Fire Away

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MrSwaggums
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Fire Away

Postby MrSwaggums » Tue Feb 19, 2013 3:35 pm

From the state of Kentucky, UG in Finance. I don't really care about "biglaw" but also don't want to be stuck doing doc review or not having a legal job. So basically applied to UK/UL?Charleston. But i do not really want to attend Uof L after learning more about it. So here are the options.

University of Kentucky $5k per yr scholarship. Tuition is 18k a year in-state and COL is pretty low.

Charleston - 25k per year scholarship and free Summer tuition. 35k a year tuition and higher COL.

Also have yet to negotiate for more scholarship money.

I believe that my best bet would be to attend UK and stay in state, where I have good ties. UK places best of the 3 law schools in KY.

Thoughts?

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hobie2515
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Re: Fire Away

Postby hobie2515 » Tue Feb 19, 2013 3:54 pm

Numbers? Also, why do you want to go to law school? If you're just doing it because you feel like you don't have other options, that's not sufficient.

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romothesavior
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Re: Fire Away

Postby romothesavior » Tue Feb 19, 2013 4:16 pm

With tuition and tuition increases, COL, and interest, you're still looking at probably close to 100k for the Kentucky degree. It wouldn't be a terrible option for someone with Kentucky ties, but not at that price. If you can negotiate it down a bit, it would be a decent choice. Their employment (per LST) isn't terrible, and is much better than Louisville.

Charleston = no way in hell

What are your numbers? How many times have you taken the LSAT?

usfvictor
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Re: Fire Away

Postby usfvictor » Tue Feb 19, 2013 4:25 pm

romothesavior wrote:With tuition and tuition increases, COL, and interest, you're still looking at probably close to 100k for the Kentucky degree. It wouldn't be a terrible option for someone with Kentucky ties, but not at that price. If you can negotiate it down a bit, it wouldn't be a terrible choice. Their employment (per LST) isn't terrible, and is much better than Louisville.

Charleston = no way in hell
What are your numbers? How many times have you taken the LSAT?



this

rad lulz
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Re: Fire Away

Postby rad lulz » Tue Feb 19, 2013 4:31 pm

romothesavior wrote:With tuition and tuition increases, COL, and interest, you're still looking at probably close to 100k for the Kentucky degree. It wouldn't be a terrible option for someone with Kentucky ties, but not at that price. If you can negotiate it down a bit, it wouldn't be a terrible choice. Their employment (per LST) isn't terrible, and is much better than Louisville.

Charleston = no way in hell

What are your numbers? How many times have you taken the LSAT?

This

timbs4339
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Re: Fire Away

Postby timbs4339 » Tue Feb 19, 2013 4:37 pm

I usually set 75K as the number for state schools like UK assuming ties and acceptable stips. That way it gives you a not onerous repayment schedule on a likely starting salary of 40-50K. Charleston at that price is out of the question.

MrSwaggums
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Re: Fire Away

Postby MrSwaggums » Tue Feb 19, 2013 4:42 pm

Basically UK will be 39k tuition + COL for 3 yrs. Doesn't seem too bad, espescially with some family help.

MrSwaggums
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Re: Fire Away

Postby MrSwaggums » Tue Feb 19, 2013 4:43 pm

^ total tuition if not increased

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romothesavior
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Re: Fire Away

Postby romothesavior » Tue Feb 19, 2013 4:58 pm

I think you're underestimating. It's easy to do, I did it myself when I was getting ready to go to law school.

13k * 3 = 39k, + tuition increases, fees, and interest on your loans (which does accrue in school). I think you're looking at closer to 50k for tuition and fees.

As for COL and books and all of that, I think 15k+ per month for 12 months is a pretty conservative estimate. So there's 45k, at least.

That's 95k. This stuff adds up quickly, trust me. Unless you're getting big help from your family (like, they'll pay your rent for 3 years), I don't see this being a wise investment. It's not the craziest investment in the world, and UK isn't a bad regional school, but it's just a lot of dough to drop on it.

rad lulz
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Re: Fire Away

Postby rad lulz » Tue Feb 19, 2013 5:01 pm

romothesavior wrote:I think you're underestimating. It's easy to do, I did it myself when I was getting ready to go to law school.

