Arkansas v Iowa Forum

[runner554]

I'm from Arkansas and have a full ride, got the stips removed, at Arkansas- Fayetteville. I also got a full ride to Iowa. Iowa looks like its a better school with better employment numbers, however I have never been there and have no connections. I don't really care where I work. Any advise?

Also I'm Asian and am a bit concerned about discrimination effecting employment chances in Arkansas.

[deadpanic]

Arkansas.

Also I'm Asian and am a bit concerned about discrimination effecting employment chances in Arkansas.

I don't think Iowa is really a bastion of racial equality. If you're trying to practice at a place like Bald Knob it might be an issue (but not even necessarily b/c of race, just b/c of ties), but outside of that, I wouldn't worry.

[ProspectiveStudent69]

Iowa grads have good luck securing jobs, in some ways more than Drake kids. I live in Cedar Rapids and have been to the library and Iowa City 100's of times, awesome place to be. Cheap cost of living, but more importantly, you have a great chance for internships which eventually will turn into jobs. I knew someone who just graduated, and now makes about 70k in Cedar Rapids at Lynch Dallas (firm). Iowa is cold in the winter, and Iowa City is super liberal. There are a ton of Asian kids in Iowa City as well, not to mention tons of hot mamas!! I got rejected at Iowa, but I would go there over a lot of schools. Its like 29th, hard to beat that IMO. Hope this helps, message me if you have any other questions.

[romothesavior]

Iowa grads have good luck securing jobs, in some ways more than Drake kids.

Uhh... yeah? Obviously?

[romothesavior]

At first I thought Arkansas, but I think Iowa has a bit more portability and better big firm opportunities.

What do you want to do? Where do you want to work?

[ProspectiveStudent69]

I've just heard Drake grads do way better in Des Moines and their teachings are much more practical than Iowa's. Iowa's more theory based i guess.

[romothesavior]

I've just heard Drake grads do way better in Des Moines and their teachings are much more practical than Iowa's. Iowa's more theory based i guess.

I think this is generally a myth. Most schools teach the same things and have the same class offerings. But who knows.

In any event, Iowa is a much stronger school than Drake for job placement and has a lot better reputation both in-state and out. OP has a full ride to Iowa, so Drake isn't really a factor here.

[Rahviveh]

I've just heard Drake grads do way better in Des Moines and their teachings are much more practical than Iowa's. Iowa's more theory based i guess.

I think this is generally a myth. Most schools teach the same things and have the same class offerings. But who knows.

In any event, Iowa is a much stronger school than Drake for job placement and has a lot better reputation both in-state and out. OP has a full ride to Iowa, so Drake isn't really a factor here.

The full-ride probably has terrible stips on it.

[romothesavior]

From what I understand, they've decided to stop being all TTT and stopped doing scholly stips this year.

[ProspectiveStudent69]

Some 1L chick said they removed the stips this year, don't qoute me but I don't see why she would lie.

[rad lulz]

At first I thought Arkansas, but I think Iowa has a bit more portability and better big firm opportunities.

What do you want to do? Where do you want to work?

If AK is like the other parochial southern states I know (and I have no reason to believe it isn't), Iowa probably isn't even very portable back to AK. I suppose if you just KILL IT at Iowa you could maybe hit one of those Iowa midsize firms or whatever.

[patrickd139]

Checking in to support the Arkansas-Fayetteville choice out of those two. Ties to an insular market + free ride at a school in that insular market + desire to practice in that market sounds like a win to me. I'm not sure the marginally increased employment odds at Iowa will come close to covering the hit that OP will take by having no ties to the markets it serves. I'm almost certain that empirical data would show that almost no one goes from Iowa to Arkansas, but I'm a little lazy to run searches at firms in Arkansas for alums. OP: you should do that before you make your choice if you want to practice in Arkansas.

OP needs to check back in to tell us where s/he wants to practice, but this seems like a no-brainer to me.

[mb9113]

Early in this cycle Iowa gave out Top 37% stips for schollies, but this month changed their mind and sent out emails/letters removing all stips.

I imagine Iowa was on track to a terrible yield and decided to reverse course.

[emciosn]

Arkansas.

Also I'm Asian and am a bit concerned about discrimination effecting employment chances in Arkansas.

I don't think Iowa is really a bastion of racial equality. If you're trying to practice at a place like Bald Knob it might be an issue (but not even necessarily b/c of race, just b/c of ties), but outside of that, I wouldn't worry.

Not really sure where you are getting this from. Are your from Iowa? Do you know? I don't know anything about Arkansas but I am from Iowa and can say that I really don't think your race would have any effect on your ability to get hired. The state as a whole is pretty white but I don't think that means we are a bunch of bigots. Iowa City is crazy liberal (as is the neighboring Cedar Rapids in large part). I worked in Des Moines for a summer and I absolutely cannot imagine your race would be held against you there or in the other cities in the state (Note that this is Iowa so the standard for what is a city is like 50,000 or above). If anything, it may help given the lack of diversity in many of the larger firms. I'm as WUSTL in StL and there is far more racial tension down here than in Iowa. I went to UG in Iowa and there was a healthy population of Asian students on campus, and there would be even more diversity in Iowa City (I did not attend U of Iowa).

As for job prospects I don't really know. My impression from a couple summers ago was that it is pretty tough. The biggest firm in Iowa is like 95 attorneys and maybe only takes on a few new ones each year. There may only be like 20 (or less) firms like that in the state. The work is interesting and fairly high level but those positions are hard to get. You either have to kill it at Iowa/Drake or come from a big name school out of state. The firms in Iowa that you would want to work for really can't absorb the number of students Drake/Iowa pump out each year PLUS ITE you are fighting against all the Iowa kids that went to T14ish schools that are coming back to the state. The firms are so blinded by the flashy school names that they are scooping those kids up and leaving the Iowa kids in the dust (before 2008 those T14 kids just didn't come back to Iowa). So, if you miss the boat on those firms you are stuck trying to find something else--sifting through 10-12 attorney firms (at best) to see if something sticks. I don't know how portable an Iowa degree is. If you really do well you may be able to get to KC, StL, Minneapolis, or Chicago but you would probably need to be towards to top of the class or form some solid connections.

These are just my thoughts. Lets say you end up outside the top third (that is being generous, I think there are plenty of top third Iowa kids who are struggling): are you more comfortable settling for some small firm job in Iowa or Arkansas?

Perhaps that should guide your decision. I guess Iowa is the better school in that its ranked higher but the further you are away from the T14 the less rankings matter. As I typed this I really started to lean toward just telling you to go Arkansas.

HTH--PM if you have any more specific questions about the Iowa job market.

ETA: I don't want to make it sound like there are 20ish 95 attorney firms in Iowa--there is not. There are probably 20ish firms (or less) with like 30+ lawyers.

[bayark]

If you want to live in the NWA area or Little Rock, UA-Fayetteville is the best thing you can do. Arkansas's legal community is incredibly insular. LR is a little more southern old boys club, but since NWA is mostly transplants from elsewhere, I doubt you'd encounter much discrimination.