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rad lulz wrote:Chances of ANY job from Cardozo aren't good so I'd probs pass on that
Why not? It seems like you have a job that can hold you over another year.C0NFUSED0L wrote:Timb: I don't plan on re-taking.
I understand your trepidation. In fact, I ended up not doing a retake when I should have. It worked out for me because I am a special snowflake (read: IP background), but for the vast majority it won't. Retaking the LSAT and sitting tight for a year could literally be the difference in getting the job of your dreams and having no job at all. Think about that. For more information, see, e.g., The Vale of Tears. You think it won't happen to you, but more than 4 out of every 10 grads from Cardozo last year is not a lawyer right now. Meanwhile at NYU, less than 1 in 10 are in the same boat. You have the GPA and the LSAT is within reach. Not everyone can say that.C0NFUSED0L wrote:I know... i don't think I'm in an ideal situation, but honestly, if I had a gun to my head right now, I'm a 1L in Cardozo on a full ride, against the odds.
I probably should have taken the LSAT slightly more seriously, but at this point, I don't see when I would retake because I definitely want to be in law school in August...can't set my life back a year, with an SO who wants to get engaged in a year + .
Any thoughts on negotiating with Fordham to move up within the NYC rankings a little bit?
Again, appreciate the thoughts.
My legal career began way before I set foot in law school. In retrospect, where I am now had a lot to do with deciding to study like mad for the LSAT get a good score and get into a school where there was a lot more wiggle room to be mediocre (and even I had problems getting a job from a T6- people I know who graduated from Cardozo my year are much less fortunate). Again, you really have to think of it not as setting your life back, but moving it forward by seriously increasing your options. Want to clerk for a district court judge? Have a shot at working for the federal government? Work for a litigation boutique?C0NFUSED0L wrote:I know... i don't think I'm in an ideal situation, but honestly, if I had a gun to my head right now, I'm a 1L in Cardozo on a full ride, against the odds.
I probably should have taken the LSAT slightly more seriously, but at this point, I don't see when I would retake because I definitely want to be in law school in August...can't set my life back a year, with an SO who wants to get engaged in a year + .
Any thoughts on negotiating with Fordham to move up within the NYC rankings a little bit?
Again, appreciate the thoughts.
1) I work with a guy who is 40 years old, graduated my year, and went to law school after being hugely successful in an entirely different field. I knew half a dozen classmates in their 30s, also with prior careers. I think the mean age was something like 25 or 26. 24 is actually the perfect age IMO (I was 21 when I started- far too young). You're also in an advantage in that you're doing something legally related, and you seem to be in NYC already, which takes out the "I'd rather go to law school in NYC than move back with my parents in nowheresville and study" post-college malaise.C0NFUSED0L wrote:one of these posts I will figure out how to quote, haha.
While on a black/white scale it seems obvious to retake, I wish I had known that in September or even December. At this point, though, I am resigned to going to school this fall. I just can't push off going to school for a year, as I will be almost 24 when I start.
Consdering I would be in on a full scholarship though, doesn't that seem to set me up for success and make me way more likely to be one of the 2/10 grads getting good job or 6/10 getting any job? (less pressure due to no stips/no debt, and good #'s compared to classmates)
Additionally, due to the fact that I would have 'minimal debt' (i'd venture to say 20-25k TOTAL if i went to dozo), wouldn't I have a lot of options within and outside of the law world? I am confident in my intellect and abilities, but the real kicker for me is that I would be in as much debt as the average undergrad, yet with a JD.
I know this wouldn't compare with a 173 > Harvard > world is my oyster, but considering my situation (S.O., family/friends in NYC area, strong desire to attend in fall '14) is it really THAT bad?
C0NFUSED0L wrote:one of these posts I will figure out how to quote, haha.
While on a black/white scale it seems obvious to retake, I wish I had known that in September or even December. At this point, though, I am resigned to going to school this fall. I just can't push off going to school for a year, as I will be almost 24 when I start.
Consdering I would be in on a full scholarship though, doesn't that seem to set me up for success and make me way more likely to be one of the 2/10 grads getting good job or 6/10 getting any job? (less pressure due to no stips/no debt, and good #'s compared to classmates)
Additionally, due to the fact that I would have 'minimal debt' (i'd venture to say 20-25k TOTAL if i went to dozo), wouldn't I have a lot of options within and outside of the law world? I am confident in my intellect and abilities, but the real kicker for me is that I would be in as much debt as the average undergrad, yet with a JD.
I know this wouldn't compare with a 173 > Harvard > world is my oyster, but considering my situation (S.O., family/friends in NYC area, strong desire to attend in fall '14) is it really THAT bad?
Gun to my head, I'd choose Cardozo, just because if you mess up it's not going to be the end of the world debt-wise.C0NFUSED0L wrote:What I'm basically getting at, is that I think you guys are right, but in terms of what i AM working with, it looks like Cardozo/Fordham/awaiting good news from a T14.
I'm in a somewhat similar boat. Decided waiting to retake would be worth it.C0NFUSED0L wrote:one of these posts I will figure out how to quote, haha.
While on a black/white scale it seems obvious to retake, I wish I had known that in September or even December. At this point, though, I am resigned to going to school this fall. I just can't push off going to school for a year, as I will be almost 24 when I start.
Consdering I would be in on a full scholarship though, doesn't that seem to set me up for success and make me way more likely to be one of the 2/10 grads getting good job or 6/10 getting any job? (less pressure due to no stips/no debt, and good #'s compared to classmates)
Additionally, due to the fact that I would have 'minimal debt' (i'd venture to say 20-25k TOTAL if i went to dozo), wouldn't I have a lot of options within and outside of the law world? I am confident in my intellect and abilities, but the real kicker for me is that I would be in as much debt as the average undergrad, yet with a JD.
