UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

(Rankings, Profiles, Tuition, Student Life, . . . )

Pick one. Or two, even.

UCLA ($32k COA)
26
50%
NU ($146k COA)
18
35%
Retake and reapply next cycle
8
15%
 
Total votes: 52

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TripTrip
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UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby TripTrip » Tue Apr 02, 2013 9:58 pm

UCLA: full-tuition scholarship + $11k stipend for the first year renewable based on continued need.
NU: $105k total scholarship.
(I even included the links to LST for you. Click on the school names.)

Yes, I'll be asking NU to increase but considering that's the highest ranked school I've gotten into and UCLA is my only comparable scholarship, it'll be difficult to get them to budge.

I'd prefer biglaw, but I'm not tied to it. I just want a corporate gig in the long run. Where I'd like to work: East Coast > Midwest > West Coast. But again, if I could find a good gig in CA I'd stay there. I have ties to MN (and got into UMN on a full scholarship), but UCLA places just as well in MN biglaw as UMN and has a lower COA for me.

Finally, I included the "retake and reapply" option for all you cycle stalkers. I bet in June I could turn that 175/4.0 into at LEAST a 178/4.0. No quarrel with retaking the LSAT here, but I would despise reapplying next cycle. I know I'm underperforming my numbers. It's because 1) I was homeschooled and 2) I've got an unprestigious UG and an easy major. (Yes, really. Cornell divulged these in a Skype interview before promptly admitting me upon discovering that I'm not socially awkward, contrary to homeschooler stereotypes.) I simply think I would not gain enough of an advantage by applying early next cycle with a new PS to make the risk worth it. But you can vote for it anyway, along with another option because this poll is cool and you can do that.

I have no debt presently and am very debt averse. With UCLA's offer, it's possible I could get through 1L and 2L without any loans at all. Throw in a SA or something similar during 2L summer and I'd graduate debt free. Thus, I voted for UCLA. I'd like to hear some opinions on this though.
Last edited by TripTrip on Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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gaud
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Re: UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby gaud » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:04 pm

TripTrip wrote:Where I'd like to work: East Coast > Midwest > West Coast.


NU, bro.

ETA: I can see why you're in a tough situation, that's a large difference in cost, but I wouldn't hit up UCLA unless I wanted to live in California.
Last edited by gaud on Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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twinkletoes16
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Re: UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby twinkletoes16 » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:05 pm

no advice, but just know I'm going to have to call you a homeschooled jungle freak at NU's ASW.

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TripTrip
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Re: UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby TripTrip » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:09 pm

gaud wrote:
TripTrip wrote:Where I'd like to work: East Coast > Midwest > West Coast.


NU, bro.

What if it were reversed? I know we stress geographic preference on here, but I'm not educated enough about either coast to have a qualified opinion about whether I'd like to live there.

twinkletoes16 wrote:no advice, but just know I'm going to have to call you a homeschooled jungle freak at NU's ASW.

That's only if you figure out who I am. :wink:

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shifty_eyed
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Re: UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby shifty_eyed » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:10 pm

Your UG institution and major shouldn't be hurting you with a 175 to back it up. I mean maybe at Yale, but still. I am really perplexed by your cycle results thus far.

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TripTrip
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Re: UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby TripTrip » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:12 pm

shifty_eyed wrote:Your UG institution and major shouldn't be hurting you with a 175 to back it up. I mean maybe at Yale, but still. I am really perplexed by your cycle results thus far.

168 ---> 175 retaker, which also killed Yale for me. I understand why you say that though.

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gaud
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Re: UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby gaud » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:12 pm

TripTrip wrote:
gaud wrote:
TripTrip wrote:Where I'd like to work: East Coast > Midwest > West Coast.


NU, bro.

What if it were reversed? I know we stress geographic preference on here, but I'm not educated enough about either coast to have a qualified opinion about whether I'd like to live there.


If it were reversed I'd choose UCLA. NU is going to give you greater options nationwide.

I'm no expert on UCLA, but I wouldn't want to live in California. Too saturated IMO.

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WokeUpInACar
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Re: UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby WokeUpInACar » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:13 pm

TripTrip wrote:
shifty_eyed wrote:Your UG institution and major shouldn't be hurting you with a 175 to back it up. I mean maybe at Yale, but still. I am really perplexed by your cycle results thus far.

168 ---> 175 retaker, which also killed Yale for me. I understand why you say that though.

Did you retake in February? Otherwise your cycle still makes no sense. I honestly think if you wait just a bit and maybe write some LOCIs you'll have a lot better options later in the cycle.

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gaud
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Re: UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby gaud » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:14 pm

WokeUpInACar wrote:
TripTrip wrote:
shifty_eyed wrote:Your UG institution and major shouldn't be hurting you with a 175 to back it up. I mean maybe at Yale, but still. I am really perplexed by your cycle results thus far.

168 ---> 175 retaker, which also killed Yale for me. I understand why you say that though.

Did you retake in February? Otherwise your cycle still makes no sense. I honestly think if you wait just a bit and maybe write some LOCIs you'll have a lot better options later in the cycle.


I agree with this.

