Fordham vs. William and Mary

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scrappydoo716
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Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby scrappydoo716 » Wed Feb 27, 2013 1:03 pm

I am stuck making a decision between a few schools that are all in relatively the same range as far as rankings go. So far I have been accepted to quite a few schools including William and Mary and Brooklyn Law, both of which are meriting serious consideration as they have awarded me hefty financial aid packages, that take their respective tuitions down to <$10,000. One of my top choices going into the process, Fordham, has still not gotten back to me about wether or not I have been accepted/ a possible financial aid package. My biggest problem is even if I get in Fordham will cost me at least $20,000 more than the other two schools I have mentioned, but it seems to afford me the brightest prospects in the regions I would like to practice (NY & CA) and in my current preferred field (entertainment and sports law) Can anyone help shed some light on wether or not Fordham is truly worth the exorbitant amount of debt I would be taking on by attending? PLEASE HELP

rad lulz
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Re: Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby rad lulz » Wed Feb 27, 2013 1:06 pm

None of those schools will help you get to CA

None of those schools will do you any favors trying to be an entertainment lawyer

What is total cost of attendance at each of those schools?

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stuckinthemiddle
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Re: Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby stuckinthemiddle » Wed Feb 27, 2013 1:08 pm

From what I've heard, Fordham is really risky at sticker.

Come back when you've gotten your financial aid package.

scrappydoo716
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Re: Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby scrappydoo716 » Wed Feb 27, 2013 1:12 pm

Fordham rank 29 (w/o financial aid) = $44,370/yr

W&M rank 35 (w financial aid) = $6,646/yr

BLS rank 65 = 3,000/ yr

rad lulz
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Re: Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby rad lulz » Wed Feb 27, 2013 1:14 pm

Total cost of attendance includes cost of living. Add that.

scrappydoo716
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Re: Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby scrappydoo716 » Wed Feb 27, 2013 1:24 pm

Fordham - $75,922/yr (again still haven't heard back about financial aid)

W&M - $29,100/yr

BLS - $34,536/yr

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hephaestus
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Re: Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby hephaestus » Wed Feb 27, 2013 1:30 pm

Obligatory question: what do you think entertainment lawyers do and why do you want to be one? It's helpful if we actually understand your goals.

scrappydoo716
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Re: Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby scrappydoo716 » Wed Feb 27, 2013 1:40 pm

from what I understand (pretty much as basic an understanding as possible) they work within the industry on contracts and various other legal documents. I am not really set on being one but of the job possibilities i have researched entertainment law seemed like a good option for me as I would like to practice within a field that I have some connection with. I know that I should not be limiting myself by choosing only job opportunities that appeal to me. Entertainment law seems to be one of the fields that does appeal to me though because I do care about the industry and would like to be somewhat a part of it. I do not have any delusions of being some rock/movie star nor do I necessarily care about networking with these people. It is mostly just the industry that I am interested in. I do however have another seperate goal of eventually becoming a judge (which I realize probably would not come from being an entertainment lawyer)This goal comes from the fact that I have always found myself to be a person of solid, yet flexible, moral fiber and consider my decision making to be quite fair.

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Crowing
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Re: Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby Crowing » Wed Feb 27, 2013 1:45 pm

The ranking does not matter. None of those schools will get you to CA. Only Fordham provides a reasonable shot at NY, but it's not worth the risk at that cost. Hopefully you will get more money there because atm none of those options look good.

scrappydoo716
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Re: Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby scrappydoo716 » Wed Feb 27, 2013 1:50 pm

If I chose to attend a school in VA such as william and mary (other options include George Mason and Washington & Lee) is there a reasonable chance that I will ever be able to work in one of my preferred regions?

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hephaestus
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Re: Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby hephaestus » Wed Feb 27, 2013 1:59 pm

scrappydoo716 wrote:If I chose to attend a school in VA such as william and mary (other options include George Mason and Washington & Lee) is there a reasonable chance that I will ever be able to work in one of my preferred regions?

No. You need a school like UCLA, USC or a T14 for your goals.

scrappydoo716
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Re: Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby scrappydoo716 » Wed Feb 27, 2013 2:15 pm

ImNoScar wrote:
scrappydoo716 wrote:If I chose to attend a school in VA such as william and mary (other options include George Mason and Washington & Lee) is there a reasonable chance that I will ever be able to work in one of my preferred regions?

No. You need a school like UCLA, USC or a T14 for your goals.


Would it make any sense at all to transfer into one of those schools after 1L? It is pretty late in the application process and my undergraduate GPA due to an unremarkable freshman year will probably hold me back. I have heard that transferring carries a certain amount of risk as it can take away from your 1L summer experience.

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Crowing
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Re: Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby Crowing » Wed Feb 27, 2013 2:18 pm

scrappydoo716 wrote:
ImNoScar wrote:
scrappydoo716 wrote:If I chose to attend a school in VA such as william and mary (other options include George Mason and Washington & Lee) is there a reasonable chance that I will ever be able to work in one of my preferred regions?

