Texas v. Northwestern

(Rankings, Profiles, Tuition, Student Life, . . . )

where to, yo?

Austin (not more than $8,822)
4
11%
Northwestern (not more than $21,380)
32
89%
 
Total votes: 36

bakaaw
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Texas v. Northwestern

Postby bakaaw » Mon Apr 15, 2013 2:23 pm

Ok internet, whatcha think:

It's nearing the END and I've got a difficult but excellent decision to make. Any help y'all could provide in steering me to the better decision would be great and thoroughly appreciated.

164 October (did real bad) --> 174 December / 3.8 GPA.

Deciding betwixt $150k at NU and full tuition/fees at UT. (Ruled out NYU/Columbia/etc with baby$ because, while sexy, that's just too damn expensive; would consider paying some $ for H, but I'm on the WL post JS1).

Parents will be paying around $14k/yr towards living expenses and I've got a 10k education award I can use towards the same, which brings total COA to about $9k over three years at UT (or nothing with a semi-lucrative SA) and $21k over three at NU, which I'd be financing with loans.

Want to work in Atlanta (from Atlanta, did UG here, been working here 4 yrs since, love it, but want to adventure for a bit elsewhere).

I have a lovely partner, who I love the shit out of, and who will be starting a library science master's program at the same time and can do it either at UT or in Chicago, although UT is probably a bit better for her. She is down for either, but if there was no me, she'd prolly move West to Texas for her schooling.

I'm open to a variety of fields and could be down to accumulate some capital with Atlanta BigLaw, but as much as I like money, I also tend to feel like I should do more to make things less shitty for others, so I'll be working a good bit in a public-interest vein long-term. My real interest, if viable, would be doing Plaintiff-side civil rights litigation re: prison and police misconduct. I'm attracted to this because it can do some good reforming systemic abuses and also has the potential, if I'm not at a non-profit, to be pretty lucrative if I can find the right cases.

I would find clerking super-interesting and enjoyable, and it would also provide some excellent training for the work I want to do.

Northwestern has a great clinic in this field, the MacArthur Justice center, and is a great setting because Chicago police have done some really stupid and horrendous things. I feel very confident I would learn the skills I need to bring this kind of practice back to Atlanta where it is definitely needed. Texas, no stranger itself to the powerful abusing their powers, is starting a civil rights clinic next year that will have a less-established pedigree and a broader focus, but the faculty seem super-talented and interesting.

Northwestern seems like it has a substantially better program for what I'm looking to do, better job numbers if I want to sell out for some time, and a better history of placement back to Atlanta. I also thought more highly of the professors/students/facilities after visiting each for ASW. In short, I think its a noticeably better school. Also, we have some amazing friends in Chicago... BUT, I would be happier living in Austin for 3 years if you took law school out of the equation. Austin is an amazing playground of my favorite things: sun, tacos, tequila. Also, I'm a little scared of the cold and my lady is all the more so.

So... what should I/we do?

And what am I not considering that I should?

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shifty_eyed
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Re: Texas v. Northwestern

Postby shifty_eyed » Mon Apr 15, 2013 2:26 pm

I think you can't go wrong with either choice. If you preferred Chicago to Austin, it would be a no-brainer for NU.

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WokeUpInACar
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Re: Texas v. Northwestern

Postby WokeUpInACar » Mon Apr 15, 2013 2:26 pm

Northwestern, not close.

curious66
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Re: Texas v. Northwestern

Postby curious66 » Mon Apr 15, 2013 2:29 pm

Northwestern -- as long as you don't mind the bitter cold.

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Blumpbeef
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Re: Texas v. Northwestern

Postby Blumpbeef » Mon Apr 15, 2013 2:30 pm

WokeUpInACar wrote:Northwestern, not close.


Ya, NU is better for Atlanta.

The one thing that would be in TXs favor is if you actually want to work in TX after graduation, otherwise there is no reason not to go to NU.

NU got Texas's Clerkship advisor and hopefully we will be getting much better clerkship numbers starting this year and next.

