GW vs. UW

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simplycatalina
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GW vs. UW

Postby simplycatalina » Tue Mar 05, 2013 12:10 am

I want to work in DC but my parents want me to stay in the Pacific region and are trying to push UW on me. I'm sure that I'd be happy working in DC my whole life--I've saved up a lot so I'd probably end up with around $50K in debt. Is attending GW worth it if I wanna stay in the area??

empyreanrrv
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Re: GW vs. UW

Postby empyreanrrv » Tue Mar 05, 2013 1:16 am

What are your numbers? What's the cost of attendance for both UW and GW? Having savings to blow on GW sticker is not smart, even if you will only graduate with 50k in debt, which is reasonable. Where do you want to practice? If you go to UW, plan to make your career in Washington. If GW, DC. What do you want to do with your degree?

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ExBiglawAssociate
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Re: GW vs. UW

Postby ExBiglawAssociate » Tue Mar 05, 2013 1:17 am

What are your salary expectations?

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simplycatalina
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Re: GW vs. UW

Postby simplycatalina » Tue Mar 05, 2013 12:22 pm

I want to do Public Interest work so my salary expectations are not high, but I'm hoping to qualify for LRAP. And yes, I understand that either school confines me to the area. I want my career to be in DC so I thought GW was the smarter choice. I just got into GW yesterday--I'm hoping for a scholarship but I understand it takes them a few weeks to send that info out.

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simplycatalina
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Re: GW vs. UW

Postby simplycatalina » Tue Mar 05, 2013 10:23 pm

Anyone else have thoughts??

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Ramius
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Re: GW vs. UW

Postby Ramius » Tue Mar 05, 2013 10:36 pm

GW is in a tough position as a T20 in that the very top schools gun for their home market pretty heavily. Their employment isn't exactly fantastic, and there is already word that the number of school-funded positions has gone up for C/O 2012. I would never tell you to make a huge investment into an education there, knowing the CoA and likely job outcomes, regardless of your employment aspirations. Also GW lacks the LRAP of some of the better schools (even GULC).

I won't tell you that GW is a complete shithole (although some might, given the strong anti-GULC and anti-GW sentiment on TLS), but I would strongly insist that you go in knowing full well that your chances of employment in DC are still relatively low in desirable DC positions.

Go in fully informed about your chances of employment, factor in the cost-benefit of LS now vs. employment and reapplying down the road and see what is right for you. I can't tell you the right choice, but if you REALLY want DC, I would seriously consider taking a little time off, building WE and maybe retaking the LSAT to strive for a T14 like UVA, PENN or even GULC instead of going immediately after GW.

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bk1
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Re: GW vs. UW

Postby bk1 » Tue Mar 05, 2013 10:38 pm

If you want to work in DC then attend GW. Unless your parents are paying for your education I see no reason why they should have any say.

It's not clear how much of your own money you're dropping on GW. Coming out of GW with $50k debt is fantastic, but if you're blowing over $50-70k or so of your own money that is a questionable decision imo.

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simplycatalina
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Re: GW vs. UW

Postby simplycatalina » Wed Mar 06, 2013 12:05 am

bk1 wrote:If you want to work in DC then attend GW. Unless your parents are paying for your education I see no reason why they should have any say.

It's not clear how much of your own money you're dropping on GW. Coming out of GW with $50k debt is fantastic, but if you're blowing over $50-70k or so of your own money that is a questionable decision imo.


My parents are supporting me through my education, yes. I've saved up around $100K and they're providing the rest. They want me to attend UW because of their diluted notions that this will allow me to get a great job in CA. My dad, of the boomer generation, does not understand the realities of the legal market. Anyway, I've always wanted to go to GW--I want to live permanently in DC. I know I'm crazy but I didn't even apply to Georgetown because I like GW significantly better.

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bk1
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Re: GW vs. UW

Postby bk1 » Wed Mar 06, 2013 12:32 am

Neither you nor your parents seem to be looking at schools logically.

I'm assuming GW is costing you sticker. It seems like an awful idea to burn the 100k you've saved up plus whatever your parents are giving you on GW. Retake/reapply is probably the credited response here since GW is not worth anything closer to sticker.

timbs4339
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Re: GW vs. UW

Postby timbs4339 » Wed Mar 06, 2013 2:17 am

Do not spend 100K in savings on GW. That's a terrible investment.

Depending on your numbers, maybe you should take the 100K, move to DC, get a low-paying non-profit job for a year or two and bring the LSAT score up. If you spend 10K on living costs, but get $50,000 more in scholly money, that's a pretty damn good return. And you'll have connections for when you go on the job hunt.

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simplycatalina
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Re: GW vs. UW

Postby simplycatalina » Wed Mar 06, 2013 6:23 am

bk1 wrote:Neither you nor your parents seem to be looking at schools logically.

I'm assuming GW is costing you sticker. It seems like an awful idea to burn the 100k you've saved up plus whatever your parents are giving you on GW. Retake/reapply is probably the credited response here since GW is not worth anything closer to sticker.


