Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

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wfaz
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Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby wfaz » Sat Jan 03, 2015 10:40 pm

Based on my admission offers I am really drawn towards Loyola Chicago and probably going to end up there for fall of 2015. At this point I am only a few days away from signing my seat deposit.

I was wondering if any current/former students have any insight they would be willing to share on the schools culture, extra circulars or advice on the school or the legal market in Chicago to begin with.

About me: (to maybe better narrow responses)

-Very interested in trial advocacy
-Looking to go private sector law although really open to anything at this point given that I am unaware of other offerings
-looking to work in Chicago upon graduation

Thank you in advance for any advice!

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Ramius
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Re: Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby Ramius » Sat Jan 03, 2015 10:47 pm

wfaz wrote:Based on my admission offers I am really drawn towards Loyola Chicago and probably going to end up there for fall of 2015. At this point I am only a few days away from signing my seat deposit.

I was wondering if any current/former students have any insight they would be willing to share on the schools culture, extra circulars or advice on the school or the legal market in Chicago to begin with.

About me: (to maybe better narrow responses)

-Very interested in trial advocacy
-Looking to go private sector law although really open to anything at this point given that I am unaware of other offerings
-looking to work in Chicago upon graduation

Thank you in advance for any advice!


http://www.lstscorereports.com/schools/loyola-chicago/2013/

Start here. Proceed accordingly.

pkraft1
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Re: Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby pkraft1 » Sat Jan 03, 2015 11:34 pm

Loyola Chicago has a nice campus in the heart of downtown. I've spent significant time there for a variety of reasons. Living in Chicago, I notice that Loyola has a good reputation. People think Northwestern, UofC, and then Loyola, then Depaul, then every other school. There's a reputation of Loyola Chicago putting out hard-workers who, likely because of their second rate status to the t14 schools, tend to work harder in firms. There was an article I read a while ago that I cannot seem to find now, but it said Loyola Chicago has graduated a disproportionate number of lawyers who are now partners in Chicago firms, especially considering the lower feed-in rate to these firms. I personally wouldn't go because how risky their unemployment outcomes look, but I think it's a strong regional.

If you have any questions about the culture or whatever, feel free to PM me.

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Ramius
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Re: Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby Ramius » Sat Jan 03, 2015 11:42 pm

pkraft1 wrote:Loyola Chicago has a nice campus in the heart of downtown. I've spent significant time there for a variety of reasons. Living in Chicago, I notice that Loyola has a good reputation. People think Northwestern, UofC, and then Loyola, then Depaul, then every other school. There's a reputation of Loyola Chicago putting out hard-workers who, likely because of their second rate status to the t14 schools, tend to work harder in firms. There was an article I read a while ago that I cannot seem to find now, but it said Loyola Chicago has graduated a disproportionate number of lawyers who are now partners in Chicago firms, especially considering the lower feed-in rate to these firms. I personally wouldn't go because how risky their unemployment outcomes look, but I think it's a strong regional.

If you have any questions about the culture or whatever, feel free to PM me.


UIUC begs to differ...

http://www.lstscorereports.com/schools/illinois/2013/

CFC1524
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Re: Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby CFC1524 » Sat Jan 03, 2015 11:50 pm

pkraft1 wrote:Loyola Chicago has a nice campus in the heart of downtown. I've spent significant time there for a variety of reasons. Living in Chicago, I notice that Loyola has a good reputation. People think Northwestern, UofC, and then Loyola, then Depaul, then every other school. There's a reputation of Loyola Chicago putting out hard-workers who, likely because of their second rate status to the t14 schools, tend to work harder in firms. There was an article I read a while ago that I cannot seem to find now, but it said Loyola Chicago has graduated a disproportionate number of lawyers who are now partners in Chicago firms, especially considering the lower feed-in rate to these firms. I personally wouldn't go because how risky their unemployment outcomes look, but I think it's a strong regional.

If you have any questions about the culture or whatever, feel free to PM me.