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untar614
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Re: Texas v. Northwestern

Postby untar614 » Mon Apr 15, 2013 2:31 pm

WokeUpInACar wrote:Northwestern, not close.

This.

I too was heavily considering going to UT prior to getting the scholarship from NW, thinking I could pull a full ride out of em. But with 150k at NW, the job prospects are just much better that such a small amount of debt makes it not even compareable, especially since youre not aiming for working in texas. Hell, if ur lucky enough to pull off a 1L SA, you would end up with next to no debt at NW too (which I'm hoping dat dere patent bar can do for me).

edit: oh yeah and as stated above, NW steals UT's staff.

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shifty_eyed
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Re: Texas v. Northwestern

Postby shifty_eyed » Mon Apr 15, 2013 2:33 pm

Blumpbeef wrote:
WokeUpInACar wrote:Northwestern, not close.


Ya, NU is better for Atlanta.

The one thing that would be in TXs favor is if you actually want to work in TX after graduation, otherwise there is no reason not to go to NU.

NU got Texas's Clerkship advisor and hopefully we will be getting much better clerkship numbers starting this year and next.


I think the weather could be a big factor if they REALLY hate the cold. Also, UT has a great MLIS program and in-state tuition is probably cheaper than Chicago or Northwestern's (thought I don't know much about how grants work for MLIS programs).

I did vote for Northwestern, but I think it's a close call!

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Blumpbeef
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Re: Texas v. Northwestern

Postby Blumpbeef » Mon Apr 15, 2013 2:36 pm

THe cold really isn't a big deal, if you're a law student. It's probably going to be a bigger issue for your spouse who isn't going to be locked up in the library all day.

I've lived in warm climates my whole life and it wasn't a real issue. If anything, this nice spring weather the past couple of days bothers me more because I have to stay in and study and don't get to enjoy it.

nonprofit-prophet
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Re: Texas v. Northwestern

Postby nonprofit-prophet » Mon Apr 15, 2013 2:45 pm

untar614 wrote:
WokeUpInACar wrote:Northwestern, not close.

This.

I too was heavily considering going to UT prior to getting the scholarship from NW, thinking I could pull a full ride out of em. But with 150k at NW, the job prospects are just much better that such a small amount of debt makes it not even compareable, especially since youre not aiming for working in texas. Hell, if ur lucky enough to pull off a 1L SA, you would end up with next to no debt at NW too (which I'm hoping dat dere patent bar can do for me).

edit: oh yeah and as stated above, NW steals UT's staff.



That's hilarious. You "stole" Emily Kadens. Our current clerkship advisor is doing just as well, if not better than Kadens. We "stole" two of your leading law and econ professors. So no, NW doesn't have the upper hand in wooing away our faculty.


Edit for link, because apparently the people in here need some facts.

http://leiterlawschool.typepad.com/leiter/2009/03/a-big-hiring-coup-for-texas-avraham-wickelgren-from-northwestern.html

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untar614
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Re: Texas v. Northwestern

Postby untar614 » Mon Apr 15, 2013 2:56 pm

nonprofit-prophet wrote:
untar614 wrote:
WokeUpInACar wrote:Northwestern, not close.

This.

I too was heavily considering going to UT prior to getting the scholarship from NW, thinking I could pull a full ride out of em. But with 150k at NW, the job prospects are just much better that such a small amount of debt makes it not even compareable, especially since youre not aiming for working in texas. Hell, if ur lucky enough to pull off a 1L SA, you would end up with next to no debt at NW too (which I'm hoping dat dere patent bar can do for me).

edit: oh yeah and as stated above, NW steals UT's staff.



That's hilarious. You "stole" Emily Kadens. Our current clerkship advisor is doing just as well, if not better than Kadens. We "stole" two of your leading law and econ professors. So no, NW doesn't have the upper hand in wooing away our faculty.


Edit for link, because apparently the people in here need some facts.

http://leiterlawschool.typepad.com/leiter/2009/03/a-big-hiring-coup-for-texas-avraham-wickelgren-from-northwestern.html

Yeesh, I didn't mean to upset anyone. It was something joked about from ASW. They made fun of the dean for pulling ppl, including I think his wife or a close relative iirc, from UT.

