Cornell vs. UVA??

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disney_fan
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Cornell vs. UVA??

Postby disney_fan » Sun Mar 24, 2013 9:19 pm

Hey everyone!

I've been an avid reader of TLS for about two years now, and recently decided I should actually make an account and post a question! So here goes...

I know this comparison (Cornell vs. UVA) has been done before, and I have read most of the previous threads, but was wondering if you helpful folk might assist me with a specific case.

I've been offered almost full tuition renewable scholarships from both schools:

$50,000 from Cornell (so there's about a $5,000 diff between that and the current est. tuition cost, which can/probably will increase yearly....)

Straight full tuition from UVA; so if the cost increases the scholarship does as well.

I've visited UVA, and really like the school and the people I met there. I also know that its considered better in a side-by-side comparison.

I'm planning on studying international law, and would love to work for the ICC or the UN or even with some random unknown international humanitarian group when I graduate; Big Law placements don't matter that much to me. However, I have thought about going into a firm years (10-15+) down the road and settling down.

My mind tells me UVA, though I kinda want to go to Cornell anyways (personal, family and location reasons).

So I'm wondering, how much, in terms of opportunity cost, would I be giving up if I do choose Cornell? Could turning down UVA "come back to haunt me" a few years down the road?

What do you think?

Thanks in advanced to all the helpful TLS people... And to the trolls, as long as you keep it interesting...

*edit* scholarship info above - thanks for pointing out that consideration Lavitz
Last edited by disney_fan on Mon Mar 25, 2013 8:44 am, edited 2 times in total.

rad lulz
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Re: Cornell vs. UVA??

Postby rad lulz » Sun Mar 24, 2013 9:25 pm

Not only is getting an international law job unrealistic, but going to a firm 10 years later when you have no (paying) clients and no experience doing the kind of law the businesses actually pay money for is even more unrealistic.

I'd reevaluate your career goals before doing anything

SportsFan
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Re: Cornell vs. UVA??

Postby SportsFan » Sun Mar 24, 2013 9:40 pm

rad lulz wrote:Not only is getting an international law job unrealistic, but going to a firm 10 years later when you have no (paying) clients and no experience doing the kind of law the businesses actually pay money for is even more unrealistic.

I'd reevaluate your career goals before doing anything

Yeah, this. OP, you should do a lot more research on the legal profession and the types of jobs you'll actually be able to get after graduation.

Ti Malice
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Re: Cornell vs. UVA??

Postby Ti Malice » Sun Mar 24, 2013 9:57 pm

SportsFan wrote:
rad lulz wrote:Not only is getting an international law job unrealistic, but going to a firm 10 years later when you have no (paying) clients and no experience doing the kind of law the businesses actually pay money for is even more unrealistic.

I'd reevaluate your career goals before doing anything

Yeah, this. OP, you should do a lot more research on the legal profession and the types of jobs you'll actually be able to get after graduation.

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jbagelboy
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Re: Cornell vs. UVA??

Postby jbagelboy » Sun Mar 24, 2013 10:16 pm

rad lulz has a point, those kinds of "international" jobs with international/global entities are basically for a select few well connected Yale grads or established professionals with years of practicing experience with firms in their field -- you don't see a lot of 26 year olds acting as legal counsel for the US delegation to the IAEA.

However, to answer your question, one thing to note is UVA is much better for clerkships in DC, which would be one path towards practicing the type of law you like. Cornell does have a strong international law program, but I'm not sure what this means as far as career development is concerned; you'd probably be better off at NYU if you want to pursue the global PI route (not sure you applied there but wth full ride at uva i assume your stats are good enough). You'd probably have to figure out exactly what you wanted once you got to Cornell, but TBH with the full rides, you'll have a decent amount of maneuvering.

Either way, you're definitely not "throwing away" anything taking a full ride at Cornell, and yes you're right, the rankings difference matters less if you don't care about clerking or big law.

Also Ithaca and Charlottesville are equally distasteful IMO

disney_fan
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Re: Cornell vs. UVA??

Postby disney_fan » Sun Mar 24, 2013 10:42 pm

Thanks jbagleboy...

Though it may be "unrealistic" to get a job practicing international law... I figure somebody's gotta do it. I don't expect to jump right into a dream job after graduation, but figure with the right internships, connections, some dumb luck and more hard work it is achievable. I've spoken to graduates from a few schools who have "made it" internationally, and while its not easy I'm sure, it is also not limited to the elite few top-of-class YHS grads. (I am still on "hold" at Harvard though and praying for a favourable response... though that might be just as unrealistic. :P )

I'm also not dead set on something like UN or ICC, though that would be sweet. I would also enjoy working for a relativity unknown humanitarian grassroots organization, -- which is why I'm really thankful that I won't have much debt to worry about in either case.... I do have a good amount of experience working (in admin, not law) with a humanitarian organization in Latin America so have established some contacts on that side of the world.

