Yale or NYU

(Rankings, Profiles, Tuition, Student Life, . . . )
User avatar
missruffian
Posts: 30
Joined: Fri Oct 31, 2014 3:22 pm

Re: Yale or NYU

Postby missruffian » Sat Jan 24, 2015 10:57 pm

k5220 wrote:NYU 3L here. NYU's interest international law program is fantastic and a lot of people get fabulous opportunities while they are here, but hiring after graduation is a different story. international human rights law is a very small and prestige-oriented niche and the name brand of yale may get you more places. if you know public interest international law is definitely what you want to do, i think yale may be better. if you're more flexible in your public interest ambitions, NYU is great and i love it here.


I've also heard that NYU's international law program is fantastic, but the competition is so fierce that you're not going to reasonably have access to all of it. I'm sure that post-grad positions are even more competitive, and Yale could provide an edge there.

User avatar
gamerish
Posts: 3126
Joined: Fri Dec 19, 2014 12:37 pm

Post removed...

Postby gamerish » Sat Jan 24, 2015 11:04 pm

Post removed...
Last edited by gamerish on Sun Jan 03, 2016 2:00 am, edited 6 times in total.

User avatar
Tiago Splitter
Posts: 15464
Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2011 1:20 am

Re: Yale or NYU

Postby Tiago Splitter » Sat Jan 24, 2015 11:18 pm

gamerish wrote:I'm rather surprised no one has responded with the forum standard "international law doesn't exist" comment for OP.

Because it's not so unicornish from these schools. Although OP hasn't said what (s)he wants to do other than not national security law so that might help clear things up.

User avatar
gamerish
Posts: 3126
Joined: Fri Dec 19, 2014 12:37 pm

Post removed...

Postby gamerish » Sun Jan 25, 2015 12:47 am

Post removed...
Last edited by gamerish on Sun Jan 03, 2016 1:59 am, edited 6 times in total.

mvp99
Posts: 1383
Joined: Fri Mar 14, 2014 9:00 pm

Re: Yale or NYU

Postby mvp99 » Sun Jan 25, 2015 12:54 am

Yale. The End.

User avatar
A. Nony Mouse
Posts: 22809
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:51 am

Re: Yale or NYU

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Sun Jan 25, 2015 1:19 am

From everything I've seen here (i.e. everything WT has said), success in international public interest law depends about as much on an individual's previous experience and skills (especially languages) as on their school. I still don't think Yale makes $200k worth of difference.

(Admittedly they're all so outside my realm of experience that the differences appear pretty darn subtle.)

User avatar
missruffian
Posts: 30
Joined: Fri Oct 31, 2014 3:22 pm

Re: Yale or NYU

Postby missruffian » Sun Jan 25, 2015 4:35 pm

gamerish wrote:She said international public interest law which smacks of the usual romanticism of international law. I'd certainly think the int law program at NYU and anything from Yale would help but it's still a unicorn field.


International law definitely exists. I agree that my view of it is romanticized, and it's probable that I'll end up in private international law at some point, but that's still international law.

User avatar
The TrashMan
Posts: 25
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2015 1:32 pm

Re: Yale or NYU

Postby The TrashMan » Mon Jan 26, 2015 5:09 pm

.
Last edited by The TrashMan on Mon Apr 20, 2015 8:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

thisone2014
Posts: 106
Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2014 7:03 pm

Re: Yale or NYU

Postby thisone2014 » Tue Jan 27, 2015 12:17 pm

pto1993 wrote: I understand your desire to be financially independent, but money is money no matter where you get it, and you should take it.

Yale all the way.



Seconded. They put aside this money specifically for the purpose of allowing you to go to whichever school you want, without having to consider the cost-- not so that it would act as a counterargument to the more expensive option.

User avatar
XxSpyKEx
Posts: 1741
Joined: Wed Dec 27, 2006 5:48 am

Re: Yale or NYU

Postby XxSpyKEx » Tue Jan 27, 2015 3:25 pm

banjo wrote:Why can't you do loans at Yale + COAP like a couple others suggested? And keep the 300k.