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gaud
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Re: UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby gaud » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:17 pm

(looking at your LSN)

Could you take a year off if this cycle doesn't pan out the way you'd like? I imagine if you applied a bit earlier your results will be different.

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thatgumyoulike
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Re: UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby thatgumyoulike » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:18 pm

Great offer from UCLA, but tough because you aren't from CA and want east coast. I'd lean NU for now, but have you tried negotiating with Cornell and Georgetown? I'm sure they would listen to your NU offer (and maybe your UCLA full ride would be worth something?).

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TripTrip
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Re: UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby TripTrip » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:23 pm

WokeUpInACar wrote:
TripTrip wrote:
shifty_eyed wrote:Your UG institution and major shouldn't be hurting you with a 175 to back it up. I mean maybe at Yale, but still. I am really perplexed by your cycle results thus far.

168 ---> 175 retaker, which also killed Yale for me. I understand why you say that though.

Did you retake in February? Otherwise your cycle still makes no sense. I honestly think if you wait just a bit and maybe write some LOCIs you'll have a lot better options later in the cycle.
No, retook in December and submitted apps at the beginning of January. I'm not done with the cycle, but deposit deadlines are coming up (NU = 4/12) and I'm going to need to start shedding offers pretty soon.

gaud wrote:(looking at your LSN)

Could you take a year off if this cycle doesn't pan out the way you'd like? I imagine if you applied a bit earlier your results will be different.
Yeah, sure could. The only reason I'm opposed is because I'd be risking my current scholarship offers and I'm not sure how much better I'd do. I have plenty of number-peers who applied at the same time as me and got into HYS, while I stay locked out of CCNMVPB. You can't blame that on application timing.

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TripTrip
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Re: UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby TripTrip » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:26 pm

thatgumyoulike wrote:Great offer from UCLA, but tough because you aren't from CA and want east coast. I'd lean NU for now, but have you tried negotiating with Cornell and Georgetown? I'm sure they would listen to your NU offer (and maybe your UCLA full ride would be worth something?).

Working on both. Cornell just admitted me on Wednesday, so they have yet to send an offer. (I pre-empted by sending my current offers so as to get a decision before 4/12.)

If Cornell gave me a full ride, I'd deposit and withdraw from UCLA and NU in a heartbeat. That would be awesome.

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shifty_eyed
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Re: UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby shifty_eyed » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:27 pm

Was your PS about killing puppies or something?

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Winston1984
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Re: UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby Winston1984 » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:30 pm

Sorry about the rough cycle. I'd have to say NU given your goals/geographic presence. A retake doesn't really seem like it will help you that much. If you were locked out of the T6, I doubt a 177 is going to give you the kind of scholarship you would need to attend. I know it's a lot of money for NU, but I would take it. Good luck!

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TripTrip
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Re: UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby TripTrip » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:38 pm

shifty_eyed wrote:Was your PS about killing puppies or something?

Ha! No. I've had a couple TLSers look over the full PDF to see if I checked the box that says "I don't want to go to law school." This was the worst they could come up with:
- Your writing ability concerns me. According to your app, you don't have experience completing an extensive writing project. Moreover, your personal statement reads too much like a resume, so it fails to accomplish the task at hand: illuminating an aspect of your life that wouldn't be clear in other parts of application. You mentioned the fact that you were homeschooled — an interesting point — and I can see that you are trying to show your personal growth during college, a new phase of your life. But what the PS lacked were vignettes that showed (and not simply told) your becoming a more social, confident person. You didn't provide the evidence to persuade me that you have grown.



Winston1984 wrote:Sorry about the rough cycle. I'd have to say NU given your goals/geographic presence. A retake doesn't really seem like it will help you that much. If you were locked out of the T6, I doubt a 177 is going to give you the kind of scholarship you would need to attend. I know it's a lot of money for NU, but I would take it. Good luck!

Geographic preference I see. But UCLA doesn't take a hit for MN biglaw, which is where I could go back to. (I'm referencing the MN BigLaw attorney thread here.)

NY would be great. But is the slightly better shot I'd have at NY biglaw worth $110k?

de5igual
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Re: UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby de5igual » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:44 pm

NU at that price isn't horrible, but for someone with a 175/4.0??? Look over your applications, maybe find new people to write your LORs and re-apply. A retake isn't really necessary. You should definitely be getting several full-rides in the T14.

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TripTrip
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Re: UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby TripTrip » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:50 pm

f0bolous wrote:NU at that price isn't horrible, but for someone with a 175/4.0??? Look over your applications, maybe find new people to write your LORs and re-apply. A retake isn't really necessary. You should definitely be getting several full-rides in the T14.

I have, and I've had other people look them over. My app has nothing glaring besides the homeschooler thing and Criminal Justice way-too-easy major.

I had five LORs. Two of them were super strong. I read one, it was way over the top. Another was written by a very close professor of mine who has been helping me through the application process (he also proofread my PS). He went to Oxford and his wife to Columbia Law. He nominated me for the Outstanding Student of my graduating class... I don't think he would subsequently roast me in an LOR. Those are the only two I sent to every school. For schools that I thought an additional letter or two could help, I rotated in the other ones. There's no correlation between letters and acceptances/rejections; I checked.

