NORTHWESTERN AT STICKER OR WUSTL-UMN AT 66,000????? Forum

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bugsy33

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Re: NORTHWESTERN AT STICKER OR WUSTL-UMN AT 66,000?????

Post by bugsy33 » Fri Jun 27, 2014 11:10 pm

sublime wrote:
bugsy33 wrote:[ but OP's options are better than 90% of people entering law school this fall.

Feel free to spot the flaw.
Sure, I get it, and I agree that just because everyone is choosing something worse doesn't make your choice "good," it only makes it "better."

Do you understand that saying "90+% of the people entering law school this fall shouldn't be going" is the practical definition of elitism? I'm not saying you are wrong in your assertion; I'm only claiming that this is the elitism that makes it difficult to take TLS advice seriously.


When you have posters telling people that going to WUSTL for free "might" be a good idea, it just sounds whack to 99% of regular-joe law students. Then again, ya'll don't give a sh*t, because regular -joe law students shouldn't be going to law school amirite?

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Re: NORTHWESTERN AT STICKER OR WUSTL-UMN AT 66,000?????

Post by sublime » Fri Jun 27, 2014 11:12 pm

..

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DoveBodyWash

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Re: NORTHWESTERN AT STICKER OR WUSTL-UMN AT 66,000?????

Post by DoveBodyWash » Fri Jun 27, 2014 11:14 pm

bugsy33 wrote:
sublime wrote:
bugsy33 wrote:[ but OP's options are better than 90% of people entering law school this fall.

Feel free to spot the flaw.
Sure, I get it, and I agree that just because everyone is choosing something worse doesn't make your choice "good," it only makes it "better."

Do you understand that saying "90+% of the people entering law school this fall shouldn't be going" is the practical definition of elitism? I'm not saying you are wrong in your assertion; I'm only claiming that this is the elitism that makes it difficult to take TLS advice seriously.


When you have posters telling people that going to WUSTL for free "might" be a good idea, it just sounds whack to 99% of regular-joe law students. Then again, ya'll don't give a sh*t, because regular -joe law students shouldn't be going to law school amirite?
The reason why i think most of them shouldn't be going to law school isn't because they're not good enough or deserving to be lawyers or something. It's because the market is just absolute shit right now. I'm not making any kind of judgment on them as people or potentially good lawyers or something. But what good is all that dreaming/potential if u never get to be a real lawyer? Or at least the type of lawyer that they dreamed of being?

I don't think i'm being elitist by saying that "X decision is unlikely to achieve Y goal"

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bugsy33

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Re: NORTHWESTERN AT STICKER OR WUSTL-UMN AT 66,000?????

Post by bugsy33 » Fri Jun 27, 2014 11:51 pm

cusenation wrote:
bugsy33 wrote:
sublime wrote:
bugsy33 wrote:[ but OP's options are better than 90% of people entering law school this fall.

Feel free to spot the flaw.
Sure, I get it, and I agree that just because everyone is choosing something worse doesn't make your choice "good," it only makes it "better."

Do you understand that saying "90+% of the people entering law school this fall shouldn't be going" is the practical definition of elitism? I'm not saying you are wrong in your assertion; I'm only claiming that this is the elitism that makes it difficult to take TLS advice seriously.


When you have posters telling people that going to WUSTL for free "might" be a good idea, it just sounds whack to 99% of regular-joe law students. Then again, ya'll don't give a sh*t, because regular -joe law students shouldn't be going to law school amirite?
The reason why i think most of them shouldn't be going to law school isn't because they're not good enough or deserving to be lawyers or something. It's because the market is just absolute shit right now. I'm not making any kind of judgment on them as people or potentially good lawyers or something. But what good is all that dreaming/potential if u never get to be a real lawyer? Or at least the type of lawyer that they dreamed of being?

I don't think i'm being elitist by saying that "X decision is unlikely to achieve Y goal"

Right, but here's the thing. We all play this game on TLS where we pretend to know that the market will still be shit in three years. We HAVE to tell people that the market will be shit in three years, otherwise people might start believe that law school is a good idea. The only way law grads can find consistent, quality work is if law schools stop overproducing JDs. This has pretty much already happened. People graduating in 2017 will be graduating in one of the smallest classes since the 1970s. This could very well be an excellent time to enroll in law school, however we cannot let people know that, lest more people enroll in law school and ruin any progress towards a balanced legal market.

