C/O 2016 Class Profiles

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bouleversement
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby bouleversement » Sun Aug 25, 2013 12:10 pm

NoodleyOne wrote:
bouleversement wrote:
sinfiery wrote:all the "lol @ 0Ls" comments finally make so much sense


Is it more than the fact people don't want to be reminded they aren't going to the school ranked just ahead of them? If so, elaborate.

No... you really just don't care anymore. It's not like me or sinfiery are going to shitty schools or anything. It's probably just you have much more important shit to worry about.


I think USNWR correlates quite well with career outcomes (with Mono's qualifications upthread) and so it is only natural for us to fixate on medians at this stage. We are, for the most part, looking to get into the best school we can. At the same time, I understand why you would no longer care about this topic once you are in a program. You have made your choice, doubtless done the best you could to get in to the best school you could, and now need nothing more than to excel at the school at which you find yourself. It is the primary factor you still have control over. For the vast majority (everyone except transfers), school selection at that point is history.

But that doesn't mean it can't be interesting. The presence here of non-0Ls I suppose proves as much.

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NoodleyOne
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby NoodleyOne » Sun Aug 25, 2013 12:46 pm

bouleversement wrote:
NoodleyOne wrote:
bouleversement wrote:
sinfiery wrote:all the "lol @ 0Ls" comments finally make so much sense


Is it more than the fact people don't want to be reminded they aren't going to the school ranked just ahead of them? If so, elaborate.

No... you really just don't care anymore. It's not like me or sinfiery are going to shitty schools or anything. It's probably just you have much more important shit to worry about.


I think USNWR correlates quite well with career outcomes (with Mono's qualifications upthread) and so it is only natural for us to fixate on medians at this stage. We are, for the most part, looking to get into the best school we can. At the same time, I understand why you would no longer care about this topic once you are in a program. You have made your choice, doubtless done the best you could to get in to the best school you could, and now need nothing more than to excel at the school at which you find yourself. It is the primary factor you still have control over. For the vast majority (everyone except transfers), school selection at that point is history.

But that doesn't mean it can't be interesting. The presence here of non-0Ls I suppose proves as much.

I haven't seen a non-0L say anything substantive, it's just normally a busy topic.

The thing you SHOULD be worried about instead of medians, which contrary to your point doesn't correlate that well at all, is when the ABA releases it's data on employment. This stuff is relevant to admissions, sure, but beyond that, don't stress about what this means for employment.

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DrStudMuffin
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby DrStudMuffin » Sun Aug 25, 2013 1:22 pm

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Last edited by DrStudMuffin on Mon Jan 27, 2014 12:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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sinfiery
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby sinfiery » Sun Aug 25, 2013 5:38 pm

bouleversement wrote:I think USNWR correlates quite well with career outcomes (with Mono's qualifications upthread) and so it is only natural for us to fixate on medians at this stage. We are, for the most part, looking to get into the best school we can. At the same time, I understand why you would no longer care about this topic once you are in a program. You have made your choice, doubtless done the best you could to get in to the best school you could, and now need nothing more than to excel at the school at which you find yourself. It is the primary factor you still have control over. For the vast majority (everyone except transfers), school selection at that point is history.

But that doesn't mean it can't be interesting. The presence here of non-0Ls I suppose proves as much.

It's more that the central idea does still matter to us, ie a decent USNWR rank and to a much more important point, employment statistics as noodely said, but as someone who has done much pontificating at the margins, how much you care about every silly little difference really just falls off a cliff /you just don't think it's worth the time to care about the small distinctions between most of the T14 schools anymore.

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crestor
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby crestor » Sun Aug 25, 2013 8:14 pm

Cicero76 wrote:
AT9 wrote:
Huskies13! wrote:No news on UFla class size--but median is 160, GPA 3.55 (both down).
USC class size is down to 176
UC Davis down to 143
American says 480 (including part-time)
Sand Diego says 245
Tenn is way up--to 158
and Pitt is down to 175.

No news on full profiles for those--just looking at "welcome letters" from deans posted on web.


UF is down to 160 and 3.55? Nice.

Weren't they reducing class sizes too?


UF Law is run in such a TTTT manner it makes me genuinely angry. There is no reason that the best university in the state shouldn't have a top 25 law school like California, New York, or even freaking Alabama do. Unfortunately, UF is run by morons with no idea of how to buy decent scores or increase the quality of students and faculty to make a better school. They don't even advertise or offer fee waivers.

