Florida State Vs Tulane - HELP!

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markymark0819
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Florida State Vs Tulane - HELP!

Postby markymark0819 » Tue Apr 16, 2013 1:01 am

FSU has told me if I follow a simple checklist I'll get residency. That brings it to 80k and there may be a scholarship (I find out in a few weeks). They held my app for six months, so my deposit is due at Tulane before I hear about possible scholarships. I got an extension, but I still need to decide to put a seat deposit down this week.

After scholarships, Tulane is 30k per year + living expenses... 90k+. FSU will be cheaper regardless of what happens 80k or less. It may even be "significantly" cheaper if I get any scholarships...

Still, when going into six figures worth of debt, I don't think 10k or 20k or even 30k will really make my decision for me.

I know they have regional clout more or less, but I think I'd be okay in Florida if I go to FSU, or if I go to Tulane I'd be happy in New Orleans, Houston, NYC (Tulane's three big markets).

I'm torn in what to do...

I have an engineering degree, am considering Environmental, IP, or Patent Law.

I think I fit into the FSU style of life and campus more than Tulane's, but I felt very comfortable at admitted students day at Tulane.
FSU was my number one for some time, but Tulane seems to offer more options and flexibility for someone so undecided.
I love New Orleans, but I also love big-time college football and the idea of a fun campus..
They're ranked the same, both have strong programs...
Both schools have been incredibly open and honest answering all my questions...
Debt will be approximately the same, salary figures are more transparent at FSU but mediocre at both...

Any idea what I should do? Any considerations I'm leaving out? Any help is appreciated!!!

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WokeUpInACar
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Re: Florida State Vs Tulane - HELP!

Postby WokeUpInACar » Tue Apr 16, 2013 1:06 am

Both of these schools are too expensive as is. How many times have you taken the LSAT?

dissonance1848
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Re: Florida State Vs Tulane - HELP!

Postby dissonance1848 » Tue Apr 16, 2013 1:08 am

FSU and Tulane are not worth what you would pay in COA.

Also, where do you have ties? That is going to determine where you can go (except for NYC, DC, and to a lesser extent Chicago).

These schools, even with IP, aren't going to give you a good chance at paying off your debt anyways.

You need to retake and reapply.

markymark0819
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Re: Florida State Vs Tulane - HELP!

Postby markymark0819 » Tue Apr 16, 2013 1:13 am

I took the LSAT once, cold, with a 161.

I have no ties anywhere.

markymark0819
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Re: Florida State Vs Tulane - HELP!

Postby markymark0819 » Tue Apr 16, 2013 1:16 am

I'm okay with the debt situation. I recognize that nearly everyone on here and elsewhere suggests not taking on this kind of debt for this kind of ranking and this kind of job prospects... Being told not to go to law school is not why I opened this forum, though I do appreciate the post and the time you took to post it.

I'm more looking for a comparison of the two schools... if it makes you feel better offering advice, let's pretend I got a full ride to both and didn't get in anywhere else.

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Br3v
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Re: Florida State Vs Tulane - HELP!

Postby Br3v » Tue Apr 16, 2013 1:23 am

markymark0819 wrote:I took the LSAT once, cold, with a 161.

I have no ties anywhere.


You realize that a cold 161 is relatively high? If you studied for 3 months and retook you could be looking at mid 170s

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WokeUpInACar
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Re: Florida State Vs Tulane - HELP!

Postby WokeUpInACar » Tue Apr 16, 2013 1:41 am

markymark0819 wrote:I took the LSAT once, cold, with a 161.

I have no ties anywhere.

DUDE. No one here is telling you not to go to law school EVER, but by not retaking you would literally be lighting hundreds of thousands in actual money and future earnings on fire. A 161 cold is an EXCEPTIONAL score. With a few months of dedicated preparation you should EASILY break 170. The LSAT is 100% learnable, and people on this board have gone from cold scores in the 140s to breaking 170 after extensive prep. You should be considering top schools like Duke, Vanderbilt, and UVA instead of these mediocre ones, and all of those are absolutely within your reach.

