San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

(Rankings, Profiles, Tuition, Student Life, . . . )

Which offer would be the best for an IP law student?

IIT-Kent ($60K, some scholarship expected)
2
22%
University of San Diego ($60K, some scholarship expected)
7
78%
Sturm at Denver University ($55K, no scholarship expected)
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 9

plasicnives
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San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby plasicnives » Tue Mar 19, 2013 9:46 pm

As you can see from my poll, the cost will be virtually the same at all schools. I currently have no debt, no kids, no spouse and my car is paid off in full. Accepting some debt will just be expected at this point, so this aspect of my decision is somewhat negligible. I mean, would it really kill me to spend the next 15 years paying off student loans if I landed my dream job?

The one and only reason I am leaning towards San Diego is that I have lived in SoCal for most of my life and would really prefer to stay here. My parents live in Denver, but I am really not a big fan of the city. From the times I have visited, I have found Denver to be depressing, white-washed, completely lacking of any culture, and thoroughly depressing in the winter. I think if I ending up spending even 10 years living in the Denver metro area, I would probably lose my soul. To say the least, it will definitely be a step outside of my comfort zone to commit to living in Denver, but something I might just have to work through. I know nothing about Chicago, as far as quality of life is concerned.

My primary question, to which I don't seem to find a consistent answer, is, which market is the most promising for IP lawyers? BCG State of the Market is reporting the San Diego market for IP law is one of the absolute best job markets in the country. It's also a stone's throw away from Silicon Beach.

However, IP law is growing in general. Boulder is marketing itself as a second Silicon Valley, with it's IBM and Google headquarters, but I'm very skeptical of Denver's seemingly golden employment record. Any thoughts?

Lastly, IIT-Kent is almost out of the picture for me. But it IS a technical institute, and studying IP law at a technical institute must surely have its advantages. From what I understand, Chicago also has a strong market for IP lawyers and would be a smart choice for anyone hoping to practice patent litigation.

If it helps, I have an MA in Math and work as a public school teacher. I'm desperate to get out of education. Think being a lawyer is bad? Try watching an 11 year old girl try to commit suicide in your classroom or try getting shot at by gang members on your way into the office. It's stuff like this that makes me want to change career paths. Any advice would be greatly appreciated and reciprocated with offerings to the god or goddess of your choice.

Lord Randolph McDuff
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Re: San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby Lord Randolph McDuff » Tue Mar 19, 2013 9:56 pm

plasicnives wrote:As you can see from my poll, the cost will be virtually the same at all schools. I currently have no debt, no kids, no spouse and my car is paid off in full. Accepting some debt will just be expected at this point, so this aspect of my decision is somewhat negligible. I mean, would it really kill me to spend the next 15 years paying off student loans if I landed my dream job?

The one and only reason I am leaning towards San Diego is that I have lived in SoCal for most of my life and would really prefer to stay here. My parents live in Denver, but I am really not a big fan of the city. From the times I have visited, I have found Denver to be depressing, white-washed, completely lacking of any culture, and thoroughly depressing in the winter. I think if I ending up spending even 10 years living in the Denver metro area, I would probably lose my soul. To say the least, it will definitely be a step outside of my comfort zone to commit to living in Denver, but something I might just have to work through. I know nothing about Chicago, as far as quality of life is concerned.

My primary question, to which I don't seem to find a consistent answer, is, which market is the most promising for IP lawyers? BCG State of the Market is reporting the San Diego market for IP law is one of the absolute best job markets in the country. It's also a stone's throw away from Silicon Beach.

However, IP law is growing in general. Boulder is marketing itself as a second Silicon Valley, with it's IBM and Google headquarters, but I'm very skeptical of Denver's seemingly golden employment record. Any thoughts?

Lastly, IIT-Kent is almost out of the picture for me. But it IS a technical institute, and studying IP law at a technical institute must surely have its advantages. From what I understand, Chicago also has a strong market for IP lawyers and would be a smart choice for anyone hoping to practice patent litigation.

If it helps, I have an MA in Math and work as a public school teacher. I'm desperate to get out of education. Think being a lawyer is bad? Try watching an 11 year old girl try to commit suicide in your classroom or try getting shot at by gang members on your way into the office. It's stuff like this that makes me want to change career paths. Any advice would be greatly appreciated and reciprocated with offerings to the god or goddess of your choice.


So those $$ figures are cost of attending for one year? Just be a teacher for one more year and re-take your LSAT. Use that masters in Math to do a cost-benefit analysis on retaking for scholarship money.