They deserve the asskicking that FSU law is going to give them in the next few years. And this is coming from someone who hates FSU.


Care to elaborate more on this post? Do you really think FSU is going to leapfrog them in the rankings whereas even this last year on LST FSU had 9% more of their graduates employed than UF. Even on these forums which is a very small and self-selecting sample I see alot of FSU/UF threads and eventually the OP says "I chose FSU, got a better feel at the school and the FSU students seemed to be a much more open-minded bunch than UF." It seems that UF has this haughty notion that they are T14 material and the be all end all in Florida which is simply not true. I mean Gainesville really is in the middle of fucking nowhere. FSU is in the capitol and at the end of the day that is a big PLUS.

It's a pretty interesting debate too because the schools right now are 46 and 48 on USNWR. But it seems that UF's policy of averaging LSAT scores just HURTS. I did not know that UF refuses to offer fee waivers. That is stupid. I have been reading various forums and people have been predicting that soon enough FSU will do what you have stated.

For example, http://www.lawschooldiscussion.org/inde ... ic=33456.0

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Cicero76
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby Cicero76 » Sun Aug 25, 2013 8:30 pm

crestor wrote:
Cicero76 wrote:
AT9 wrote:
Huskies13! wrote:No news on UFla class size--but median is 160, GPA 3.55 (both down).
USC class size is down to 176
UC Davis down to 143
American says 480 (including part-time)
Sand Diego says 245
Tenn is way up--to 158
and Pitt is down to 175.

No news on full profiles for those--just looking at "welcome letters" from deans posted on web.


UF is down to 160 and 3.55? Nice.

Weren't they reducing class sizes too?


UF Law is run in such a TTTT manner it makes me genuinely angry. There is no reason that the best university in the state shouldn't have a top 25 law school like California, New York, or even freaking Alabama do. Unfortunately, UF is run by morons with no idea of how to buy decent scores or increase the quality of students and faculty to make a better school. They don't even advertise or offer fee waivers.

They deserve the asskicking that FSU law is going to give them in the next few years. And this is coming from someone who hates FSU.


Care to elaborate more on this post? Do you really think FSU is going to leapfrog them in the rankings whereas even this last year on LST FSU had 9% more of their graduates employed than UF. Even on these forums which is a very small and self-selecting sample I see alot of FSU/UF threads and eventually the OP says "I chose FSU, got a better feel at the school and the FSU students seemed to be a much more open-minded bunch than UF." It seems that UF has this haughty notion that they are T14 material and the be all end all in Florida which is simply not true. I mean Gainesville really is in the middle of fucking nowhere. FSU is in the capitol and at the end of the day that is a big PLUS.

It's a pretty interesting debate too because the schools right now are 46 and 48 on USNWR. But it seems that UF's policy of averaging LSAT scores just HURTS. I did not know that UF refuses to offer fee waivers. That is stupid. I have been reading various forums and people have been predicting that soon enough FSU will do what you have stated.

For example, http://www.lawschooldiscussion.org/inde ... ic=33456.0


UF is resting on its laurels as the undisputed king of Florida in terms of overall university prestige, and on the strength of its alumni base. It doesn't seem to feel the pressure to improve that it should be feeling. FSU law didn't used to be so close to UF, and a lot of boomer employers still see it that way. That will change.

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crestor
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby crestor » Sun Aug 25, 2013 8:40 pm

So because FSU is willing to play the ranking game and lower class size and take highest LSAT and offer more scholarships for high LSAT students, FSU is going to shit kick UF in the rankings soon enough AND have better looking girls.

Image

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Cicero76
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby Cicero76 » Sun Aug 25, 2013 9:40 pm

crestor wrote:So because FSU is willing to play the ranking game and lower class size and take highest LSAT and offer more scholarships for high LSAT students, FSU is going to shit kick UF in the rankings soon enough AND have better looking girls.

[img]mr%20burns[/img]


Yes. But it's fine, because UF will still shit-kick FSU up and down the length of the Swamp come November.

Lord Randolph McDuff
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby Lord Randolph McDuff » Sun Aug 25, 2013 9:55 pm

CU brought in its "largest class ever," per my 1L source at orientation. Pretty sure this was a total accident and our medians were kicked in the tits. They haven't posted yet but I'll check back when they do.

