Stetson University College of Law

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zatharus
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Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby zatharus » Mon Dec 01, 2014 4:03 pm

Intangibles matter. If they didn't there would be no point in having discussion forums like this in the first place and everybody could make their school choice purely by the numbers.

I'm out. I've got better things to do than post here.

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isuperserial
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Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby isuperserial » Mon Dec 01, 2014 4:22 pm

zatharus wrote:Intangibles matter. If they didn't there would be no point in having discussion forums like this in the first place and everybody could make their school choice purely by the numbers.

I'm out. I've got better things to do than post here.


Intangibles matter, but I feel like a bad decision wouldn't be made better by 24 hour gym access or being close to the beach.

Ultimately it's 3 years, and while the climate you spend those years in is important, it's much less important than things like prospects or costs.

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Rigo
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Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby Rigo » Mon Dec 01, 2014 4:51 pm

zatharus wrote:I'm out. I've got better things to do than post here.

I love how people say this.

timbs4339
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Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby timbs4339 » Mon Dec 01, 2014 5:06 pm

Lyndsc wrote:- I have taken the LSAT once and (at the risk of incurring the wrath of TLS) I don't have the time or desire to take it again. My score was lowish 160's, my GPA is 3.84.
I like Stetson, I like the area, I like the focus of the school. Thoughts?


Holy missed opportunities Batman!

Specialty rankings are flame. They are marketing pitches by the school that don't translate into job prospects and are often just packaging up stuff that you can get at any other school and selling it as if it is some special program. If employers really cared that Stetson was ranked #1 in trial advocacy it wouldn't have a 60% employment score with 80% of the grads working in Florida. If being #1 in trial advocacy mattered, firms in LA and NYC would be paying big $$$ to Stetson grads to first chair trials after they get their license. Not happening.

You're giving up a definite improvement in job prospects, geographic flexibility, and money by not taking the test again. You can make time- a few hours a week to study for six months. As for "desire"- it's a standardized test. Nobody who isn't running their own test prep company has the desire to take it multiple times. You do it because each point can be worth thousands of dollars and it's the smart, rational thing to do in an America where higher ed costs are out of control.

Lyndsc
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Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby Lyndsc » Mon Dec 01, 2014 6:22 pm

timbs4339 wrote:
Lyndsc wrote:- I have taken the LSAT once and (at the risk of incurring the wrath of TLS) I don't have the time or desire to take it again. My score was lowish 160's, my GPA is 3.84.
I like Stetson, I like the area, I like the focus of the school. Thoughts?


Holy missed opportunities Batman!

Specialty rankings are flame. They are marketing pitches by the school that don't translate into job prospects and are often just packaging up stuff that you can get at any other school and selling it as if it is some special program. If employers really cared that Stetson was ranked #1 in trial advocacy it wouldn't have a 60% employment score with 80% of the grads working in Florida. If being #1 in trial advocacy mattered, firms in LA and NYC would be paying big $$$ to Stetson grads to first chair trials after they get their license. Not happening.

You're giving up a definite improvement in job prospects, geographic flexibility, and money by not taking the test again. You can make time- a few hours a week to study for six months. As for "desire"- it's a standardized test. Nobody who isn't running their own test prep company has the desire to take it multiple times. You do it because each point can be worth thousands of dollars and it's the smart, rational thing to do in an America where higher ed costs are out of control.


I understand what you're saying, but it's just uninformed of you to say I can make time to study, I can't, it's simply not feasible. I work full time in the office, I work as a waitress at night and I go to school full time. The score that I got the first time was a miracle, I literally walked in and took the test after taking only two practice tests that come with your LSAC account, I didn't buy a book, I didn't take a class. I am not about to risk getting a lower score. In theory yes, I should take a year off and study, but I am a K - JD and I am self aware to know that if I took a year off I would likely lose my motivation and never return to school. The fact is not every person has the ability to take the LSAT and come out 170's for whatever reason. Good point on the trial advocacy front, I was just curious about it.

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isuperserial
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Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby isuperserial » Mon Dec 01, 2014 6:43 pm

Lyndsc wrote:
timbs4339 wrote:
Lyndsc wrote:- I have taken the LSAT once and (at the risk of incurring the wrath of TLS) I don't have the time or desire to take it again. My score was lowish 160's, my GPA is 3.84.
I like Stetson, I like the area, I like the focus of the school. Thoughts?


Holy missed opportunities Batman!