Not retaking the LSAT would easily be the worst financial decision of your entire life.

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Tekrul
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Re: Florida State Vs Tulane - HELP!

Postby Tekrul » Tue Apr 16, 2013 1:46 am

WokeUpInACar wrote:
markymark0819 wrote:I took the LSAT once, cold, with a 161.

I have no ties anywhere.

DUDE. No one here is telling you not to go to law school EVER, but by not retaking you would literally be lighting hundreds of thousands in actual money and future earnings on fire. A 161 cold is an EXCEPTIONAL score. With a few months of dedicated preparation you should EASILY break 170. The LSAT is 100% learnable, and people on this board have gone from cold scores in the 140s to breaking 170 after extensive prep. You should be considering top schools like Duke, Vanderbilt, and UVA instead of these mediocre ones, and all of those are absolutely within your reach.

Not retaking the LSAT would easily be the worst financial decision of your entire life.


You just got the best advice you could get. I advise you heed it.

sflyr2016
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Re: Florida State Vs Tulane - HELP!

Postby sflyr2016 » Tue Apr 16, 2013 1:52 am

markymark0819 wrote:I'm okay with the debt situation. I recognize that nearly everyone on here and elsewhere suggests not taking on this kind of debt for this kind of ranking and this kind of job prospects... Being told not to go to law school is not why I opened this forum, though I do appreciate the post and the time you took to post it.

I'm more looking for a comparison of the two schools... if it makes you feel better offering advice, let's pretend I got a full ride to both and didn't get in anywhere else.


I think they will both lock you up into their respective regions. FSU is very well respected in Florida, and even though they don't typically do that great in SFla biglaw, I think it's more self-selection than anything else. It holds up, I think, with UF and UM as far as its reputation down here in Miami. Also, I think being in the capital is worth something if you take advantage of those opportunities. My cousin went to Tulane and then transferred into GULC because he knew that Tulane would limit him to that region (he was top 3% after 1l), but FSU will do the same. However, I would rather be stuck in Florida for the rest of my life, than Louisiana. I would gun hard, aim at Sterns Weaver in Miami, Gray-Robinson, and Gunster, which are big firms that recruit heavy at all the Florida schools, not to mention Weaver is an FSU grad. Also, FSU may give you a shot at Atlanta, along with, Tampa, Orlando, and Miami. Life wouldn't be all bad at anyone of those cities.
Last edited by sflyr2016 on Tue Apr 16, 2013 1:55 am, edited 1 time in total.

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WokeUpInACar
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Re: Florida State Vs Tulane - HELP!

Postby WokeUpInACar » Tue Apr 16, 2013 1:55 am

joeant wrote:
markymark0819 wrote:I'm okay with the debt situation. I recognize that nearly everyone on here and elsewhere suggests not taking on this kind of debt for this kind of ranking and this kind of job prospects... Being told not to go to law school is not why I opened this forum, though I do appreciate the post and the time you took to post it.

I'm more looking for a comparison of the two schools... if it makes you feel better offering advice, let's pretend I got a full ride to both and didn't get in anywhere else.


I think they will both lock you up into their respective regions. I think FSU is very well respected in Florida, and even though they don't typically do that great in SFla biglaw, I think it's more self-selection than anything else. It holds up, I think, with UF and UM as far as its reputation down here in Miami. Also, I think being in the capital is worth something if you take advantage of those opportunities. My cousin went to Tulane and then transferred into GULC because he knew that Tulane would limit him to that region (he was top 3% after 1l and also got into Berk), but FSU will do the same. However, I would rather be stuck in Florida for the rest of my life, than Louisiana. I would gun hard, aim at Sterns Weaver in Miami, Gray-Robinson, and Gunster, which are big firms that recruit heavy at all the Florida schools, not to mention Weaver is an FSU grad. Also, FSU may give you a shot at Atlanta, along with, Tampa, Orlando, and Miami. Life wouldn't be all bad at anyone of those cities.