Strong regional seems a little disingenuous. To be "strong," you need to place more than 50% of your students in full-time legal positions (Loyola doesn't), and to be a "regional," you need to have decent control over your local market (Loyola doesn't have this either). Loyola may (and I say this hesitantly) be an okay decision for free; personally, however, I would stay the hell away from a school in a super competitive market with a 48% employment score.

Sorry OP, can't speak to that culture; that said, take a look at those employment statistics (as well as total debt at repayment) and make sure you are making a good long-term decision. What are your stats? Retake on the table? Any other acceptances?

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JohannDeMann
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Re: Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby JohannDeMann » Sun Jan 04, 2015 12:02 am

Chicago legal market is okay right now. Not great and still slowly rebounding from recession levels. The suburbs have strong legal markets though.
Do you have ties or connections to the city?

wfaz
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Re: Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby wfaz » Sun Jan 04, 2015 12:10 am

CFC1524 wrote:
pkraft1 wrote:Loyola Chicago has a nice campus in the heart of downtown. I've spent significant time there for a variety of reasons. Living in Chicago, I notice that Loyola has a good reputation. People think Northwestern, UofC, and then Loyola, then Depaul, then every other school. There's a reputation of Loyola Chicago putting out hard-workers who, likely because of their second rate status to the t14 schools, tend to work harder in firms. There was an article I read a while ago that I cannot seem to find now, but it said Loyola Chicago has graduated a disproportionate number of lawyers who are now partners in Chicago firms, especially considering the lower feed-in rate to these firms. I personally wouldn't go because how risky their unemployment outcomes look, but I think it's a strong regional.

If you have any questions about the culture or whatever, feel free to PM me.


Strong regional seems a little disingenuous. To be "strong," you need to place more than 50% of your students in full-time legal positions (Loyola doesn't), and to be a "regional," you need to have decent control over your local market (Loyola doesn't have this either). Loyola may (and I say this hesitantly) be an okay decision for free; personally, however, I would stay the hell away from a school in a super competitive market with a 48% employment score.

Sorry OP, can't speak to that culture; that said, take a look at those employment statistics (as well as total debt at repayment) and make sure you are making a good long-term decision. What are your stats? Retake on the table? Any other acceptances?


I got a pretty nice scholarship offer and if I am modest with housing I can manage to walk away debt free from loyola law. other schools accepted were depaul, IU Maurer, IUPUI, Valpo Law, and Kent Law

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Mack.Hambleton
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Re: Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby Mack.Hambleton » Sun Jan 04, 2015 1:37 am

Don't go to any of those schools

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JohannDeMann
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Re: Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby JohannDeMann » Sun Jan 04, 2015 2:02 am

loyola debt free is a fine outcome. if you are gonna spend savings it might be worth taking out some debt and saving some of your savings.

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lhanvt13
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Re: Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby lhanvt13 » Sun Jan 04, 2015 2:06 am

I live a block away. They have the best chic-fil-a in town. So that's plus points for Loyola...

CFC1524
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Re: Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby CFC1524 » Sun Jan 04, 2015 2:51 am

JohannDeMann wrote:loyola debt free is a fine outcome. if you are gonna spend savings it might be worth taking out some debt and saving some of your savings.


Debt-free is definitely a plus, but he still only has a coin-flip chance of becoming an attorney. I'd feel better recommending Loyola for free if OP had ties to the area / a work background he can use to help him acquire a job post-graduation.

Are you K-JD, or have you been out of college for a few years? No debt is step one, but you need to make sure you can get a job afterwards as well. 48% employment score is a tough sell for me, especially if OP has a full-time job already

BigZuck
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Re: Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby BigZuck » Sun Jan 04, 2015 4:45 am

What do you mean by private sector law?

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KMart
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Re: Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby KMart » Sun Jan 04, 2015 4:46 am

lhanvt13 wrote:I live a block away. They have the best chic-fil-a in town. So that's plus points for Loyola...

From the law school or the main campus in Rogers Park?

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lhanvt13
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Re: Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby lhanvt13 » Sun Jan 04, 2015 6:41 am

imKMart wrote:
lhanvt13 wrote:I live a block away. They have the best chic-fil-a in town. So that's plus points for Loyola...