I know the retake isn't necessary, but it would be worlds easier than trying to come up with a new PS that would "woo" adcomms in ways this one didn't.

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FlanAl
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Re: UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby FlanAl » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:53 pm

its really pretty early in the cycle. are you on any T6 wait lists? also I'm pretty sure you can just always put down deposits and wait it out. I also applied with a december retake and underperformed my numbers (but your numbers are much better than mine)

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Rlabo
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Re: UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby Rlabo » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:55 pm

according to your lsn it looks like you have yet to hear back from plenty of top schools which you will probably be hearing back from within the next week or so. Given your numbers, I can't imagine one of them not picking you up.

As per nu v ucla, its going to depend on how much you value not having debt vs having a shot on working on the east coast. If it were me I would be picking nu but that's only because regardless of where I go I know I want/plan to be in NYC upon graduation and so I would try to give myself the best shot at making that happen. Also a t14 in general would allow me to feel slightly less risk averse than t20, including northwestern which has a solid rep of producing lawyers that will actually be able to preform at graduation (hence most have prior work experience).

But even with all that, if i got stanford nyu or penn it would completely change this conversation so if you can get an extension on those deadlines and wait it out a bit more you may be pleasantly surprised.

Regardless, I'm pulling for you Trip and am sure wherever you decide on you'll succeed. I mean you don't get a 4.0 and a 175 without hard work so you'll go far.

Good luck

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TripTrip
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Re: UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby TripTrip » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:59 pm

FlanAl wrote:its really pretty early in the cycle. are you on any T6 wait lists? also I'm pretty sure you can just always put down deposits and wait it out. I also applied with a december retake and underperformed my numbers (but your numbers are much better than mine)

The only school I've been rejected from is Yale, but I'm held at Columbia and Harvard and WL'd at Chicago, Berk, and Duke.

I'm not done with the cycle yet, but in the coming week and a half I'll have to choose between these two options since NU's deposit deadline is 4/12. Hence this thread.


Rlabo wrote:according to your lsn it looks like you have yet to hear back from plenty of top schools which you will probably be hearing back from within the next week or so. Given your numbers, I can't imagine one of them not picking you up.

As per nu v ucla, its going to depend on how much you value not having debt vs having a shot on working on the east coast. If it were me I would be picking nu but that's only because regardless of where I go I know I want/plan to be in NYC upon graduation and so I would try to give myself the best shot at making that happen. Also a t14 in general would allow me to feel slightly less risk averse than t20, including northwestern which has a solid rep of producing lawyers that will actually be able to preform at graduation (hence most have prior work experience).

But even with all that, if i got stanford nyu or penn it would completely change this conversation so if you can get an extension on those deadlines and wait it out a bit more you may be pleasantly surprised.

Regardless, I'm pulling for you Trip and am sure wherever you decide on you'll succeed. I mean you don't get a 4.0 and a 175 without hard work so you'll go far.

Good luck

Thanks. The only struggle I have is that it would take a significant scholarship to pull me to CCN/MVPB, and I just don't think that's going to happen at this point. I'm optimistic, but we'll see.

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WokeUpInACar
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Re: UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby WokeUpInACar » Tue Apr 02, 2013 11:07 pm

I have to implore you not to commit to NU at that price. I think all of your negative results (besides Yale obv) could legitimately be chalked up to YP. I'd bet that you have just gotten very unlucky because you didn't express specific interest in any of these schools. Write GOOD LOCIs and wait to see what happens. I'd be flabbergasted if you don't get something better.

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TripTrip
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Re: UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby TripTrip » Tue Apr 02, 2013 11:10 pm

WokeUpInACar wrote:I have to implore you not to commit to NU at that price. I think all of your negative results (besides Yale obv) could legitimately be chalked up to YP. I'd bet that you have just gotten very unlucky because you didn't express specific interest in any of these schools. Write GOOD LOCIs and wait to see what happens. I'd be flabbergasted if you don't get something better.

You think CCN is YP? There's no evidence of YP there. I wrote Why X essays for Cornell, Duke, NU, UVA, and Penn, as well as essay #8 for Mich and the AnBryce scholarship essay for NYU.

Also, why would NU not offer $150k in that case? They were throwing that kind of money around this cycle.

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WokeUpInACar
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Re: UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby WokeUpInACar » Tue Apr 02, 2013 11:13 pm

Chicago definitely YPs, and Columbia and NYU might be waiting to see if you'll withdraw because they've decided not to give you the biggest named scholarships and don't think you'll attend otherwise.

Also NU didn't offer the 150k to many people with 174+... They concentrated on 3.75+, 171-173 if you look at TLS and LSN because they didn't think they'd get people with numbers like yours.

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phillywc
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Re: UCLA (fo' free) vs. NU (not fo' free)

Postby phillywc » Tue Apr 02, 2013 11:15 pm

This topic terrifies me.

Your numbers are way better than mine can possibly be next year.

For what it's worth I would hold off for more decisions, going with UCLA is nothing else came in.




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