Specialty rankings are flame. They are marketing pitches by the school that don't translate into job prospects and are often just packaging up stuff that you can get at any other school and selling it as if it is some special program. If employers really cared that Stetson was ranked #1 in trial advocacy it wouldn't have a 60% employment score with 80% of the grads working in Florida. If being #1 in trial advocacy mattered, firms in LA and NYC would be paying big $$$ to Stetson grads to first chair trials after they get their license. Not happening.

You're giving up a definite improvement in job prospects, geographic flexibility, and money by not taking the test again. You can make time- a few hours a week to study for six months. As for "desire"- it's a standardized test. Nobody who isn't running their own test prep company has the desire to take it multiple times. You do it because each point can be worth thousands of dollars and it's the smart, rational thing to do in an America where higher ed costs are out of control.


I understand what you're saying, but it's just uninformed of you to say I can make time to study, I can't, it's simply not feasible. I work full time in the office, I work as a waitress at night and I go to school full time. The score that I got the first time was a miracle, I literally walked in and took the test after taking only two practice tests that come with your LSAC account, I didn't buy a book, I didn't take a class. I am not about to risk getting a lower score. In theory yes, I should take a year off and study, but I am a K - JD and I am self aware to know that if I took a year off I would likely lose my motivation and never return to school. The fact is not every person has the ability to take the LSAT and come out 170's for whatever reason. Good point on the trial advocacy front, I was just curious about it.


If you go to school full time, then wait till you finish your degree and put that time towards the LSAT.

Finally, law school is an up-at-dawn, pride-swallowing siege that I will never fully tell you about, okay? If seriously all it took to make you not go is a year off, I'm not so sure it's the best choice to begin with. Now, if you were looking at Harvard, I'd say "hell, that's an objectively good business decision to go, they'll make lots of money and then if they hate it they can quit." Not at Stetson. You have to love it if you're going to go to Stetson. And if you don't know you'll love it, it just isn't worth it. There's plenty of jobs that require a lot less investment and that will pay you a lot more money then a degree from Stetson will ever get you. I'd rather you lose motivation now then five years into a job you hate with tens of thousands of dollars of debt.

I'm not trying to be an asshole, I'm just very concerned. Other people will probably disagree with me, and that's okay too.

timbs4339
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Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby timbs4339 » Mon Dec 01, 2014 6:46 pm

Lyndsc wrote:I understand what you're saying, but it's just uninformed of you to say I can make time to study, I can't, it's simply not feasible. I work full time in the office, I work as a waitress at night and I go to school full time. The score that I got the first time was a miracle, I literally walked in and took the test after taking only two practice tests that come with your LSAC account, I didn't buy a book, I didn't take a class. I am not about to risk getting a lower score. In theory yes, I should take a year off and study, but I am a K - JD and I am self aware to know that if I took a year off I would likely lose my motivation and never return to school. The fact is not every person has the ability to take the LSAT and come out 170's for whatever reason. Good point on the trial advocacy front, I was just curious about it.


Your last sentence is right in general- but it's wrong in your case. You're telling us that you took 2 PTs and then the real thing and scored in the low 160s. With average studying, 15-20 PTs and using the free advice on this forum and relatively cheap Powerscore bibles, you can absolutely bump that score up to the 170s. FWIW, it took me about 10 before I saw a real jump, which ended up being 8 points overall. If you don't mind, what was your section breakdown?

Potentially getting a lower score does not matter. You do know that only HYS averages scores, right (USNWR only counts the highest score so schools have no incentive to average)? You cannot do worse than your current score for admissions purposes. You can probably do much better.

Honestly, your relative success on the first try should make you more motivated for the next take, not less. I don't think you can appreciate how close you are to having excellent career options. Want to work for the DOJ? That becomes significantly more likely from a T10 school. If it's absolutely impossible for you to fit studying in right now, then consider taking at least a year off while you study. It sounds like you have enough income to support yourself while you study, don't unnecessarily restrict your options by insisting upon going K-JD.

Lyndsc
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Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby Lyndsc » Mon Dec 01, 2014 7:01 pm

timbs4339 wrote:
Lyndsc wrote:I understand what you're saying, but it's just uninformed of you to say I can make time to study, I can't, it's simply not feasible. I work full time in the office, I work as a waitress at night and I go to school full time. The score that I got the first time was a miracle, I literally walked in and took the test after taking only two practice tests that come with your LSAC account, I didn't buy a book, I didn't take a class. I am not about to risk getting a lower score. In theory yes, I should take a year off and study, but I am a K - JD and I am self aware to know that if I took a year off I would likely lose my motivation and never return to school. The fact is not every person has the ability to take the LSAT and come out 170's for whatever reason. Good point on the trial advocacy front, I was just curious about it.