13k * 3 = 39k, + tuition increases, fees, and interest on your loans (which does accrue in school). I think you're looking at closer to 50k for tuition and fees.

As for COL and books and all of that, I think 15k+ per month for 12 months is a pretty conservative estimate. So there's 45k, at least.

That's 95k. This stuff adds up quickly, trust me. Unless you're getting big help from your family (like, they'll pay your rent for 3 years), I don't see this being a wise investment. It's not the craziest investment in the world, and UK isn't a bad regional school, but it's just a lot of dough to drop on it.

Like someone just said, I'd probably drop $75k for UK

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romothesavior
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Re: Fire Away

Postby romothesavior » Tue Feb 19, 2013 5:05 pm

I think I would too. It just depends on how much help OP gets from the folks. I think it's conservatively in the 90-100k range now, probably more like 100k+ when he graduates LS. A little more than I'd be willing to throw down.

Try negotiating and maybe consider a June LSAT to get a few more points and a few more bucks.

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spleenworship
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Re: Fire Away

Postby spleenworship » Tue Feb 19, 2013 5:30 pm

If you can get a little bigger scholly at UK that would not be a horrible decision.

good luck.

MrSwaggums
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Re: Fire Away

Postby MrSwaggums » Tue Feb 19, 2013 7:47 pm

Thanks to everyone for the advice thus far. I have realized Charleston is not a good decision, basically I loved the thought of living there for 3 years, but that definitely doesn't justify attending a school like that.

On the topic of scholarship negotiation I have a few points I'd like some advice on.

Would the Charleston scholarship be effective at all as a bargaining chip to get UK to increase what they've offered?

Should I send an app to the KY school NKU (no plans at all to attend there!) and get a possible full ride, and use that as leverage?

Both schools are far inferior so it seems dubious that they would be effective to use in bargaining. Any other general advice or tips on increasing scholarships? I had a friend who attended UK and basically just said "I want more money" and they gave him an extra 2k per year.

MrSwaggums
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Re: Fire Away

Postby MrSwaggums » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:03 pm

romothesavior wrote:I think I would too. It just depends on how much help OP gets from the folks. I think it's conservatively in the 90-100k range now, probably more like 100k+ when he graduates LS. A little more than I'd be willing to throw down.

Try negotiating and maybe consider a June LSAT to get a few more points and a few more bucks.


Thanks for the info. After looking at UK's COA information on the website they compute annual COA for an in-stater like me to be $35k per year, deduct the $5k per year and total COA comes to $90k. There website factors $1k per month rent, I know many people that attend and pay in the $500-$700 a month range, some much less with roommates involved. In all likelihood it would be unwise on my part to room with someone not in professional school though. I know my parents will help with some bills/fees but probably only to the tune of around $3500 a year.

After factoring all this and adding some figures, as it stands right now I put my COA at less that $80k (not including tuition increases). So maybe not a bad option if I can get some more money from them.

I have always wanted to pursue law and I know how bad the outlook is now but I set a goal of a long time ago to attend UK Law (avid fan, attend a lot of athletic events there, love the city) so I definitely am biased toward LS attendance.

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romothesavior
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Re: Fire Away

Postby romothesavior » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:07 pm

Sounds good. Try to negotiate the price down, and go to UK. Its a decent option for someone in your shoes.

Id still maybe consider a retake in June for $$ as well. Good luck OP!

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spleenworship
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Re: Fire Away

Postby spleenworship » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:12 pm

MrSwaggums wrote:Thanks to everyone for the advice thus far. I have realized Charleston is not a good decision, basically I loved the thought of living there for 3 years, but that definitely doesn't justify attending a school like that.

On the topic of scholarship negotiation I have a few points I'd like some advice on.

Would the Charleston scholarship be effective at all as a bargaining chip to get UK to increase what they've offered?