From the law school or the main campus in Rogers Park?

Law school. It's near rush and... Chicago ish right?

mickey_mouse
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Re: Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby mickey_mouse » Sun Jan 04, 2015 12:49 pm

lhanvt13 wrote:
imKMart wrote:
lhanvt13 wrote:I live a block away. They have the best chic-fil-a in town. So that's plus points for Loyola...

From the law school or the main campus in Rogers Park?

Law school. It's near rush and... Chicago ish right?


Yep! Their business school is right there too. It's actually a cool set-up, the law school is about 1.5 blocks off the Magnificent Mile.

12% biglaw score on LST though...

Wingtip88
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Re: Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby Wingtip88 » Sun Jan 04, 2015 1:19 pm

Only law schools worth going to in Illinois are University of Chicago, Northwestern and UIUC (if you get full ride.)

It's really simple... Expected job outcomes weighed against debt. If you could hack Loyola for free why not go to UIUC and try do the same?

rbm4791
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Re: Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby rbm4791 » Sun Jan 04, 2015 2:29 pm

I go to Loyola, feel free to PM me.

NYCFAN1
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Re: Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby NYCFAN1 » Sun Jan 04, 2015 3:30 pm

rbm4791 wrote:I go to Loyola, feel free to PM me.


future forum goers will probably have similar questions to the OP

why not respond to OP's inquiries so everyone can view them?

pkraft1
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Re: Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby pkraft1 » Sun Jan 04, 2015 4:08 pm

CFC1524 wrote:
pkraft1 wrote:Loyola Chicago has a nice campus in the heart of downtown. I've spent significant time there for a variety of reasons. Living in Chicago, I notice that Loyola has a good reputation. People think Northwestern, UofC, and then Loyola, then Depaul, then every other school. There's a reputation of Loyola Chicago putting out hard-workers who, likely because of their second rate status to the t14 schools, tend to work harder in firms. There was an article I read a while ago that I cannot seem to find now, but it said Loyola Chicago has graduated a disproportionate number of lawyers who are now partners in Chicago firms, especially considering the lower feed-in rate to these firms. I personally wouldn't go because how risky their unemployment outcomes look, but I think it's a strong regional.

If you have any questions about the culture or whatever, feel free to PM me.


Strong regional seems a little disingenuous. To be "strong," you need to place more than 50% of your students in full-time legal positions (Loyola doesn't), and to be a "regional," you need to have decent control over your local market (Loyola doesn't have this either). Loyola may (and I say this hesitantly) be an okay decision for free; personally, however, I would stay the hell away from a school in a super competitive market with a 48% employment score.

Sorry OP, can't speak to that culture; that said, take a look at those employment statistics (as well as total debt at repayment) and make sure you are making a good long-term decision. What are your stats? Retake on the table? Any other acceptances?



I agree with nearly everything you are saying, but I think you are defining "strong regional" in such a way as to specifically exclude Loyola Chicago rather than using common definitions of these words. I agree that Loyola Chicago is not a great option, but the local reputation is fairly strong. And only in your oddly narrow definition of "regional" is Loyola not a regional school. 67.8 total employment IN ILLINOIS (including not lawyer jobs) is indicative of regional placement. No one uses the definition of having control over a market, which has no bright-line, not common usage, and more importantly not the point: by stating Loyola is a regional school, I mean to exclude national placement.

I didn't mention UIUC because it's not actually in Chicago, and I was comparing Chicago schools. If you want to live in Chicago and got to school in Chicago, UIUC will not do that for you. It is a better option (in terms of employment, which should be the most important factor) than Loyola Chicago, however.

timbs4339
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Re: Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby timbs4339 » Sun Jan 04, 2015 6:36 pm

pkraft1 wrote:
CFC1524 wrote:
pkraft1 wrote:Loyola Chicago has a nice campus in the heart of downtown. I've spent significant time there for a variety of reasons. Living in Chicago, I notice that Loyola has a good reputation. People think Northwestern, UofC, and then Loyola, then Depaul, then every other school. There's a reputation of Loyola Chicago putting out hard-workers who, likely because of their second rate status to the t14 schools, tend to work harder in firms. There was an article I read a while ago that I cannot seem to find now, but it said Loyola Chicago has graduated a disproportionate number of lawyers who are now partners in Chicago firms, especially considering the lower feed-in rate to these firms. I personally wouldn't go because how risky their unemployment outcomes look, but I think it's a strong regional.