Your last sentence is right in general- but it's wrong in your case. You're telling us that you took 2 PTs and then the real thing and scored in the low 160s. With average studying, 15-20 PTs and using the free advice on this forum and relatively cheap Powerscore bibles, you can absolutely bump that score up to the 170s. FWIW, it took me about 10 before I saw a real jump, which ended up being 8 points overall. If you don't mind, what was your section breakdown?

Potentially getting a lower score does not matter. You do know that only HYS averages scores, right (USNWR only counts the highest score so schools have no incentive to average)? You cannot do worse than your current score for admissions purposes. You can probably do much better.

Honestly, your relative success on the first try should make you more motivated for the next take, not less. I don't think you can appreciate how close you are to having excellent career options. Want to work for the DOJ? That becomes significantly more likely from a T10 school. If it's absolutely impossible for you to fit studying in right now, then consider taking at least a year off while you study. It sounds like you have enough income to support yourself while you study, don't unnecessarily restrict your options by insisting upon going K-JD.


Thank you, it's something to consider.

BigZuck
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Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby BigZuck » Mon Dec 01, 2014 8:55 pm

Lyndsc wrote:
timbs4339 wrote:
Lyndsc wrote:- I have taken the LSAT once and (at the risk of incurring the wrath of TLS) I don't have the time or desire to take it again. My score was lowish 160's, my GPA is 3.84.
I like Stetson, I like the area, I like the focus of the school. Thoughts?


Holy missed opportunities Batman!

Specialty rankings are flame. They are marketing pitches by the school that don't translate into job prospects and are often just packaging up stuff that you can get at any other school and selling it as if it is some special program. If employers really cared that Stetson was ranked #1 in trial advocacy it wouldn't have a 60% employment score with 80% of the grads working in Florida. If being #1 in trial advocacy mattered, firms in LA and NYC would be paying big $$$ to Stetson grads to first chair trials after they get their license. Not happening.

You're giving up a definite improvement in job prospects, geographic flexibility, and money by not taking the test again. You can make time- a few hours a week to study for six months. As for "desire"- it's a standardized test. Nobody who isn't running their own test prep company has the desire to take it multiple times. You do it because each point can be worth thousands of dollars and it's the smart, rational thing to do in an America where higher ed costs are out of control.


I understand what you're saying, but it's just uninformed of you to say I can make time to study, I can't, it's simply not feasible. I work full time in the office, I work as a waitress at night and I go to school full time. The score that I got the first time was a miracle, I literally walked in and took the test after taking only two practice tests that come with your LSAC account, I didn't buy a book, I didn't take a class. I am not about to risk getting a lower score. In theory yes, I should take a year off and study, but I am a K - JD and I am self aware to know that if I took a year off I would likely lose my motivation and never return to school. The fact is not every person has the ability to take the LSAT and come out 170's for whatever reason. Good point on the trial advocacy front, I was just curious about it.


What you say is self-awareness I say is immaturity/impulsiveness/laziness. Potato, po-ta-to I guess

Law school really isn't worth doing unless you're going to do it right. If you do what you say you're going to do then you're definitely doing it wrong IMO.

FloridaLaw
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Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby FloridaLaw » Tue Dec 02, 2014 1:23 pm

Lyndsc wrote:
BigZuck wrote:Gotta answer all these questions if you want help in this forum:

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=206299


In order to receive the best feedback in this forum, please provide as much of the following information in your original post as possible:

-The schools you are considering
-The total Cost of Attendance (COA) of each. COA = cost of tuition + fees + books + cost of living (COL) + accumulated interest - scholarships. Here is a helpful calculator.
-How you will be financing your COA, i.e. loans, family, or savings
-Where you are from and where you want to work, and other places where you have significant ties (if any)
-Your general career goals
-Your LSAT/GPA numbers
-How many times you have taken the LSAT

I was excited to see this thread because I am considering Stetson. I applied mostly as a throw away/safety school, being first in trial advocacy had caught my attention, but I wasn't seriously considering it until I got my scholarship offer and did some more research on the area. I've been waiting for OP to answer these questions, but that doesn't seem to be happening so I will! :D