Like I said, it's most likely not going to cost me sticker. I got in 2 days ago and they send out scholarships 2-3 weeks later. So I'm guessing I'll get something/also qualify for need-based aid. Even with around $25K per year, it's not worth it if I want to work in DC? Also, I have a very legitimate reason for not applying to Georgetown; if you want specific details, PM me. Still waiting on a few other T14, but I could never go to Gtown.

timbs4339
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Re: GW vs. UW

Postby timbs4339 » Wed Mar 06, 2013 9:44 am

cbarlow1016 wrote:
bk1 wrote:Neither you nor your parents seem to be looking at schools logically.

I'm assuming GW is costing you sticker. It seems like an awful idea to burn the 100k you've saved up plus whatever your parents are giving you on GW. Retake/reapply is probably the credited response here since GW is not worth anything closer to sticker.


Like I said, it's most likely not going to cost me sticker. I got in 2 days ago and they send out scholarships 2-3 weeks later. So I'm guessing I'll get something/also qualify for need-based aid. Even with around $25K per year, it's not worth it if I want to work in DC? Also, I have a very legitimate reason for not applying to Georgetown; if you want specific details, PM me. Still waiting on a few other T14, but I could never go to Gtown.


25k/year+20K year living costs = 45K*3 ($145K total). Tack on another 10-15K for accrued interest, bar fees, and tuition hikes and that's 160K.

IDK how you expect to get need based aid with 100K in savings- that's probably more than 95% of law students have in the bank. Need-based scholarships don't really exists except at HYS.

You have the savings and parental contributions, which will lower your long term debt repayment amounts. So that's good. But it also expands your current options. I wouldn't advise on GW if you were taking out that amount of debt, and unless you're filthy rich I don't advise on it with savings either. It would be less riskier, IMO, to take your savings and move to DC and get a low paid job doing whatever you eventually want to do or a paralegal job at a large firm, study for the LSAT, and go T14.

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simplycatalina
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Re: GW vs. UW

Postby simplycatalina » Wed Mar 06, 2013 10:01 am

timbs4339 wrote:
cbarlow1016 wrote:
bk1 wrote:Neither you nor your parents seem to be looking at schools logically.

I'm assuming GW is costing you sticker. It seems like an awful idea to burn the 100k you've saved up plus whatever your parents are giving you on GW. Retake/reapply is probably the credited response here since GW is not worth anything closer to sticker.


Like I said, it's most likely not going to cost me sticker. I got in 2 days ago and they send out scholarships 2-3 weeks later. So I'm guessing I'll get something/also qualify for need-based aid. Even with around $25K per year, it's not worth it if I want to work in DC? Also, I have a very legitimate reason for not applying to Georgetown; if you want specific details, PM me. Still waiting on a few other T14, but I could never go to Gtown.


25k/year+20K year living costs = 45K*3 ($145K total). Tack on another 10-15K for accrued interest, bar fees, and tuition hikes and that's 160K.

IDK how you expect to get need based aid with 100K in savings- that's probably more than 95% of law students have in the bank. Need-based scholarships don't really exists except at HYS.

You have the savings and parental contributions, which will lower your long term debt repayment amounts. So that's good. But it also expands your current options. I wouldn't advise on GW if you were taking out that amount of debt, and unless you're filthy rich I don't advise on it with savings either. It would be less riskier, IMO, to take your savings and move to DC and get a low paid job doing whatever you eventually want to do or a paralegal job at a large firm, study for the LSAT, and go T14.


Ok thanks for the advice! :)

NYstate
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Re: GW vs. UW

Postby NYstate » Wed Mar 06, 2013 10:23 am

GW is the classic trap school.
http://insidethelawschoolscam.blogspot. ... s.html?m=1


Don't pay sticker to go there.

If you have a good job why are you leaving it for law school?
You should read
Don't go to law school unless by prof campos.

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cahwc12
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Re: GW vs. UW

Postby cahwc12 » Wed Mar 06, 2013 11:15 am

cbarlow1016 wrote:
bk1 wrote:If you want to work in DC then attend GW. Unless your parents are paying for your education I see no reason why they should have any say.

It's not clear how much of your own money you're dropping on GW. Coming out of GW with $50k debt is fantastic, but if you're blowing over $50-70k or so of your own money that is a questionable decision imo.


My parents are supporting me through my education, yes. I've saved up around $100K and they're providing the rest. They want me to attend UW because of their diluted notions that this will allow me to get a great job in CA. My dad, of the boomer generation, does not understand the realities of the legal market. Anyway, I've always wanted to go to GW--I want to live permanently in DC. I know I'm crazy but I didn't even apply to Georgetown because I like GW significantly better.


For someone who has the fortitude to save $100,000 you sure are wanting to make a stupid decision.

Take that $100,000 and get into the capital gains racket, or find some other investment that is more likely to yield a reasonable return on your investment. No one will tell you that GW or UW is a sound investment at sticker. The only reason you will have manageable debt is because you are going to blow all your savings on it.

You could use that $100,000 to live in a nice beach house on the shores of Thailand for the rest of your life. Or you can blow it all being miserable for a 70% chance at becoming a lawyer.

