One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

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un bon avocat
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One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby un bon avocat » Sat Aug 17, 2013 9:52 pm

Edited..
Last edited by un bon avocat on Tue Sep 10, 2013 11:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

rad lulz
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Re: One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby rad lulz » Sat Aug 17, 2013 10:03 pm


un bon avocat
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Re: One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby un bon avocat » Sat Aug 17, 2013 11:07 pm

Edited
Last edited by un bon avocat on Tue Sep 10, 2013 11:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.

rad lulz
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Re: One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby rad lulz » Sat Aug 17, 2013 11:35 pm

Teaching law is rarefied air and that's basically not gonna happen from these places

Houston for that much doesn't make sense because your shot at high paying jobs is so low

Rutgers is fine for that price if you just want to be a lawyer in a small firm doing "shitlaw," but not if you aren't from NJ

Don't know a lot about reaching undergrad w a law degree but have heard anecdotal stories of some people adjunctive at universities and community colleges. I don't think that's really what you want though.

Void
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Re: One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby Void » Sat Aug 17, 2013 11:55 pm

Take Rutgers. In the end, your shot at gainful employment will be a mixture of luck, your grades, your law school experiences, your writing skills, your interviewing skills, "fit," the needs of the local market at the precise time you're applying, who you know, and the name of your school. Right now you really only have control over one of those factors- the last one. That last one matters, but only a tiny amount compared to the whole picture (unless the name of your school is HYS and perhaps the rest of the T-14).

The other BIG factor you can control right now is your debt. Given your choices, it would seem like a reckless decision to pick a lot more debt on the gamble that the name of your school will even really matter in the end.

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Yukos
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Re: One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby Yukos » Sat Aug 17, 2013 11:58 pm

Are you from Jersey and fine with working at a small firm there all your life (and not making $$$)? If yes, Rutgers is a decent choice. If you answered no to any part of that question, you need to retake and not go to law school right now. With your GPA, you won't be able to get into a law school that will give you a decent chance at a teaching job, so I think you need to move past that dream. Your realistic options are: retaking, getting a 170+ and going to a school near where you live for free and then working at a smallish firm (if you can get a job), or retaking, getting a 170+ and going to Northwestern (assuming you have work experience) for a decent shot at working at a big firm. Anything else would be a terrible financial decision. Sorry if that sounds harsh, but it's important for you to realize the stakes of your decision.

un bon avocat
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Re: One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby un bon avocat » Sun Aug 18, 2013 3:54 am

What about going to either school and transferring with really good grades, or leaving if grades dont come out so hot. I could deal with having spent a year's worth of tuition/costs.

cidergirl
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Re: One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby cidergirl » Sun Aug 18, 2013 4:00 am

Take the full ride. Transfer to a T14 if your grades are good enough. Don't look back.

sparty99
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Re: One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby sparty99 » Sun Aug 18, 2013 8:18 am

un bon avocat wrote:What about going to either school and transferring with really good grades, or leaving if grades dont come out so hot. I could deal with having spent a year's worth of tuition/costs.


You DON'T GO TO LAW SCHOOL WITH THE INTENTIONS OF TRANSFERRING TO A BETTER SCHOOL.

GO to Rutgers or retake.

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hephaestus
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Re: One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby hephaestus » Sun Aug 18, 2013 8:38 am

Where are you from?

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TheSpanishMain
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Re: One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby TheSpanishMain » Sun Aug 18, 2013 11:33 am

I really think the right answer is to retake, work for a year or two, and then revisit the idea of law school. If that's out, I guess Rutgers if you're fine with being geographically limited to Jersey and not getting into academia.

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Otunga
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Re: One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby Otunga » Sun Aug 18, 2013 11:48 am

You're going to have a tough time attaining a job in academia with your GPA due to the t14 being mostly inaccessible. You say you'd be content to be an attorney, though, so retake and go to a school with better job prospects.

I'd say take the Rutgers full ride but you don't seem all too enamored with the idea. And if you're at all hesitant about going to a school where you're locked into a region that you're unsure you even like, don't do it.

un bon avocat
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Re: One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby un bon avocat » Sun Aug 18, 2013 4:38 pm

Yes, I am definitely hesitant about Rutgers.

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jselson
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Re: One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby jselson » Sun Aug 18, 2013 4:58 pm

ImNoScar wrote:Where are you from?

Void
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Re: One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby Void » Sun Aug 18, 2013 5:04 pm

un bon avocat wrote:Yes, I am definitely hesitant about Rutgers.


I agree that you shouldn't go to Rutgers unless you want to practice in NJ for the first few years of your career. If you are hesitant because you don't want to be in NJ, then you probably should retake.

If you want NorCal you're in a tough spot because Stanford and Boalt dominate out there and the brutal truth is you won't get into either of them with your GPA. But you could retake and get 170+ and try for a full ride at one of the lower ranked Bay Area schools like Davis or Hastings.

rad lulz
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Re: One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby rad lulz » Sun Aug 18, 2013 5:05 pm

Void wrote:
un bon avocat wrote:Yes, I am definitely hesitant about Rutgers.


