Yell at me and tell me to pick UVA (Dillard) over H (off WL) Forum

[jd20132013]

Well if they only think you got into your school because you're a URM they'll probably just think you only got into HLS because you're a URM too.

creates more cognitive dissonance for them though

[Mack.Hambleton]

i like this thread

edit: not wanting biglaw, I think a case could be made if you're going the LRAP route

[jkpolk]

You'd fit in better at Harvard

[ph14]

You'd fit in better at Harvard

Let's avoid posts like this and stick to constructive and helpful comments for the OP.

[redsox]

UVA is obviously a PC answer.

But you live only once. I'd take Harvard.

YOLO! So spend the entire time in debt!

[Mack.Hambleton]

UVA is obviously a PC answer.

But you live only once. I'd take Harvard.

YOLO! So spend the entire time in debt!

isnt that what u did

[NYSprague]

i like this thread

edit: not wanting biglaw, I think a case could be made if you're going the LRAP route

Are you serious?
There is no case here for going to Harvard at sticker other than 0L love for the Harvard name.

[redsox]

UVA is obviously a PC answer.

But you live only once. I'd take Harvard.

YOLO! So spend the entire time in debt!

isnt that what u did

I took HYS sticker over a T14 full ride, yeah. But I'm paying for a lot of it by burning savings I wouldn't otherwise touch until I'm 59 and a half. That won't bother me for a while, and the debt will be gone after 2 years. Not saying what I did is brilliant either, but there's no way I would have done it if it was gonna mean $300k in loans.

[cotiger]

So I see that TLS hasn't rid the world of 0L bigdumb yet

[ph14]

So I see that TLS hasn't rid the world of 0L bigdumb yet

Don't attack the OP for asking a legitimate question in the on-topic forums. It's not an easy decision, especially once you are in that position.

[Kronk]

Not big dumb. I honestly think he would be fine either way. Either that or I need the article where HLS graduate aren't getting jobs within 9 months. UVa has some unemployed or school employed graduates, but the cost is low enough that the risk doesn't matter so much.

[cotiger]

My favorite part of the 300k sticker calculation is how it doesn't even begin to tell you how fucked you are. At the end of your ten year repayment plan, you've paid like $435,000. That is, of course, assuming that you found a job that will continue to allow you to pay $43,500 per year after your 3 year big law stint is over.

Oh, and if you want to clerk after graduation, you better add a whole bundle of interest that's accumulating while you make minimal payments.

Yeah, totally worth it.

[cotiger]

So I see that TLS hasn't rid the world of 0L bigdumb yet

Don't attack the OP for asking a legitimate question in the on-topic forums. It's not an easy decision, especially once you are in that position.

I dunno, IMO it's a pretty simple decision unless you've got prestige blinders on. And if you've got that, why even ask? Just go to Harvard.

[Lincoln]

I bet not a single actual lawyer picked HLS.

Speaking as someone paying off less than what you would, go with the money. Your entire working and private life after graduation will be totally different.

[ph14]

So I see that TLS hasn't rid the world of 0L bigdumb yet

Don't attack the OP for asking a legitimate question in the on-topic forums. It's not an easy decision, especially once you are in that position.

I dunno, IMO it's a pretty simple decision unless you've got prestige blinders on. And if you've got that, why even ask? Just go to Harvard.

1. It may not be a simple decision when you are in OP's situation. Assuming that people are voting legitimately, there are a decent amount of votes for the Harvard option. Plus, OP presumably just got off a waitlist and has to make a decision in a short amount of time.
2. Even if it were a really simple decision, TLS on-topic forums are exactly the place to confirm that you are making the right decision.

[ymmv]

So I see that TLS hasn't rid the world of 0L bigdumb yet

Don't attack the OP for asking a legitimate question in the on-topic forums. It's not an easy decision, especially once you are in that position.

I dunno, IMO it's a pretty simple decision unless you've got prestige blinders on. And if you've got that, why even ask? Just go to Harvard.

1. It may not be a simple decision when you are in OP's situation. Assuming that people are voting legitimately, there are a decent amount of votes for the Harvard option. Plus, OP presumably just got off a waitlist and has to make a decision in a short amount of time.
2. Even if it were a really simple decision, TLS on-topic forums are exactly the place to confirm that you are making the right decision.

Who gives a shit what people are voting. I mean have you seen the 0L populace of this forum?

[jd20132013]

if he's serious about PI why is Harvard so bad if he can do their Loan Repayment?

this is a serious question

[ymmv]

if he's serious about PI why is Harvard so bad if he can do their Loan Repayment?

this is a serious question

Because lots of PI jobs don't qualify and because you're effectively selling yourself into 10 years of bondage if it turns out you hate your qualifying PI gig after all. It's a potentially horrible situation that many have cited as one of their biggest regrets in life.