+1. I really don't understand what the issue here is. It's not like you have throw away the $300k to pay for YLS if you're planning to do PI anyways (and, hence, qualify for PLSF). You won't spend a cent for law school that way. It's also worth mentioning that the actual amount you'll keep is $200k with NYU, not $300k, since you'll be paying NYC cost of living out of pocket if you attend NYU. I really can't think of a good reason why you would pick NYU over Yale, especially if you want to go into international law--there's like a handful of attorneys in the country who practice "international law," and don't you think your odds of joining them would be better by attending the best law school in the country rather than competing for grades at NYU for a chance at one of those positions?

thisone2014 wrote:
pto1993 wrote: I understand your desire to be financially independent, but money is money no matter where you get it, and you should take it.

Yale all the way.



Seconded. They put aside this money specifically for the purpose of allowing you to go to whichever school you want, without having to consider the cost-- not so that it would act as a counterargument to the more expensive option.


+3.

User avatar
missruffian
Posts: 30
Joined: Fri Oct 31, 2014 3:22 pm

Re: Yale or NYU

Postby missruffian » Tue Jan 27, 2015 8:50 pm

pto1993 wrote:Not to be rude but it seems clear that your parents are both immensely wealthy and incredibly generous. I understand your desire to be financially independent, but money is money no matter where you get it, and you should take it. If they are willing to pay 300k and "think that this money doesn't matter" you could probably go to Yale, become a janitor, and still have them pay for your life. So go to Yale, and have all the opportunities in the world, and take a well-paying happy job, and still have them pay for your life. If shit hits the fan and they cease to be an additional bank account for you, you will still have a Yale degree and can effortlessly get a 6 figure job. Again not trying to be rude, but I think your family history may have given you a distorted perception of what "shit-paying job" means and what it takes to live comfortably.

Yale all the way.


I think you're right.

User avatar
missruffian
Posts: 30
Joined: Fri Oct 31, 2014 3:22 pm

Re: Yale or NYU

Postby missruffian » Tue Jan 27, 2015 8:57 pm

XxSpyKEx wrote:I really don't understand what the issue here is. It's not like you have throw away the $300k to pay for YLS if you're planning to do PI anyways (and, hence, qualify for PLSF). You won't spend a cent for law school that way. It's also worth mentioning that the actual amount you'll keep is $200k with NYU, not $300k, since you'll be paying NYC cost of living out of pocket if you attend NYU. I really can't think of a good reason why you would pick NYU over Yale, especially if you want to go into international law--there's like a handful of attorneys in the country who practice "international law," and don't you think your odds of joining them would be better by attending the best law school in the country rather than competing for grades at NYU for a chance at one of those positions?


I don't entirely understand how loans work. Can anyone get loans, no matter how much money you have? And doesn't PLSF only work if you commit to public service for 10 years? While I want to do public interest, I also want to dabble in other things. Also, during the 10 years before your loans are forgiven, would your credit score be negatively affected by having such significant loans?

User avatar
A. Nony Mouse
Posts: 22809
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:51 am

Re: Yale or NYU

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Tue Jan 27, 2015 10:30 pm

Yes, everyone can get loans, unless your personal credit rating is too low (and then you'd need a co-signer, but it would have be to really catastrophically low. In practice everyone can get loans). You can't have "too much money" to get loans; the idea is that if you have the money to pay for school but want to keep that money and take out loans instead, you do you.

PSLF requires 10 years of public service, but it doesn't have to be consecutive (it's 120 payments total). If you go to a non-eligible employer for a while those payments just won't count toward PSLF. Your payments themselves are tied to income, so if you're in biglaw or the like, your payment will probably go back up to the standard 10-year payment. Of course, there are regular rumblings about capping the amount of forgiveness under PSLF.

I'm not super up on credit scores, but people here have said that credit score is more based on obligations v. income/assets than the amount of the loans per se. If your payment isn't very high compared to your income/assets, your credit could still be decent. (I should have a better answer for this because I should know my own credit score, but, well, I don't right now.)