My Cornell area preference isn't for Ithaca itself, just for its proximity to other areas. I'd really just like to be able to drive up near fam/friends on weekends now and then, and that's pretty much impossible from VA.

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Rahviveh
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Re: Cornell vs. UVA??

Postby Rahviveh » Sun Mar 24, 2013 10:50 pm

disney_fan wrote:Thanks jbagleboy...

Though it may be "unrealistic" to get a job practicing international law... I figure somebody's gotta do it. I don't expect to jump right into a dream job after graduation, but figure with the right internships, connections, some dumb luck and more hard work it is achievable. I've spoken to graduates from a few schools who have "made it" internationally, and while its not easy I'm sure, it is also not limited to the elite few top-of-class YHS grads. (I am still on "hold" at Harvard though and praying for a favourable response... though that might be just as unrealistic. :P )

I'm also not dead set on something like UN or ICC, though that would be sweet. I would also enjoy working for a relativity unknown humanitarian grassroots organization, -- which is why I'm really thankful that I won't have much debt to worry about in either case.... I do have a good amount of experience working (in admin, not law) with a humanitarian organization in Latin America so have established some contacts on that side of the world.

My Cornell area preference isn't for Ithaca itself, just for its proximity to other areas. I'd really just like to be able to drive up near fam/friends on weekends now and then, and that's pretty much impossible from VA.

You are choosing between peer schools and nothing will be lost by attending Cornell.

Just make sure you are happy doing big law after graduation because that's your most likely outcome out of these schools.

edit: I missed that you have a full ride so at least you'll have flexibility in your job search. Still, these schools are essentially feeders to the corporate world and you sound like a do gooder who would want nothing to do with that

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Lavitz
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Re: Cornell vs. UVA??

Postby Lavitz » Sun Mar 24, 2013 11:38 pm

Have you estimated the total CoA for each school, OP?

I'm just curious because I know the full-ride at Cornell isn't actually a full-ride. We get $50K/year but tuition this year will be around $57K--unless you got some sort of super-dean's scholarship they're not telling me about.

I'm not sure how the dean's scholarships work at UVA, but if we're just talking about $150K from both schools, Cornell's tuition is $5K/year higher than UVA's nonresident tuition, so you're looking at a $15K difference in tuition paid. This wouldn't be a big deal if CoL was definitely lower in Ithaca, but I think it's actually a wash. Not sure what other expenses would close the gap here, so UVA would likely be the slightly cheaper of the two options, if that makes a difference to you.

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Rahviveh
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Re: Cornell vs. UVA??

Postby Rahviveh » Sun Mar 24, 2013 11:41 pm

Lavitz wrote:Have you estimated the total CoA for each school, OP?

I'm just curious because I know the full-ride at Cornell isn't actually a full-ride. We get $50K/year but tuition this year will be around $57K--unless you got some sort of super-dean's scholarship they're not telling me about.

I'm not sure how the dean's scholarships work at UVA, but if we're just talking about $150K from both schools, Cornell's tuition is $5K/year higher than UVA's nonresident tuition, so you're looking at a $15K difference in tuition paid. This wouldn't be a big deal if CoL was definitely lower in Ithaca, but I think it's actually a wash. Not sure what other expenses would close the gap here, so UVA would likely be the slightly cheaper of the two options, if that makes a difference to you.

CoL might actually be higher in Ithaca. The quality of housing is definitely better in c-ville. OP you will find that out if you visit.

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Lavitz
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Re: Cornell vs. UVA??

Postby Lavitz » Sun Mar 24, 2013 11:48 pm

ChampagnePapi wrote:CoL might actually be higher in Ithaca. The quality of housing is definitely better in c-ville. OP you will find that out if you visit.

Yeah, I guess I was being too generous to Ithaca there.

You should visit Cornell if you haven't already, OP.

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jbagelboy
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Re: Cornell vs. UVA??

Postby jbagelboy » Mon Mar 25, 2013 1:21 am

ChampagnePapi wrote:You are choosing between peer schools and nothing will be lost by attending Cornell.


This is what I was getting at :)

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stuckinthemiddle
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Re: Cornell vs. UVA??

Postby stuckinthemiddle » Mon Mar 25, 2013 9:48 am

Peers. Go to the cheaper one or the one near the market you'd like to work in or the one where you "fit in" more.

gaucholaw
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Re: Cornell vs. UVA??

Postby gaucholaw » Tue Mar 26, 2013 6:22 am

Now choosing Cornell over UVA for personal reasons could be totally valid..... but for other poster calling them "Peers"......... :roll: why so much uva hate on this board




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