Where to go?!

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BigZuck
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Re: Where to go?!

Postby BigZuck » Sun Jul 14, 2013 5:11 pm

cfox17 wrote:
Monochromatic Oeuvre wrote:If TLS seems elitist, it's because non-elite applicants almost never wind up making enough money to pay back their debt. We're not telling you that 90% of schools aren't good enough for shits and giggles, we're telling you because 90% of schools are legitimately not good enough, at least in the context of six-figure debt. Part of the reason we tell a lot of people not to go to law school is that way too many people are still going to law school, and paying sticker at a T2 is literally the worst decision you will ever make in your life.


I understand, and I know that I can not expect much from schools that are low T2 or not even ranked. I am already planing on retaking the LSAT and a 158 is by no means acceptable to me. I know and can score much higher then that. I was simply looking for advice on schools, but I need to understand that before I can do that I need to improve my scores drastically and I will. I am sorry for getting under anyones skin or rubbing anybody the wrong way. I never intended to do so.

I believe the general consensus is to study hard, retake the LSAT, then hopefully place in a nice regional school like UGA, Vandy, UNC, UTK, etc.


I can't think of any one person for whom all those schools would be good realistic options. Only go to a school in a state that you have ties to or a T14 (plus Vandy in your case). And it has to be at a reasonable price.

Where do you have ties to? Where have you lived/worked/gone to school to for long stretches of time? Where do your parents live? Where do you have "roots"? Keep in mind that having a great uncle or a second cousin in a place doesn't really count...

So yeah, if you're from Georgia (for example) go to UGA/GSU for as close to a full ride as possible or Emory/Vandy for a steep discount. Or go to Duke or UVA if you can swing it.

UT is out considering your lack of stated ties.

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Ruxin1
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Re: Where to go?!

Postby Ruxin1 » Sun Jul 14, 2013 5:13 pm

cfox17 wrote:
Monochromatic Oeuvre wrote:If TLS seems elitist, it's because non-elite applicants almost never wind up making enough money to pay back their debt. We're not telling you that 90% of schools aren't good enough for shits and giggles, we're telling you because 90% of schools are legitimately not good enough, at least in the context of six-figure debt. Part of the reason we tell a lot of people not to go to law school is that way too many people are still going to law school, and paying sticker at a T2 is literally the worst decision you will ever make in your life.


I understand, and I know that I can not expect much from schools that are low T2 or not even ranked. I am already planing on retaking the LSAT and a 158 is by no means acceptable to me. I know and can score much higher then that. I was simply looking for advice on schools, but I need to understand that before I can do that I need to improve my scores drastically and I will. I am sorry for getting under anyones skin or rubbing anybody the wrong way. I never intended to do so.

I believe the general consensus is to study hard, retake the LSAT, then hopefully place in a nice regional school like UGA, Vandy, UNC, UTK, etc.


I'm not sure whether you are using a different definition of regional, but Vandy is the only one on that list that is. The other T1 schools will limit you to the state they are located in.

cfox17
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Re: Where to go?!

Postby cfox17 » Sun Jul 14, 2013 5:41 pm

What I mean by regional is just if I go to UNC/Wake I'll be able to place well in NC and maybe some parts of East TN, then if I went to Vandy/UTK I could place in TN/NC maybe. As you can see, I really just mean schools that are southern and place well where they are located and surrounding areas. I have my strongest ties in TN. I go to UT now and my fraternity has many ties to lawyers all throughout TN, NC, GA, MS, and other states.

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electricfeel
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Re: Where to go?!

Postby electricfeel » Sun Jul 14, 2013 5:42 pm

cfox17 wrote:
Pure Protein wrote:
cfox17 wrote:I too came to this site for advice on schools and the application process but it's starting to be a site where you are constantly criticized and your success is damned if you don't score a 180 and have a 4.0 GPA


I honestly feel compelled to comment after reading this.

There may be certain times when TLS seems unreasonably harsh on applicants with low stats but, in the overwhelming majority of circumstances, it IS advice. Contributors who tell you that you have a bad LSAT score do it for your benefit. They know that law school is extremely expensive and that employment, even at T-14s, is not guaranteed. The people who are put-off by this attitude tend to be ones who only look at law school with a "get in the door" mentality. What TLS does is try to convince you that "getting in the door" (getting accepted to a school) should not be your goal. In fact, some people on this forum have lived through, or are still living through, the circumstances surrounding a high debt/bad prospects JD. People who want to work in small or medium markets and go to strong regional schools on large scholarships are not criticized. The criticism (harsh advice) on TLS is largely reserved for people about to invest $200,000+ into an education that isn't worth it 99 times out of 100.

I for one am extremely thankful that I found TLS when I did. While I was accepted into a few good schools, some even on partial scholarship, TLS convinced me that it would be a terrible mistake to matriculate at any school if my LSAT potential wasn't reached. In the last 2 months of studying, I have seen that my actual score was nowhere near my potential. I will encourage you to do the same. Were you consistently hitting that 165 before you took it, or was that a one time thing? How many PTs did you take? How much prep material do you have left? Retake the test, and be as ready as you possibly can be.

Finally, this website isn't called "Mediocre Law Schools", "Average Law Schools", or even "Good Law Schools". It's "Top Law Schools", and the advice you will get here comes from people who either are aiming for or attending a Top Law School. This might be different in the school-specific areas of TLS, but you can't go to the "Choosing a Law School" section of "Top Law Schools", list several T2 or T3 schools (for which you will probably be paying sticker or close to it based on your stats) and then complain about the website.



