POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

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Clearly
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby Clearly » Wed Apr 24, 2013 4:15 am

I'd like to add that I'm impressed your even willing to take an honest look at your plan. You don't realize how many people come here in your position and refuse to even entertain the information people provide them. You have to realize that every single thing you've seen here is written from the position of experience, and people wanting to either help you make the same smart choices they did, or help you avoid the mistakes they have. Keep it up, if you keep digging, you will see.

T4Rockstar
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby T4Rockstar » Wed Apr 24, 2013 4:16 am

Clearlynotstefan wrote:A 2.7 173+ has a fair chance at Northwestern with several years of postgrad work experience. That said, you don't need to shoot that high, doing better on the LSAT will still open more significant scholarships up and mitigate the risk. Honestly, it's the most important test of your life, and to go about it like you did is remarkably irresponsible. You seem like an intelligent fellow here, how can you justify not studying for the most important test of your life? It matters more than your GPA does to schools! Retake, and bust your ass, realizing that a great school is still possible, even with your GPA. My first practice test was around your range, its entirely possible to pick up tons of points from there. Just do it man.



How do you recommend studying? I have an old Princeton Review book that didn't seem useful when I looked at it. I really would need to figure out the logic games. Venn diagrams and bs like that are like ten years ago for me. Anyone had good success with the classes?

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rinkrat19
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby rinkrat19 » Wed Apr 24, 2013 4:21 am

Clearlynotstefan wrote:I'd like to add that I'm impressed your even willing to take an honest look at your plan. You don't realize how many people come here in your position and refuse to even entertain the information people provide them. You have to realize that every single thing you've seen here is written from the position of experience, and people wanting to either help you make the same smart choices they did, or help you avoid the mistakes they have. Keep it up, if you keep digging, you will see.

+1
And this explains why you got some jackass responses at first (including mine). You sounded like you might be one of the unreachables. TLS sees dozens of misguided souls every cycle and it takes a lot of effort and patience to repeat the same argument over and over and a lot of times people go blithely on with their terrible law school plans. We--seriously!--do it to try and help people, but damn do we get jaded.

LSAT study advice: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=200917

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Clearly
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby Clearly » Wed Apr 24, 2013 4:24 am

T4Rockstar wrote:
Clearlynotstefan wrote:A 2.7 173+ has a fair chance at Northwestern with several years of postgrad work experience. That said, you don't need to shoot that high, doing better on the LSAT will still open more significant scholarships up and mitigate the risk. Honestly, it's the most important test of your life, and to go about it like you did is remarkably irresponsible. You seem like an intelligent fellow here, how can you justify not studying for the most important test of your life? It matters more than your GPA does to schools! Retake, and bust your ass, realizing that a great school is still possible, even with your GPA. My first practice test was around your range, its entirely possible to pick up tons of points from there. Just do it man.



How do you recommend studying? I have an old Princeton Review book that didn't seem useful when I looked at it. I really would need to figure out the logic games. Venn diagrams and bs like that are like ten years ago for me. Anyone had good success with the classes?

Start poking around the LSAT prep forum here, you'll find plenty of peoples opinions on where to start. If games are killing you, I have great news: it's the easiest section of the test once you have a little practice in. I used to DREAD those things, now they're a snap. If you PM me I'll share some ideas on LSAT prep. Realize games are very repetitive, most of them are variations on simple games that happen over and over again, and you can master them in a few months max. The whole test is very conducive to prep work, so much of it is repeated patterns in question types, with experience you'll see its not as overwhelming a beast as it first appears.

So does this mean you're deciding to decline these offers and retake?

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Clearly
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby Clearly » Wed Apr 24, 2013 4:28 am

rinkrat19 wrote:
Clearlynotstefan wrote:I'd like to add that I'm impressed your even willing to take an honest look at your plan. You don't realize how many people come here in your position and refuse to even entertain the information people provide them. You have to realize that every single thing you've seen here is written from the position of experience, and people wanting to either help you make the same smart choices they did, or help you avoid the mistakes they have. Keep it up, if you keep digging, you will see.