You are an awful, awful, poster and this is terrible advice. Wby don't you make 3 more threads trying to justify BC at sticker?

sflyr2016
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Re: Florida State Vs Tulane - HELP!

Postby sflyr2016 » Tue Apr 16, 2013 1:56 am

WokeUpInACar wrote:
joeant wrote:
markymark0819 wrote:I'm okay with the debt situation. I recognize that nearly everyone on here and elsewhere suggests not taking on this kind of debt for this kind of ranking and this kind of job prospects... Being told not to go to law school is not why I opened this forum, though I do appreciate the post and the time you took to post it.

I'm more looking for a comparison of the two schools... if it makes you feel better offering advice, let's pretend I got a full ride to both and didn't get in anywhere else.


I think they will both lock you up into their respective regions. I think FSU is very well respected in Florida, and even though they don't typically do that great in SFla biglaw, I think it's more self-selection than anything else. It holds up, I think, with UF and UM as far as its reputation down here in Miami. Also, I think being in the capital is worth something if you take advantage of those opportunities. My cousin went to Tulane and then transferred into GULC because he knew that Tulane would limit him to that region (he was top 3% after 1l and also got into Berk), but FSU will do the same. However, I would rather be stuck in Florida for the rest of my life, than Louisiana. I would gun hard, aim at Sterns Weaver in Miami, Gray-Robinson, and Gunster, which are big firms that recruit heavy at all the Florida schools, not to mention Weaver is an FSU grad. Also, FSU may give you a shot at Atlanta, along with, Tampa, Orlando, and Miami. Life wouldn't be all bad at anyone of those cities.

You are a awful, awful, poster and this is terrible advice. Wby don't you make 3 more threads trying to justify BC at sticker?


BC with 1/3 scholarship. I hope you aren't a law student. If so, I question your productivity..

TheNextAmendment
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Re: Florida State Vs Tulane - HELP!

Postby TheNextAmendment » Tue Apr 16, 2013 7:29 am

joeant wrote:
WokeUpInACar wrote:
joeant wrote:
markymark0819 wrote:I'm okay with the debt situation. I recognize that nearly everyone on here and elsewhere suggests not taking on this kind of debt for this kind of ranking and this kind of job prospects... Being told not to go to law school is not why I opened this forum, though I do appreciate the post and the time you took to post it.

I'm more looking for a comparison of the two schools... if it makes you feel better offering advice, let's pretend I got a full ride to both and didn't get in anywhere else.


I think they will both lock you up into their respective regions. I think FSU is very well respected in Florida, and even though they don't typically do that great in SFla biglaw, I think it's more self-selection than anything else. It holds up, I think, with UF and UM as far as its reputation down here in Miami. Also, I think being in the capital is worth something if you take advantage of those opportunities. My cousin went to Tulane and then transferred into GULC because he knew that Tulane would limit him to that region (he was top 3% after 1l and also got into Berk), but FSU will do the same. However, I would rather be stuck in Florida for the rest of my life, than Louisiana. I would gun hard, aim at Sterns Weaver in Miami, Gray-Robinson, and Gunster, which are big firms that recruit heavy at all the Florida schools, not to mention Weaver is an FSU grad. Also, FSU may give you a shot at Atlanta, along with, Tampa, Orlando, and Miami. Life wouldn't be all bad at anyone of those cities.

You are a awful, awful, poster and this is terrible advice. Wby don't you make 3 more threads trying to justify BC at sticker?


BC with 1/3 scholarship. I hope you aren't a law student. If so, I question your productivity..


ugh you're a moron

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cahwc12
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Re: Florida State Vs Tulane - HELP!

