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Re: Penn v. UVA v. UCLA v. Duke???

Posted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 7:34 am
by jiazhoujiazhou
J-e-L-L-o wrote:I'm liking Duke more and more. Small class sizes of less than 220 ppl, warm weather, excellent placing ability, amazing clerkship numbers.

Duke doesn't get a lot of respect on TLS that it should deserve. I would choose Duke for a native citizen but...

The elephant in the room is that OP is international student. He would need as much help as possible to score a firm that will sponsor him. I would go Penn in this situation as the larger class size should attract a larger # of employers that are willing to recruit the OP. Cali or otherwise.


Smaller firms are indeed too cautious about the visa thing. So you mean that more large firms do OCI in Penn than in Duke, or just that larger firms like Penn better?

Re: Penn v. UVA v. UCLA v. Duke???

Posted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 11:55 am
by Nelson
Roughly the same opportunities will probably be open to you at Duke and Penn with equivalent grades. I'd pay 40k just to be in Philly over Durham, but that's more a personal preference thing.

Re: Penn v. UVA v. UCLA v. Duke???

Posted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 12:02 pm
by Nelson
J-e-L-L-o wrote:I would go Penn in this situation as the larger class size should attract a larger # of employers that are willing to recruit the OP. Cali or otherwise.

I doubt Penn's OCI is meaningfully larger than Duke's, though the geographic distribution might be a little different. I'd guess (not knowing exactly what firms go to Duke) that most of the big firms that would be willing to sponsor a non-US citizen come to both.

Re: Penn v. UVA v. UCLA v. Duke???

Posted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 3:37 pm
by J-e-L-L-o
Nelson wrote:
J-e-L-L-o wrote:I would go Penn in this situation as the larger class size should attract a larger # of employers that are willing to recruit the OP. Cali or otherwise.

I doubt Penn's OCI is meaningfully larger than Duke's, though the geographic distribution might be a little different. I'd guess (not knowing exactly what firms go to Duke) that most of the big firms that would be willing to sponsor a non-US citizen come to both.


You know what...I think you are right. And Duke has a 12% preference to California. Employment stats are on par for both. Class size of Penn was 270 compared to 225 at Duke. More students went to big firms over 500 employees as a percentage at Penn but that could be more self selection to other things. Good example a higher percentage of the class at Duke went clerking.

Looks like school selection should come down to atmosphere of the school and not placement power. Warm weather vs cold and small town vs city.

I'd have to change my pick to Duke. I'd rather go to a small town in warm weather if employment is bout the same and the class size is smaller.

For reference:
https://www.law.upenn.edu/careers/emplo ... istics.php
http://law.duke.edu/career/employmentdata-detail/

Re: Penn v. UVA v. UCLA v. Duke???

Posted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 10:20 pm
by GMGP
J-e-L-L-o wrote:
Nelson wrote:
J-e-L-L-o wrote:I would go Penn in this situation as the larger class size should attract a larger # of employers that are willing to recruit the OP. Cali or otherwise.

I doubt Penn's OCI is meaningfully larger than Duke's, though the geographic distribution might be a little different. I'd guess (not knowing exactly what firms go to Duke) that most of the big firms that would be willing to sponsor a non-US citizen come to both.


You know what...I think you are right. And Duke has a 12% preference to California. Employment stats are on par for both. Class size of Penn was 270 compared to 225 at Duke. More students went to big firms over 500 employees as a percentage at Penn but that could be more self selection to other things. Good example a higher percentage of the class at Duke went clerking.

Looks like school selection should come down to atmosphere of the school and not placement power. Warm weather vs cold and small town vs city.

I'd have to change my pick to Duke. I'd rather go to a small town in warm weather if employment is bout the same and the class size is smaller.

For reference:
https://www.law.upenn.edu/careers/emplo ... istics.php
http://law.duke.edu/career/employmentdata-detail/


Duke career services has really good relationships with Cali firms. If you hustle at Penn I'm sure you can get a great firm job in Cali, but from what I have experienced and heard (current Duke 1L) is that Cali firms do not have an recruitng presence in Penn at all while they are pretty active here. I know several 2Ls that are going to LA or San Fran for summers.

Re: Penn v. UVA v. UCLA v. Duke???

Posted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 12:58 am
by Br3v
Nixon goes to Cali

Re: Penn v. UVA v. UCLA v. Duke???

Posted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 1:35 am
by Tom Joad
Dook. Dook and UVA are as peer as it gets and 40k plus extra living expenses is a lot of money. You will still need to get grades at any of your options.

Re: Penn v. UVA v. UCLA v. Duke???

Posted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 10:12 pm
by GMGP
All of the T6-14 with the exception of Georgetown are essentially equal in terms of prestige and employment IMO. Minor year to year fluctuations sure, but paying out the nose for a few spots or percentage points isn't the best move. I have an admitted bias to Duke, I go here and love it, but putting that aside the smart move is take Duke's money and run.

Re: Penn v. UVA v. UCLA v. Duke???

Posted: Mon Apr 08, 2013 1:41 pm
by J-e-L-L-o
I would say that it's not that simple. Once admitted to some schools and after you get you scholarship info, it comes down to the soft factors as well that can help sway your decision. Weather, student body, location of country....blah blah blah..

still...take Duke's money and run because they can get ya everything you want OP.