If you have any questions about the culture or whatever, feel free to PM me.


Strong regional seems a little disingenuous. To be "strong," you need to place more than 50% of your students in full-time legal positions (Loyola doesn't), and to be a "regional," you need to have decent control over your local market (Loyola doesn't have this either). Loyola may (and I say this hesitantly) be an okay decision for free; personally, however, I would stay the hell away from a school in a super competitive market with a 48% employment score.

Sorry OP, can't speak to that culture; that said, take a look at those employment statistics (as well as total debt at repayment) and make sure you are making a good long-term decision. What are your stats? Retake on the table? Any other acceptances?



I agree with nearly everything you are saying, but I think you are defining "strong regional" in such a way as to specifically exclude Loyola Chicago rather than using common definitions of these words. I agree that Loyola Chicago is not a great option, but the local reputation is fairly strong. And only in your oddly narrow definition of "regional" is Loyola not a regional school. 67.8 total employment IN ILLINOIS (including not lawyer jobs) is indicative of regional placement. No one uses the definition of having control over a market, which has no bright-line, not common usage, and more importantly not the point: by stating Loyola is a regional school, I mean to exclude national placement.

I didn't mention UIUC because it's not actually in Chicago, and I was comparing Chicago schools. If you want to live in Chicago and got to school in Chicago, UIUC will not do that for you. It is a better option (in terms of employment, which should be the most important factor) than Loyola Chicago, however.


The poster's definition is right on point. If your professional school can't deliver 50% FT employment in the freaking profession that it's supposed to prepare you for, it doesn't have strong placement. Whether the 25% or 40% it does place all work in the state the school is in is indicative of whether it's regional/national (exception for schools in NYC that place into NYC biglaw), not if it is strong or weak.

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naschkatze
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Re: Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby naschkatze » Thu Jan 29, 2015 5:55 am

Hey you guys!

I am hoping you might be of some help because everyone in my family is of no help!
I got accepted to Loyola Chicago with a 96K scholarship (so 9K/year total) and accepted to Indiana University Maurer with a 75K/year scholarship (where I would pay appx 25K/year).

Indiana is ranked in the T30, hence my interest. But, I would have little-to-no loans if I attend Loyola.
I also already live in Chicago, so I would not have to move, which is another plus. I am indeed leaning towards Loyola but I am not sure if it is just due to convenience. Would I be committing suicide by not going to a T30?!

I am interested in practicing in Chicago and am looking to get into a big firm here (Latham & Watkins, Skadden, Winston & Strawn etc.)

Any advice is totally appreciated!

timbs4339
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Re: Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby timbs4339 » Thu Jan 29, 2015 8:56 am

naschkatze wrote:Hey you guys!

I am hoping you might be of some help because everyone in my family is of no help!
I got accepted to Loyola Chicago with a 96K scholarship (so 9K/year total) and accepted to Indiana University Maurer with a 75K/year scholarship (where I would pay appx 25K/year).

Indiana is ranked in the T30, hence my interest. But, I would have little-to-no loans if I attend Loyola.
I also already live in Chicago, so I would not have to move, which is another plus. I am indeed leaning towards Loyola but I am not sure if it is just due to convenience. Would I be committing suicide by not going to a T30?!

I am interested in practicing in Chicago and am looking to get into a big firm here (Latham & Watkins, Skadden, Winston & Strawn etc.)

Any advice is totally appreciated!


Loyola's big firm employment score is 15%. That's a 15% chance of getting the jobs you want. Would you be fine making 40-60K after graduation working as a public defender, for a small firm, or as a government lawyer? If you want biglaw you need to retake and get into a T14.