Also, the jobs are hard to get in the first place, even out of Harvard. Sure, HLS practically guarantees you employment but it's not necessarily good employment, especially if you fail to hustle. PI is tough even at the top.

[NYSprague]

if he's serious about PI why is Harvard so bad if he can do their Loan Repayment?

this is a serious question

Because it's much better to not owe the money at all. Because he will be constrained in his job choice for 10 years. Because he will have to worry about the debt and interest accumulating and his debt mounting because payments don't cover interest. Because what if he loses his job. Because what if he changes his mind and goes for biglaw. Because Harvard LRAP counts spousal income, so problem for OP if he gets married. Because he can now do other things with that money instead of loan repayment.

Because it's stupid to pay $300,000 for something you can get for $50,000.

[cotiger]

So I see that TLS hasn't rid the world of 0L bigdumb yet

Don't attack the OP for asking a legitimate question in the on-topic forums. It's not an easy decision, especially once you are in that position.

I dunno, IMO it's a pretty simple decision unless you've got prestige blinders on. And if you've got that, why even ask? Just go to Harvard.

1. It may not be a simple decision when you are in OP's situation. Assuming that people are voting legitimately, there are a decent amount of votes for the Harvard option. Plus, OP presumably just got off a waitlist and has to make a decision in a short amount of time.
2. Even if it were a really simple decision, TLS on-topic forums are exactly the place to confirm that you are making the right decision.

Been in this situation, and I had a decent amount of savings/parental that I wouldn't be taking out near 300k. Such a easy decision that it's difficult for me to believe that anyone really debating this is approaching it rationally.

As for the second part, you're right. I was a bit harsh. I just thought that the battle of full ride over sticker had been won months ago.

[cotiger]

if he's serious about PI why is Harvard so bad if he can do their Loan Repayment?

this is a serious question

Because it's much better to not owe the money at all. Because he will be constrained in his job choice for 10 years. Because he will have to worry about the debt and interest accumulating and his debt mounting because payments don't cover interest. Because what if he loses his job. Because what if he changes his mind and goes for biglaw. Because Harvard LRAP counts spousal income, so problem for OP if he gets married. Because he can now do other things with that money instead of loan repayment.

Because it's stupid to pay $300,000 for something you can get for $50,000.

Also keep in mind that less than 12% of Harvard grads last year actually ended up doing PI. Lotta people talk about doing it. Few follow through.

[ymmv]

If it helps, OP, I turned it down for substantially less than a full ride - still going to have ~$100k debt from UG and LS COA - and I don't regret that particular decision for a second. I already get anxious about what will effectively be $150k or more by the time I repay it; if I had $400k+ hanging over my head I would probably wake up in a cold sweat every night, fancy degree be damned.

No amount of prestige is worth that much loss of freedom and sound sleep. Be wise.

[cotiger]

So many people hate being a lawyer that the ability to just not give a fuck and do something different is invaluable.

The extra $375,000 is also nice if you end up liking being a lawyer.

[rpupkin]

So many people hate being a lawyer that the ability to just not give a fuck and do something different is invaluable.

The extra $375,000 is also nice if you end up liking being a lawyer.

Where is this extra $375K coming from? For the OP, isn't the difference between HLS and UVA the cost of tuition? That's a lot--it's about $160K--but it's not as much as is being hinted at ITT.

OP: The smarter choice is UVA. No one seems to realize how much debt sucks until they actually have to live with it. Having said that, HLS will give you a shot at some things (in PI and elsewhere) that UVA likely won't. I don't think it's $160K worth of difference, but it is a real difference.

[cotiger]

So many people hate being a lawyer that the ability to just not give a fuck and do something different is invaluable.

The extra $375,000 is also nice if you end up liking being a lawyer.

Where is this extra $375K coming from? For the OP, isn't the difference between HLS and UVA the cost of tuition? That's a lot--it's about $160K--but it's not as much as is being hinted at ITT.

OP: The smarter choice is UVA. No one seems to realize how much debt sucks until they actually have to live with it. Having said that, HLS will give you a shot at some things (in PI and elsewhere) that UVA likely won't. I don't think it's $160K worth of difference, but it is a real difference.

OP said 300k vs 50k at graduation. That's like 435k over 10 years vs 60k. Thus, a 375k difference. Interest actually accrues more quickly after you graduate, so you can't stop your cost analysis there.

Cost of tuition plus increases plus COL differences plus interest on all that is how you get to a 250k difference at graduation. 50k COL over three years at UVA is too low, but there's still a massive cost difference between the two.