I know this wouldn't compare with a 173 > Harvard > world is my oyster, but considering my situation (S.O., family/friends in NYC area, strong desire to attend in fall '14) is it really THAT bad?
Yes. Thats is a very unreasonable mindset. SorryC0NFUSED0L wrote:Great points all.
Is it unreasonable to go into Cardozo with the mindset of:
"I am highly confident that I can finish in the top 20 percent, while being aware that everyone thinks this way.
But if I don't, my life isn't over debt-wise, and I hope to get lucky (by means of a connection/current employer/find a different job that i have the freedom to take due to minor financial constraints)"
as opposed to re-taking, getting a 168, and being in a similar position next year with maybe slightly different offers but an equally difficult decision.
my current job is low-paying. it's not enough to live on in NYC. i'm out of my parents house regardless after this year, and I don't know if the rent will be taken care of if I'm not in school...i know it's hard to go case-by-case like this...
C0NFUSED0L wrote:my current job is low-paying. it's not enough to live on in NYC. i'm out of my parents house regardless after this year, and I don't know if the rent will be taken care of if I'm not in school...i know it's hard to go case-by-case like this...
Yeah that's a terrible reason to make a life changing decision.Bikeflip wrote:C0NFUSED0L wrote:my current job is low-paying. it's not enough to live on in NYC. i'm out of my parents house regardless after this year, and I don't know if the rent will be taken care of if I'm not in school...i know it's hard to go case-by-case like this...
That's how people make bad choices, they feel they must make the choice. Also, "I must go to one those schools" is a false choice. So let me give you another false choice: Your life may suck for a year while you sit out and retake, but it beats being an unemployed 3L/post grad and looking at your loan balance. Read this thread to see what can (and most likely will) happen if you don't have a job lined up by the end of 2L.
You are statistically unlikely to be much above median, and no amount of hard work can guarantee you anything. It may be hard to conceptualizer that, but this is not a case where effort is rewarded by success. You are curved against your classmates. Some people just get it and some just don't, and there's no way of knowing which you are until it is too late. I might also add that grades give you a shot at a job, they don't guarantee one.C0NFUSED0L wrote:Great points all.
Is it unreasonable to go into Cardozo with the mindset of:
"I am highly confident that I can finish in the top 20 percent, while being aware that everyone thinks this way.
But if I don't, my life isn't over debt-wise, and I hope to get lucky (by means of a connection/current employer/find a different job that i have the freedom to take due to minor financial constraints)"
as opposed to re-taking, getting a 168, and being in a similar position next year with maybe slightly different offers but an equally difficult decision.
my current job is low-paying. it's not enough to live on in NYC. i'm out of my parents house regardless after this year, and I don't know if the rent will be taken care of if I'm not in school...i know it's hard to go case-by-case like this...
Look, if your parents are willing to subsidize you for law school, then they can subsidize you living out of the house (or you can just live with them). Explain that another year might yield much better results, you're not going to be sitting around doing nothing, and worst-case scenario you end up in the exact same boat.C0NFUSED0L wrote:Great points all.
Is it unreasonable to go into Cardozo with the mindset of:
"I am highly confident that I can finish in the top 20 percent, while being aware that everyone thinks this way.
But if I don't, my life isn't over debt-wise, and I hope to get lucky (by means of a connection/current employer/find a different job that i have the freedom to take due to minor financial constraints)"
as opposed to re-taking, getting a 168, and being in a similar position next year with maybe slightly different offers but an equally difficult decision.
my current job is low-paying. it's not enough to live on in NYC. i'm out of my parents house regardless after this year, and I don't know if the rent will be taken care of if I'm not in school...i know it's hard to go case-by-case like this...
Hell, go play hockey while teaching English in Korea. Not wanting to stand up to your parents is a terrible reason to do anything, let alone law school.worldtraveler wrote:Yeah that's a terrible reason to make a life changing decision.Bikeflip wrote:C0NFUSED0L wrote:my current job is low-paying. it's not enough to live on in NYC. i'm out of my parents house regardless after this year, and I don't know if the rent will be taken care of if I'm not in school...i know it's hard to go case-by-case like this...
That's how people make bad choices, they feel they must make the choice. Also, "I must go to one those schools" is a false choice. So let me give you another false choice: Your life may suck for a year while you sit out and retake, but it beats being an unemployed 3L/post grad and looking at your loan balance. Read this thread to see what can (and most likely will) happen if you don't have a job lined up by the end of 2L.
go teach English in Korea or something if you're really that desperate. It's one year of your life vs. the rest of it.
anneshirley wrote:Goal: Biglaw in Chicago
Regional Ties: Originally from Chicago and Undergrad in Chicago. Immediate family here. Extended all in Michigan (not sure that even matters)
School(s): Accepted to: University of Michigan and Northwestern (no scholarhip info yet) University of Illinois (-75k over 3 years in scholarship), Chicago-Kent (full ride scholarship), Washington University (-105k over 3 years in scholarship).
Other Info: Will be graduating undergrad debt free.
Bikeflip wrote:anneshirley wrote:Goal: Biglaw in Chicago
Regional Ties: Originally from Chicago and Undergrad in Chicago. Immediate family here. Extended all in Michigan (not sure that even matters)
School(s): Accepted to: University of Michigan and Northwestern (no scholarhip info yet) University of Illinois (-75k over 3 years in scholarship), Chicago-Kent (full ride scholarship), Washington University (-105k over 3 years in scholarship).
Other Info: Will be graduating undergrad debt free.
Forget Kent. I've heard UMich isn't placing grads into Chicago like they were, but a chunk of that could be self selection. Have you tried to leverage Michigan's offer against Northwestern in an attempt to get Northwestern to give you money?