BigZuck
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Re: Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby BigZuck » Thu Jan 29, 2015 8:57 am

naschkatze wrote:Hey you guys!

I am hoping you might be of some help because everyone in my family is of no help!
I got accepted to Loyola Chicago with a 96K scholarship (so 9K/year total) and accepted to Indiana University Maurer with a 75K/year scholarship (where I would pay appx 25K/year).

Indiana is ranked in the T30, hence my interest. But, I would have little-to-no loans if I attend Loyola.
I also already live in Chicago, so I would not have to move, which is another plus. I am indeed leaning towards Loyola but I am not sure if it is just due to convenience. Would I be committing suicide by not going to a T30?!

I am interested in practicing in Chicago and am looking to get into a big firm here (Latham & Watkins, Skadden, Winston & Strawn etc.)

Any advice is totally appreciated!


Why, specifically, is the T30 distinction important to you?

You will almost certainly never work at a big Chicago firm from either, so that's moot. If you want to work at a firm like that, then go to Northwestern or University of Chicago.

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romothesavior
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Re: Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby romothesavior » Thu Jan 29, 2015 9:01 am

timbs4339 wrote:
naschkatze wrote:Hey you guys!

I am hoping you might be of some help because everyone in my family is of no help!
I got accepted to Loyola Chicago with a 96K scholarship (so 9K/year total) and accepted to Indiana University Maurer with a 75K/year scholarship (where I would pay appx 25K/year).

Indiana is ranked in the T30, hence my interest. But, I would have little-to-no loans if I attend Loyola.
I also already live in Chicago, so I would not have to move, which is another plus. I am indeed leaning towards Loyola but I am not sure if it is just due to convenience. Would I be committing suicide by not going to a T30?!

I am interested in practicing in Chicago and am looking to get into a big firm here (Latham & Watkins, Skadden, Winston & Strawn etc.)

Any advice is totally appreciated!


Loyola's big firm employment score is 15%. That's a 15% chance of getting the jobs you want. Would you be fine making 40-60K after graduation working as a public defender, for a small firm, or as a government lawyer? If you want biglaw you need to retake and get into a T14.

+1.

If your goal is big law, Loyola is a bad choice. The statistics on that are crystal clear, don't let one of these random "hey I go to Loyola, PM me if you want details because I won't say them publicly" posters tell you otherwise.

Look at the jobs data: http://www.lstscorereports.com/schools/loyola-chicago/2013/

timbs4339
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Re: Loyola-Chicago (Culture, pointers, logical expectations)

Postby timbs4339 » Thu Jan 29, 2015 10:53 am

romothesavior wrote:
timbs4339 wrote:
naschkatze wrote:Hey you guys!

I am hoping you might be of some help because everyone in my family is of no help!
I got accepted to Loyola Chicago with a 96K scholarship (so 9K/year total) and accepted to Indiana University Maurer with a 75K/year scholarship (where I would pay appx 25K/year).

Indiana is ranked in the T30, hence my interest. But, I would have little-to-no loans if I attend Loyola.
I also already live in Chicago, so I would not have to move, which is another plus. I am indeed leaning towards Loyola but I am not sure if it is just due to convenience. Would I be committing suicide by not going to a T30?!

I am interested in practicing in Chicago and am looking to get into a big firm here (Latham & Watkins, Skadden, Winston & Strawn etc.)

Any advice is totally appreciated!


Loyola's big firm employment score is 15%. That's a 15% chance of getting the jobs you want. Would you be fine making 40-60K after graduation working as a public defender, for a small firm, or as a government lawyer? If you want biglaw you need to retake and get into a T14.

+1.

If your goal is big law, Loyola is a bad choice. The statistics on that are crystal clear, don't let one of these random "hey I go to Loyola, PM me if you want details because I won't say them publicly" posters tell you otherwise.


Hey FYI don't let those elitist TLS hivemind h8ers get you down. Lots of people who were #1 in the class at Loyola work at Skadden.




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