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A. Nony Mouse
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Re: San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Tue Mar 19, 2013 9:59 pm

Dude/dudette, if you think Denver is depressing in the winter, you will not make it in Chicago. Denver in winter is paradise next to Chicago.

NYstate
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Re: San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby NYstate » Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:09 pm

Can you give us more information? Where else did you apply, etc.
What are your numbers?
I would read law school transparency for each of these schools.

But just going off what you have? San Diego?
Don't go to Denver if you hate it . I think kent has terrible job placement.

plasicnives
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Re: San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby plasicnives » Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:12 pm

A. Nony Mouse wrote:Dude/dudette, if you think Denver is depressing in the winter, you will not make it in Chicago. Denver in winter is paradise next to Chicago.


Yeah, I'm pretty close to ruling Kent out entirely unless someone comes into this thread with a revelation about how the Chicago technology market is will do anything to hire patent lawyers with computer experience.

plasicnives
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Re: San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby plasicnives » Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:20 pm

NYstate wrote:Can you give us more information? Where else did you apply, etc.
What are your numbers?
I would read law school transparency for each of these schools.

But just going off what you have? San Diego?
Don't go to Denver if you hate it . I think kent has terrible job placement.



[*]LSAT is 161.
[*]GPA is 3.63.
[*]I have applied to at least 8 more schools that I am still waiting to hear back from: UCLA, Tulane, Northwestern, Hastings, CU Boulder, William and Mary, Penn State, and Richmond.
[*] I have also been accepted to UC Irvine and Michigan State, but I have already ruled them out because Irvine is too new of a school and Michigan State seems to specialize in public interest. I have a decent scholarship offer from Michigan State, but it seems like there is no way to go to Michigan State and not work in public interest.
[*]I have been wait-listed to Washington and Lee.

Law school transparency is an excellent, excellent recommendation, btw. Thank you.

plasicnives
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Re: San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby plasicnives » Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:26 pm

Lord Randolph McDuff wrote:
plasicnives wrote:As you can see from my poll, the cost will be virtually the same at all schools. I currently have no debt, no kids, no spouse and my car is paid off in full. Accepting some debt will just be expected at this point, so this aspect of my decision is somewhat negligible. I mean, would it really kill me to spend the next 15 years paying off student loans if I landed my dream job?

The one and only reason I am leaning towards San Diego is that I have lived in SoCal for most of my life and would really prefer to stay here. My parents live in Denver, but I am really not a big fan of the city. From the times I have visited, I have found Denver to be depressing, white-washed, completely lacking of any culture, and thoroughly depressing in the winter. I think if I ending up spending even 10 years living in the Denver metro area, I would probably lose my soul. To say the least, it will definitely be a step outside of my comfort zone to commit to living in Denver, but something I might just have to work through. I know nothing about Chicago, as far as quality of life is concerned.

My primary question, to which I don't seem to find a consistent answer, is, which market is the most promising for IP lawyers? BCG State of the Market is reporting the San Diego market for IP law is one of the absolute best job markets in the country. It's also a stone's throw away from Silicon Beach.

However, IP law is growing in general. Boulder is marketing itself as a second Silicon Valley, with it's IBM and Google headquarters, but I'm very skeptical of Denver's seemingly golden employment record. Any thoughts?

Lastly, IIT-Kent is almost out of the picture for me. But it IS a technical institute, and studying IP law at a technical institute must surely have its advantages. From what I understand, Chicago also has a strong market for IP lawyers and would be a smart choice for anyone hoping to practice patent litigation.

If it helps, I have an MA in Math and work as a public school teacher. I'm desperate to get out of education. Think being a lawyer is bad? Try watching an 11 year old girl try to commit suicide in your classroom or try getting shot at by gang members on your way into the office. It's stuff like this that makes me want to change career paths. Any advice would be greatly appreciated and reciprocated with offerings to the god or goddess of your choice.


So those $$ figures are cost of attending for one year? Just be a teacher for one more year and re-take your LSAT. Use that masters in Math to do a cost-benefit analysis on retaking for scholarship money.


This is good advice, but I really don't want to teach, even for one more year. I've spent 5 years bouncing from school to school, in the Los Angeles public school system. I'm nowhere near having tenure, and my salary is capped at $42K. 10 years from now, I could maybe be making closer to $50K with the possibility of tenure and getting out of the urban schools into schools that are not utterly impoverished. With those kind of salary cap's, I would be netting almost the same amount of money as a patent litigator with $150K in student debt.

