Columbia ($) vs Duke ($$) vs NU ($$) vs Year off

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Columbia vs Duke vs NU vs Gap Year

Columbia (90k)
19
37%
Duke (105k)
3
6%
NU (120k)
6
12%
Year Off
24
46%
 
Total votes: 52

nmb43
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Columbia ($) vs Duke ($$) vs NU ($$) vs Year off

Postby nmb43 » Sat Apr 13, 2013 2:35 pm

Hey all,

I'm a K-JD, 178 LSAT/3.80 GPA. My goal is biglaw for a couple years and then PI (think bigfed). I've heard that outside of HYS-Chi going the bigfed PI route can be tough and unfortunately those schools seem to be out this cycle (H and Chi waitlists, no word from Y, didn't apply to S).

I think the two weak spots of my application this cycle were applying late and lack of work experience so I'm considering taking a year off to work and reapplying next cycle (and submitting really early.. like on the first day). I don't know if reading TLS for hours a day for the last week is making me be unnecessarily pessimistic (and if I am, please tell me so) but I'm scared of wracking up $100,000+ in debt if that only gives me a dubious shot at my fulfilling my goals

Thanks

Ti Malice
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Re: Columbia ($) vs Duke ($$) vs NU ($$) vs Year off

Postby Ti Malice » Sat Apr 13, 2013 2:39 pm

Law school will always be there. Go get some WE. Someone with your numbers should not accept anything less than one of YHS or another T14 on a full scholarship.

That said, H pulls a good number of folks off the WL. Your cycle isn't over yet.

2013applicant
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Re: Columbia ($) vs Duke ($$) vs NU ($$) vs Year off

Postby 2013applicant » Sat Apr 13, 2013 2:41 pm

As a K-JD at one of your waitlist schools, I can say without a doubt that I regret not getting some experience for a year or two before matriculating. Voted for taking a year off.

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Doorkeeper
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Re: Columbia ($) vs Duke ($$) vs NU ($$) vs Year off

Postby Doorkeeper » Sat Apr 13, 2013 4:36 pm

Ti Malice wrote:Law school will always be there. Go get some WE. Someone with your numbers should not accept anything less than one of YHS or another T14 on a full scholarship.

That said, H pulls a good number of folks off the WL. Your cycle isn't over yet.

All of this.

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jbagelboy
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Re: Columbia ($) vs Duke ($$) vs NU ($$) vs Year off

Postby jbagelboy » Sat Apr 13, 2013 5:36 pm

TLS exaggerates the deltas between these top schools. Columbia will give you as good a shot at biglaw as any other program, and the name + your connections outside of law school will be perfectly sufficient to work in fed. So if you want to go to law school next, dont let tls scare you away based on that consideration when you have more than half tuition scholarship.

That said, I always think taking a year or two off to work is a good idea as long as you have a decent job, and second, with your lsat you should be hitting hs and the late application probably hurt you. Yale the late app makes no difference so it would be the same result if you applied on the first day.

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NoodleyOne
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Re: Columbia ($) vs Duke ($$) vs NU ($$) vs Year off

Postby NoodleyOne » Sat Apr 13, 2013 5:46 pm

jbagelboy wrote:TLS exaggerates the deltas between these top schools. Columbia will give you as good a shot at biglaw as any other program, and the name + your connections outside of law school will be perfectly sufficient to work in fed. So if you want to go to law school next, dont let tls scare you away based on that consideration when you have more than half tuition scholarship.

That said, I always think taking a year or two off to work is a good idea as long as you have a decent job, and second, with your lsat you should be hitting hs and the late application probably hurt you. Yale the late app makes no difference so it would be the same result if you applied on the first day.

0L

Ti Malice
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Re: Columbia ($) vs Duke ($$) vs NU ($$) vs Year off

Postby Ti Malice » Sat Apr 13, 2013 6:12 pm

NoodleyOne wrote:
jbagelboy wrote:TLS exaggerates the deltas between these top schools. Columbia will give you as good a shot at biglaw as any other program, and the name + your connections outside of law school will be perfectly sufficient to work in fed. So if you want to go to law school next, dont let tls scare you away based on that consideration when you have more than half tuition scholarship.