- I have applied binding early decision to Duke, I have also applied to Tulane, Emory, Richmond (accepted with the promise of significant scholarship money), and Northeastern.
- I'm not sure of total COA. Tuition is around $38,000 and I was offered a $36,000 per year with the stipulation of maintaining 2.25 GPA.
- I have managed to save some money while working through college (just shy of $10,000), but aside from that I will be financing law school entirely in loans.
- I'm from Maine, I have no family ties and no real desire to stay here. I don't particularly care where I live, I'm more of a make the best of it/go with the flow kind of girl as far as that is concerned. I'm excited to move to wherever that may be.
- I plan to go into prosecution.
- I have taken the LSAT once and (at the risk of incurring the wrath of TLS) I don't have the time or desire to take it again. My score was lowish 160's, my GPA is 3.84. I have alright softs, nothing spectacular, I've been working at my County's Distrist Attorney's office since I was 19, I started as an unpaid intern (while working two other jobs and being a full time student) and in just shy of two years I have worked my way up to Victim Witness Advocate, which here is pretty much as high as you can go without being an ADA, I was raised by my Dad (drug addict) and lived in and out of foster homes, and some boring honors. Non-URM.

I like Stetson, I like the area, I like the focus of the school. Thoughts?

What is the order of your choice between Emory, Richmond and Stetson?

FloridaLaw
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Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby FloridaLaw » Tue Dec 02, 2014 1:28 pm

zatharus wrote:Intangibles matter. If they didn't there would be no point in having discussion forums like this in the first place and everybody could make their school choice purely by the numbers.

I'm out. I've got better things to do than post here.

your feedback is very much appreciated man! Thank you. Not everyone wants to work as a Corporate slave in New York.

BigZuck
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Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby BigZuck » Tue Dec 02, 2014 1:54 pm

FloridaLaw wrote:
zatharus wrote:Intangibles matter. If they didn't there would be no point in having discussion forums like this in the first place and everybody could make their school choice purely by the numbers.

I'm out. I've got better things to do than post here.

your feedback is very much appreciated man! Thank you. Not everyone wants to work as a Corporate slave in New York.


"I don't want to work in New York city with their fancy big laws. I just wanna cop a 100k medium laws job and live in a modest house on the beach"
-Every Stetson 1L that has ever lived

FloridaLaw
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Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby FloridaLaw » Tue Dec 02, 2014 2:51 pm

BigZuck wrote:
FloridaLaw wrote:
zatharus wrote:Intangibles matter. If they didn't there would be no point in having discussion forums like this in the first place and everybody could make their school choice purely by the numbers.

I'm out. I've got better things to do than post here.

your feedback is very much appreciated man! Thank you. Not everyone wants to work as a Corporate slave in New York.


"I don't want to work in New York city with their fancy big laws. I just wanna cop a 100k medium laws job and live in a modest house on the beach"
-Every Stetson 1L that has ever lived

Stetson has the highest bar passage rate in Florida. Is that a factor to consider in your opinion?

BigZuck
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Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby BigZuck » Tue Dec 02, 2014 3:01 pm

FloridaLaw wrote:
BigZuck wrote:
FloridaLaw wrote:
zatharus wrote:Intangibles matter. If they didn't there would be no point in having discussion forums like this in the first place and everybody could make their school choice purely by the numbers.

I'm out. I've got better things to do than post here.

your feedback is very much appreciated man! Thank you. Not everyone wants to work as a Corporate slave in New York.


"I don't want to work in New York city with their fancy big laws. I just wanna cop a 100k medium laws job and live in a modest house on the beach"
-Every Stetson 1L that has ever lived

Stetson has the highest bar passage rate in Florida. Is that a factor to consider in your opinion?


Not at all. Bar passage rate only really matters if it's abnormally low.

If you want help, answer these questions: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=206299

FloridaLaw
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Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby FloridaLaw » Tue Dec 02, 2014 3:06 pm

]
I want help ONLY from people who either go to Stetson or any of the other Florida law schools. Not interested in your general stuff that you keep repeating in every thread.
Last edited by FloridaLaw on Tue Dec 02, 2014 3:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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hoos89
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Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby hoos89 » Tue Dec 02, 2014 3:07 pm

Dirigo wrote:
FloridaLaw wrote:
sublime wrote:Do you want to work in Tampa/Orlando?

Are you from Tampa/Orlando?

Can you go for near free?

What are your goals?

I want to work in Tampa, and got good money from Stetson.

You didn't answer the goals question or where you're from, but also please quantify "good money."


Also, are there any stipulations? Some law schools get really tricky with those and will, for instance, set a 3.0 stipulation to maintain the scholarship, when the mean is 2.5.


FloridaLaw wrote:
zatharus wrote:Intangibles matter. If they didn't there would be no point in having discussion forums like this in the first place and everybody could make their school choice purely by the numbers.

I'm out. I've got better things to do than post here.

your feedback is very much appreciated man! Thank you. Not everyone wants to work as a Corporate slave in New York.