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teiswei
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Re: San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby teiswei » Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:45 pm

plasicnives wrote:
NYstate wrote:Can you give us more information? Where else did you apply, etc.
What are your numbers?
I would read law school transparency for each of these schools.

But just going off what you have? San Diego?
Don't go to Denver if you hate it . I think kent has terrible job placement.



[*]LSAT is 161.
[*]GPA is 3.63.
[*]I have applied to at least 8 more schools that I am still waiting to hear back from: UCLA, Tulane, Northwestern, Hastings, CU Boulder, William and Mary, Penn State, and Richmond.
[*] I have also been accepted to UC Irvine and Michigan State, but I have already ruled them out because Irvine is too new of a school and Michigan State seems to specialize in public interest. I have a decent scholarship offer from Michigan State, but it seems like there is no way to go to Michigan State and not work in public interest.
[*]I have been wait-listed to Washington and Lee.

Law school transparency is an excellent, excellent recommendation, btw. Thank you.

Irvine will give you a better opportunity at a solid job than any of the other three options. If you're faced with sticker, however, I wouldn't do it. Here is the initial class' job numbers:
http://www.law.uci.edu/career_dev/employment-statistics.html

According to the dean, two of the three unemployed are now employed and the third had a family emergency and was forced to delay the bar until this past February.

uci2013
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Re: San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby uci2013 » Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:58 pm

You might want to give UCI another look. We have awesome IP faculty who are highly cited and very good IP placement if you have the background. We've placed people at MoFo, Knobbe, Foley Lardner and I think Cooley (not sure on the Cooley) for IP; possibly others.

NYstate
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Re: San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby NYstate » Tue Mar 19, 2013 11:27 pm

I feel like you need to know more about law school
admissions but I'm not knowledgable enough about these schools to help you.You probably should retake for a higher LSAT score but your job sounds like it is slowly destroying you. But you could get into better schools with more money if you get a higher score. Your GPA is good enough to help you with a high enough LSAT.

Have you looked into the threads for each school? Maybe you can do something to get northwestern to look at you? I would post in those threads to see where they are in processing applications.

Re: UCI as far as i know the first class all went for free and the dean helped them all get jobs. No one thinks that will continue.

plasicnives
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Re: San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby plasicnives » Tue Mar 19, 2013 11:54 pm

teiswei wrote:
plasicnives wrote:
NYstate wrote:Can you give us more information? Where else did you apply, etc.
What are your numbers?
I would read law school transparency for each of these schools.

But just going off what you have? San Diego?
Don't go to Denver if you hate it . I think kent has terrible job placement.



[*]LSAT is 161.
[*]GPA is 3.63.
[*]I have applied to at least 8 more schools that I am still waiting to hear back from: UCLA, Tulane, Northwestern, Hastings, CU Boulder, William and Mary, Penn State, and Richmond.
[*] I have also been accepted to UC Irvine and Michigan State, but I have already ruled them out because Irvine is too new of a school and Michigan State seems to specialize in public interest. I have a decent scholarship offer from Michigan State, but it seems like there is no way to go to Michigan State and not work in public interest.
[*]I have been wait-listed to Washington and Lee.

Law school transparency is an excellent, excellent recommendation, btw. Thank you.

Irvine will give you a better opportunity at a solid job than any of the other three options. If you're faced with sticker, however, I wouldn't do it. Here is the initial class' job numbers:
http://www.law.uci.edu/career_dev/employment-statistics.html

According to the dean, two of the three unemployed are now employed and the third had a family emergency and was forced to delay the bar until this past February.


My god. That's definitely a game changer. Thanks for the share.

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somewhatwayward
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Re: San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby somewhatwayward » Wed Mar 20, 2013 12:09 am

I hear you on wanting to get out of teaching, but your chances of getting a high-paying private sector job out of these schools is probably in the single digits or maybe the low teens. IP helps a little (although I don't think math is as in demand as engineering, esp electrical and bio PhDs). Have you taken the patent bar? People talk about IP secure but that is becoming less of a thing as more and more patent-bar eligible people flock to law schools, many of them much better than these schools (sorry), in the hopes of landing the high-paying jobs.

