NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

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jenesaislaw
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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby jenesaislaw » Fri Feb 15, 2013 1:51 pm

Here are six anecdotes from Drexel. I had dinner with six 2Ls last month and they are terrified about finding a job. Absolutely terrified.

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Bronx Bum
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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby Bronx Bum » Fri Feb 15, 2013 2:00 pm

You have terrible options. Please retake.

tarp
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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby tarp » Fri Feb 15, 2013 4:05 pm

Newsflash: EVERYONE in the COUNTRY is terrified about being unable to find a job. The job market and the economy stinks in general.

You are thinking short-term if you think a law degree from anything but a top 14 school is worthless in the long run. Once the economy improves, the job market will improve as well.

rad lulz
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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby rad lulz » Fri Feb 15, 2013 4:08 pm

tarp wrote:Newsflash: EVERYONE in the COUNTRY is terrified about being unable to find a job. The job market and the economy stinks in general.

You are thinking short-term if you think a law degree from anything but a top 14 school is worthless in the long run. Once the economy improves, the job market will improve as well.

You gotta make payments on your loans and the interest that rapidly accrues on those loans very soon after graduation, you mongol idiot.

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JamesDean1955
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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby JamesDean1955 » Fri Feb 15, 2013 4:24 pm

rad lulz wrote:
tarp wrote:Newsflash: EVERYONE in the COUNTRY is terrified about being unable to find a job. The job market and the economy stinks in general.

You are thinking short-term if you think a law degree from anything but a top 14 school is worthless in the long run. Once the economy improves, the job market will improve as well.

You gotta make payments on your loans and the interest that rapidly accrues on those loans very soon after graduation, you mongol idiot.


Tarp, I agree with you in that the job market and economy sucks across industries and also that it will improve, contrary to most people on TLS.

However, Rad Lulz is right about these loans, and at this juncture I would not take out a significant amount of loans for anything other than a T14 school. While I think things will improve, they aren't going to improve THAT much THAT fast. Meanwhile you'd be drowning in loans and your credit will tank.

Also, all of these schools suck ass, and these schools above all others are /=/ "anything but a top 14 school"

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jenesaislaw
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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby jenesaislaw » Fri Feb 15, 2013 4:32 pm

tarp wrote:Newsflash: EVERYONE in the COUNTRY is terrified about being unable to find a job. The job market and the economy stinks in general.

You are thinking short-term if you think a law degree from anything but a top 14 school is worthless in the long run. Once the economy improves, the job market will improve as well.


And you don't understand the structural changes the legal profession has undergone and continues to undergo.

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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby rad lulz » Fri Feb 15, 2013 4:34 pm

jenesaislaw wrote:
tarp wrote:Newsflash: EVERYONE in the COUNTRY is terrified about being unable to find a job. The job market and the economy stinks in general.

You are thinking short-term if you think a law degree from anything but a top 14 school is worthless in the long run. Once the economy improves, the job market will improve as well.


And you don't understand the structural changes the legal profession has undergone and continues to undergo.

NY TO 190

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jenesaislaw
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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby jenesaislaw » Fri Feb 15, 2013 4:49 pm

rad lulz wrote:NY TO 190


God, you joke about this...but people during the 2007-2008 cycle believed it was inevitable (me included). I remember being at a hotel with my cousins in like July 2007 talking about it. Boy things have changed.

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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby tarp » Fri Feb 15, 2013 5:06 pm

You do realize that for some people, it's either go to law school now, or never go? People get older, less inclined to go to school, get settled in employment, start families, etc. There's also plenty of people out there who can pay 16k a year for three years plus living expenses, out of pocket, and will graduate without any debt. Even if they don't find a legal job for a few years, that person now has a law degree that will be an asset once the economy improves.

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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby cinephile » Fri Feb 15, 2013 5:08 pm

tarp wrote:You do realize that for some people, it's either go to law school now, or never go? People get older, less inclined to go to school, get settled in employment, start families, etc. There's also plenty of people out there who can pay 16k a year for three years plus living expenses, out of pocket, and will graduate without any debt. Even if they don't find a legal job for a few years, that person now has a law degree that will be an asset once the economy improves.


