mcavoy wrote:Some TTTs stealthily do this, too. They put the stips at 2.0 (generally the "good academic standing" threshold) and then set the curve to 2.0.


Wouldn't this make them fail out a lot of students?

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zombie mcavoy
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Re: Word of Warning

Postby zombie mcavoy » Wed Mar 11, 2015 10:28 am

Well I imagine in such cases they set their "good academic standard" lower, but, sure: many TTTs intend to fail out a sizable portion of their students. (Because they let anyone with a pulse in and don't want/cant allow their bar passage rates to plummet)

mvp99
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Re: Word of Warning

Postby mvp99 » Wed Mar 11, 2015 10:29 am

even the worst curves don't go below 2.6-7

itascot1992
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Re: Word of Warning

Postby itascot1992 » Wed Mar 11, 2015 10:30 am

zombie mcavoy wrote:Well I imagine in such cases they set their "good academic standard" lower, but, sure: many TTTs intend to fail out a sizable portion of their students. (Because they let anyone with a pulse in and don't want/cant allow their bar passage rates to plummet)


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_la ... GPA_curves

wonder how up to date that is

the TTTT def do that shit wow

donewithannarbor
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Re: Word of Warning

Postby donewithannarbor » Wed Mar 11, 2015 11:24 am

While I also believe that a bunch of schools have schemes to 1) maximize revenue, 2) game the USNews categories by entiting high LSAT students and 3) cut off scholarships by stacking sections and fiddling with the curve, the precise 2.0-curve scheme being discussed sounds implausible. If there are a whole bunch of students with multiple Ds who rightfully fail out, wouldn't that be too costly for the school's bottom line? In other words, the fail-outs are in most cases students who did NOT enjoy scholarships upon entering and would go through their 3 years paying full-cost. If the school kicks out a bunch of full-cost payers, it's left with a whole bunch of people its subsidizing (who, granted, should do better on the bar and employment placement, making the school look better). The only way this works is if they have it figured out that they will usually be left with enough full-cost payers who do well enough to move on for three years (and pay the bills for the school). I am assuming that most of the scholarship students who fail to meet the stips just drop out if they are running < 2.0, so they do not turn into a revenue source. Dropping enrollment must disrupt a model such as this.

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Auxilio
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Re: Word of Warning

Postby Auxilio » Wed Mar 11, 2015 3:32 pm

donewithannarbor wrote:While I also believe that a bunch of schools have schemes to 1) maximize revenue, 2) game the USNews categories by entiting high LSAT students and 3) cut off scholarships by stacking sections and fiddling with the curve, the precise 2.0-curve scheme being discussed sounds implausible. If there are a whole bunch of students with multiple Ds who rightfully fail out, wouldn't that be too costly for the school's bottom line? In other words, the fail-outs are in most cases students who did NOT enjoy scholarships upon entering and would go through their 3 years paying full-cost. If the school kicks out a bunch of full-cost payers, it's left with a whole bunch of people its subsidizing (who, granted, should do better on the bar and employment placement, making the school look better). The only way this works is if they have it figured out that they will usually be left with enough full-cost payers who do well enough to move on for three years (and pay the bills for the school). I am assuming that most of the scholarship students who fail to meet the stips just drop out if they are running < 2.0, so they do not turn into a revenue source. Dropping enrollment must disrupt a model such as this.


I would not be too confident that someone tricked into attending a TTT will not continue through law school barely passing.

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A. Nony Mouse
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Re: Word of Warning

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Wed Mar 11, 2015 3:41 pm

TTTs do notoriously fail a big chunk of students at the end of 1L. They get a year's tuition from them, then ditch them before they get to the point where they can affect the school's bar passage rate. It's not that they're losing 2 years of tuition income on the students who fail - it's that they're getting a year's worth of tuition from people they probably didn't have to accept.

Nomo
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Re: Word of Warning

Postby Nomo » Wed Mar 11, 2015 3:54 pm

If you let in a bunch of kids with 2.9 gpas and 146 LSATs, you're going to have to fail some of them out in order to keep your bar passage rate high enough to stay accredited.

Also, its possible that students can fall below the standards for "good academic standing" and not fail out. Students can be put on probation and given a semester to improve. Most students will improve because not all 2L classes will be on the curve, and the sections won't be stacked anymore.




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