Basically you will need to land in maybe the top 20% of your class at these schools, maybe higher, to have a shot at the job you want. I say this not to be mean but to challenge the way you are thinking about this decision: what makes you think you can beat 80-90% of a group of highly-motivated (they all know only half the class gets jobs...) people who have similar work ethic and intelligence to you? The kicker is that what really matters is your ability to take law school exams which is not always correlated with your intelligence and work ethic anyway. Betting on being top 10-20% (to get the IP job) or to land in the half of the class that gets any job is a losing gamble. You say you have looked at LST...how did you come away w the conclusion that these schools are with paying for? If you can go for free, that would make things more reasonable.

If you are going this year despite the terrible odds, first register for the June LSAT and get your ass into gear studying like crazy (ifyou can get a 3.6 studying math, you can do better than a shit, pure shit 161); then negotiate like crazy trying to get them to up your scholarship offers using the other offers as leverage and then put a seat deposit down at USD bc it sounds like Denver and kent are bad fits and UCI is not worth sticker; then take the LSAT and at least break 165 (that is an order) and go back to USD and ask for serious scholarship money. Then attend USD basically for free and hustle like crazy but be prepared for landing no job after you graduate.

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Yukos
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Re: San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby Yukos » Wed Mar 20, 2013 12:22 am

somewhatwayward wrote:I hear you on wanting to get out of teaching, but your chances of getting a high-paying private sector job out of these schools is probably in the single digits or maybe the low teens. IP helps a little (although I don't think math is as in demand as engineering, esp electrical and bio PhDs). Have you taken the patent bar? People talk about IP secure but that is becoming less of a thing as more and more patent-bar eligible people flock to law schools, many of them much better than these schools (sorry), in the hopes of landing the high-paying jobs.

Basically you will need to land in maybe the top 20% of your class at these schools, maybe higher, to have a shot at the job you want. I say this not to be mean but to challenge the way you are thinking about this decision: what makes you think you can beat 80-90% of a group of highly-motivated (they all know only half the class gets jobs...) people who have similar work ethic and intelligence to you? The kicker is that what really matters is your ability to take law school exams which is not always correlated with your intelligence and work ethic anyway. Betting on being top 10-20% (to get the IP job) or to land in the half of the class that gets any job is a losing gamble. You say you have looked at LST...how did you come away w the conclusion that these schools are with paying for? If you can go for free, that would make things more reasonable.

If you are going this year despite the terrible odds, first register for the June LSAT and get your ass into gear studying like crazy (ifyou can get a 3.6 studying math, you can do better than a shit, pure shit 161); then negotiate like crazy trying to get them to up your scholarship offers using the other offers as leverage and then put a seat deposit down at USD bc it sounds like Denver and kent are bad fits and UCI is not worth sticker; then take the LSAT and at least break 165 (that is an order) and go back to USD and ask for serious scholarship money. Then attend USD basically for free and hustle like crazy but be prepared for landing no job after you graduate.


+1, retake is definitely the best option but working in a job you hate for another year is shitty. Then again, San Diego gives you less than a coin-flip's chance of becoming a lawyer of any type and less than 10% get market paying (ie >$100k) gigs.

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J-e-L-L-o
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Re: San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby J-e-L-L-o » Wed Mar 20, 2013 1:17 am

Retake is TCR. Get a 170+ and try to get in to Northwestern or Cornell.

You will not get an IP boost with a math degree:

A. CATEGORY A: Bachelor's Degree in a Recognized Technical Subject.
An applicant will be considered to have established to the satisfaction of the OED Director that he
or she possesses the necessary scientific and technical training if he or she provides an official
transcript showing that a Bachelor's degree was awarded in one of the following subjects by an
accredited United States college or university, or that the equivalent to a Bachelor's degree was
awarded by a foreign university in one of the following subjects:
Biology Pharmacology Electrochemical Engineering
Biochemistry Physics Engineering Physics
Botany Textile Technology General Engineering
Computer Science* Aeronautical Engineering Geological Engineering
Electronics Technology Agricultural Engineering Industrial Engineering
Food Technology Biomedical Engineering Mechanical Engineering
General Chemistry Ceramic Engineering Metallurgical Engineering
Marine Technology Chemical Engineering Mining Engineering
Microbiology Civil Engineering Nuclear Engineering
Molecular Biology Computer Engineering Petroleum Engineering
Organic Chemistry Electrical Engineering
*Acceptable Computer Science degrees must be accredited by the Computer Science
Accreditation Commission (CSAC) of the Computing Sciences Accreditation Board (CSAB), or
by the Computing Accreditation Commission (CAC) of the Accreditation Board for Engineering
and Technology (ABET), on or before the date the degree was awarded. Computer science
degrees that are accredited may be found on the Internet (http://www.abet.org).