Nope. Law degrees are like deli meats. They go rancid pretty quickly.

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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby stillwater » Fri Feb 15, 2013 5:09 pm

tarp wrote:You do realize that for some people, it's either go to law school now, or never go? People get older, less inclined to go to school, get settled in employment, start families, etc. There's also plenty of people out there who can pay 16k a year for three years plus living expenses, out of pocket, and will graduate without any debt. Even if they don't find a legal job for a few years, that person now has a law degree that will be an asset once the economy improves.


I don't think thats a good argument. That gap in employment is a red flag even if because of the economy. Each year that ticks by more and more graduates flood the job market. No matter how good the economy is, it won't be able to absorb close to that amount of people.

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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby rad lulz » Fri Feb 15, 2013 5:23 pm

tarp wrote:You do realize that for some people, it's either go to law school now, or never go? People get older, less inclined to go to school, get settled in employment, start families, etc. There's also plenty of people out there who can pay 16k a year for three years plus living expenses, out of pocket, and will graduate without any debt. Even if they don't find a legal job for a few years, that person now has a law degree that will be an asset once the economy improves.

This is utter retardation. Not only will your law degree go stale if you don't use it (I think someone here put forth stats that if you don't get a legal job a year after you graduate, the chances that you will work as a lawyer plummet), but quit acting like law school is some necessary good that a certain segment of the population needs to obtain in order to feel self-actualized. This is sublime idiocy.

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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby jenesaislaw » Fri Feb 15, 2013 5:24 pm

tarp wrote:You do realize that for some people, it's either go to law school now, or never go? People get older, less inclined to go to school, get settled in employment, start families, etc. There's also plenty of people out there who can pay 16k a year for three years plus living expenses, out of pocket, and will graduate without any debt. Even if they don't find a legal job for a few years, that person now has a law degree that will be an asset once the economy improves.


You act like going to law school is like having kids, getting married, or a shiny red Corvette.

No less, I think few people would argue against going if you can graduate without any debt, have a decent chance to practice law post-graduation, and understand the type of jobs graduates actually get from the school in question.

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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby Ti Malice » Fri Feb 15, 2013 5:29 pm

tarp wrote:You do realize that for some people, it's either go to law school now, or never go? People get older, less inclined to go to school, get settled in employment, start families, etc. There's also plenty of people out there who can pay 16k a year for three years plus living expenses, out of pocket, and will graduate without any debt. Even if they don't find a legal job for a few years, that person now has a law degree that will be an asset once the economy improves.


You're either evil or an idiot. Your advice is perpetually wrong and dangerous.

For many people, the intelligent thing to do is to never go to law school. If a person cannot promptly find legal work after graduation, the degree quickly becomes an albatross. No legal employer wants to hire someone three years removed from graduation with no legal WE, and many non-legal employers will view the degree-holder as overqualified and a flight risk.

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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby tarp » Fri Feb 15, 2013 5:38 pm

That's cool, if you have some stupid undergrad degree like English.

If you're a biochemist, there will be opportunities out there.

Not everyone is a whiny little 21 year old kid fresh out of undergrad who majored in General Studies and sees law school as a shortcut to a shiny new biglaw gig since they're not smart enough for med school.

Personally, I am hanging my own shingle and doing contract work for other established lawyers and quickly building myself a very strong reputation in my area. Law is a profession and should be treated as such. Employment is never the goal... practicing law is the goal. A lawyer should aspire to self-employment, or partnership, not merely being an associate in a firm.

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stillwater
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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby stillwater » Fri Feb 15, 2013 5:43 pm

tarp wrote:That's cool, if you have some stupid undergrad degree like English.

If you're a biochemist, there will be opportunities out there.

Not everyone is a whiny little 21 year old kid fresh out of undergrad who majored in General Studies and sees law school as a shortcut to a shiny new biglaw gig since they're not smart enough for med school.

Personally, I am hanging my own shingle and doing contract work for other established lawyers and quickly building myself a very strong reputation in my area. Law is a profession and should be treated as such. Employment is never the goal... practicing law is the goal. A lawyer should aspire to self-employment, or partnership, not merely being an associate in a firm.


yea, so idiot not evil.

bro, you are giving bad advice. if you could magically suspend time, then maybe your advice would have credence. but unfortunately this isn't the movie Click, we can't just put lives on ice while the market figures itself out.

