hashashin wrote:To reiterate: the claim is not that biglaw placement numbers literally EQUAL DCN stats, but that, considering GULC's reputational equivalence and vastly disparate PI/Gov emphasis w.r.t to those schools, GULC's placement POWER is probably roughly equivalent. I don't see this assertion as being all that controversial.
Ok. Let me walk you through it.
Obviously the biglaw/fedclerk number from GULC are below the other T14, but as you said, that doesn't tell the whole story. There are other desirable legal jobs out there. So let's start adding them in.
First, let's assume that every single Gov/PI job is as desirable for the graduate as a biglaw/fedclerk job is. This is unlikely, as there are most likely people who got stuck with a crappy government job instead of the awesome government just they wanted included in those statistics. With biglaw/fedclerk, on the other hand, they are assuredly doing well in the area they chose. However, we'll pretend that's not the case and add them all together regardless. As you have mentioned, GULC has a lot of these jobs. Northwestern has an equally valid case for Business, so it's only fair to include them too.
Next, let's assume that every person working in a SmallLaw firm (1-99 lawyers) wanted to be there. This is HIGHLY unlikely to the point of absurdity, but just for argument let's say it's true. As pointed out earlier, GULC has a lot more of these jobs than other T14.
Next, let's assume that every school-funded job is totally legit and desired. This is unlikely to be the case, as most of these jobs appeared only with the start of the crash, but we'll just go with it. DNC don't really have any school-funded positions, while GULC has a significant number.
The result of this?
Cornell: 94, 76, 85 -> avg: 85
Duke: 85, 82, 85 -> avg: 84
Northwestern: 87, 77, 76 -> avg: 80
Georgetown: 81, 62, 73 -> avg: 72
Notice that GULC is the lowest every single year.
There's one last category that we can add to GULC, though, that raises its scores: JD advantage. Again, it is unlikely (or at least unverifiable) that every single one of these jobs was a sought-after position like biglaw/fedclerk are, but for the sake of argument let's say they were.
Duke: 87, 87 -> avg: 87
Northwestern: 85, 85 -> avg: 85
Cornell: 76, 85 -> avg: 81
Georgetown: 72, 85 -> avg: 79
The BEST that can be said for GULC is that if we calculate everything using assumptions (some of which are frankly absurd) that are absolutely most favorable to GULC, they STILL come in last. Even if we ignore the one of the years because it's "unfair," the BEST that GULC can say is that it's tied. If, on the other hand, those people who are in 2-10 person law firms weren't actually gunning for SmallLaw, then GULC loses.
This is in addition to the the significantly higher percentage of unemployed or underemployed students coming out of GULC.
So EVEN IF all of those 2-10 person law firm grads are happy to be there, and therefore GULC has similar positive placement with other schools, GULC is STILL worse because their negative outcomes are so much higher.
So in order to convince me that GULC places as well as these other schools, you need to explain why ALL of these assumptions are totally valid, as well as explain away why GULC grads have such high unemployment.
And I'm not convinced by the class size reduction bit. From the C/O 2013 to the C/O2016 (i.e. change that has yet to be captured by data), GULC has reduced by 8%. DNC? 11%, 15%, and 5%, respectively.
This isn't to say that GULC is a bad school. Just that you need to have very specific goals in order to justify it, because for the majority of students, there will be much better options available.