Should I send an app to the KY school NKU (no plans at all to attend there!) and get a possible full ride, and use that as leverage?

Both schools are far inferior so it seems dubious that they would be effective to use in bargaining. Any other general advice or tips on increasing scholarships? I had a friend who attended UK and basically just said "I want more money" and they gave him an extra 2k per year.


Use that scholly. Use any scholly.

Doesn't matter if it is a worse school, you can honestly say you are seriously considering them just because of lowered price. With the market for law students the way it is right now, they'll understand and probably offer you more.

Even $2K more is $6K less money you have to get a loan for over the 3 years.

MrSwaggums
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Re: Fire Away

Postby MrSwaggums » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:22 pm

romothesavior wrote:Sounds good. Try to negotiate the price down, and go to UK. Its a decent option for someone in your shoes.

Id still maybe consider a retake in June for $$ as well. Good luck OP!


Thank You.

My LSAT was 161 and I honestly didnt study much. It was in Dec and the week before my last UG finals week when i was taking 16 hrs. I was swamped all semester and didnt put much time into LSAT prep. I feel if i devoted a few hrs a day til June I could have a good sized leap bc basically i just need to increase the LG portion.

MrSwaggums
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Re: Fire Away

Postby MrSwaggums » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:24 pm

spleenworship wrote:
MrSwaggums wrote:Thanks to everyone for the advice thus far. I have realized Charleston is not a good decision, basically I loved the thought of living there for 3 years, but that definitely doesn't justify attending a school like that.

On the topic of scholarship negotiation I have a few points I'd like some advice on.

Would the Charleston scholarship be effective at all as a bargaining chip to get UK to increase what they've offered?

Should I send an app to the KY school NKU (no plans at all to attend there!) and get a possible full ride, and use that as leverage?

Both schools are far inferior so it seems dubious that they would be effective to use in bargaining. Any other general advice or tips on increasing scholarships? I had a friend who attended UK and basically just said "I want more money" and they gave him an extra 2k per year.




Use that scholly. Use any scholly.

Doesn't matter if it is a worse school, you can honestly say you are seriously considering them just because of lowered price. With the market for law students the way it is right now, they'll understand and probably offer you more.

Even $2K more is $6K less money you have to get a loan for over the 3 years.


Thank you for the advice. I will email the Dean of Admissions who I have corresponded with some and basically say that Im having a hard time committing to attend UK becasue of Charleston's lesser COA and beautiful location :lol: but some more money would reassure me that UK is where I will attend.

That sound like a decent strategy?

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spleenworship
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Re: Fire Away

Postby spleenworship » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:34 pm

MrSwaggums wrote:
spleenworship wrote:
MrSwaggums wrote:Thanks to everyone for the advice thus far. I have realized Charleston is not a good decision, basically I loved the thought of living there for 3 years, but that definitely doesn't justify attending a school like that.

On the topic of scholarship negotiation I have a few points I'd like some advice on.

Would the Charleston scholarship be effective at all as a bargaining chip to get UK to increase what they've offered?

Should I send an app to the KY school NKU (no plans at all to attend there!) and get a possible full ride, and use that as leverage?

Both schools are far inferior so it seems dubious that they would be effective to use in bargaining. Any other general advice or tips on increasing scholarships? I had a friend who attended UK and basically just said "I want more money" and they gave him an extra 2k per year.




Use that scholly. Use any scholly.

Doesn't matter if it is a worse school, you can honestly say you are seriously considering them just because of lowered price. With the market for law students the way it is right now, they'll understand and probably offer you more.

Even $2K more is $6K less money you have to get a loan for over the 3 years.


Thank you for the advice. I will email the Dean of Admissions who I have corresponded with some and basically say that Im having a hard time committing to attend UK becasue of Charleston's lesser COA and beautiful location :lol: but some more money would reassure me that UK is where I will attend.

That sound like a decent strategy?



Say it along with me "I would prefer to go to your school, but Charleston offered me $25K per year. Money is a big concern for me what with everything I've read in the NYT and such. Is there anything you can do to help me? Because I really do want to go to your school, I'm just not sure I can afford to."