No. You need a school like UCLA, USC or a T14 for your goals.


Would it make any sense at all to transfer into one of those schools after 1L? It is pretty late in the application process and my undergraduate GPA due to an unremarkable freshman year will probably hold me back. I have heard that transferring carries a certain amount of risk as it can take away from your 1L summer experience.


It's not an advisable plan because you'll need very good 1L grades to transfer up.

AP-375
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Re: Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby AP-375 » Wed Feb 27, 2013 2:21 pm

ImNoScar wrote:
scrappydoo716 wrote:If I chose to attend a school in VA such as william and mary (other options include George Mason and Washington & Lee) is there a reasonable chance that I will ever be able to work in one of my preferred regions?

No. You need a school like UCLA, USC or a T14 for your goals.


1) The answer to this question is not unequivocally no. (Although I should probably clarify that by saying, define reasonable chance.) I'm at W&M now. I am headed to a top NYC firm. So are several others. I know several headed to California. Both require grades and hustle.
If your question is "Is it possible to ever work in these locations?" Then the answer is yes, of course. I'll let everyone else add all of the caveats that you should be well aware of.
2) I don't know anyone from here going into entertainment law.
3) Why is your cost of attendance so high for W&M? If you're paying $6k in yearly tuition, your COL should only be like $16k more, which would put you at $22k/yr/$66k total, which seems like a low price to me.
Last edited by AP-375 on Wed Feb 27, 2013 2:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

scrappydoo716
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Re: Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby scrappydoo716 » Wed Feb 27, 2013 2:23 pm

Crowing wrote:
scrappydoo716 wrote:
ImNoScar wrote:
scrappydoo716 wrote:If I chose to attend a school in VA such as william and mary (other options include George Mason and Washington & Lee) is there a reasonable chance that I will ever be able to work in one of my preferred regions?

No. You need a school like UCLA, USC or a T14 for your goals.


Would it make any sense at all to transfer into one of those schools after 1L? It is pretty late in the application process and my undergraduate GPA due to an unremarkable freshman year will probably hold me back. I have heard that transferring carries a certain amount of risk as it can take away from your 1L summer experience.


It's not an advisable plan because you'll need very good 1L grades to transfer up.



And say per some chance I do receive those grades (top 15% or so) then is the risk worth it?

scrappydoo716
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Re: Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby scrappydoo716 » Wed Feb 27, 2013 2:26 pm

AP-375 wrote:
ImNoScar wrote:
scrappydoo716 wrote:If I chose to attend a school in VA such as william and mary (other options include George Mason and Washington & Lee) is there a reasonable chance that I will ever be able to work in one of my preferred regions?

No. You need a school like UCLA, USC or a T14 for your goals.


1) The answer to this question is not unequivocally no. (Although I should probably clarify that by saying, define reasonable chance.) I'm at W&M now. I am headed to a top NYC firm. So are several others. I know several headed to California. Both require grades and hustle.
If your question is "Is it possible to ever work in these locations?" Then the answer is yes, of course. I'll let everyone else add all of the caveats that you should be well aware of.
2) I don't know anyone from here going into entertainment law.
3) Why is your cost of attendance so high for W&M? If you're paying $6k in yearly tuition, your COL should only be like $16k more, which would put you at $20k/yr/$60k total, which seems like a low price to me.


I got the cost of living off of their website, I assume it is probably a high estimate. The school says it has a sports and entertainment law society which hosts an annual symposium. Would this not provide an adequate opportunity to network?

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North
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Re: Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby North » Wed Feb 27, 2013 2:29 pm

scrappydoo716 wrote:And say per some chance I do receive those grades (top 15% or so) then is the risk worth it?

If I win the lottery, is buying a ticket worth the risk?

There's an 85% chance that you won't be in the top 15%.

kryptix
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Re: Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby kryptix » Wed Feb 27, 2013 2:32 pm

I do know quite a few people in Fordham who went into entertainment, especially fashion where Fordham seems to have connections (but these people had a passion for it already). Also 2 that went to pro sports and a few in music/TV in NYC, but none of these pay anything like biglaw market if that is what your looking for...

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Crowing
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Re: Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby Crowing » Wed Feb 27, 2013 2:34 pm

scrappydoo716 wrote:And say per some chance I do receive those grades (top 15% or so) then is the risk worth it?


If you're asking if the transfer stigma is bad enough to make transferring bad, then the answer is (in general) no.

AP-375
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Re: Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby AP-375 » Wed Feb 27, 2013 2:36 pm

scrappydoo716 wrote:
AP-375 wrote:1) The answer to this question is not unequivocally no. (Although I should probably clarify that by saying, define reasonable chance.) I'm at W&M now. I am headed to a top NYC firm. So are several others. I know several headed to California. Both require grades and hustle.
If your question is "Is it possible to ever work in these locations?" Then the answer is yes, of course. I'll let everyone else add all of the caveats that you should be well aware of.
2) I don't know anyone from here going into entertainment law.
3) Why is your cost of attendance so high for W&M? If you're paying $6k in yearly tuition, your COL should only be like $16k more, which would put you at $20k/yr/$60k total, which seems like a low price to me.