I get that Yale is the holy grail of amazing law schools, but I do find it kind of amazing to think that someone would pay $200K more to go there.

Edited to add: sorry, that sounded more judgmental than I meant. It's your life, not mine, so I apologize.

User avatar
XxSpyKEx
Posts: 1741
Joined: Wed Dec 27, 2006 5:48 am

Re: Yale or NYU

Postby XxSpyKEx » Tue Jan 27, 2015 11:31 pm

missruffian wrote:
XxSpyKEx wrote:I really don't understand what the issue here is. It's not like you have throw away the $300k to pay for YLS if you're planning to do PI anyways (and, hence, qualify for PLSF). You won't spend a cent for law school that way. It's also worth mentioning that the actual amount you'll keep is $200k with NYU, not $300k, since you'll be paying NYC cost of living out of pocket if you attend NYU. I really can't think of a good reason why you would pick NYU over Yale, especially if you want to go into international law--there's like a handful of attorneys in the country who practice "international law," and don't you think your odds of joining them would be better by attending the best law school in the country rather than competing for grades at NYU for a chance at one of those positions?


I don't entirely understand how loans work. Can anyone get loans, no matter how much money you have? And doesn't PLSF only work if you commit to public service for 10 years? While I want to do public interest, I also want to dabble in other things. Also, during the 10 years before your loans are forgiven, would your credit score be negatively affected by having such significant loans?


A. Nony Mouse covered your questions regarding getting loans and PLSF better than I could have. With respect to the credit score, the student loans won't negatively impact you (oddly enough). You just need to make on-time payments, and they will actually increase your credit score. The amount of your payments have nothing to do with your credit score (AFAIK). But when you apply for things like credit cards, a mortgage, etc., most places will ask you what your monthly/yearly income is and what your monthly debt obligations are, and will reduce the amount they will let you borrow based on that information (i.e. relative to if you had no debt). However, most places will also ask you about your assets, and if you have $200k sitting around somewhere, that will vastly increase the amount of money that banks will be willing to let you borrow.

Pretty much, if $300k is nothing to your parents (which it sounds like it isn't a big deal), just take that money and roll with it. If it has some appreciable value on their overall wealth, you could always just take out student loans, and rely on COAP/PLSF. You should really look into COAP before you make a decision, though. I don't know what the terms of that is, but I recall back in 2009, they pretty much covered your entire loan repayments for people who didn't make over $60k /year, and if you made more than that, all they required was for your to pay a portion of your loan. Pretty sure COAP isn't quite as generous as that anymore, but it's probably still very generous (I would be surprised if they didn't cover your entire PAYE payments, at a minimum, on a salary under $60k, where you could just ride that out for 10 years and then do PLSF).

User avatar
XxSpyKEx
Posts: 1741
Joined: Wed Dec 27, 2006 5:48 am

Re: Yale or NYU

Postby XxSpyKEx » Tue Jan 27, 2015 11:57 pm

A. Nony Mouse wrote:I get that Yale is the holy grail of amazing law schools, but I do find it kind of amazing to think that someone would pay $200K more to go there.


Although that $200k is basically like monopoly money anyways between COAP and/or PAYE & PLSF (assuming OP decides to pursue the career she's talking about pursuing and not biglaw). Moreover, Yale is also pretty much a guarantee you're going to find something awesome after law school, whereas NYU is much more grade dependent. The very top of the class at NYU has the same (or better) options that YLS grads do, but if OP winds up at the bottom of her class at NYU, her options will be a lot more limited than if she chose to attend YLS. I dunno, I'd take Yale over a full tuition scholarship at NYU in a heartbeat (especially considering cost of living in NYC for 3 years is going to wind up costing at least $75k anyways), and her parents seem to be immensely wealthy and willing to pay for her education so that she wouldn't have to make a decision regarding where to go based on cost.




Return to “Choosing a Law School”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], carlos_danger, TheSpanishMain and 2 guests