Bing. Done.

TheZoid
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Re: Fire Away

Postby TheZoid » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:43 pm

MrSwaggums wrote:
romothesavior wrote:Sounds good. Try to negotiate the price down, and go to UK. Its a decent option for someone in your shoes.

Id still maybe consider a retake in June for $$ as well. Good luck OP!


Thank You.

My LSAT was 161 and I honestly didnt study much. It was in Dec and the week before my last UG finals week when i was taking 16 hrs. I was swamped all semester and didnt put much time into LSAT prep. I feel if i devoted a few hrs a day til June I could have a good sized leap bc basically i just need to increase the LG portion.


You absolutely need to retake. 161 isn't a bad score with that little studying. Put in a few solid months and the payoff will be well worth it.

MrSwaggums
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Re: Fire Away

Postby MrSwaggums » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:47 pm

Thanks Spleen and Zoid for the advice.

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romothesavior
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Re: Fire Away

Postby romothesavior » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:54 pm

MrSwaggums wrote:
romothesavior wrote:Sounds good. Try to negotiate the price down, and go to UK. Its a decent option for someone in your shoes.

Id still maybe consider a retake in June for $$ as well. Good luck OP!


Thank You.

My LSAT was 161 and I honestly didnt study much. It was in Dec and the week before my last UG finals week when i was taking 16 hrs. I was swamped all semester and didnt put much time into LSAT prep. I feel if i devoted a few hrs a day til June I could have a good sized leap bc basically i just need to increase the LG portion.

I'd consider it strongly then. A few points could get you a full ride or close to it. And if they say they can't make that happen this year, you could ask for a deferral and get the huge scholarship for next year. That'd be the equivalent of like a 50k job plus whatever you could make in the interim year off. Law school could up almost completely free from UK with a few more points.

P.S. You have no idea what a relief it is to talk to someone reasonable, knowledgeable, and open minded after some of the stubborn folks around these parts lately.

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cinephile
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Re: Fire Away

Postby cinephile » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:58 pm

I'd agree that UK is fine if you're okay with staying in state after graduation, but you would need more scholly $$ to make it worth your while. Retake and reapply sounds like a good strategy.

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somewhatwayward
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Re: Fire Away

Postby somewhatwayward » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:59 pm

MrSwaggums wrote:
romothesavior wrote:Sounds good. Try to negotiate the price down, and go to UK. Its a decent option for someone in your shoes.

Id still maybe consider a retake in June for $$ as well. Good luck OP!


Thank You.

My LSAT was 161 and I honestly didnt study much. It was in Dec and the week before my last UG finals week when i was taking 16 hrs. I was swamped all semester and didnt put much time into LSAT prep. I feel if i devoted a few hrs a day til June I could have a good sized leap bc basically i just need to increase the LG portion.


Please consider retaking either in June (if you have sufficient time to study...what you did for Dec was insufficient) or in October. A 161 is a very strong score for not having studied much. You could probably add 10 points or more if you buckled down. If you even add three points you'd prob get a full ride from UK (which US why you should retake in June even if you are set on going next fall - if you raise your score in June they'll increase your scholarship). Why pay 80K when you don't have to?...not to mention the other options that would be available in the high 160s or 170s.

Seriously....161 on the real deal for someone who hasn't studied much is pretty darn good...don't leave those points on the table and consign yourself to debt peonage! (But do study properly for the retake) Good luck!

ETA: FWIW both me and my sibling had diagnostic LSAT scores in the low 160s (I was freaking out bc I had never met a standardized test I didn't take to immediately) but we both studied and got in the 170s.

MrSwaggums
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Re: Fire Away

Postby MrSwaggums » Tue Feb 19, 2013 9:07 pm

Thanks again to everyone for all the advice and tips, I appreciate the knowledge that everyone has shared with me.

I will retake in June and hopefully reap some good benefits because I definitely dont wanna put myself in a bad situation with debt graduating from LS at the ripe old age of 26 haha.




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