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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby grapefruits » Fri Feb 15, 2013 5:49 pm

cinephile wrote:
tarp wrote:You do realize that for some people, it's either go to law school now, or never go? People get older, less inclined to go to school, get settled in employment, start families, etc. There's also plenty of people out there who can pay 16k a year for three years plus living expenses, out of pocket, and will graduate without any debt. Even if they don't find a legal job for a few years, that person now has a law degree that will be an asset once the economy improves.


Nope. Law degrees are like deli meats. They go rancid pretty quickly.


Precisely. The longer you go without a job, the less likely you are to ever find one.

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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby Rahviveh » Fri Feb 15, 2013 5:50 pm

tarp wrote:That's cool, if you have some stupid undergrad degree like English.

If you're a biochemist, there will be opportunities out there.

Not everyone is a whiny little 21 year old kid fresh out of undergrad who majored in General Studies and sees law school as a shortcut to a shiny new biglaw gig since they're not smart enough for med school.

Personally, I am hanging my own shingle and doing contract work for other established lawyers and quickly building myself a very strong reputation in my area. Law is a profession and should be treated as such. Employment is never the goal... practicing law is the goal. A lawyer should aspire to self-employment, or partnership, not merely being an associate in a firm.


Mind sharing your background? School (or range) and debt load?

rad lulz
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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby rad lulz » Fri Feb 15, 2013 6:17 pm

I'll just repay my loans with satisfaction from a job well done. Shouldn't be too hard.

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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby goldeneye » Fri Feb 15, 2013 6:44 pm

i wish there was a way to delete posts like tarps. there is a reason that most people are on the same side of this discussion.

take one look at jdunderground and let me know how the legal profession is doing.

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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby uvabro » Fri Feb 15, 2013 7:13 pm

OP, tarps knows what he's talking about. Go! Law firms only recruit off your major which is awesome and no one else will have it. No one here knows what they're talking about, and if 1% of people become successful from these places that logically means that you have a 99% shot of making it big. Just follow your heart. That is the trick in this field. As Justice Scalia said, "Follow your heart and not the facts to reach the proper conclusion."

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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby goldeneye » Fri Feb 15, 2013 7:22 pm

uvabro wrote:OP, tarps knows what he's talking about. Go! Law firms only recruit off your major which is awesome and no one else will have it. No one here knows what they're talking about, and if 1% of people become successful from these places that logically means that you have a 99% shot of making it big. Just follow your heart. That is the trick in this field. As Justice Scalia said, "Follow your heart and not the facts to reach the proper conclusion."


The problem with joking like this is that this guy is dumb enough to believe it.

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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby romothesavior » Fri Feb 15, 2013 7:29 pm

tarp wrote: Employment is never the goal... practicing law is the goal.

lawl

uvabro
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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby uvabro » Fri Feb 15, 2013 7:37 pm

romothesavior wrote:
tarp wrote: Employment is never the goal... practicing law is the goal.

lawl

i told the same thing to my mechanic. he still demanded i pay him. dude knows nothing about how to make money.

uvabro
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Re: NYLS v. St. John's v. Seton Hall v. Drexel v. Pace

Postby uvabro » Fri Feb 15, 2013 7:38 pm

stillwater wrote:
tarp wrote:That's cool, if you have some stupid undergrad degree like English.

If you're a biochemist, there will be opportunities out there.

Not everyone is a whiny little 21 year old kid fresh out of undergrad who majored in General Studies and sees law school as a shortcut to a shiny new biglaw gig since they're not smart enough for med school.

Personally, I am hanging my own shingle and doing contract work for other established lawyers and quickly building myself a very strong reputation in my area. Law is a profession and should be treated as such. Employment is never the goal... practicing law is the goal. A lawyer should aspire to self-employment, or partnership, not merely being an associate in a firm.


yea, so idiot not evil.

bro, you are giving bad advice. if you could magically suspend time, then maybe your advice would have credence. but unfortunately this isn't the movie Click, we can't just put lives on ice while the market figures itself out.


i think the market has figured itself out. you can't have more lawyers than people.




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