+1
And this explains why you got some jackass responses at first (including mine). You sounded like you might be one of the unreachables. TLS sees dozens of misguided souls every cycle and it takes a lot of effort and patience to repeat the same argument over and over and a lot of times people go blithely on with their terrible law school plans. We--seriously!--do it to try and help people, but damn do we get jaded.

LSAT study advice: http://top-law-schools.com/forums/viewt ... 6&t=200917

Haha, I thought troll early on too...but its so nice to see posts like these when they happen.
As someone who literally thanks TLS for saving me from economic ruin at a T50, I feel morally obligated to stick around and be patient with these unreachables.

T4Rockstar
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby T4Rockstar » Wed Apr 24, 2013 4:42 am

Clearlynotstefan wrote:
rinkrat19 wrote:
Clearlynotstefan wrote:I'd like to add that I'm impressed your even willing to take an honest look at your plan. You don't realize how many people come here in your position and refuse to even entertain the information people provide them. You have to realize that every single thing you've seen here is written from the position of experience, and people wanting to either help you make the same smart choices they did, or help you avoid the mistakes they have. Keep it up, if you keep digging, you will see.

+1
And this explains why you got some jackass responses at first (including mine). You sounded like you might be one of the unreachables. TLS sees dozens of misguided souls every cycle and it takes a lot of effort and patience to repeat the same argument over and over and a lot of times people go blithely on with their terrible law school plans. We--seriously!--do it to try and help people, but damn do we get jaded.

LSAT study advice: http://top-law-schools.com/forums/viewt ... 6&t=200917

Haha, I thought troll early on too...but its so nice to see posts like these when they happen.
As someone who literally thanks TLS for saving me from economic ruin at a T50, I feel morally obligated to stick around and be patient with these unreachables.


Yea... I have like a week to put deposits down. Honestly.... the idea of going somewhere like UM or UF gave me a warm fuzzy feeling. I think the forum post that really just made it too much mentioned something about Florida Coastal being owned by University of Pheonix. Just rubbed me the wrong way.

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John_rizzy_rawls
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby John_rizzy_rawls » Wed Apr 24, 2013 6:33 am

T4Rockstar wrote:
Clearlynotstefan wrote:
rinkrat19 wrote:
Clearlynotstefan wrote:I'd like to add that I'm impressed your even willing to take an honest look at your plan. You don't realize how many people come here in your position and refuse to even entertain the information people provide them. You have to realize that every single thing you've seen here is written from the position of experience, and people wanting to either help you make the same smart choices they did, or help you avoid the mistakes they have. Keep it up, if you keep digging, you will see.

+1
And this explains why you got some jackass responses at first (including mine). You sounded like you might be one of the unreachables. TLS sees dozens of misguided souls every cycle and it takes a lot of effort and patience to repeat the same argument over and over and a lot of times people go blithely on with their terrible law school plans. We--seriously!--do it to try and help people, but damn do we get jaded.

LSAT study advice: http://top-law-schools.com/forums/viewt ... 6&t=200917

Haha, I thought troll early on too...but its so nice to see posts like these when they happen.
As someone who literally thanks TLS for saving me from economic ruin at a T50, I feel morally obligated to stick around and be patient with these unreachables.


Yea... I have like a week to put deposits down. Honestly.... the idea of going somewhere like UM or UF gave me a warm fuzzy feeling. I think the forum post that really just made it too much mentioned something about Florida Coastal being owned by University of Pheonix. Just rubbed me the wrong way.


You can absolutely get to a T50 school with very good money if you work hard and crush the LSAT. Don't sell yourself short dude. You'll be glad you took good advice.

T4Rockstar
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby T4Rockstar » Wed Apr 24, 2013 8:52 am

I am actually looking at the LSAC school finder and the chances of getting into a t50 school with my GPA are extremely slim even if I destroy the LSAT. UM is probably doable.