Postby cahwc12 » Tue Apr 16, 2013 7:56 am

joeant wrote:
WokeUpInACar wrote:
joeant wrote:
markymark0819 wrote:I'm okay with the debt situation. I recognize that nearly everyone on here and elsewhere suggests not taking on this kind of debt for this kind of ranking and this kind of job prospects... Being told not to go to law school is not why I opened this forum, though I do appreciate the post and the time you took to post it.

I'm more looking for a comparison of the two schools... if it makes you feel better offering advice, let's pretend I got a full ride to both and didn't get in anywhere else.


I think they will both lock you up into their respective regions. I think FSU is very well respected in Florida, and even though they don't typically do that great in SFla biglaw, I think it's more self-selection than anything else. It holds up, I think, with UF and UM as far as its reputation down here in Miami. Also, I think being in the capital is worth something if you take advantage of those opportunities. My cousin went to Tulane and then transferred into GULC because he knew that Tulane would limit him to that region (he was top 3% after 1l and also got into Berk), but FSU will do the same. However, I would rather be stuck in Florida for the rest of my life, than Louisiana. I would gun hard, aim at Sterns Weaver in Miami, Gray-Robinson, and Gunster, which are big firms that recruit heavy at all the Florida schools, not to mention Weaver is an FSU grad. Also, FSU may give you a shot at Atlanta, along with, Tampa, Orlando, and Miami. Life wouldn't be all bad at anyone of those cities.

You are a awful, awful, poster and this is terrible advice. Wby don't you make 3 more threads trying to justify BC at sticker?


BC with 1/3 scholarship. I hope you aren't a law student. If so, I question your productivity..


You think paying 75% of sticker COA is a scholarship (because you have to pay COL too)? Do you consider getting $1000 cash and no money down on a new car a scholarship? You're bragging about going $200k+ in debt like it's some badge of honor.

Your advice isn't that terrible, it's just that after OP admits he didnt' study for the LSAT and his career goals, his options aren't really his only options, and he would be a fool to not retake the LSAT and go to a much better school. If he were locked into only these two (which is usually never the case) I think that advice would be reasonable.

rad lulz
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Re: Florida State Vs Tulane - HELP!

Postby rad lulz » Tue Apr 16, 2013 8:43 am

joeant wrote:
markymark0819 wrote:I'm okay with the debt situation. I recognize that nearly everyone on here and elsewhere suggests not taking on this kind of debt for this kind of ranking and this kind of job prospects... Being told not to go to law school is not why I opened this forum, though I do appreciate the post and the time you took to post it.

I'm more looking for a comparison of the two schools... if it makes you feel better offering advice, let's pretend I got a full ride to both and didn't get in anywhere else.


I think they will both lock you up into their respective regions. FSU is very well respected in Florida, and even though they don't typically do that great in SFla biglaw, I think it's more self-selection than anything else. It holds up, I think, with UF and UM as far as its reputation down here in Miami. Also, I think being in the capital is worth something if you take advantage of those opportunities. My cousin went to Tulane and then transferred into GULC because he knew that Tulane would limit him to that region (he was top 3% after 1l), but FSU will do the same. However, I would rather be stuck in Florida for the rest of my life, than Louisiana. I would gun hard, aim at Sterns Weaver in Miami, Gray-Robinson, and Gunster, which are big firms that recruit heavy at all the Florida schools, not to mention Weaver is an FSU grad. Also, FSU may give you a shot at Atlanta, along with, Tampa, Orlando, and Miami. Life wouldn't be all bad at anyone of those cities.

"Just do Stearns Weaver bro"

lol wut

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hephaestus
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Re: Florida State Vs Tulane - HELP!

Postby hephaestus » Tue Apr 16, 2013 8:57 am

joeant wrote:
markymark0819 wrote:I'm okay with the debt situation. I recognize that nearly everyone on here and elsewhere suggests not taking on this kind of debt for this kind of ranking and this kind of job prospects... Being told not to go to law school is not why I opened this forum, though I do appreciate the post and the time you took to post it.