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crestor
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby crestor » Sun Aug 25, 2013 10:00 pm

Lord Randolph McDuff wrote:CU brought in its "largest class ever," per my 1L source at orientation. Pretty sure this was a total accident and our medians were kicked in the tits. They haven't posted yet but I'll check back when they do.



as you go to CU, i assume campos must be a pariah among his colleagues lol. it would be epic to have class with him though.

indo
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby indo » Sun Aug 25, 2013 10:28 pm

ImNoScar wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:I don't understand why everyone is so giddy.

I'm excited because I'm hoping some TTTs will close and stop preying on the misinformed.



+1 .

Steveloblaw
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby Steveloblaw » Mon Aug 26, 2013 4:30 pm

Received a packet from Michigan, which included the following stats about the incoming 2013 class:

Applied: 4,900
Enrolled: 315
Women: 48%
Minorities: 23%
GPA: 3.53/3.72/3.83
LSAT: 165/168/170

Mean Age: 24
75% 1+ years out of Undergrad

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jingosaur
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby jingosaur » Mon Aug 26, 2013 4:35 pm

Steveloblaw wrote:Received a packet from Michigan, which included the following stats about the incoming 2013 class:

Applied: 4,900
Enrolled: 315
Women: 48%
Minorities: 23%
GPA: 3.53/3.72/3.83
LSAT: 165/168/170

Mean Age: 24
75% 1+ years out of Undergrad


Well I guess people who go to Michigan won't be saying that they go to a Top 10 law school anymore...

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bouleversement
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby bouleversement » Mon Aug 26, 2013 4:36 pm

Steveloblaw wrote:Received a packet from Michigan, which included the following stats about the incoming 2013 class:

Applied: 4,900
Enrolled: 315
Women: 48%
Minorities: 23%
GPA: 3.53/3.72/3.83
LSAT: 165/168/170

Mean Age: 24
75% 1+ years out of Undergrad


Interesting. tyft.

Applications pretty steady but enrollment down sharply.


.05
/.01/--
1/1/--

edit: #s
Last edited by bouleversement on Mon Aug 26, 2013 4:41 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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jbagelboy
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby jbagelboy » Mon Aug 26, 2013 4:38 pm

jingosaur wrote:
Steveloblaw wrote:Received a packet from Michigan, which included the following stats about the incoming 2013 class:

Applied: 4,900
Enrolled: 315
Women: 48%
Minorities: 23%
GPA: 3.53/3.72/3.83
LSAT: 165/168/170

Mean Age: 24
75% 1+ years out of Undergrad


Well I guess people who go to Michigan won't be saying that they go to a Top 10 law school anymore...


168. Ouch.

zbollenb
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby zbollenb » Mon Aug 26, 2013 4:51 pm

Wow, I just submitted my application to Michigan. I'm only 1 point below median now!

04102014
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby 04102014 » Mon Aug 26, 2013 4:58 pm

What's crazy is that 168 comes with a not insignificant cut in class size.

04102014
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby 04102014 » Mon Aug 26, 2013 6:31 pm

jingosaur wrote:
Steveloblaw wrote:Received a packet from Michigan, which included the following stats about the incoming 2013 class:

Applied: 4,900
Enrolled: 315
Women: 48%
Minorities: 23%
GPA: 3.53/3.72/3.83
LSAT: 165/168/170

Mean Age: 24
75% 1+ years out of Undergrad


Well I guess people who go to Michigan won't be saying that they go to a Top 10 law school anymore...


You're silly.

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SteelPenguin
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby SteelPenguin » Mon Aug 26, 2013 6:33 pm

Any chance one of Columbia, NYU, or Penn take an LSAT median hit?

Steveloblaw
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby Steveloblaw » Mon Aug 26, 2013 6:36 pm

SteelPenguin wrote:Any chance one of Columbia, NYU, or Penn take an LSAT median hit?


Also interested in this...considering UVA, Duke, and now Michigan took a hit, it seems likely Penn will as well, though perhaps they played the game better (and UVA, for example, has to take a significant amount of in-state applicants). So we will see.

I somehow doubt NYU and Columbia will though - they've played for higher LSAT's consistently in the past, so perhaps their GPA will fall.

04102014
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby 04102014 » Mon Aug 26, 2013 6:39 pm

Steveloblaw wrote:
SteelPenguin wrote:Any chance one of Columbia, NYU, or Penn take an LSAT median hit?