USD is not all roses and sunshine. SD is a very small legal market. Most of the IP work is medical device, bio-med, and EE stuff. 3.3% OCI hiring and 13% of jobs from students' previous employer don't equal a good outcome for someone trying to break into the SD scene. You can do IP litigation but w/o a top law school or technical degree it will be harder.

I would choose UCI over USD. Not for sticker though. UCI gives generous scholarship amounts. Raise dat LSAT

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rickgrimes69
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Re: San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby rickgrimes69 » Wed Mar 20, 2013 7:57 am

J-e-L-L-o wrote:You will not get an IP boost with a math degree


About time someone mentioned this. OP, Math doesn't even qualify you to sit for the patent bar. You probably aren't doing IP work.

NYstate
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Re: San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby NYstate » Wed Mar 20, 2013 8:47 am

rickgrimes69 wrote:
J-e-L-L-o wrote:You will not get an IP boost with a math degree


About time someone mentioned this. OP, Math doesn't even qualify you to sit for the patent bar. You probably aren't doing IP work.


What is your undergrad degree in?

Not all IP is patent work, but I don't know howmuch math will help you.

timbs4339
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Re: San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby timbs4339 » Wed Mar 20, 2013 9:00 am

plasicnives wrote:
teiswei wrote:
plasicnives wrote:
NYstate wrote:Can you give us more information? Where else did you apply, etc.
What are your numbers?
I would read law school transparency for each of these schools.

But just going off what you have? San Diego?
Don't go to Denver if you hate it . I think kent has terrible job placement.



[*]LSAT is 161.
[*]GPA is 3.63.
[*]I have applied to at least 8 more schools that I am still waiting to hear back from: UCLA, Tulane, Northwestern, Hastings, CU Boulder, William and Mary, Penn State, and Richmond.
[*] I have also been accepted to UC Irvine and Michigan State, but I have already ruled them out because Irvine is too new of a school and Michigan State seems to specialize in public interest. I have a decent scholarship offer from Michigan State, but it seems like there is no way to go to Michigan State and not work in public interest.
[*]I have been wait-listed to Washington and Lee.

Law school transparency is an excellent, excellent recommendation, btw. Thank you.

Irvine will give you a better opportunity at a solid job than any of the other three options. If you're faced with sticker, however, I wouldn't do it. Here is the initial class' job numbers:
http://www.law.uci.edu/career_dev/employment-statistics.html

According to the dean, two of the three unemployed are now employed and the third had a family emergency and was forced to delay the bar until this past February.


My god. That's definitely a game changer. Thanks for the share.


No, it's not. That class had T10 numbers, there were only 60 of them, they all had full-rides, and the dean went gangbusters to find them positions. UCI will not be pulling those numbers with 150 students most paying sticker and a faculty who have used all their contacts.

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J-e-L-L-o
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Re: San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby J-e-L-L-o » Wed Mar 20, 2013 11:36 am

timbs4339 wrote:No, it's not. That class had T10 numbers, there were only 60 of them, they all had full-rides, and the dean went gangbusters to find them positions. UCI will not be pulling those numbers with 150 students most paying sticker and a faculty who have used all their contacts.


UCI class is already 110. I love your crystal ball though. They are really generous w/ scholarships so I don't know what you are talking about most paying sticker. They've added around 20 students per year so in only 2-3 years they should reach 150 students if current trends hold. Anecdotal evidence from students themselves are not inline w/ the TLS "UCI is new and will be shit" mantra

For a "new" school they are already placing students better than more established schools w/ larger classes. The (still) small classes are a benefit IMO

Summer placements for 1L's and 2L's 2010-2012
http://www.law.uci.edu/career_dev/past_placements.html

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J-e-L-L-o
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Re: San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby J-e-L-L-o » Wed Mar 20, 2013 11:39 am

rickgrimes69 wrote:
J-e-L-L-o wrote:You will not get an IP boost with a math degree


About time someone mentioned this. OP, Math doesn't even qualify you to sit for the patent bar. You probably aren't doing IP work.


Not from these schools he is considering. A specific degree is not required for trademark, licensing, and copyright but good grades from a good school are.

09042014
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Re: San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby 09042014 » Wed Mar 20, 2013 12:01 pm

plasicnives wrote:
A. Nony Mouse wrote:Dude/dudette, if you think Denver is depressing in the winter, you will not make it in Chicago. Denver in winter is paradise next to Chicago.