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somewhatwayward
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Re: GW vs. UW

Postby somewhatwayward » Wed Mar 06, 2013 12:24 pm

Um, you have 100K and your parents can contribute another 100K (to get your debt down to 50K) and you expect to qualify for need-based aid? There are law students and prospective law students out there who are truly needy (living paycheck to paycheck or even on government assistance) and most won't receive a dime in need-based aid because of law schools' huge focus on merit aid. The fact that you have 100K puts you in a better position than 95% of law students, so you should expect to be behind all of them in line for need-based aid. You might get merit aid, but you will not get need-based aid unless the aid office has gone insane.

You are right that UW is unlikely to get you CA. In fact, it is about a 50/50 chance that you will get any job from there. Unfortunately GW is about the same. Don't blow your savings on these schools. Instead retake the LSAT until you get a big scholarship to a decent school (GW for free would be ok - I mean, I wouldn't do it bc it could end up being a waste of three years but at least you wouldn't blow 100K on it) and then invest your 100K. That 100K could be 430K in 30 years at 5% interest or 750K in 30 years at 7%.

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Solistus
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Re: GW vs. UW

Postby Solistus » Wed Mar 06, 2013 1:11 pm

Just to add to the "there's no such thing as need based aid" chorus:

I have several admit offers. I have basically no assets in my name, no income, and no expected contribution from my parents. I have received several admit offers and some *merit* scholarship offers, but the only form of "need based aid" I have been offered is loans.

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francesfarmer
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Re: GW vs. UW

Postby francesfarmer » Wed Mar 06, 2013 1:24 pm

Solistus wrote:Just to add to the "there's no such thing as need based aid" chorus:

I have several admit offers. I have basically no assets in my name, no income, and no expected contribution from my parents. I have received several admit offers and some *merit* scholarship offers, but the only form of "need based aid" I have been offered is loans.

To add to this: I have no assets, my parents make <$20k a year, and I got <$40k need-based aid total over three years from a T-14. Law school is not undergrad in terms of financial aid.

rad lulz
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Re: GW vs. UW

Postby rad lulz » Wed Mar 06, 2013 1:30 pm

I second what everyone already said about yall being really dumb about money.

Do you have a demonstrable PI background?

I don't mean volunteering at the soup kitchen once in a while or doing TFA.

If not, you're gonna be at the OCI bread line like everyone else.

Why not just, I dunno, do PI.

Use that $100k and start a charity or something.

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alwayssunnyinfl
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Re: GW vs. UW

Postby alwayssunnyinfl » Wed Mar 06, 2013 1:34 pm

cbarlow's loaded? You guys should be nicer to her, she's cute too.

rad lulz
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Re: GW vs. UW

Postby rad lulz » Wed Mar 06, 2013 1:36 pm

alwayssunnyinfl wrote:cbarlow's loaded? You guys should be nicer to her, she's cute too.

And she and her family are dumb about money. Good combo.

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alwayssunnyinfl
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Re: GW vs. UW

Postby alwayssunnyinfl » Wed Mar 06, 2013 1:42 pm

rad lulz wrote:
alwayssunnyinfl wrote:cbarlow's loaded? You guys should be nicer to her, she's cute too.

And she and her family are dumb about money. Good combo.


Eh, I didn't like cbarlow when she first went nuts in whatever thread that was, but she's grown on me. CB, it sounds like you've wanted to go into law for a while, and you feel like you could be one of those attorneys that does good with your law degree. But the truth is, if you blow your savings on this degree, you're going to be at a huge disadvantage to really help.

The only reasons I see to go to a "highly ranked" law school is if it's the best school you got into with a great scholarship, or because you can use the prestige to get a job that you would not get otherwise. GW and UW both probably won't fit this bill. If you really want to work at an organization in DC where you can make a difference, your best bet probably is to move there, study for a retake, and do UVA or ED GWU for a free ride.

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hephaestus
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Re: GW vs. UW

Postby hephaestus » Wed Mar 06, 2013 1:50 pm

What kind of PI work do you want to do? Why specifically in DC? Why isn't just doing PI an option (as rad said)?

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manofjustice
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Re: GW vs. UW

Postby manofjustice » Wed Mar 06, 2013 2:18 pm

Your parents are wrong. You want to work in DC and do PI work? UW will kill both those goals quicker than a...well, whatever...

Yes, your parents are dead wrong.

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VeeD101
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Re: GW vs. UW

Postby VeeD101 » Wed Mar 06, 2013 6:16 pm

NYstate wrote:GW is the classic trap school.
http://insidethelawschoolscam.blogspot. ... s.html?m=1


Don't pay sticker to go there.

If you have a good job why are you leaving it for law school?
You should read
Don't go to law school unless by prof campos.


I don't know what having a good job has to do with going to law school. Not everyone wants to go to law school because they don't have a clue about what else to do in life. OP, it may be perfectly acceptable to give up a good job to go to law school if that is what you want and that is what you have worked hard and saved for. That being said, listen to what others have said here about the prospects of going to GW and getting the job you want in the DC area.




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