That said, I always think taking a year or two off to work is a good idea as long as you have a decent job, and second, with your lsat you should be hitting hs and the late application probably hurt you. Yale the late app makes no difference so it would be the same result if you applied on the first day.

0L

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thelawyler
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Re: Columbia ($) vs Duke ($$) vs NU ($$) vs Year off

Postby thelawyler » Sat Apr 13, 2013 6:15 pm

Depends what you'd do on your year off.

Lagunitan
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Re: Columbia ($) vs Duke ($$) vs NU ($$) vs Year off

Postby Lagunitan » Mon Apr 15, 2013 6:24 am

I have a worse LSAT and GPA than you (but in the same ballpark), and I got into YLS this cycle. I think my work experience was largely responsible for me getting in, and I also think it has made me a much more mature person. If you can find something worthwhile to do for a couple years, I strongly encourage you to do it.

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Borg
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Re: Columbia ($) vs Duke ($$) vs NU ($$) vs Year off

Postby Borg » Mon Apr 15, 2013 8:11 am

Absolutely go get some work experience. I've found it extremely helpful, and pretty much every K-JD I've met regrets going straight through. Most law students have no idea how the business world operates, and I think it's a huge disadvantage.

I also agree with the above poster that it probably doesn't matter whether you go to Chicago or Columbia in terms of finding a job in the federal government. They're both great schools, and it's unlikely that the name on the resume is going to make a difference at that level. Plenty of grads from both are in those positions.

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CorpusChristi
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Re: Columbia ($) vs Duke ($$) vs NU ($$) vs Year off

Postby CorpusChristi » Mon Apr 15, 2013 8:51 am

With regards to NYC market, Columbia gives you anything you need for biglaw.

Coming from top5 law school in the UK, not from Oxbridge, though ( I was rejected post-interview ), I've had no problem in securing internships with top5 biggest law firms in the world in London. The statistics give you everything you need to get a reasonable argument for choosing Columbia. In the USA, just like in the UK, the top London colleges ( I study at one of them ) give more biglaw interns/trainees than any other unis, incl. Oxbridge. The same is true of the USA - NYC top colleges ( incl. Columbia ) give you, as highlighted above, anything you need for a "biglaw" career. Many top firms have more interns from Columbia than any other US ls.

Best of luck

PS If you really want HYS, get some work experience/improve numbers and reapply.

Keasbey
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Re: Columbia ($) vs Duke ($$) vs NU ($$) vs Year off

Postby Keasbey » Mon Apr 15, 2013 9:05 am

You must have some glaring holes in your app if you didn't get YHS yet. I feel like just one year off may not be enough, you may want to take two or three off to really make yourself standout. Your will still be good for a few more years.

dixiecupdrinking
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Re: Columbia ($) vs Duke ($$) vs NU ($$) vs Year off

Postby dixiecupdrinking » Mon Apr 15, 2013 9:36 am

CLS would be defensible. You'll have a fine shot at what you want to do. But Harvard will help and you should be a shoo-in there. Did you apply late? (Edit: Okay, now that I've learned to read, you did apply late. Yeah, reapply next year, in October, and you have a really good shot at Harvard at least.)

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CorpusChristi
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Re: Columbia ($) vs Duke ($$) vs NU ($$) vs Year off

Postby CorpusChristi » Mon Apr 15, 2013 11:49 am

Is it really worth it, wasting one year, just to get to Harvard when you're accepted at Columbia with money? I beg to differ, but... we just have various points of view.

Best regards

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Justin Genious
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Re: Columbia ($) vs Duke ($$) vs NU ($$) vs Year off

Postby Justin Genious » Mon Apr 15, 2013 12:04 pm

CorpusChristi wrote:Is it really worth it, wasting one year, just to get to Harvard when you're accepted at Columbia with money? I beg to differ, but... we just have various points of view.

Best regards

Depending on one's career aspirations, yes.