We can't possibly know what the market will be like in three years, but all signs point to it being a hell of a lot better than last year based on a reduction in graduates alone.

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chuckbass

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Re: NORTHWESTERN AT STICKER OR WUSTL-UMN AT 66,000?????

Post by chuckbass » Sat Jun 28, 2014 12:01 am

bugsy33 wrote:NW at sticker is probably going to be a bad decision. UMN and WUSTL have similar profiles, but WUSTL has a more national reputation.

WUSTL: Beautiful campus, gorgeous law building, prestigious name.

Minny: B1G School, better social life, more stuff to do, however the law building is meh and the winters are brutal

Most people here will tell you that either school is too expensive at 66k, but that's really up to you. After you factor in COL and interest, your loan payments will be about $16-1700/month for ten years.

If it were me I'd choose WUSTL because I already had the Big Ten experience. However if I went to a smaller school for UG I'd probably choose Minnesota.

How much scholarship $$ did UIUC, ND, and Iowa give you? Those schools are all on par with WUSTL and UMN. I know lots of people had huge $$$$ to UIUC this year.
This is wrong, at least for WUSTL vs. MN. If you only look at these two, unless you want to live in Minnesota after law school, choose WUSTL. WUSTL has superior placement and at equal cost should be a no brainer (if you're sticking with these options).

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bugsy33

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Re: NORTHWESTERN AT STICKER OR WUSTL-UMN AT 66,000?????

Post by bugsy33 » Sat Jun 28, 2014 12:07 am

scottidsntknow wrote: This is wrong, at least for WUSTL vs. MN. If you only look at these two, unless you want to live in Minnesota after law school, choose WUSTL. WUSTL has superior placement and at equal cost should be a no brainer (if you're sticking with these options).
I agree. WUSTL unless OP wants to practice in MN. Or retake for $$ at NU.

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Re: NORTHWESTERN AT STICKER OR WUSTL-UMN AT 66,000?????

Post by 03152016 » Sat Jun 28, 2014 12:27 am

bugsy33 wrote:Right, but here's the thing. We all play this game on TLS where we pretend to know that the market will still be shit in three years. We HAVE to tell people that the market will be shit in three years, otherwise people might start believe that law school is a good idea. The only way law grads can find consistent, quality work is if law schools stop overproducing JDs. This has pretty much already happened. People graduating in 2017 will be graduating in one of the smallest classes since the 1970s. This could very well be an excellent time to enroll in law school, however we cannot let people know that, lest more people enroll in law school and ruin any progress towards a balanced legal market.
the looming problem for incoming 1Ls isn't necessarily unemployment (though certain schools will always have mediocre employment numbers) but rising costs
Campos: Everybody knows in a vague way that the price of higher education has been outstripping inflation for a long time, but when you focus on actual numbers it's utterly astounding. In inflation-adjusted 2012 dollars, Harvard Law School in the 1950s cost $5,000 per year in tuition. By 1970, it was about $12,500 a year. By 1980, it was $16,000. By 1990, it was $27,000. By 2000, it was $35,000, and [in 2012 it was] $53,000. And Harvard Law School is completely typical because law schools, especially elite law schools, all tend to charge the same tuition. So Harvard Law School costs 10 times more in real dollars than it did 50 years ago.
with debt figures skyrocketing, an awful lot of people on the wrong end of that bimodal salary distribution are in for a rough go
even with paye/ibr

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Re: NORTHWESTERN AT STICKER OR WUSTL-UMN AT 66,000?????

Post by 03152016 » Sat Jun 28, 2014 12:29 am

re-read those numbers if they didn't sink in
those are inflation adjusted
jesus

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Kikero

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Re: NORTHWESTERN AT STICKER OR WUSTL-UMN AT 66,000?????

Post by Kikero » Sat Jun 28, 2014 12:40 am

I wouldn't go any of these routes (this coming from an NU student with a generally good experience). But if I had to, I would do NU at sticker over WUSTL or UMN.

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Re: NORTHWESTERN AT STICKER OR WUSTL-UMN AT 66,000?????

Post by BigZuck » Sat Jun 28, 2014 12:42 am

I'd say probably at least 90% of people who go to law school now probably shouldn't either because the placement of the school they chose isn't good enough to get them the job they want/need or they will be in too much debt or (more than likely) some combination of the two.

How is that elitism?

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