Yeah, I'm pretty close to ruling Kent out entirely unless someone comes into this thread with a revelation about how the Chicago technology market is will do anything to hire patent lawyers with computer experience.


They will not.

But Denver's market is small as hell.

And San Deigo's isn't that great either.

Do you have a CE or EE degree or is it just a MA in Math? Because an MA in Math might get you patent litigation, but from those schools you'll still need good grades.

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romothesavior
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Re: San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby romothesavior » Wed Mar 20, 2013 12:06 pm

I am confused by your nunbers. Is that cost in the poll per year? If so, RUN from all of these schools. 180k in principal for a school like these? You're out of your mind if you'd pay that for these job prospects.

And I understand that you are tired of teaching. But one more year of teaching and being miserable or a boatload of debt and being in/underemployed and far more miserable for a long time?

Retake is TCR.

09042014
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Re: San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby 09042014 » Wed Mar 20, 2013 12:07 pm

romothesavior wrote:I am confused by your nunbers. Is that cost in the poll per year? If so, RUN from all of these schools. 180k in principal for a school like these? You're out of your mind if you'd pay that for these job prospects.

And I understand that you are tired of teaching. But one more year of teaching and being miserable or a boatload of debt and being in/underemployed and far more miserable for a long time?

Retake is TCR.


And if you burn out of teacher, I have no clue how you'd make it at a law firm.

The seven hour days and 4 months of vacation must be tiring.

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Re: San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby timbs4339 » Wed Mar 20, 2013 1:57 pm

J-e-L-L-o wrote:
timbs4339 wrote:No, it's not. That class had T10 numbers, there were only 60 of them, they all had full-rides, and the dean went gangbusters to find them positions. UCI will not be pulling those numbers with 150 students most paying sticker and a faculty who have used all their contacts.


UCI class is already 110. I love your crystal ball though. They are really generous w/ scholarships so I don't know what you are talking about most paying sticker. They've added around 20 students per year so in only 2-3 years they should reach 150 students if current trends hold. Anecdotal evidence from students themselves are not inline w/ the TLS "UCI is new and will be shit" mantra

For a "new" school they are already placing students better than more established schools w/ larger classes. The (still) small classes are a benefit IMO

Summer placements for 1L's and 2L's 2010-2012
http://www.law.uci.edu/career_dev/past_placements.html


They simply cannot support the type of school they want to be while maintaining scholarships at the level they have been. It doesn't require a crystal ball, simply basic logic and understanding of how law school economics work. The plan was full schollys for the inaugural class, half schollys for the second and then normal pricing onward.

Anecdotal evidence is just that, anecdotal, and students who took a risk (but less than the students are taking now) have an extreme incentive to play up their own experiences. Unless you are being offered serious money that brings the cost down to around 75K total, there is no benefit to "getting in on the ground floor" of UCI.

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A. Nony Mouse
Posts: 22865
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:51 am

Re: San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Wed Mar 20, 2013 4:30 pm

Desert Fox wrote:
romothesavior wrote:I am confused by your nunbers. Is that cost in the poll per year? If so, RUN from all of these schools. 180k in principal for a school like these? You're out of your mind if you'd pay that for these job prospects.

And I understand that you are tired of teaching. But one more year of teaching and being miserable or a boatload of debt and being in/underemployed and far more miserable for a long time?

Retake is TCR.


And if you burn out of teacher, I have no clue how you'd make it at a law firm.

The seven hour days and 4 months of vacation must be tiring.

I realize you're probably just trolling, but you've never been a teacher, have you?

09042014
Posts: 18282
Joined: Wed Oct 14, 2009 10:47 pm

Re: San Diego v Sturm v IIT-Kent for IP Law / Patent Litigation

Postby 09042014 » Wed Mar 20, 2013 5:27 pm

A. Nony Mouse wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:
romothesavior wrote:I am confused by your nunbers. Is that cost in the poll per year? If so, RUN from all of these schools. 180k in principal for a school like these? You're out of your mind if you'd pay that for these job prospects.

And I understand that you are tired of teaching. But one more year of teaching and being miserable or a boatload of debt and being in/underemployed and far more miserable for a long time?

Retake is TCR.


And if you burn out of teacher, I have no clue how you'd make it at a law firm.

The seven hour days and 4 months of vacation must be tiring.

I realize you're probably just trolling, but you've never been a teacher, have you?


I was sorta trolling, but teachers at the high school I attended rolled into school at 7:15: left at 3:30 and had three- 50 minute periods off. More like 3.5 months off.




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