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tehkris
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby tehkris » Wed Apr 24, 2013 8:55 am

OP, our situations are similar to an extent. I'm keeping this thread open all day. Thank you for posting this. This thread FTW :D

20141023
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby 20141023 » Wed Apr 24, 2013 9:20 am

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Last edited by 20141023 on Mon Feb 16, 2015 12:26 am, edited 1 time in total.

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romothesavior
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby romothesavior » Wed Apr 24, 2013 11:34 am

T4Rockstar wrote:I am actually looking at the LSAC school finder and the chances of getting into a t50 school with my GPA are extremely slim even if I destroy the LSAT. UM is probably doable.

Things like the school finder or LSP aren't very helpful, especially for splitters. Check out Law School Numbers.com. You will see that tons of people go to top 50 schools, and even top 14 schools, with sub-3.0s.

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Simplicity
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby Simplicity » Wed Apr 24, 2013 11:54 am

T4Rockstar wrote:I need something where I am around smart people.

Then why are you considering going to Florida coastal? Seems like an oxymoron to me.

shntn
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby shntn » Wed Apr 24, 2013 12:22 pm

Simplicity wrote:
T4Rockstar wrote:I need something where I am around smart people.

Then why are you considering going to Florida coastal? Seems like an oxymoron to me.

Now, now, let's be nice.

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YankeesFan
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby YankeesFan » Wed Apr 24, 2013 12:31 pm

Maybe admirality law....A transfer from St. Thomas to UofM's admirality program would be awesome.

I didn't realize you were interested in admirality law. This is a complete game changer and makes Florida Coastal a no-brainer. I mean, the school has the word Coastal in it. Coastal=admirality law powerhouse. Be sure you do well enough to transfer to UofM's admirality law though, as this will open you up to the world of international admirality law, a little known about niche legal field that is quite prestigious, almost up there with international space law.

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slawww
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby slawww » Wed Apr 24, 2013 12:33 pm

Please re-take the LSAT. I'm not a T-14 or bust person like a lot of people on here, but your options at the moment are definitely bad. I had the same exact GPA and LSAT combo and fortunately re-took and increased 10 points. I wish I didn't squander my first two re-takes before I found TLS or I'd take the LSAT again, but that's another story. I'm going to UF, btw, so you can very easily do it too.

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vanwinkle
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby vanwinkle » Wed Apr 24, 2013 12:56 pm

T4Rockstar wrote:Why is planning for a transfer that poor a decision?

Two general reasons, and then two specific to the Florida Coastal fast-track:

1) You actually give things up in a transfer. Even if you do well enough, then you're giving up the connections to professors you formed while doing well in 1L, you're giving up a very likely shot at Law Review, you're giving up bonds you've formed in any student organizations and shots at officer positions with them.

2) Note that I said "if you do well enough". To make a significant upward transfer, "well enough" is a very narrow range from a school this low-ranked. You're looking at needing to finish in the top 1-2%, at a minimum, to make a transfer up to a significantly better school. And then you're giving up any scholarship money. You're basically gambling that you won't end up in the bottom 98% of the class. Maybe you'll do well, but are you sure you'll do that well?

3) The transfer cycle is over the summer, and you enroll in the new school starting 2L fall. You typically only get to transfer the traditional 1L courses. If you're on a 2-year fast-track program, and I looked up the Florida Coastal fast-track schedule, you'll be taking four semesters of classes (summer before traditional 1L, 1L fall and spring, and summer between 1L and 2L). The extra classes won't count at your new school. Four semesters is the equivalent of two years. And the ABA requirements are that you take at least 2 years' worth of credits at the degree-awarding institution, so you'll be required to take two full years there. So you'll actually end up taking four years' worth of classes.