I got the cost of living off of their website, I assume it is probably a high estimate. The school says it has a sports and entertainment law society which hosts an annual symposium. Would this not provide an adequate opportunity to network?

I don't know anything about that program, probably because I don't really have any interest in it. W&M is well-priced and could potentially get you where you want to go geographically, but to make it into the industry you want you'd have to hustle and network like crazy the entire time and get lucky.

scrappydoo716
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Re: Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby scrappydoo716 » Wed Feb 27, 2013 2:43 pm

AP-375 wrote:
scrappydoo716 wrote:
AP-375 wrote:1) The answer to this question is not unequivocally no. (Although I should probably clarify that by saying, define reasonable chance.) I'm at W&M now. I am headed to a top NYC firm. So are several others. I know several headed to California. Both require grades and hustle.
If your question is "Is it possible to ever work in these locations?" Then the answer is yes, of course. I'll let everyone else add all of the caveats that you should be well aware of.
2) I don't know anyone from here going into entertainment law.
3) Why is your cost of attendance so high for W&M? If you're paying $6k in yearly tuition, your COL should only be like $16k more, which would put you at $20k/yr/$60k total, which seems like a low price to me.


I got the cost of living off of their website, I assume it is probably a high estimate. The school says it has a sports and entertainment law society which hosts an annual symposium. Would this not provide an adequate opportunity to network?

I don't know anything about that program, probably because I don't really have any interest in it. W&M is well-priced and could potentially get you where you want to go geographically, but to make it into the industry you want you'd have to hustle and network like crazy the entire time and get lucky.


Any pointers on doing this at W&M other than the obligatory work hard and study?

timbs4339
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Re: Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby timbs4339 » Wed Feb 27, 2013 3:09 pm

scrappydoo716 wrote:
AP-375 wrote:
ImNoScar wrote:
scrappydoo716 wrote:If I chose to attend a school in VA such as william and mary (other options include George Mason and Washington & Lee) is there a reasonable chance that I will ever be able to work in one of my preferred regions?

No. You need a school like UCLA, USC or a T14 for your goals.


1) The answer to this question is not unequivocally no. (Although I should probably clarify that by saying, define reasonable chance.) I'm at W&M now. I am headed to a top NYC firm. So are several others. I know several headed to California. Both require grades and hustle.
If your question is "Is it possible to ever work in these locations?" Then the answer is yes, of course. I'll let everyone else add all of the caveats that you should be well aware of.
2) I don't know anyone from here going into entertainment law.
3) Why is your cost of attendance so high for W&M? If you're paying $6k in yearly tuition, your COL should only be like $16k more, which would put you at $20k/yr/$60k total, which seems like a low price to me.


I got the cost of living off of their website, I assume it is probably a high estimate. The school says it has a sports and entertainment law society which hosts an annual symposium. Would this not provide an adequate opportunity to network?


Most law schools have one of those (mine did). You'll be networking with other law students. Every year they'll bring in some partners from Proskauer or in-house at a studio who will tell you that it is impossible to break into sports or entertainment law without biglaw credentials + a lot of luck or serious, real connections to the industry. Planning to go into sports or entertainment law is just not a good bet for your average fantasy football league champ or former high school Shakespearean actor.

iditarod
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Re: Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby iditarod » Thu Feb 28, 2013 3:14 pm

North wrote:
scrappydoo716 wrote:And say per some chance I do receive those grades (top 15% or so) then is the risk worth it?

If I win the lottery, is buying a ticket worth the risk?

There's an 85% chance that you won't be in the top 15%.


This is not necessarily true and hack tls groupthink. if OP has a record of hitting the top 15% in his hs and undergrad and has an above median LSAT (which it sounds like he does), then he has a much better than 15% shot of hitting this mark.

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North
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Re: Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby North » Thu Feb 28, 2013 3:19 pm

iditarod wrote:
North wrote:
scrappydoo716 wrote:And say per some chance I do receive those grades (top 15% or so) then is the risk worth it?

If I win the lottery, is buying a ticket worth the risk?

There's an 85% chance that you won't be in the top 15%.


This is not necessarily true and hack tls groupthink. if OP has a record of hitting the top 15% in his hs and undergrad and has an above median LSAT (which it sounds like he does), then he has a much better than 15% shot of hitting this mark.

No.

Pretty much every single person in OP's class will be able to say exactly the same thing. Think about it, dude.

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lawhopeful10
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Re: Fordham vs. William and Mary

Postby lawhopeful10 » Thu Feb 28, 2013 3:23 pm

Even if we grant that above median LSAT students have a slightly better shot at above median grades is that really something the OP or whoever are gonna roll the dice on. People with above LSAT medians finish with below median grades sometimes and if they took your advice then they are likely fucked.




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