I'm more looking for a comparison of the two schools... if it makes you feel better offering advice, let's pretend I got a full ride to both and didn't get in anywhere else.


I think they will both lock you up into their respective regions. FSU is very well respected in Florida, and even though they don't typically do that great in SFla biglaw, I think it's more self-selection than anything else. It holds up, I think, with UF and UM as far as its reputation down here in Miami. Also, I think being in the capital is worth something if you take advantage of those opportunities. My cousin went to Tulane and then transferred into GULC because he knew that Tulane would limit him to that region (he was top 3% after 1l), but FSU will do the same. However, I would rather be stuck in Florida for the rest of my life, than Louisiana. I would gun hard, aim at Sterns Weaver in Miami, Gray-Robinson, and Gunster, which are big firms that recruit heavy at all the Florida schools, not to mention Weaver is an FSU grad. Also, FSU may give you a shot at Atlanta, along with, Tampa, Orlando, and Miami. Life wouldn't be all bad at anyone of those cities.

1. Do you honestly believe that lack of South Florida big law placement is self-selection? Like students are actively saying, "well, I'm unemployed, but that's better than having to do big law in Miami."
2. "Just gun hard" is phenomenally bad advice. Literally all of your classmates will be working very hard, knowing that only a small percentage will have a good outcome.
3. These firms "recruit heavily" in the sense that they take the top 10% + law review. If you look at recently hired associates, almost all have flagship law review.
4. Good for your cousin but there's a 97% chance you won't be top 3%. Going to law school with the thought of transferring is a fools errand.
5. If you knew anything about the Atlanta market, you'd know that it's not some sort of back up market accessible to Florida students. It's one of the worst performing markets currently.
6. OP, you say you're "ok with the debt." Student loan debt is not dischargeable in bankruptcy. There's a high chance from these schools you won't be able to service your debt, and it'll take 30 years to pay off. During that time, you'll have difficulty securing a home loan and other financial products.
7. Retake or don't go. Don't commit debt suicide.

sflyr2016
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Re: Florida State Vs Tulane - HELP!

Postby sflyr2016 » Tue Apr 16, 2013 9:01 am

I think they will both lock you up into their respective regions. I think FSU is very well respected in Florida, and even though they don't typically do that great in SFla biglaw, I think it's more self-selection than anything else. It holds up, I think, with UF and UM as far as its reputation down here in Miami. Also, I think being in the capital is worth something if you take advantage of those opportunities. My cousin went to Tulane and then transferred into GULC because he knew that Tulane would limit him to that region (he was top 3% after 1l and also got into Berk), but FSU will do the same. However, I would rather be stuck in Florida for the rest of my life, than Louisiana. I would gun hard, aim at Sterns Weaver in Miami, Gray-Robinson, and Gunster, which are big firms that recruit heavy at all the Florida schools, not to mention Weaver is an FSU grad. Also, FSU may give you a shot at Atlanta, along with, Tampa, Orlando, and Miami. Life wouldn't be all bad at anyone of those cities.[/quote]
You are a awful, awful, poster and this is terrible advice. Wby don't you make 3 more threads trying to justify BC at sticker?[/quote]

BC with 1/3 scholarship. I hope you aren't a law student. If so, I question your productivity..[/quote]

You think paying 75% of sticker COA is a scholarship (because you have to pay COL too)? Do you consider getting $1000 cash and no money down on a new car a scholarship? You're bragging about going $200k+ in debt like it's some badge of honor.

Your advice isn't that terrible, it's just that after OP admits he didnt' study for the LSAT and his career goals, his options aren't really his only options, and he would be a fool to not retake the LSAT and go to a much better school. If he were locked into only these two (which is usually never the case) I think that advice would be reasonable.[/quote]

Not bragging. Far from it. I was correcting him. And if I had a package worth bragging about -- why would I seek input on a website as much as I have?