4) If you transfer to a good school, you'll be thrown into OCI immediately. OCI is at the start of 2L fall. This happens to transfers. Your job prospects may be better at your new school's OCI, but one basic point of discussion during interviews is what you did your 1L summer. You're expected typically to have some kind of outside-the-classroom legal experience, either a paid position or an unpaid internship or a paid research position for a professor. Instead, you'll be taking classes. The classes include "Summer Associate Simulation", but good luck explaining to an interviewer how in-class simulated work is better experience than actual work. You're going to have nothing to talk about other than classes, and that will make you extremely boring, which is the worst thing you can be in an interview.

T4Rockstar wrote:If I can conceivably get 165-170 on the LSAT, shouldn't I blow the competition at St. Thomas away?

What you actually get matters more than what you can "conceivably get". And if you're the type who just assumes their ability can be greater than they test at, without doing anything to actually improve their test results, then you're going to suck in law school.

T4Rockstar wrote:My option would be to hold out for a t50 school. Is a top 50-75 school not even worth it? A 2.7 is going to make getting into a top100 school tough i think.

I've known people with sub-3.0 GPAs who got 170+ on the LSAT and got into Northwestern. Yes, the T14 school, seriously. The LSAT is a huge determining factor in school admissions, and especially if you have mitigating factors (medical reasons for poor performance, years of health since that show it's resolved by now) for your low GPA. Maybe you don't want to go to a T14, but getting a high LSAT can also get you scholarship money at lower-ranked schools. Even some T50 schools may throw huge scholarship dollars at you if you could get up into the 165-170 range.

Retake is real here. Even if your goal isn't the best school possible, a higher LSAT will also get you scholarship money at much better schools. Florida Coastal gave you $$$ with a low LSAT and your terrible GPA, why don't you think better schools would give you $$$ for a higher LSAT?

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vanwinkle
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby vanwinkle » Wed Apr 24, 2013 12:57 pm

YankeesFan wrote:I didn't realize you were interested in admirality law. This is a complete game changer and makes Florida Coastal a no-brainer. I mean, the school has the word Coastal in it. Coastal=admirality law powerhouse. Be sure you do well enough to transfer to UofM's admirality law though, as this will open you up to the world of international admirality law, a little known about niche legal field that is quite prestigious, almost up there with international space law.

Funny, but let's troll a little less. OP actually seems to want legit advice.

Purplebook
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby Purplebook » Wed Apr 24, 2013 1:27 pm

shntn wrote:Retake, ED UVA.



This never gets old. :lol:

That being said, I'm pretty certain someone just made this thread for the fun of it. This is not a real situation.

T4Rockstar
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby T4Rockstar » Wed Apr 24, 2013 9:59 pm

Purplebook wrote:
shntn wrote:Retake, ED UVA.



This never gets old. :lol:

That being said, I'm pretty certain someone just made this thread for the fun of it. This is not a real situation.



This is definitely a real situation. Lol. I am seriously trying to sell living in my parent's house for another year while studying for the LSAT. I may be able to do some SEO work for the year, and make a little money while doing it. I hate computers though and this work is sooooo boring. I'd really like to retake. I've been speaking with some lawyers I know and the input is mixed. Some say that outside of the top elite law schools, it doesn't much matter where you went as long as your in the top 25 percent. Of course, the ones I know that went to GWU and Hoffstra are balling out of control with their money. So I dunno... I definitely don't know any big players out of the tier 4. Going to keep pushing the rents and hope I get a year long reprieve.

timbs4339
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby timbs4339 » Wed Apr 24, 2013 10:01 pm

T4Rockstar wrote:Of course, the ones I know that went to GWU and Hoffstra are balling out of control with their money.


lol flame.

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rinkrat19
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby rinkrat19 » Wed Apr 24, 2013 10:01 pm

T4Rockstar wrote:
Purplebook wrote:
shntn wrote:Retake, ED UVA.



This never gets old. :lol:

That being said, I'm pretty certain someone just made this thread for the fun of it. This is not a real situation.