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jbagelboy
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Re: Columbia ($) vs Duke ($$) vs NU ($$) vs Year off

Postby jbagelboy » Mon Apr 15, 2013 12:35 pm

Ti Malice wrote:
NoodleyOne wrote:
jbagelboy wrote:TLS exaggerates the deltas between these top schools. Columbia will give you as good a shot at biglaw as any other program, and the name + your connections outside of law school will be perfectly sufficient to work in fed. So if you want to go to law school next, dont let tls scare you away based on that consideration when you have more than half tuition scholarship.

That said, I always think taking a year or two off to work is a good idea as long as you have a decent job, and second, with your lsat you should be hitting hs and the late application probably hurt you. Yale the late app makes no difference so it would be the same result if you applied on the first day.

0L


bullshit.

OP said he wants to do "biglaw", so 500+ attorney firm. columbia for more than half tuition scholly is entirely defensible. you dismiss others as "0L" as if you are attorneys, judges, litigators who have been practicing for years and are intimately enlightened. when you just applied this cycle too so whats with the condescension? seriously? what is your basis for claiming such exclusive knowledge and input? I've talked to CLS grads in LA, SF, NYC, and DC doing EVERYTHING, including ones who made it to SCOTUS.

I think the credited answer is for OP to work for 1-2 years and apply early in the cycle. that doesn't mean he couldn't achieve his career goals going to columbia law.

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banjo
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Re: Columbia ($) vs Duke ($$) vs NU ($$) vs Year off

Postby banjo » Mon Apr 15, 2013 12:56 pm

A significant minority of TLSers believe WE is worth it just for OCI: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=189449

Whether you elect to defer your CLS scholly or reapply for a shot at HYS (hopefully with aid), I think working for a bit is worth it.

nmb43
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Re: Columbia ($) vs Duke ($$) vs NU ($$) vs Year off

Postby nmb43 » Mon Apr 15, 2013 1:34 pm

Thanks for the advice everyone. CLS is a great school and I could probably fulfill my goals by attending there. However, the more I think about this the more I'm leaning towards taking a year or two off.. not just for another shot to gun at HYS.. but for the experience/perspective I'll gain from working in the real world. The idea of not going straight from 8 semesters of cramming for undergrad exams to 6 semesters of cramming for law school exams is kind of refreshing actually. Plus.. H or Y would be pretty great.

Keasbey wrote:You must have some glaring holes in your app if you didn't get YHS yet. I feel like just one year off may not be enough, you may want to take two or three off to really make yourself standout. Your will still be good for a few more years.


Thats the weird part.. I really can't think of any gaping holes outside of WE. I didn't have amazing softs but I had pretty strong undergrad extracurriculars (varsity athlete, leadership in a couple organizations, a handful of awards/honors). I was very close with the professors that I asked to write LORs and they seemed really excited to help me so I can only assume those were strong. I thought my interview went well. The only holes I can think of are applying late and lack of WE. Home depot and roofing probably didn't play well when they're used to former investment bankers and senators interns with all the leadership/managerial experience those types of jobs entail. Maybe my personal statement needs some polish. Anyway, yeah a year or two should leave me in good shape.



Now the hard part.. finding a meaningful job for the next year.

tidymnstr
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Re: Columbia ($) vs Duke ($$) vs NU ($$) vs Year off

Postby tidymnstr » Mon Apr 15, 2013 1:53 pm

Apply next year as soon as possible is the cycle if you don't want Columbia now. Take a class, do volunteer work, or if you can find something interesting do that until next year!

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jbagelboy
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Re: Columbia ($) vs Duke ($$) vs NU ($$) vs Year off

Postby jbagelboy » Mon Apr 15, 2013 2:03 pm

nmb43 wrote:Thanks for the advice everyone. CLS is a great school and I could probably fulfill my goals by attending there. However, the more I think about this the more I'm leaning towards taking a year or two off.. not just for another shot to gun at HYS.. but for the experience/perspective I'll gain from working in the real world.


This exactly. work blows, but the experience is essential to making an informed decision, and it will help you in other ways you might not understand right now. You may very well end up at CLS again with a butler or hamilton, but you won't regret the time taken off. its good to see someone taking positive advice! good luck!!




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