As far as my advice, I, unlike you, answered his actual question. I gave him some input about the topic at hand, "Florida State vs. Tulane" without parenting him on money management or the lsat. He's an adult. He should be damn well aware of the risks of accruing that much debt, this early in life, in a profession that is so unhealthy that law student's are seeking class action suits against the very institutions they attended as their first act of lawyering. Statistically, law school is a bad investment that shows terrible returns, unless of course your are driven and truly passionate about what you want to do. But even then, there is high probability of being forced into work you won't enjoy and being burdened by debt. Still, having a law degree will help you in more areas than just law, but I won't get into the merits into why earning a J.D. is a good thing.

Let the OP decide on his own. And if my opinion about FSU in Florida gives him even a sliver of perspective to better help him with his decision, then I actually did what the OP asked for -- I helped.
Last edited by sflyr2016 on Tue Apr 16, 2013 9:16 am, edited 1 time in total.

sflyr2016
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Re: Florida State Vs Tulane - HELP!

Postby sflyr2016 » Tue Apr 16, 2013 9:13 am

You think paying 75% of sticker COA is a scholarship
[/quote]

Damn, your math is bad... Did you mean 67%? Also, It comes out to a little less than 60% but I say 1/3 to keep it simple and include books, etc.

And yes, not paying full tuition because of awarded merit is by definition a scholarship. Did you mean to ask whether I thought it was a good scholarship? In that case no. And that's why I am struggling with my decision.
Last edited by sflyr2016 on Tue Apr 16, 2013 9:14 am, edited 1 time in total.

rad lulz
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Re: Florida State Vs Tulane - HELP!

Postby rad lulz » Tue Apr 16, 2013 9:13 am

joeant wrote:He's an adult. He should be damn well aware of the risks of accruing that much debt,

But he's not

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Gunnar Stahl
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Re: Florida State Vs Tulane - HELP!

Postby Gunnar Stahl » Tue Apr 16, 2013 9:31 am

Tekrul wrote:
WokeUpInACar wrote:
markymark0819 wrote:I took the LSAT once, cold, with a 161.

I have no ties anywhere.

DUDE. No one here is telling you not to go to law school EVER, but by not retaking you would literally be lighting hundreds of thousands in actual money and future earnings on fire. A 161 cold is an EXCEPTIONAL score. With a few months of dedicated preparation you should EASILY break 170. The LSAT is 100% learnable, and people on this board have gone from cold scores in the 140s to breaking 170 after extensive prep. You should be considering top schools like Duke, Vanderbilt, and UVA instead of these mediocre ones, and all of those are absolutely within your reach.

Not retaking the LSAT would easily be the worst financial decision of your entire life.


You just got the best advice you could get. I advise you heed it.

envisciguy
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Re: Florida State Vs Tulane - HELP!

Postby envisciguy » Tue Apr 16, 2013 12:29 pm

WokeUpInACar wrote:
markymark0819 wrote:I took the LSAT once, cold, with a 161.

I have no ties anywhere.

DUDE. No one here is telling you not to go to law school EVER, but by not retaking you would literally be lighting hundreds of thousands in actual money and future earnings on fire. A 161 cold is an EXCEPTIONAL score. With a few months of dedicated preparation you should EASILY break 170. The LSAT is 100% learnable, and people on this board have gone from cold scores in the 140s to breaking 170 after extensive prep. You should be considering top schools like Duke, Vanderbilt, and UVA instead of these mediocre ones, and all of those are absolutely within your reach.

Not retaking the LSAT would easily be the worst financial decision of your entire life.


PLEASE heed this advice. I got a 156 on my first cold practice test and after studying got to a 170. You're doing yourself a huge disservice not retaking. If you got your score up just a couple points, you could be looking at better schools or at the very least, these same schools with minimal debt.




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