This is definitely a real situation. Lol. I am seriously trying to sell living in my parent's house for another year while studying for the LSAT. I may be able to do some SEO work for the year, and make a little money while doing it. I hate computers though and this work is sooooo boring. I'd really like to retake. I've been speaking with some lawyers I know and the input is mixed. Some say that outside of the top elite law schools, it doesn't much matter where you went as long as your in the top 25 percent. Of course, the ones I know that went to GWU and Hoffstra are balling out of control with their money. So I dunno... I definitely don't know any big players out of the tier 4. Going to keep pushing the rents and hope I get a year long reprieve.
Unless these lawyers graduated in 2009 or later, their advice on school choice and job placement is literally worthless. The market has completely changed and current lawyers have absolutely no clue.

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romothesavior
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby romothesavior » Wed Apr 24, 2013 10:07 pm

The next person who accuses the OP of trolling or flaming or not being real is going to take a timeout.

T4Rockstar
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby T4Rockstar » Wed Apr 24, 2013 10:19 pm

rinkrat19 wrote:
T4Rockstar wrote:
Purplebook wrote:
shntn wrote:Retake, ED UVA.



This never gets old. :lol:

That being said, I'm pretty certain someone just made this thread for the fun of it. This is not a real situation.



This is definitely a real situation. Lol. I am seriously trying to sell living in my parent's house for another year while studying for the LSAT. I may be able to do some SEO work for the year, and make a little money while doing it. I hate computers though and this work is sooooo boring. I'd really like to retake. I've been speaking with some lawyers I know and the input is mixed. Some say that outside of the top elite law schools, it doesn't much matter where you went as long as your in the top 25 percent. Of course, the ones I know that went to GWU and Hoffstra are balling out of control with their money. So I dunno... I definitely don't know any big players out of the tier 4. Going to keep pushing the rents and hope I get a year long reprieve.
Unless these lawyers graduated in 2009 or later, their advice on school choice and job placement is literally worthless. The market has completely changed and current lawyers have absolutely no clue.



Yea. That is kind of what I am thinking too. These guys graduated before the big problems. One is literally a genius. He was doing calculus work books with his twin brother (who is doing a PHD/MD program at University of Chicago medical) while we were in middle school taking algebra 1 honors. So when it came to numbers... tax law just worked for him. The other one posted a pic on FB the other day standing next to the vice president in a private home. He started at St. Thomas and ended up at George Washington after placing #4 in his class. I know some Nova graduates who are doing okay. They are like ADA attorneys and not making any real money. However; it seems like an ADA type job is actually a fairly good stepping stone.

I am trying to convince the folks. My father lined up a first summer internship working with some attorneys that represent the PBA (Police Benevolency Association). Again, if I could get into maritime law and work in the law enforcement area concerning Marine Patrol, Homeland Security waterways, etc. I am from Fort Lauderdale and this is the yachting capital of the world. I would even be content taking the JD and becoming a marine patrol officer. Perhaps the JD would be useful for promotion within law enforcement. I know most people have to "pay their dues" to get into marine patrol. I wonder if maybe the legal qualification of a JD would give me an increased chance to fill candidacy for such a position.

Anyways... I am going to push for the LSAT retake. UM would really be the place to go for admirality, and I don't want to close doors before I even start. Another year in the guestroom IS going to kill me though. I will be a shell of a man by the time I finish studying. LOL.

T4Rockstar
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby T4Rockstar » Wed Apr 24, 2013 10:23 pm

Oh... and I asked Florida Coastal about how the numbers would work for the 2 year program.

$25,000 scholarship
Tuition Scholarship
Summer 2013 $15,900 $10,166

Fall 2013 $19,549 $12,500

Spring Intersession $3,317 $2,121

Spring 2013 $19,549 $12,500

Summer 2014 $16,536 $10,573

They bump up my scholarship a bit, and then give you the last semester for free. Of course, like others have noted, I would probably have an awful time trying to transfer in this kind of course layout.

T4Rockstar
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Re: POS school, but practically free and 2 years!

Postby T4Rockstar » Wed Apr 24, 2013 10:24 pm

That didn't post right... the numbers on the right are the scholarship coverage and the left is the actualy price of tuition.




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