I agree that you shouldn't go to Rutgers unless you want to practice in NJ for the first few years of your career. If you are hesitant because you don't want to be in NJ, then you probably should retake.

If you want NorCal you're in a tough spot because Stanford and Boalt dominate out there and the brutal truth is you won't get into either of them with your GPA. But you could retake and get 170+ and try for a full ride at one of the lower ranked Bay Area schools like Davis or Hastings.

Not with that GPA

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Nova
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Re: One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby Nova » Sun Aug 18, 2013 5:10 pm

Did you apply to wustl?

Seems like you missed out on some opportunities for better scholarships at some better schools.

I would retake/reapply and blanket the t30 if I were you.

jarofsoup
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Re: One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby jarofsoup » Sun Aug 18, 2013 5:13 pm

You didn't get into Hastings, Davis, Santa Clara or any CA schools with your LSAT score?

Ti Malice
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Re: One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby Ti Malice » Sun Aug 18, 2013 5:14 pm

Ignore the USNWR rankings. "Tier 1" and "Tier 2" don't necessarily mean anything because the rankings don't necessarily correlate to job placement power. Also, outside the T14 (and even within), schools only place locally/regionally. Preexisting ties will range from somewhat important to essential for breaking into many of these markets.

You're also underestimating your cost of attendance, mostly for UH, since it looks like you're not accounting for tuition increases or interest that accrues during your time in law school. If you debt-financed everything, you'd end up with ~$130K of debt at the beginning of repayment; paying $20K in your first year would leave you with about $105K of debt at repayment. That's absurd for UH.

If you're hesitant about Rutgers-Camden, don't go. At least attending won't financially ruin you, but job prospects out of R-C are not pretty.

Please tell us where you have ties.

Void
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Re: One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby Void » Sun Aug 18, 2013 5:18 pm

rad lulz wrote:
Void wrote:
un bon avocat wrote:Yes, I am definitely hesitant about Rutgers.


I agree that you shouldn't go to Rutgers unless you want to practice in NJ for the first few years of your career. If you are hesitant because you don't want to be in NJ, then you probably should retake.

If you want NorCal you're in a tough spot because Stanford and Boalt dominate out there and the brutal truth is you won't get into either of them with your GPA. But you could retake and get 170+ and try for a full ride at one of the lower ranked Bay Area schools like Davis or Hastings.

Not with that GPA


No? Not even with like a 175?

Ti Malice
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Re: One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby Ti Malice » Sun Aug 18, 2013 5:21 pm

jarofsoup wrote:You didn't get into Hastings, Davis, Santa Clara or any CA schools with your LSAT score?


All three of those schools would be worse choices than what OP already has on the table.

rad lulz
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Re: One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby rad lulz » Sun Aug 18, 2013 5:25 pm

Void wrote:
rad lulz wrote:
Void wrote:
un bon avocat wrote:Yes, I am definitely hesitant about Rutgers.


I agree that you shouldn't go to Rutgers unless you want to practice in NJ for the first few years of your career. If you are hesitant because you don't want to be in NJ, then you probably should retake.

If you want NorCal you're in a tough spot because Stanford and Boalt dominate out there and the brutal truth is you won't get into either of them with your GPA. But you could retake and get 170+ and try for a full ride at one of the lower ranked Bay Area schools like Davis or Hastings.

Not with that GPA


No? Not even with like a 175?

With a 2.7 you probably won't even get in. CA publics almost never admit people with sub 3.0 GPAs

Void
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Re: One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby Void » Sun Aug 18, 2013 5:38 pm

Ti Malice wrote:
jarofsoup wrote:You didn't get into Hastings, Davis, Santa Clara or any CA schools with your LSAT score?


All three of those schools would be worse choices than what OP already has on the table.


Except he actually wants to be in CA and doesn't appear to want to be in NJ. If you're going to graduate without a job either way, you may as well be someplace nice. Plus, being homeless in CA is pretty easy, weather-wise.

Void
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Re: One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby Void » Sun Aug 18, 2013 5:39 pm

rad lulz wrote:
Void wrote:
No? Not even with like a 175?

With a 2.7 you probably won't even get in. CA publics almost never admit people with sub 3.0 GPAs


Huh. Didnt know they were so choosy.

Ti Malice
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Re: One week left to decide, Please advise! Tier 1 vs Tier 2

Postby Ti Malice » Sun Aug 18, 2013 6:03 pm

Void wrote:
Ti Malice wrote:
jarofsoup wrote:You didn't get into Hastings, Davis, Santa Clara or any CA schools with your LSAT score?


All three of those schools would be worse choices than what OP already has on the table.


Except he actually wants to be in CA and doesn't appear to want to be in NJ. If you're going to graduate without a job either way, you may as well be someplace nice. Plus, being homeless in CA is pretty easy, weather-wise.


Except Rutgers is offering him a full ride whereas stingy Hastings/Davis would leave him with $200K+ of debt at graduation (probably closer to $300K). If you're going to graduate unemployed, you may as well not also graduate in utter financial ruin. And he did say he had no real preference as to where he ends up working, so emphasizing CA schools that amount to horrible investments just because of his "perfect world" statement makes no sense at all.




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