Thank you, that was a great response. I was already set on taking the LSAT again in October as I had little change to prepare before and I only PT'd a few times (3-5). I analyzed my scores more closer and my best section was thrown out, figures, and then I bombed the logic games section. I think by simply studying, taking more PTs, going over my powerscore books, and by starting to learn how to think like the LSAT demands can improve my score drastically. Also, I do not mean to sound as complaining, and I do not believe people who are honest as to be bad advice. I solely meant not everyone can get into top law schools and with those scores I am not even near the range, so I was just looking for advice. I am going to study extremely hard and improve my score, thats the bottom line, then get into UT, UNC, Wake, or a strong regional school. That is where I want to be, in the South, and I believe that would fit me well.


Do you realize that only the top 10%, if that, of students at Wake or UT are going to get jobs that make over 80k a year? Let me rephrase that, you have a 90% chance of not making enough money to pay back your loans. Please reconsider.

BigZuck
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Re: Where to go?!

Postby BigZuck » Sun Jul 14, 2013 5:51 pm

'round these parts UT=The University of Texas, pardner

Schools like UTK and UGA are fine so long as you're good with working in that state (and that state only) and they are cheap to attend (I'm thinking like 60-80K max). And that you have ties to that state of course.

Sounds like you're from Tennessee. Your only real options are UTK, Vandy, and the T14. Maaaaaaybe Emory. You can and should apply to other schools for scholarship negotiation purposes but there's only a select few that you should actually consider attending.

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jackattack17
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Re: Where to go?!

Postby jackattack17 » Sun Jul 14, 2013 6:34 pm

OP, study hard (~3 hours/day, practice test every week) and blanket the southern T1/T2 schools with your mid-160s score. Target Vandy, Emory, UGA, Bama, UNC, and WF (maybe Virginia/Florida schools too, but it sounds like you don't want to be there and those schools are regional). If you get 167/168+, throw apps to UT, Dook, and UVA too. Safeties could be Ga St and UTK. Come back with your Oct score and we can re-evaluate.

TennesseeLaw
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Re: Where to go?!

Postby TennesseeLaw » Sun Jul 14, 2013 8:01 pm

[deleted]
Last edited by TennesseeLaw on Wed Sep 04, 2013 10:16 am, edited 1 time in total.

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electricfeel
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Re: Where to go?!

Postby electricfeel » Sun Jul 14, 2013 8:36 pm

TennesseeLaw wrote:OP: I would suggest UTK. In my opinion, UT will be fine as a regional school if that is what you want. I am currently an undergrad there as well. Go Vols!


Haha this can't be serious.

BigZuck
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Re: Where to go?!

Postby BigZuck » Sun Jul 14, 2013 8:52 pm

electricfeel wrote:
TennesseeLaw wrote:OP: I would suggest UTK. In my opinion, UT will be fine as a regional school if that is what you want. I am currently an undergrad there as well. Go Vols!


Haha this can't be serious.


What's wrong with that statement? If a Tennessean wants to work at a small firm in Tenn, UTK for cheap is fine

TennesseeLaw
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Re: Where to go?!

Postby TennesseeLaw » Sun Jul 14, 2013 9:12 pm

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Last edited by TennesseeLaw on Wed Sep 04, 2013 10:17 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Clearly
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Re: Where to go?!

Postby Clearly » Sun Jul 14, 2013 9:24 pm

the thing is, you have two options. Go to an elite school, or go to a local school with significant scholarship. You need a killer lsat to do either of these things. Tls is all about regional schools with scholarships. You continue to imply that you are ok going to these schools, but you need to realize attending at sticker is a terrible idea. You concede you don't want to work biglaw, you acknowledge you don't plan on a large salary, if that's the case, you simply can not pay sticker at a regional school. You will need to retake and do well to make law school a good idea, regardless of your goals.

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electricfeel
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Re: Where to go?!

Postby electricfeel » Sun Jul 14, 2013 11:34 pm

Clearlynotstefan wrote:the thing is, you have two options. Go to an elite school, or go to a local school with significant scholarship. You need a killer lsat to do either of these things. Tls is all about regional schools with scholarships. You continue to imply that you are ok going to these schools, but you need to realize attending at sticker is a terrible idea. You concede you don't want to work biglaw, you acknowledge you don't plan on a large salary, if that's the case, you simply can not pay sticker at a regional school. You will need to retake and do well to make law school a good idea, regardless of your goals.


Ok. You said it way better than I could.

nick417
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Re: Where to go?!

Postby nick417 » Mon Jul 15, 2013 9:53 am

Monochromatic Oeuvre wrote:If TLS seems elitist, it's because non-elite applicants almost never wind up making enough money to pay back their debt. We're not telling you that 90% of schools aren't good enough for shits and giggles, we're telling you because 90% of schools are legitimately not good enough, at least in the context of six-figure debt. Part of the reason we tell a lot of people not to go to law school is that way too many people are still going to law school, and paying sticker at a T2 is literally the worst decision you will ever make in your life.



Agreed: Instead of listing schools to find out where you will be accepted. You should be trying to find schools that will give you the most scholarship money. The only thing guaranteed with law school is debt. The less, the better.




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