While this is certainly true, you SHOULD be interested in being gainfully employed as an attorney if you go to law school. That is far from guaranteed. Also, you should know going in that your "good" outcome is probably going to come with a salary in the range of $40-$50k (on top of however much debt you incur).
Last edited by hoos89 on Tue Dec 02, 2014 3:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

timbs4339
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Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby timbs4339 » Tue Dec 02, 2014 3:08 pm

FloridaLaw wrote:
BigZuck wrote:
FloridaLaw wrote:
zatharus wrote:Intangibles matter. If they didn't there would be no point in having discussion forums like this in the first place and everybody could make their school choice purely by the numbers.

I'm out. I've got better things to do than post here.

your feedback is very much appreciated man! Thank you. Not everyone wants to work as a Corporate slave in New York.


"I don't want to work in New York city with their fancy big laws. I just wanna cop a 100k medium laws job and live in a modest house on the beach"
-Every Stetson 1L that has ever lived

Stetson has the highest bar passage rate in Florida. Is that a factor to consider in your opinion?


Well the cherries won't pick themselves I guess. JD Advantage right?

FloridaLaw
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Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby FloridaLaw » Tue Dec 02, 2014 3:10 pm

Did they teach you that at your T6 school?

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Rigo
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Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby Rigo » Tue Dec 02, 2014 3:16 pm

FloridaLaw wrote:I want help ONLY from people who either go to Stetson or any of the other Florida law schools. Not interested in your general stuff that you keep repeating in every thread.

1L is generally the same at all schools. The people in this thread are simply acting as a flashing yellow light, as they should. Objective data should factor more into your decision than subjective anecdotes.
But if you insist, go on Facebook to the Class of 2016 group page and message several random people about their experiences.

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baal hadad
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Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby baal hadad » Tue Dec 02, 2014 3:18 pm

FloridaLaw wrote:]
I want help ONLY from people who either go to Stetson or any of the other Florida law schools. Not interested in your general stuff that you keep repeating in every thread.

Go read my advice I'm an actual lawyer in fl

FloridaLaw
Posts: 36
Joined: Wed Nov 26, 2014 5:53 pm

Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby FloridaLaw » Tue Dec 02, 2014 3:19 pm

baal hadad wrote:
FloridaLaw wrote:]
I want help ONLY from people who either go to Stetson or any of the other Florida law schools. Not interested in your general stuff that you keep repeating in every thread.

Go read my advice I'm an actual lawyer in fl

Where did u go to school?

User avatar
baal hadad
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Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby baal hadad » Tue Dec 02, 2014 3:21 pm

FloridaLaw wrote:
baal hadad wrote:
FloridaLaw wrote:]
I want help ONLY from people who either go to Stetson or any of the other Florida law schools. Not interested in your general stuff that you keep repeating in every thread.

Go read my advice I'm an actual lawyer in fl

Where did u go to school?

Out-of-state at a much "better" school than Stetson, because if you want certain jobs in Florida, Stetson will not get you there
Last edited by baal hadad on Tue Dec 02, 2014 3:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

FloridaLaw
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Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby FloridaLaw » Tue Dec 02, 2014 3:21 pm

Dirigo wrote:
FloridaLaw wrote:I want help ONLY from people who either go to Stetson or any of the other Florida law schools. Not interested in your general stuff that you keep repeating in every thread.

1L is generally the same at all schools. The people in this thread are simply acting as a flashing yellow light, as they should. Objective data should factor more into your decision than subjective anecdotes.
But if you insist, go on Facebook to the Class of 2016 group page and message several random people about their experiences.

Why are you in this thread??

timbs4339
Posts: 2733
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2011 12:19 pm

Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby timbs4339 » Tue Dec 02, 2014 3:23 pm

FloridaLaw wrote:Did they teach you that at your T6 school?


Nah it was "Corporate slave" 101.

But go on being happy that you have an extra 1.5% chance of getting the opportunity to pay a few hundred dollars for bar fees and CLE's per year.

FloridaLaw
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Re: Stetson University College of Law

Postby FloridaLaw » Tue Dec 02, 2014 3:24 pm

baal hadad wrote:
FloridaLaw wrote:
baal hadad wrote:
FloridaLaw wrote:]
I want help ONLY from people who either go to Stetson or any of the other Florida law schools. Not interested in your general stuff that you keep repeating in every thread.

Go read my advice I'm an actual lawyer in fl

Where did u go to school?

Out-of-state at a much better school than Stetson, because if you want certain jobs in Florida, Stetson will not get you there

Are you ashamed to say its name?




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