Also interested in this...considering UVA, Duke, and now Michigan took a hit, it seems likely Penn will as well, though perhaps they played the game better (and UVA, for example, has to take a significant amount of in-state applicants). So we will see.

I somehow doubt NYU and Columbia will though - they've played for higher LSAT's consistently in the past, so perhaps their GPA will fall.



I'd be shocked if NYU doesn't drop a point. Large class size, and they admitted an atypical # of 168s last cycle.

Steveloblaw
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby Steveloblaw » Mon Aug 26, 2013 6:44 pm

ohpobrecito wrote:
Steveloblaw wrote:
SteelPenguin wrote:Any chance one of Columbia, NYU, or Penn take an LSAT median hit?


Also interested in this...considering UVA, Duke, and now Michigan took a hit, it seems likely Penn will as well, though perhaps they played the game better (and UVA, for example, has to take a significant amount of in-state applicants). So we will see.

I somehow doubt NYU and Columbia will though - they've played for higher LSAT's consistently in the past, so perhaps their GPA will fall.



I'd be shocked if NYU doesn't drop a point. Large class size, and they admitted an atypical # of 168s last cycle.


After looking at the data again, you're probably right...we also have the 25/75 #'s from NYU, and they're listed at 168 and 172 respectively. Statistically, that means it's likely to see a 170 median, which would be a 1 point drop.

Edit: Also, apparently Duke held it's median at 169, correction from my post above.

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longlivetheking
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby longlivetheking » Mon Aug 26, 2013 7:12 pm

Steveloblaw wrote:
ohpobrecito wrote:
Steveloblaw wrote:
SteelPenguin wrote:Any chance one of Columbia, NYU, or Penn take an LSAT median hit?


Also interested in this...considering UVA, Duke, and now Michigan took a hit, it seems likely Penn will as well, though perhaps they played the game better (and UVA, for example, has to take a significant amount of in-state applicants). So we will see.

I somehow doubt NYU and Columbia will though - they've played for higher LSAT's consistently in the past, so perhaps their GPA will fall.



I'd be shocked if NYU doesn't drop a point. Large class size, and they admitted an atypical # of 168s last cycle.


After looking at the data again, you're probably right...we also have the 25/75 #'s from NYU, and they're listed at 168 and 172 respectively. Statistically, that means it's likely to see a 170 median, which would be a 1 point drop.

Edit: Also, apparently Duke held it's median at 169, correction from my post above.



i just fapped to 170 nyu median.

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Monochromatic Oeuvre
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby Monochromatic Oeuvre » Mon Aug 26, 2013 7:14 pm

SteelPenguin wrote:Any chance one of Columbia, NYU, or Penn take an LSAT median hit?


CLS: I doubt it. Seemed like the guidelines for 170-172 remained roughly as they were in past years. But a big school that didn't really drop class size, so I suppose it's possible. They haven't told us anything regarding numbers.
NYU: Probably. I would've said maybe before based on the fact that they seemed quite eager to pull in 170s with GPAs they may not have taken in years past. Plus they're big enough so that smaller differences are magnified. But now that they have 168/172 splits, I'd say 170 seems likely to follow.
Penn: I doubt it, based on pretty robust rejection rates of 170+. But if Michigan and UVA both dropped, it's on the table.

Of course, clearly my predictive skills suck, so take my words with a grain of salt.

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longlivetheking
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Re: C/O 2016 Class Profiles

Postby longlivetheking » Mon Aug 26, 2013 7:19 pm

Monochromatic Oeuvre wrote:
SteelPenguin wrote:Any chance one of Columbia, NYU, or Penn take an LSAT median hit?


CLS: I doubt it. Seemed like the guidelines for 170-172 remained roughly as they were in past years. But a big school that didn't really drop class size, so I suppose it's possible. They haven't told us anything regarding numbers.
NYU: Probably. I would've said maybe before based on the fact that they seemed quite eager to pull in 170s with GPAs they may not have taken in years past. Plus they're big enough so that smaller differences are magnified. But now that they have 168/172 splits, I'd say 170 seems likely to follow.
Penn: I doubt it, based on pretty robust rejection rates of 170+. But if Michigan and UVA both dropped, it's on the table.

Of course, clearly my predictive skills suck, so take my words with a grain of salt.



seriously though how is penn rejecting all those 170s? this has gotta be one of biggest mysteries of the 2012-2013 cycle.




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