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Icculus
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Re: Texas v. Northwestern

Postby Icculus » Mon Apr 15, 2013 3:01 pm

nonprofit-prophet wrote:
untar614 wrote:
WokeUpInACar wrote:Northwestern, not close.

This.

I too was heavily considering going to UT prior to getting the scholarship from NW, thinking I could pull a full ride out of em. But with 150k at NW, the job prospects are just much better that such a small amount of debt makes it not even compareable, especially since youre not aiming for working in texas. Hell, if ur lucky enough to pull off a 1L SA, you would end up with next to no debt at NW too (which I'm hoping dat dere patent bar can do for me).

edit: oh yeah and as stated above, NW steals UT's staff.



That's hilarious. You "stole" Emily Kadens. Our current clerkship advisor is doing just as well, if not better than Kadens. We "stole" two of your leading law and econ professors. So no, NW doesn't have the upper hand in wooing away our faculty.


Edit for link, because apparently the people in here need some facts.

http://leiterlawschool.typepad.com/leiter/2009/03/a-big-hiring-coup-for-texas-avraham-wickelgren-from-northwestern.html


Emily Kadens is fucking insane.

Edit: and yes if was his wife. /off topic.

OP: I would say NU is the winner here considering employment numbers.

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rinkrat19
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Re: Texas v. Northwestern

Postby rinkrat19 » Mon Apr 15, 2013 3:09 pm

nonprofit-prophet wrote:That's hilarious. You "stole" Emily Kadens. Our current clerkship advisor is doing just as well, if not better than Kadens. We "stole" two of your leading law and econ professors. So no, NW doesn't have the upper hand in wooing away our faculty.


Edit for link, because apparently the people in here need some facts.

http://leiterlawschool.typepad.com/leiter/2009/03/a-big-hiring-coup-for-texas-avraham-wickelgren-from-northwestern.html
Yikes, sensitive much?

OP, I agree with the general consensus. NU is better unless you have a burning desire to work in Texas.

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Cobretti
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Re: Texas v. Northwestern

Postby Cobretti » Mon Apr 15, 2013 3:24 pm

Sounds like NU either way, but what school is your SO looking at in Chicago? Is it NU/uchi or something that's a big step down from UT? Unless you're engaged it shouldn't really matter, but just curious.

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franklyscarlet
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Re: Texas v. Northwestern

Postby franklyscarlet » Mon Apr 15, 2013 3:31 pm

OP, Texas native here. I won't say it was the easiest transition ever and I started to miss Texas when we hit March and I was still wearing a coat, but I love it here. As for tacos, don't worry, I've figured out where to send people for real(ish) ones :D you'll adjust.

bakaaw
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Re: Texas v. Northwestern

Postby bakaaw » Mon Apr 15, 2013 4:05 pm

Thank you!

I hear y'all and am leaning North myself, but I thought it would be closer...
No deference to the lady? No weight to Austin's considerable loveliness? And might job prospects, while huge, be reduced relatively as criteria when COA is so low?

Also, clarification about the SO's library situation because library school is strange: so one of the reasons she's more into UT is because she'd be actually taking classes with a cohort of future librarians. This wouldn't be the case in Chicago. She got into another top 10 program but that program does most of its classes online and helps set its kids up with internships wherever they're living. Job prospects for each program are about the same.

franklyscarlet wrote:OP, Texas native here. I won't say it was the easiest transition ever and I started to miss Texas when we hit March and I was still wearing a coat, but I love it here. As for tacos, don't worry, I've figured out where to send people for real(ish) ones :D you'll adjust.


Yeah, Chicago has some pretty great Mexican food, but my impression is you kind of have to seek it out, whereas in Austin its hard not to stumble into something delicious.

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Cobretti
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Re: Texas v. Northwestern

Postby Cobretti » Mon Apr 15, 2013 4:20 pm

Your COA at both are effectively zero, UT doesn't get a boost for being slightly cheaper.

bakaaw
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Re: Texas v. Northwestern

Postby bakaaw » Mon Apr 15, 2013 4:32 pm

Cobretti wrote:Your COA at both are effectively zero, UT doesn't get a boost for being slightly cheaper.


I hear you. I'm just saying that being in the fortunate position of emerging essentially debt-free either way puts job prospects a little lower on the list of really important factors. I'm less-fucked if I strike out at UT with no debt than if I had massive debts.

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Micdiddy
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Re: Texas v. Northwestern

Postby Micdiddy » Mon Apr 15, 2013 4:40 pm

Isn't the whole point of going to law school for job prospects? How can financial concerns not always be the most important factor (debt + job prospects)? If debt is not in the equation, then job prospects is the only thing that matters, imo.
Yes, yes, I will live a tiny bit of room for what area you would like to live in for 3 years, and other random concerns that should not even be discussed unless job prospects are relatively equal. In this case they are not. NU by a mile.

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untar614
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Re: Texas v. Northwestern

Postby untar614 » Mon Apr 15, 2013 4:42 pm

bakaaw wrote:
Cobretti wrote:Your COA at both are effectively zero, UT doesn't get a boost for being slightly cheaper.


I hear you. I'm just saying that being in the fortunate position of emerging essentially debt-free either way puts job prospects a little lower on the list of really important factors. I'm less-fucked if I strike out at UT with no debt than if I had massive debts.


Yes, but isn't the whole point of going to law school getting a law job? Job prospects are generally weighed agaisnt COA i na cost-benefit comparison. But if the cost is negligible, then really you should only be considering the benefit i.e. job prospects.

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Micdiddy
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Re: Texas v. Northwestern

Postby Micdiddy » Mon Apr 15, 2013 4:45 pm

untar614 wrote:
bakaaw wrote:
Cobretti wrote:Your COA at both are effectively zero, UT doesn't get a boost for being slightly cheaper.


I hear you. I'm just saying that being in the fortunate position of emerging essentially debt-free either way puts job prospects a little lower on the list of really important factors. I'm less-fucked if I strike out at UT with no debt than if I had massive debts.


Yes, but isn't the whole point of going to law school getting a law job? Job prospects are generally weighed agaisnt COA i na cost-benefit comparison. But if the cost is negligible, then really you should only be considering the benefit i.e. job prospects.


someone got scooped 8)

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Ohiobumpkin
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Re: Texas v. Northwestern

Postby Ohiobumpkin » Mon Apr 15, 2013 4:46 pm

WokeUpInACar wrote:Northwestern, not close.

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untar614
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Re: Texas v. Northwestern

Postby untar614 » Mon Apr 15, 2013 4:52 pm

Micdiddy wrote:
untar614 wrote:
bakaaw wrote:
Cobretti wrote:Your COA at both are effectively zero, UT doesn't get a boost for being slightly cheaper.


I hear you. I'm just saying that being in the fortunate position of emerging essentially debt-free either way puts job prospects a little lower on the list of really important factors. I'm less-fucked if I strike out at UT with no debt than if I had massive debts.


Yes, but isn't the whole point of going to law school getting a law job? Job prospects are generally weighed agaisnt COA i na cost-benefit comparison. But if the cost is negligible, then really you should only be considering the benefit i.e. job prospects.


someone got scooped 8)

ur just jelly i was at ASW and u weren't. for all u know, I have mad pics and aint even postin em. :P

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Micdiddy
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Re: Texas v. Northwestern

Postby Micdiddy » Mon Apr 15, 2013 5:03 pm

untar614 wrote:ur just jelly i was at ASW and u weren't. for all u know, I have mad pics and aint even postin em. :P


As Shifty would say:

Image

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untar614
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Re: Texas v. Northwestern

Postby untar614 » Mon Apr 15, 2013 5:34 pm

Micdiddy wrote:
untar614 wrote:ur just jelly i was at ASW and u weren't. for all u know, I have mad pics and aint even postin em. :P


As Shifty would say:

Image

oh man, is that from one of them real housewives shows? even a gif from that makes me cringe. touche sir.




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